DeathbyVolcano
Banned
Dance In My Blood said:
Donkey Kong Country 1 and 2 were piss easy!
IGN Posts Up More Project Cafe Hardware Power Rumors
- Thread starter Nirolak
- Start date
Donkey Kong Country 1 and 2 were piss easy!
lunchwithyuzo
Banned
DKCR sure, but NSMB Wii? The series of actions in that game is way more complex, and open, than any previous 2D Mario?Dance In My Blood said:
DragonKnight
Member
Amir0x said:
How can you be so wrong and yet so right within the same post? I mean Galaxy isn't my favorite game ever but it has at least the number three spot down pat. Great now I wanna play it again.
And the game (Pokemon) is primarily marketed to children. Give the game a break. I will give you this though. The teams...at least for the gym leaders and the Elite Four need to be randomized.
I find it laughable that Amir0x is saying the superguide is the result of nintendo catered to pussies.
That's missing the entire point of the superguide. The superguide allows nintendo to create more difficult levels to please hardcore fans while still giving casuals the ability to enjoy their games without too much frustration. Has the superguide built an environment that tolerates people who can't play video games well? Sure, but I hardly think that's too much reason for complaint when they're putting out games like NSMBWii, galaxy2, and DKCR, all of which are tough to 100% in their own right.
Also, anyone who says pokemon is simple rock paper scissors clearly hasn't played it since gold/silver at least. Are they easy games? Yeah, I guess. Are they easy to master? To be the very best? LIKE NO ONE EVER WAS? No, that takes quite a bit of patience and knowledge.
That's missing the entire point of the superguide. The superguide allows nintendo to create more difficult levels to please hardcore fans while still giving casuals the ability to enjoy their games without too much frustration. Has the superguide built an environment that tolerates people who can't play video games well? Sure, but I hardly think that's too much reason for complaint when they're putting out games like NSMBWii, galaxy2, and DKCR, all of which are tough to 100% in their own right.
Also, anyone who says pokemon is simple rock paper scissors clearly hasn't played it since gold/silver at least. Are they easy games? Yeah, I guess. Are they easy to master? To be the very best? LIKE NO ONE EVER WAS? No, that takes quite a bit of patience and knowledge.
The argument against super guide is like saying games shouldn't have selectable difficulty levels. Giving the designer and the players choice is always a better thing.
More importantly super guide is a great way to manage difficult in certain genres where a simple difficulty setting option wont be effective, like in a platformer for example.
More importantly super guide is a great way to manage difficult in certain genres where a simple difficulty setting option wont be effective, like in a platformer for example.
DragonKnight
Member
guek said:
herzogzwei1989
Banned
killermmn said:
I know but that does come until 2013 if I'm not mistaken.
Open? Compared to something like Mario 3 or Super Mario World? Both those games have much larger environments to accommodate lots of vertical movement and flying. I've always considered NSMB on both the DS and Wii to use the original Super Mario Bros. as a jumping off point.lunchwithyuzo said:
ElRenoRaven
Member
NEO0MJ said:
You're not alone. They're never fun. It's always a case of search for the new oxygen source.
Gamer @ Heart
Member
Dance In My Blood said:
Silly man, the books arent canon.
herzogzwei1989
Banned
17 days and counting.
lunchwithyuzo
Banned
That's level design, not mechanics. I'd agree NSMBWii is more contained or "boxy" and that's due to also supporting a 4 player design, but the end result isn't necessairily something I'd consider dumbed down either. Also, SMB3's levels are generally much smaller and shorter even.Dance In My Blood said:
Mechanics though, Mario himself has a much more complex moveset and the variables at play, especially with more players, is exponentially more complex than the NES or SNES games. 100%-ing 9-7 in NSMBWii is probably the most difficult single level in any 2D Mario game, and it's design really illustrates how well complex mechanics (wall jumping, floating, ice sliding) and feindish evironmental hazards (fire breathing Pirana plants in an ice block level) can marry with the game's capable design.
I also find it a little weird you make no distinction between NSMB games. Personally, I think the jump between DS and Wii is huge, more than comprable to something like SMB to SMB3.
I really enjoyed the minecart stages in DKCR, always wondered what some people complained when I first played it, great stuff! The things I didn't like about the game were collision detection, non-satisfying jump (and sfx) from enemies head (compared to NSMBW) and some of the bosses. And to me these were minor faults and did not take anything significant away from an amazing action game.
herzogzwei1989
Banned
chaosblade said:
More shaders beyond the 800 in RV770?
Death Dealer
Member
herzogzwei1989 said:
A smaller process will allow a faster clock speed than the original PC R700 family design, plus the progress of tech will allow better ram. Kinda doubt Nintendo would spec more shaders than 800, easier to bump up speeds and improve ram latency and bandwidth.
elrechazado
Banned
and don't we think that this will probably backfire when MS and sony inevitably make a jump beyond in say, 2 years?NSQuote said:
Father_Brain
Banned
elrechazao said:
This has been already said before in other Cafe threads, but it's extraordinarily implausible that the necessary tech to pull off Samaritan-quality graphics in a $400 console-sized box will exist in time for hardware launching in 2014, let alone earlier.
elrechazao said:
Well, depending on the plan for 'cafe', Nintendo can do the same thing again, 3 years after that. Not much use crystal-balling. Cafe could be an utter failure before those first two years are up, even. Or it could have become the default lead platform and the natural transition for all those Wii gamers with all those Wii games and peripherals.
We can't really predict anything without knowing more about the system, its 3rd party support, its hardware, the Nintendo first party lineup, the controller....
elrechazao said:
Absolutely not. brain_stew is the much more knowledgeable person here, but the thinking is that there's no way MS/Sony could come up with a console so advanced by 2014 that ports to Cafe's hardware shouldn't be fairly doable, as long as the RAM isn't too low.
Now, it's possible that MS/Sony will take a bloodbath on hardware and/or price it so high no one would buy it, but that doesn't seem especially likely. MS is just about to break even on the 360 generation after billions down with the Xbox, and the rumors have been for a couple of years now that Microsoft won't subsidize the 360 like the did with Xbox anymore. They have to sink/swim on their own merits. Sony has only just broken even on the hardware, to say nothing for the billions lost just this generation. Therefore, neither is likely to repeat an Xbox (which wasn't an impossible port to PS2, anyways) or PS3-like result again.
Obviously, we can't know for sure until everyone's cards (and middlewares) are on the table, but the extremely likely scenario is that porting to Cafe should be a GameCube-level simple task and not a Wii-level task.
ecosse_011172
Banned
Eurogamer have again today stated confidently that Cafe won't be much more powerful than PS360.
"What's more interesting is to think about the market reaction to a console which will launch six or seven years after the other HD systems, but only slightly out-match them in terms of graphical prowess."
"The downside is that it won't actually be any more graphically powerful than its rivals."
"What's more interesting is to think about the market reaction to a console which will launch six or seven years after the other HD systems, but only slightly out-match them in terms of graphical prowess."
"The downside is that it won't actually be any more graphically powerful than its rivals."
herzogzwei1989
Banned
True. Those things would allow for an almost-staggeringly powerful console using improved 2008 technology on a modern process.Death Dealer said:
Shin Johnpv
Member
To build on what donny was talking about. You also have to add on that I HIGHLY doubt that Sony and MS are going to wait till 2014 to launch their next consoles. Just wait till E3 and see how all the press and attention is going to be on Nintendo's next gen console. As I've said before in this thread, this is not Sega coming off the failure of the Sega CD, 32x, and Saturn. This is Nintendo coming off the insanely successful Wii that just kicked the 360's and PS3's collective asses. Do you really think Sony and MS are going to let Nintendo have the only next-gen console on the market for 2 years?
This announcement for E3 that they're going to be showing their next gen console just lit an assload of fires under the asses of MS and Sony. I guarantee both went into full OH SHIT need a new console ASAP mode when they caught wind of it. I would not be surprised to see one of them launch between end of 2012 and middle of 2013 with the other coming out end of 2013.
No way Sony and MS are letting Nintendo be the only next gen console for 2 years. Not happening. So anyone trying to say Sony or MS will be using Y-tech which will be ready in 2014 is just wrong. They're not going to wait that long.
This announcement for E3 that they're going to be showing their next gen console just lit an assload of fires under the asses of MS and Sony. I guarantee both went into full OH SHIT need a new console ASAP mode when they caught wind of it. I would not be surprised to see one of them launch between end of 2012 and middle of 2013 with the other coming out end of 2013.
No way Sony and MS are letting Nintendo be the only next gen console for 2 years. Not happening. So anyone trying to say Sony or MS will be using Y-tech which will be ready in 2014 is just wrong. They're not going to wait that long.
Smiles and Cries
Member
ecosse_011172 said:
this would be more like a Nintendo thing to do.
It would also put the other two companies at ease, they would not feel the need to rush out the next generation if Cafe is just matching this one.
IGN vs. Eurogamer FIGHT!
I would like the IGN's specs better
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
I'm still going with 'barely anymore powerful' for the Cafe. I know the rumoured specs, I know they're a sizable improvement, I just refuse to buy any of it until I know factually otherwise. I cannot, no matter how hard I try, see Nintendo jumping into any kind of high end hardware. They might say they're doing it, but stuff like the 3DS shows their interpretation of such things is very different to what most think.
In fact, I fully expect the Cafe's reveal to be seriously underwhelming on a graphical level. I expect a lot of ports from third parties that are a mix of looking exactly the same as their 360/PS3 counterparts, and looking worse because they've spent less time with the hardware. From Nintendo I expect them to be like any developer who started from scratch with this generation's hardware; still getting used to the power under the hood. I dont doubt Nintendo will make full use of it over time, but they'll be starting like scratch like everybody else did years ago, and their titles will show.
Maybe this is a stupid perspective to have, especially based on the rumours. Whatever. I dig Nintendo, I dig thier games, and I dig their technological quirks. But they're well and truly out of the hardware race as far as I care, and I expect them to play extremely conservative even when they claim they're not. It will be a 3DS situation.
EDIT: For what it's worth, I refuse to buy into any of IGN's hyperbolic bullshittery. I dont care what their analysis of the hardware is, or what they're sources told them. They have a history of talking shit and over estimating and now is not the time to forget that.
In fact, I fully expect the Cafe's reveal to be seriously underwhelming on a graphical level. I expect a lot of ports from third parties that are a mix of looking exactly the same as their 360/PS3 counterparts, and looking worse because they've spent less time with the hardware. From Nintendo I expect them to be like any developer who started from scratch with this generation's hardware; still getting used to the power under the hood. I dont doubt Nintendo will make full use of it over time, but they'll be starting like scratch like everybody else did years ago, and their titles will show.
Maybe this is a stupid perspective to have, especially based on the rumours. Whatever. I dig Nintendo, I dig thier games, and I dig their technological quirks. But they're well and truly out of the hardware race as far as I care, and I expect them to play extremely conservative even when they claim they're not. It will be a 3DS situation.
EDIT: For what it's worth, I refuse to buy into any of IGN's hyperbolic bullshittery. I dont care what their analysis of the hardware is, or what they're sources told them. They have a history of talking shit and over estimating and now is not the time to forget that.
Shin Johnpv said:
I'm sure Sony and MS are gonna speed things up a bit but I think they will also want to wait and see how well the cafe is received upon reveal and release on the market before retiring their current consoles. The Eurogamer article linked above, and other sites have argued well on why Sony and MS are in no rush to start the next cycle. And if the cafe debuts to underwhelming sales, like only matching or slightly exceeding 360 and PS3 like numbers I don't think Sony and MS will be in much of a hurry.
herzogzwei1989
Banned
Shin Johnpv said:
Agreed. I expect both Xbox3 and PS4 to be on the shelves no later than fall 2013.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
No, its a safe one. I feel the exact same.EatChildren said:
EatChildren said:
I've been saying this forever now, I firmly believe the cafe will be to the wii what the 3ds is to the ds. Significantly more powerful, with more modernized system features but still lagging behind in both power and system features when compared to their competitors.
IGN has always over sold graphical power talk in order to generate hits and get fans drooling.
Did the exact same thing with the 3ds.
And Nintendo is not abandoning the wide consumer base approach in order to "recapture the hardcore". That one line from one rumor is waaaay over valued. I feel confident that the cafe will be exactly what the 3ds is but with a better day 1 feature set and exactly what the Eurogamer article says it will be.
If the console allows you to play on the TV then continue on a little screen it would be a gigantic fail if Advance Wars is not a launch title.
Also, for games using both at the same time : Luigi Mansion with a ghost sensor on the padlet.
What are your ideas guys? Is it the thread to discuss them by the way?
Also, for games using both at the same time : Luigi Mansion with a ghost sensor on the padlet.
What are your ideas guys? Is it the thread to discuss them by the way?
herzogzwei1989
Banned
On another note, if Zelda Cafe looked like this improved Unreal Engine 3 tech-demo, I'd be a happy man.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5XahF-3DWo
It looks like a current-gen version of Twilight Princess.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5XahF-3DWo
It looks like a current-gen version of Twilight Princess.
From The Dust
Banned
I don't know who to believe. IGN loves hyperbole and I'm not sure of Eurogamer's track record. I hope for a good jump above PS360
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
artwalknoon said:
Exactly. I look forward to another generation of "nintendo abandoned the hardcore", especially from the dickheads I have to deal with, who write off every game on the Wii because the horsepower isn't cutting edge, and because it's not full of shitty dudebro shooters and cinematic wank.
For IGN, lets keep in mind this nugget of gold:
herzogzwei1989
Banned
From The Dust said:
RV770 would provide a 4-5x leap beyond PS360, and the RV740 would provide about a 3x leap.
From The Dust
Banned
herzogzwei1989 said:
I understand that. but with IGN, you can't be too careful. just look at their pre-3DS stuff
herzogzwei1989
Banned
From The Dust said:
Their pre-3DS stuff was outrageous. I think Cafe will end up being somewhere inbetween IGN and Eurogamers expectations.