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[Lunatic_Gamer]

The new interview came from Digital Foundry, where CD Projekt Red said that it will be making sure it doesn't make the same mistakes it did with Cyberpunk 2077 when it came to performance issues.

This time around, CD Projekt Red will be taking a console-first approach to ensure 60FPS stability. However, the studio acknowledges that the Xbox Series S will be extremely challening.

On the Xbox Series S and the 60FPS benchmark, it was said, "I will say that 60 FPS will definitely be extremely challenging on the Series S, let's just say that this something that we need to to figure out".

You can watch the full interview by Digital Foundry below:

https://insider-gaming.com/the-witcher-4-series-s-will-be-extremely-challenging/

 

[rodrigolfp]

This time around, CD Projekt Red will be taking a console-first approach to ensure 60FPS stability.

Good.

 

[Moses85]

60 FPS / 480p

 

[jm89]

They mentioned they are doing "console first development"

Hopefully with that approach no shit show like cyberpunk

 

[Gaiff]

>60fps target
>Consoles first
>UE5

CDPR are such morons it's astounding.

Also, what do you mean "Insider Gaming". This is DF.

 

[Punished Miku]

I'm sure they'll figure out something. And then port it to Switch 2 after that. Its not like Series S hasn't had 30 fps games before.

 

[Connificent]

 

[SJRB]

By the time this game releases we'll be two, maybe even three years down the line. Xbox console sales will have tanked even further, even less people will play on an Xbox S.

Just don't release on Xbox. Stop letting that retarded Xbox S hold you back.

 

[Skifi28]

Some people were saying "it's just a tech demo, it doesn't mean anything" but when you deliberately make a 60fps showing on a specific console, it's a statement in itself. I don't know how well the final product will turn out, but setting such a target early in development can only be good news.

 

[cormack12]

Good, leave it at 30fps then. Everyone knew what they were buying with the Series S.

Using console as the base makes even more sense now. PC players can up their HD textures, shadows and draw distance and just get native higher frames without needing framegen.

Everyone wins

 

[RodriGames40]

>60fps target
>Consoles first
>UE5

CDPR are such morons it's astounding.

Also, what do you mean "Insider Gaming". This is DF.

Did you watch the presentation?

 

[GigaBowser]

cdpr arm love nintendos 30fps switch 2 come soon bookmarked

 

[Donald mac Ronald]

Ah another game being held back by series shit.

Thanks Phil

 

[Gaiff]

Did you watch the presentation?

Yes, and they're utter morons. They want to have a "solid foundation", which also means they'll also have to massively pare back the visuals. They say scaling up is easier than scaling down. Yeah, it also makes your games uglier.

All the UE5 stuff they preach about is also insanely demanding on hardware. The end result will very likely be a meh looking game, but at least it will have a consistent performance, assuming UE5 doesn't fuck everyone over.

Dumb decision. Target 30 and go balls to the walls with the visuals. It will be 2027 by the time the game hits the market.

 

[Verchod]

Surely this game won't be or for several years.
This generation of Xbox will either of been replaced or just irrelevant by then. Don't target it.

 

[kevboard]

I don't think anyone would be shocked it it's 30fps on Series S

 

[nial]

By the time this game releases we'll be two, maybe even three years down the line. Xbox console sales will have tanked even further, even less people will play on an Xbox S.

Just don't release on Xbox. Stop letting that retarded Xbox S hold you back.

They'll have to make a PS6P version, so I don't think it matters much.

 

[RodriGames40]

Yes, and they're utter morons. They want to have a "solid foundation", which also means they'll also have to massively pare back the visuals. They say scaling up is easier than scaling down. Yeah, it also makes your games uglier.

All the UE5 stuff they preach about is also insanely demanding on hardware. The end result will very likely be a meh looking game, but at least it will have a consistent performance, assuming UE5 doesn't fuck everyone over.

They are not pairing back anything, what are you talking about? They had an over 30 minutes presentation at the Unreal Fest explaining their whole journey to achieve 60 FPS on the PS5, down to frametime costs, engine breakthroughs and goals. All of these new features are prioritizing performance over anything else, it's the first thing the CDProjekt reps talked about.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

By the time this game releases we'll be two, maybe even three years down the line. Xbox console sales will have tanked even further, even less people will play on an Xbox S.

Just don't release on Xbox. Stop letting that retarded Xbox S hold you back.

That's why the next couple of years is going to be so interesting.

You have probably 80 million PS5s by now, 15 million series s, and 15 million series x... When you consider the drop off in active users who buy B2P games on Xbox Series, you'd not only have to imagine some devs will make the decision to drop support, but more it highlights what I said in another thread about Sony not moneyhatting games against Xbox moving forward. There's literally zero financial incentive to do this.

The only reasons to put games on xbox series now is as follows:

• Game shows up on GamePass, i.e. is funded via GamePass
• Hoping that the next xbox even if it is a PC will play existing Series games and might find SOME market
• Keeping Sony honest, which will probably lean more towards NSW2

 

[Gaiff]

They are not pairing back anything, what are you talking about?

Of course they are. It's a zero-sum game. You can't say you're not paring things back with a 60fps target compared to a 30fps. I doubt GTA VI with a 60fps target would look as good as it does. A 60fps mode isn't off the table, but 30fps is evidently what the game was built around.

They had an over 30 minutes presentation at the Unreal Fest explaining their whole journey to achieve 60 FPS on the PS5, down to frametime costs, engine breakthroughs and goals. All of these new features are prioritizing performance over all costs, it's the first thing mentioned to begin with.

Which in no way addresses what I said. They said themselves in the video that scaling up is easier than scaling down, ie, it's easier to aim for higher performance on lower-end hardware and scale things up than the other way around because downgrading visuals doesn't necessarily give good results.

 

[RodriGames40]

Of course they are. It's a zero-sum game. You can't say you're not paring things back with a 60fps target compared to a 30fps. I doubt GTA VI with a 60fps target would look as good as it does. A 60fps mode isn't off the table, but 30fps is evidently what the game was built around.

This is fanfiction from your part, there's a whole section solely explaining how they scaled hardware lumen accordingly through distance fields to fit a 16.6ms target. UE5 is over 150% faster than it was back in 2020, the Matrix Demo could easily run today at 60 frames with overhead to spare. "30 FPS is evidently what it was built around", did you watch the presentation again?

Which in no way addresses what I said. They said themselves in the video that scaling up is easier than scaling down, ie, it's easier to aim for higher performance on lower-end hardware and scale things up than the other way around.

And...? What's the problem with this? If anything, the scale down approach caused them many problems that are literally mentioned in the presentation. You think you know better than the engineering leads at the studio?

 

[Punished Miku]

That's why the next couple of years is going to be so interesting.

You have probably 80 million PS5s by now, 15 million series s, and 15 million series x... When you consider the drop off in active users who buy B2P games on Xbox Series, you'd not only have to imagine some devs will make the decision to drop support, but more it highlights what I said in another thread about Sony not moneyhatting games against Xbox moving forward. There's literally zero financial incentive to do this.

The only reasons to put games on xbox series now is as follows:

• Game shows up on GamePass, i.e. is funded via GamePass
• Hoping that the next xbox even if it is a PC will play existing Series games and might find SOME market
• Keeping Sony honest, which will probably lean more towards NSW2

Its really not that interesting. Put out the version you can on S. Make it PA. Next gen you'll have access to a top of the line PC version also if you want it. Its not any different than making a game run well on PC and Steam Deck.

Ports are going to be plentiful for Switch 2 for the next 7 years.

 

[Kenpachii]

Drop current gen console support, focus on PS6 and PC in 2027.

 

[memoryman3]

It will likely just be 30fps on Series S…and with no Switch 2 version, as that would take more work than the Witcher 3 port.

 

[Senua]

"Insider gaming"

Give DF the credit it's their interview

 

[Gaiff]

This is fanfiction from your part,

They literally tell you how scaling up is easier than scaling down. That's how it's always worked and CDPR didn't invent magic to get around this. There are many things that don't necessarily scale down unless you remove them completely or lower them so much they don't even look the same.

there's a whole section solely explaining how they scaled hardware lumen accordingly through distance fields to fit a 16.6ms target. UE5 is over 150% faster than it was back in 2020, the Matrix Demo could easily run today at 60 frames with overhead to spare.

And once again this has nothing to do with what I said. Yeah, you can scale stuff up and down, who's arguing this? What's being argued is that a dev making a game targeting 30fps will have a much easier time making a gorgeous-looking game than a dev targeting 60fps and then upping the visuals for a 30fps mode. Take FF XVI, gorgeous game at 30fps on PS5. Looks like dirt in the 60fps mode.

"30 FPS is evidently what it was built around", did you watch the presentation again?

Talking about GTA VI.

And...? What's the problem with this? If anything, the scale down approach caused them many problems that are literally mentioned in the presentation. You think you know better than the engineering leads at the studio?

Yeah, Cyberpunk, which was them attempting to run a game that just had no business running on last-gen consoles.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Its really not that interesting. Put out the version you can on S. Make it PA. Next gen you'll have access to a top of the line PC version also if you want it. Its not any different than making a game run well on PC and Steam Deck.

Ports are going to be plentiful for Switch 2 for the next 7 years.

Explain how that's more beneficial than just releasing a PC version?

I get why you personally would want that, but whats in it for the dev/publisher?

It's very different from making a game on PC and optimizing it for Steam Deck. You're literally taking the same game and just playing with the quality settings for Steam Deck, not compiling a new version running on specific hardware and even then plenty of games don't get Steam Deck certified. In most cases, devs are just putting steam deck icons in the game and not actually optimizing for Steam Deck and still get steam deck certified... people complaining about stem deck certified or even playable credentials are littered through the steam community...

 

[Punished Miku]

Explain how that's more beneficial than just releasing a PC version?

I get why you personally would want that, but whats in it for the dev/publisher?

It's very different from making a game on PC and optimizing it for Steam Deck. You're literally taking the same game and just playing with the quality settings for Steam Deck, not compiling a new version running on specific hardware and even then plenty of games don't get Steam Deck certified. In most cases, devs are just putting steam deck icons in the game and not actually optimizing for Steam Deck and still get steam deck certified... people complaining about stem deck certified or even playable credentials are littered through the steam community...

Theyre in the business of selling video games. I dont know if they despise Xbox customers as much as people here do. They just did that Witcher 3 Xbox controller.

 

[RodriGames40]

They literally tell you how scaling up is easier than scaling down. That's how it's always worked and CDPR didn't invent magic to get around this.

What's your point with this? They learned their lesson and are now scaling up from now on, somehow this is a negative for you?

And once again this has nothing to do with what I said. Yeah, you can scale stuff up and down, who's arguing this? What's being argued is that a dev making a game targeting 30fps will have a much easier time making a gorgeous-looking game than a dev targeting 60fps and then upping the visuals for a 30fps mode. Take FF XVI, gorgeous game at 30fps on PS5. Looks like dirt in the 60fps mode.

You don't know what you are arguing about to begin with. They never targeted 30 FPS for The Witcher 4, not even this early tech demo is aiming for 30, whether they could make a better looking game at that framerate is completely irrelevant for CDProjekt's case. FF XVI's situation is not their situation and neither is GTA VI's, what do you even mean?

Talking about GTA VI.

What has freaking GTA VI to do with The Witcher 4 in a completely different engine?

Yeah, Cyberpunk, which was them attempting to run a game that just had no business running on last-gen consoles.

It wasn't just that. Again, it's mentioned in the video that even their PC build was far from perfect due to REDEngine simply not scaling well across specs, not just those of last gen consoles. If this is an attempt to dig at UE5, you are failing miserably at it.

 

[ProtoByte]

Based on what they showed/said I'd be surprised if this game comes out even by 2027. I'm honestly thinking 2028. Might be easier to just cancel the Xbox Series versions altogether at that point.

 

[Kenneth Haight]

 

[Schmendrick]

Good.

Shit.

 

[Memati187]

Lmao, go straight for 576i/50hz/25fps for the series S, problem solved.

 

[Arsic]

Simple solution:
Don't make a Xbox version.

Make Xbox drop this dung heap requirement it has to run on S. It has the lowest attach rate. It cannot be worth the development time and sacrifices made to put this thing on either Xbox.

Put it on PS5 and PC. Be done with it.

 

[rodrigolfp]

Shit.

30fps, yeah.

 

[adamsapple]

Simple solution:
Don't make a Xbox version.

Simpler solution, don't aim for 60fps on Series S.

Lots of games launched without 60fps modes on Series S which had them on a series X, including CDPR's own Cyberpunk.

 

[memoryman3]

When you consider the drop off in active users who buy B2P games on Xbox Series

Make Xbox drop this dung heap requirement it has to run on S. It has the lowest attach rate

So, do we have proof that Xbox players don't buy games outside of Game Pass? Or at a lower rate than PlayStation players?

 

[ShaiKhulud1989]

Series aS Potato as it gets

 

[Gaiff]

What's your point with this? They learned their lesson and are now scaling up from now on, somehow this is a negative for you?

My point is that they'll be targeting 60fps in a game on consoles in 2027. This means the 30fps mode will not be as good looking as if it was the target to begin with. It's the secondary mode, not the primary one.

You don't know what you are arguing about to begin with. They never targeted 30 FPS for The Witcher 4, not even this early tech demo is aiming for 30, whether they could make a better looking game at that framerate is completely irrelevant for CDProjekt's case. FF XVI's situation is not their situation and neither is GTA VI's, what do you even mean?

What has freaking GTA VI to do with The Witcher 4 in a completely different engine?

This situation isn't unique to CDPR, or Rockstar, or anyone else. It's a reality that has been around us since game development began. Targeting 30fps will produce a better looking game than targeting 60 and then dialing things back to hit 30.

It wasn't just that. Again, it's mentioned in the video that even their PC build was far from perfect due to REDEngine simply not scaling well across platforms, not just last gen consoles. If this is an attempt to dig at UE5, you are failing miserably at it.

When was it this mentioned? Timestamp? It's not a "dig" at UE5. UE5 has just failed us colossally so far. I don't need to say anything about it. The results speak for themselves.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Theyre in the business of selling video games. I dont know if they despise Xbox customers as much as people here do. They just did that Witcher 3 Xbox controller.

I wasn't talking about CDPR and no one is saying companies "hate xbox." It's just a matter of when it isn't financially feasible to support the platform.

So, do we have proof that Xbox players don't buy games outside of Game Pass? Or at a lower rate than PlayStation players?

We've seen it on UK charts, yes.

 

[FireFly]

Yes, and they're utter morons. They want to have a "solid foundation", which also means they'll also have to massively pare back the visuals. They say scaling up is easier than scaling down. Yeah, it also makes your games uglier.

All the UE5 stuff they preach about is also insanely demanding on hardware. The end result will very likely be a meh looking game, but at least it will have a consistent performance, assuming UE5 doesn't fuck everyone over.

Dumb decision. Target 30 and go balls to the walls with the visuals. It will be 2027 by the time the game hits the market.

What was shown in the demo was effectively what you would expect to see in a 30 FPS mode, running at a reasonable resolution. GTA 6 runs at close to 1440p and looks nice and sharp, while the demo runs at an 800p lower bound and looks very soft. I really hope they don't push for more on the base consoles, so 1440p30 is still on the table.

Of course they may degrade the image quality in the 60 FPS mode to raise the resolution, but that remains to be seen.

 

[scydrex]

Just do 30fps on series S and be done with it.

 

[hemo memo]

If WB can port Hogwarts Legacy to the Switch, then CDPR can port W4 to Series S. Whether it is worthwhile is a different matter.

 

[RodriGames40]

My point is that they'll be targeting 60fps in a game on consoles in 2027. This means the 30fps mode will not be as good looking as if it was the target to begin with. It's the secondary mode, not the primary one.

That conundrum has nothing to do with The Witcher 4, you are seeing ghosts if this is a concern to you.

This situation isn't unique to CDPR, or Rockstar, or anyone else. It's a reality that has been around us since game development began. Targeting 30fps will produce a better looking game than targeting 60 and then dialing things back to hit 30.

It does not matter in this case. Epic has been consistently tailoring UE5 in the last couple years to target 60 frames per second no matter what, and this is the game they want to show what the engine can do now that it is actually optimized.

When was it this mentioned? Timestamp? It's not a "dig" at UE5. UE5 has just failed us colossally so far. I don't need to say anything about it. The results speak for themselves.

The section for how was RedEngine designed got you covered. It did not scale well for anything but the very high PC specs they targeted, and as soon as complexity increased even the features they had planned for those fell apart. It took a lot of work to even make it multithreaded, UE5 being significantly easier now that they have Epic backing them. Saying it has failed us is true but also dishonest, feel free to blame Epic for saving the massive optimizations for the 5.5 and 5.6 engine releases that no developer has shipped on so far.

 

[amigastar]

I think it will look close to the Demo we've seen, minus all the npc in the town.

 

[FrankWza]

Another gargantuan task brought on by the albatross.

 

[JayK47]

Why are they even talking about current gen? This will be a next gen game when it comes out in 2028. And I would hope it does run at 60 fps.

 

[Gaiff]

That conundrum has nothing to do with The Witcher 4, you are seeing ghosts if this is a concern to you.

This conundrum affects every dev. What are you talking about?

It does not matter in this case.

lol.

Epic has been consistently tailoring UE5 in the last couple years to target 60 frames per second no matter what, and this is the game they want to show what the engine can do now that it is actually optimized.

And what are the results so far?

The section for how was RedEngine designed got you covered. It did not scale well for anything but the very high PC specs they targeted, and as soon as complexity increased even the features they had planned for those fell apart. It took a lot of work to even make it multithreaded, UE5 being significantly easier now that they have Epic backing them. Saying it has failed us is true but also dishonest, feel free to blame Epic for saving the massive optimizations for the 5.5 and 5.6 engine releases that no developer has shipped on so far.

I asked for the timestamp, not your paraphrasing.

 

[Mr Moose]

If Ubisoft can port Hogwarts Legacy to the Switch, then CDPR can port W4 to Series S. Whether it is worthwhile is a different matter.

 

[adamsapple]

Capcom's upcoming Snake Eater Delta also looks nice.