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"I Need a New PC!" 2014 Part 2. Read OP, your 2500K will run Witcher 3. MX100s! 970!

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riflen

Member
I have a possibly stupid question for you guys:

What's the generally accepted "best" method of capping framerate in conjunction with vsync these days? My new cards will be here on Monday and it'll be the first time (in a long time) that I'll have to worry about going above and beyond the 60fps my plasma can handle. I'd like to be able to set everything globally, if possible. I've gathered as much information as I could but it's mostly just forum opinions with no hard science behind them -- lots of "I don't know why, but it works" posts and vague, outdated articles.

The one I see most often is some variation of a global 59.xx fps cap + vsync set in Afterburner/Precision/etc. Wouldn't this cause the engine to constantly miss the 16ms refresh and default down to 30fps?

Any help would be much appreciated.

There is no best. The best approach will vary from game to game. This is because not all vsync implementations are the same and not all game engines or games behave in the same manner.

In keeping with this, the answer to your specific question is; it depends. Yes, if you're using vsync with double buffering. No, if you're using another implementation such as adaptive vsync (which can be forced as a nvidia driver option, but rarely implemented by developers in game), or vsync with a render ahead queue.

I suggest you read this on triple buffering from Anandtech. http://www.anandtech.com/show/2794
It's useful background and importantly explains that DirectX does not feature true triple buffering and in fact utilises an optional render ahead queue. If your game is 32-bit, you can use D3DOverrider to force on this queue, which will prevent the problem you describe.

Anyway, you will need to experiment. Sometimes the in-game vsync is best, sometimes it's trash. You can use the utilities you mention to cap the framerate and GPU drivers to enable vsync. There's also nvidia inspector (for nvidia GPUs), which can be customised to add in your own arbitrary cap value. I think RadeonPro is also useful, although I've no experience with it personally.
 

ScRYeD

Member
Just finished my new Air 540 computer.

Side
14467781361_96eace48b1_b.jpg
14284526339_8cdcb579b2_b.jpg

Frontish & Back
 

Tablo

Member
^That is such sex, it us my dream to have such clean cabling...
I swear ima hit up one of you pros in LA when I do my build. Will provide free pizza and beverages LOL
 

ScRYeD

Member
^That is such sex, it us my dream to have such clean cabling...
I swear ima hit up one of you pros in LA when I do my build. Will provide free pizza and beverages LOL

Damn, dude. Beautiful. Dumb question: where do you get the colored PSU cables? Is it just a modular PSU, and then you can order the cables separately?
Thanks and I have a Corsair ax860 and bought the Corsair Sleeved cable kit for $120AUD.
 

ScRYeD

Member
Sick build my dude! It's not too often I see a green one, and it looks REAL good on this.
Oh wow, that looks amazing.

Looks cool. FYI I'm pretty sure that second SLI bridge is superfluous. The second SLI port on GTX cards is only needed for 3 and 4-way configurations.

Thanks guys. I had 2 bridges so i just put them both on untill i decide what to do with them, looks like i have to make a custom one.....somehow. I also painted a Green h105 ring, i wonder if it would look better than the white?
 

Dries

Member
So how long do you guys generally last with your CPUs? I'm asking this because in the summer of 2015 I'll be upgrading my 2500K 3.3ghz to either go for a Haswell (E?) or a Broadwell. The reason I'll be upgrading my CPU is because I've set my sights on a GTX 800 series card, probably the GTX 880 and it just doesn't feel logical to run a sparkly new GPU on an 5 year old CPU. So how much gain should I get from upgrading my 2500K? It feels kinda stupid saying this, but this may affect the advice you'll give:
money isn't really an issue

Would you guys consider it fairly neseccary, a complete waste of money, or somewhere in between?

I also just want to give some props to this thread and the users inside it. I've really learned a lot over the past year or so and you guys are always really helpful in informing the lesser informed people like me, so thanks!
 

jfoul

Member
Looks like I'm going to return the Gigabyte R9 290X OC ($330) from Amazon Warehouse. I can't get warranty because of the U.K serial number, which also tanks the resale value of this card. Also, the card crashed and rebooted my desktop today while playing Metro LL. This happened once with Tomb Raider, and I just figured it was my old PSU. This is now on my new Hive - 750W. It could also be a software/driver hiccup, but without a warranty I'm not going to test my luck. From what I can tell, everyone else who bought one through Warehouse got a U.S serial number, and have been stable. No worries, Amazon return policy is awesome.

I'll be looking for a GTX 780/ti 3GB/6GB, or R9 290/X (ASUS,/MSI/Gigabyte/EVGA). If anybody is selling one, send me a pm.
 

Furoba

Member
I am looking to build my first rig and would like to have some advice.

First off, here's my basic background.

Your Current Specs: N/A
Budget: +/- $1000 (excluding monitor + peripherals) / Japan
Main Use: Light Gaming 5, Gaming 5, Emulation (PS2/Wii) 2, Video Editing 1, Streaming games in HD 5, 3D/Model work (and what program) 1, General Usage (Word, Web, 1080p playback) 5.
Monitor Resolution: Need to buy monitor so 1080p for everything but the most demanding things would be nice. Looking to buy a 120Hz+ @ 1080p monitor.
List SPECIFIC games or applications that you MUST be able to run well: Total War/Civ5/Sins of a Solar Empire/Starcraft 2, 4X RTS etc.
How important is PhysX / SuperSampling / CUDA to you? Not very important.
Looking to reuse any parts?: No
When will you build?: August - September
Will you be overclocking?: No (not sure)

I am currently considering the "Great - Best Value" build from the OP.

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i5-4690K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor ($239.99 @ Amazon)
Motherboard: ASRock Z97 Extreme3 ATX LGA1150 Motherboard ($119.91 @ Newegg)
Memory: Corsair 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($86.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Samsung 840 EVO 120GB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($79.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Blue 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($54.98 @ OutletPC)
Video Card: Asus Radeon R9 270X 2GB DirectCU II Video Card ($179.00 @ Newegg)
Case: Corsair 200R ATX Mid Tower Case ($54.99 @ TigerDirect)
Power Supply: Antec Basiq Plus 550W 80+ Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply ($67.98 @ Best Buy)
Optical Drive: Asus DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS DVD/CD Writer ($16.98 @ OutletPC)
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 8.1 (OEM) (64-bit) ($89.98 @ OutletPC)
Total: $990.79
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-06-15 09:53 EDT-0400

1. Anything in this build that could be cheaper / better for about the same money?
2. Is there a big noise difference between the Corsair 200R and something like a Define R4?
3. What are the differences between the different vendor editions for the R9 270X?
4. Any bottlenecks I should watch out for?
5. Anything out there that is worth waiting for a few more months?

Cheers!

Anyone?

Cheers.
 

Stubo

Member
Looks like I'm going to return the Gigabyte R9 290X OC ($330) from Amazon Warehouse. I can't get warranty because of the U.K serial number, which also tanks the resale value of this card. Also, the card crashed and rebooted my desktop today while playing Metro LL. This happened once with Tomb Raider, and I just figured it was my old PSU. This is now on my new Hive - 750W. It could also be a software/driver hiccup, but without a warranty I'm not going to test my luck. From what I can tell, everyone else who bought one through Warehouse got a U.S serial number, and have been stable. No worries, Amazon return policy is awesome.

I'll be looking for a GTX 780/ti 3GB/6GB, or R9 290/X (ASUS,/MSI/Gigabyte/EVGA). If anybody is selling one, send me a pm.
This really sucks, did you contact gigabyte about it? Between them and amazon maybe they could sort something out for you?
 

Genio88

Member
Guys please i need an advice, i've got the AIO Antec h20 620, here is specs, cooling my FX8350, i've also added on it a Corsair AF 120 quiet edition, to push air to the 120mm radiator, whilest the stock Antec fan pull it out, the problem is that the Antec stock fan is pretty loud, especially when the cpu gets hotter and it raises the rpm, and i can't see it's speed via bios nor check it's rpm on windows, so i'd like to change it with a quieter fan but that also doesn't increase the cpu temperature too much, what would you suggest? i'v seen the corsair sp120, the performance edition seems good but loud, i woudn't know if it's louder than my Antec, there is also a quiet edition, but i wouldn't know if it's strong enough to keep my cpu cool, so i ask for your help.
 
Looks like I'm going to return the Gigabyte R9 290X OC ($330) from Amazon Warehouse. I can't get warranty because of the U.K serial number, which also tanks the resale value of this card. Also, the card crashed and rebooted my desktop today while playing Metro LL. This happened once with Tomb Raider, and I just figured it was my old PSU. This is now on my new Hive - 750W. It could also be a software/driver hiccup, but without a warranty I'm not going to test my luck. From what I can tell, everyone else who bought one through Warehouse got a U.S serial number, and have been stable. No worries, Amazon return policy is awesome.

I'll be looking for a GTX 780/ti 3GB/6GB, or R9 290/X (ASUS,/MSI/Gigabyte/EVGA). If anybody is selling one, send me a pm.

I"m having issues with mine as well. Thought it was a driver issue, but havn't been able to get any drivers to work. Havn't checked the warranty yet.
 

sk3tch

Member
The R9 290/290X used market is very attractive price-wise - but if I were you guys, I would stay far, far away. The reason you're seeing such great prices is due to the crypto currency crashes, and even if someone states they weren't used for mining - I'd assume they were. Even if it works fine, you're just setting yourself up for an earlier failure. Not worth the headache.

For my $$$ right now, the used 780 market is insane. I was able to setup a 780 Classified SLI rig for under $700 (buying used on eBay). The release of the 6GB variants has helped the prices stay low. Plus - very, very slim chance they were used for mining.
 

Tanwo

Member
If you're not overclocking, then the main benefits of a Z-series motherboard are lost. You can save some money and select an H87 board.

I'd not heard of that PSU and there's absolutely no need for 750W output with this PC. I looked it up and it does not have an 80 Plus rating. In fact the manufacturer has deceptively put an "85 + Efficiency" logo on the product web page, which deliberately resembles a genuine 80 Plus logo. I would avoid this PSU.

I would put money saved on the motherboard towards a good quality, lower output PSU (~550W) unit. It's more important to get clean power delivery with good efficiency. That will keep the PSU cooler and quieter.
Try to get a semi-modular PSU. It will help with cable tidying and airflow as well as looking neater. I don't think your budget will allow fully modular. Ideally I prefer a single 12V rail, but that's not totally necessary. It should have at least 80 Plus Bronze rating.

I don't know what's available in Spain, but elsewhere in Europe I would look at XFX Pro 550, Antec 550 or EVGA if you can find them. Seasonic are always safe I think.

Case choice is often down to personal preference. I'm not too knowledgeable on cases, but there are plenty in the OP to start you off.

Thank you very much!
I didn't know Z-series was for overclocking, I will get a Gigabyte GA-H87-HD3.
About the PSU, I'll try to get a 80 Plus Bronze one.

I've been thinking about the heatsink, is it needed for this CPU? (Intel Core i5-4570 3.2Ghz)
 

Sendou

Member
So is this a problem?


Referring to how the refresh rate is different in NVIDIA Control Panel and Windows Control Panel. Either won't let me change. Windows shows me the option but when I choose 60Hz there it just goes straight back to 59Hz. Is it possible that Windows Control Panel is taking priority and running games at 60FPS when monitor is 59Hz is causing problems? I'm sorry if this isn't a right place to ask but this looked like the closest place this would go to.
 

Stubo

Member
Anyone?

Cheers.

Get windows from reddit for a tenner and invest the extra into a 280x instead!
Yup, 8.1 Pro is normally ~$20. Do this or get a bigger SSD and a 280. Like this:

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i5-4690K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor ($239.99 @ Amazon)
Motherboard: ASRock Z97 Extreme3 ATX LGA1150 Motherboard ($127.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Memory: Kingston Fury Black Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($69.99 @ Amazon)
Storage: Crucial MX100 256GB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($106.81 @ NCIX US)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Blue 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($51.99 @ Amazon)
Video Card: MSI Radeon R9 280 3GB TWIN FROZR Video Card ($246.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Corsair 200R ATX Mid Tower Case ($54.99 @ Amazon)
Power Supply: Antec Basiq Plus 550W 80+ Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply ($67.98 @ Best Buy)
Optical Drive: Asus DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS DVD/CD Writer ($16.99 @ Newegg)
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 8.1 (OEM) (64-bit) ($20.00)
Total: $1003.71
 
I have a i5-760 at 2.8 with 14gb ram and this week I upgraded the gpu from a gtx480 to a gtx 770 4gb.
I am wondering if I should return the gtx 770 and go with a gtx 780 instead as I dont want to have to upgrade the gpu for a few years after this.
Would this be a good idea ? I play at 1080p btw.
 

kharma45

Member
I have a i5-760 at 2.8 with 14gb ram and this week I upgraded the gpu from a gtx480 to a gtx 770 4gb.
I am wondering if I should return the gtx 770 and go with a gtx 780 instead as I dont want to have to upgrade the gpu for a few years after this.
Would this be a good idea ? I play at 1080p btw.

If you can afford it and won't get stung for returning the 770 then I'd consider doing it. The 780 will have longer legs than the 770.

As a side note too, look to overclock your i5 to help give you a boost in CPU bound games. That chip can go to around 4GHz.
 
Thank you CreepingFear, I'll give that program a try :)

Just for clarification, my D Disk is completely empty. Do I have to install any OS or create a Program Files folder?

You don't have to install an OS on it, but I think you have to create a folder on D for Steammover to move the games that get installed on the SSD and moved over to the HDD for. I named mine Steam Library, but you can name it whatever you like.
 

Nipo

Member
OK, this is a dumb question but I googled and couldn't get a straight answer.

I want to get a 1440p monitor for work and a 1080p monitor for gaming. Will I be able to run them in extended screen mode at the same time or do I need both monitors to be the same resolution?
 

undecided

Member
OK, this is a dumb question but I googled and couldn't get a straight answer.

I want to get a 1440p monitor for work and a 1080p monitor for gaming. Will I be able to run them in extended screen mode at the same time or do I need both monitors to be the same resolution?

They are separate displays in extended and can be different resolutions.

Mirroring is where they would match.
 

teiresias

Member
They are separate displays in extended and can be different resolutions.

Mirroring is where they would match.

To extend this to another related question. I currently have one monitor and my plasma TV hooked up. I switch between them using shortcuts on the desktop depending on if I'm playing something on the TV.

If I buy a second monitor can I run the pair of monitors in extended mode and switch to the plasma separately and have the monitors disabled like in my current setup?
 
So, I've tried about 4-5 different versions with DDU and all shows the same results. The card runs great when I can get through a benchmark, but I can't get rid of the tearing/artifacts.

Alright need some help guys. Picked up one of the 290X's off Amazon and trying to get things going. I'm seeing a lot of tearing and stretching randomally. Happens at any time. Other strange thing is that games get forced to Windowed Mode after a short period of time. If I go back to full screen, it'll jump back to Windowed shortly after.

i'm using the latest AMD drivers and uninstalled all Nvidia drivers. I've ran in Safe Mode and havn't seen issues there. I ran Furmark and actually saw no issues during that. I've seen tearing/stretching on the desktop, browsing the web, Just Cause2, Goat Simulator, etc.

My system :

i5-2500k
Seasonic 550W
ASUS P8Z68-V LX
Gigabyte R9 290X

I've re installed the drivers as well. Any thoughts guys? Really appreciate it.

Any other things to try? Thinking I might have to return this one. Hopefully Amazon can get me another one....

I made a video of the issue i'm seeing in case anyone has seen something similar. I've contacted Gigabyte as well since it looks like the warranty is still active. This thing is consuming all my time....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g7whpLKs2fE
 

Azzurri

Gold Member
Did anyone get the 295x2? If so, how is it?

If I can get one to fit in a mITX I want to go that route, but I don't kow if it's too long. I wonder if Corsair new cases will house em?

Like the Carbide 240 and 380T
 

musicjunkie

Neo Member
Noticed one of my HDs sounded a tad louder than normal. Is this anything I should be concerned about? If so anything I should/can do before just replacing it? I am no hard drive expert sadly :/

EDIT: Should mention this HD is only about 8 months old.

 

kharma45

Member
That does look a great deal. Ive recently bought a Sapphire AMD R9 290 TRI-X OC Graphics Card for £284 but not used it yet as not bought all the parts for my new build.

Would it be worth sending it back and getting a refund and getting that card?

I'd steer clear of dealing with pixmania.
 

Seanbob11

Member
Hey guys.

I recently build a new PC and was wondering what to do with the old one.

I have decided turn the old one into a dedicated emulating machine.

Ideally I'd like to have it sitting under my TV like a console-type case. The old PC had a ATX MB but if there's a good case that's a micro-atx I could get one. I was thinking something like this but the reviews of that case seem quite poor, and it's a microATX case.

Are there any cases out there that would fit these requirements?
 
Looks like I'm going to return the Gigabyte R9 290X OC ($330) from Amazon Warehouse. I can't get warranty because of the U.K serial number, which also tanks the resale value of this card. Also, the card crashed and rebooted my desktop today while playing Metro LL. This happened once with Tomb Raider, and I just figured it was my old PSU. This is now on my new Hive - 750W. It could also be a software/driver hiccup, but without a warranty I'm not going to test my luck. From what I can tell, everyone else who bought one through Warehouse got a U.S serial number, and have been stable. No worries, Amazon return policy is awesome.

I'll be looking for a GTX 780/ti 3GB/6GB, or R9 290/X (ASUS,/MSI/Gigabyte/EVGA). If anybody is selling one, send me a pm.

Damn, I feel for ya jfoul. I got my 290x in from amazon last night and haven't had a chance to try it out just yet, need to wait for the rest of my parts to come in. I did check my SN and it is a US based one and I have until 2/2017 left on the warranty. I don't mind taking the chance on this card for the price and if it doesn't work, well, I'll cross that bridge when I get there :p.
 
A friend of mine is selling his old PC for ~$500 Canadian:

Intel i7 (first gen) CPU 920 @2.67 GHz
Geforce 9800 gtx+ GPU
12 GB ram
1TB HD
Windows 7 x64
Asus p6t motherboard
650w PSU
Blu/CD/DVD player
27' IPS Dell monitor

How old is this build? I have no PC atm as my laptop died. I was looking at laptops but it's hard to find anything that can play 1080p under $600 CAD.

The most intensive software I plan to run are older games like Witcher 1/2, Bethesda RPGs with mods, and 1080p video. PS4 will otherwise run next gen for me.
 

kharma45

Member
A friend of mine is selling his old PC for ~$500 Canadian:

Intel i7 (first gen) CPU 920 @2.67 GHz
Geforce 9800 gtx+ GPU
12 GB ram
1TB HD
Windows 7 x64
Asus p6t motherboard
650w PSU
Blu/CD/DVD player
27' IPS Dell monitor

How old is this build? I have no PC atm as my laptop died. I was looking at laptops but it's hard to find anything that can play 1080p under $600 CAD.

The most intensive software I plan to run are older games like Witcher 1/2, Bethesda RPGs with mods, and 1080p video. PS4 will otherwise run next gen for me.

Going by the card and CPU late 2008 or early 2009 would be my bets.
 

Pjsprojects

Member
Guys please i need an advice, i've got the AIO Antec h20 620, here is specs, cooling my FX8350, i've also added on it a Corsair AF 120 quiet edition, to push air to the 120mm radiator, whilest the stock Antec fan pull it out, the problem is that the Antec stock fan is pretty loud, especially when the cpu gets hotter and it raises the rpm, and i can't see it's speed via bios nor check it's rpm on windows, so i'd like to change it with a quieter fan but that also doesn't increase the cpu temperature too much, what would you suggest? i'v seen the corsair sp120, the performance edition seems good but loud, i woudn't know if it's louder than my Antec, there is also a quiet edition, but i wouldn't know if it's strong enough to keep my cpu cool, so i ask for your help.

I run the same cpu overclocked with a Cooler master heat sink and run the 120mm Cooler master fans throughout. These are have hardly any noise to them but my Nvidea card fans make loads of noise,so just make sure it's not your graphics card being loud.
 

G.Newell

Member
I'd still wait for DC.



and ATX

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-4670K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor (£163.00 @ Amazon UK)
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler (£25.45 @ Scan.co.uk)
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-Z97X-UD3H ATX LGA1150 Motherboard (£106.76 @ Scan.co.uk)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Blue 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive (£40.31 @ Amazon UK)
Case: Fractal Design Define R4 (Black Pearl) ATX Mid Tower Case (£79.53 @ Amazon UK)
Other: G.Skill 8GB (2x 4GB) Dual Channel Ares Series Memory Kit (DDR3 2133, 11-11-11-30, 1.6v, Intel XMP Extreme Memory Profile Ready) (£55.99)
Other: Crucial CT256MX100SSD1 256GB MX100 SATA 2.5 Inch 7mm SSD Includes 9.5mm Adapter (£74.81)
Other: be quiet! Pure Power L8 630W BN182 Modular 80+ Bronze 12cm Quiet Fan Braided Cables SLi/Xfire (£57.16)
Other: Windows 8 from reddit r/softwareswap (£10.15)
Total: £613.16
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-06-12 14:06 BST+0100)

And not even half your budget used! You could do stuff like upgrade the PSU (say a Gold one and fully modular), go to an i7 (you'll get little to no boost in most games that are around), bigger SSD if you wanted.

I have a £1000 budget and this was a first recommendation on what parts to get. This only uses just above half the budget so i was wondering where to upgrade parts on that list.

I will get the 512gb ssd mx100 instead and i've already bought a Sapphire AMD R9 290 TRI-X OC Graphics Card. Lastly i was looking at the corsair air 540 as a case to get. Where else can i upgrade?

Also is devils canyons worth the extra cost, i remember the early reviews were not amazing.
 
So they told me to try puttin the R9 in without using the 6-pin cable, this should start the card in safe mode or something. It still didn't work, my PC was completely dead when I pressed the power button.

So it should be the card, right? Dead on arrival.
 
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