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[Grover]

erm... what? if you life with your girlfriend/wife, most parts of the home and the decoration will be mandated by her and most women don't wanna see stiupid toys from manchildren in their livingspace.
a "mancave" is perfectly acceptebal.

but woman aren't the victim in that scenario?

 

[Vampire On Titus]

Preaching to the converted? SJW became a bannable word on GAF almost immediately after it became a thing.

The funny thing is, outside of GAF, I thought it actually became a pretty useful word to describe the relatively new culture of people who abrasively rage on the internet in the name of liberal issues. I've seen many liberals themselves use it - and not ironically or sarcastically.

Not everyone who is a liberal or in favour of liberal activism thinks the phenomenon of liberal ragers are a good thing.

It's definetely not a good thing.

I dislike the word for the reasons I posted previously. However, I feel like the reaction of immediately dismissing anyone who uses it is handwaving a problem in the left that absolutely does exist. Other terms like "regressive left" have come up as a means of describing this behavior. Also people noting the differences in values as an cultural authoritarian/libertarian split. Another big problem with the term "SJW" is also that it always sounds like a good thing to me. Even used in a negative context. I think anyone unfamiliar with the behavior would think the term sounded like a good thing as well.

 

[GamerJM]

I'd say using the term "politically correct," might be more annoying, just because in 99% of instances it's usually synonymous with "doesn't go out of their way to be an asshole to minority or oppressed groups," but the person saying it doesn't want to admit that. It feels like a term that has a more vague definition, I guess. But both are really annoying.

 

[GeordieMark]

Of course, when used as a direct dismissal of a person.

When used in generalities "those SJW types..." it refers to a shorthand that we all understand. Again I've seen liberals default to it because it's very descriptive. It's akin to the word "white knight" that was popular in feminist circles a few years ago.

When I hear "those SJWs" from a liberal, I instantly know what they mean: typically a younger millennial, maybe someone who was brought up with liberal politics and lacks nuance on the subjects beyond a first or second year college course, raging about it in all caps on tumblr or Facebook. It's not just being a liberal advocate: It's those people who seem to be shadow boxing "enemies" with every sanctimonious word.

But hey. I wouldn't use the word. I know too well how it's also associated with some real cavemen...

Yeah, Its the smart-ass, accusing tone, and air of smug superiority that accompanies a message, rather than the message itself that results in labels like that.

 

[K.Sabot]

Oh, how about 'Bernie Bros'.

The good ol' Fox News "lable and dismiss" tactic. Very effective and very scummy, the left finds out how powerful it is every election season.

 

[Arozay]

X-gate and x-culture are probably worse.

 

[kavanf1]

Sexy Jehovah's Witness

 

[silvermember]

I get that, but I feel like at least part of the whole "we're on the side of righteousness" means "I act better than the jackasses I fight." Judging people by context and actual meaning rather than shutting down like a bot edit filter because you hear a word does no one any service.

There is no side of righteousness, in debates relating to unfairness and the treatment of others. There is only those with empathy and does without empathy.

But let's assume what you said is true about righteousness. Righteousness doesn't mean you have to give people not worth your time, a moment of your time. Sometimes the best thing you can do is simply ignore the unrighteous, since most internet debates are worthless. People on websites rarely ever change, so why bother.

Humans spend a lot time filtering unnecessary information.

 

[Gotdatmoney]

Men's Rights Onion Knights

How dare you. When they reach level 100 no one will be able to stop them. Be patient.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

15 years ago, children complained when online communities run by adults didn't tolerate calling people gay or fags. Now people call adults PC or SJWs when online communities don't tolerate racism, homophobia, transphobia, or sexism.

The issue for people who unironically use SJW is they're so insulated from critical thinking that they get totally confused on where the line is drawn when it's obvious to anyone who actually interacts with people different than themselves. "Cuck" is an even sadder modern way of calling someone a fag.

 

[Inferno313]

Bernie Bro is just code for millennial.

No, "Bernie Bro" is in some ways, similar to the original usage of SJW that's being discussed in this thread. Bernie Bros are typically white young men whose support for Bernie Sanders outweighs their commitment to human decency.

Remember when people were criticizing Bernie for not recognizing Black Lives Matter? Which, ended up being a net positive as it really improved his approach to those issues. However, during that time, a large number of Bernie's white supporters were harassing the members of Black Lives Matter for, as they claimed, not recognizing that Bernie was their best option, and that they should just shut up and support him.

Those are Bernie Bros.

 

[Grover]

I'd say using the term "politically correct," might be more annoying, just because in 99% of instances it's usually synonymous with "doesn't go out of their way to be an asshole to minority or oppressed groups,"

"bob did you know we cant even turn away the gays anymore?"
"well chris things are very pc these days"

 

[shadowsdarknes]

This guy probably isn't fond of social justice warriors.

 

[studyguy]

I dunno I just can't be arsed to care about people who bicker over internet terminology when it's completely irrelevant to my day to day. I'm simply never surrounded by the type of people who are impacted by any of this 'my way or the highway' online shit in any way shape or form. Controversial issues or not, it's nowhere near as hyperbolic in person as it is online.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

No, "Bernie Bro" is in some ways, similar to the original usage of SJW that's being discussed in this thread. Bernie Bros are typically white young men whose support for Bernie Sanders outweighs their commitment to human decency.

Remember when people were criticizing Bernie for not recognizing Black Lives Matter? Which, ended up being a net positive as it really improved his approach to those issues. However, during that time, a large number of Bernie's white supporters were harassing the members of Black Lives Matter for, as they claimed, not recognizing that Bernie was their best option, and that they should just shut up and support him.

Those are Bernie Bros.

Yeah I associate all the Bernie related insults with the type of person who put their fingers in their ears and parroted "Bernie marched with MLK" instead of actually engaging with black people. Bernie knows how to listen to others and work on himself and his message. Some of his supporters don't get it, because they don't want to.

 

[PSqueak]

My girlfriend has decorated about 99% of the house with minimal input from me.

My office space is organized to my liking and is the closest thing I have to a man cave. And I plan to have a semblance of a man cave/theater room in my next house.

It's not going to be an anti-woman room at all.

I really have no idea what you're talking about. A man referring to his space of the house that was driven largely by his input (as opposed to the rest of the house) is not inherently some anti-woman sentiment.

But why does it need a distinction? You don't call the rest of the house the "woman cave" or anything, why can't it be called the Theater room, the Entertainment room, or you know, just the lounge?

Imagine you invite a bunch of friends, both male and female, what would sound better to everyone "This is my man cave" or "this is the theater room, which i designed myself"?

Calling it the Man cave reeks of insecurity, exclussion and the need to assert some sort of dominion which is incredibly silly for what is a glorified lounge.

 

[Coffee Dog]

There is no side of righteousness, in debates relating to unfairness and the treatment of others. There is only those with empathy and does without empathy.

But let's assume what you said is true about righteousness. Righteousness doesn't mean you have to give people not worth your time, a moment of your time. Sometimes the best thing you can do is simply ignore the unrighteous, since most internet debates are worthless. People on websites rarely ever change, so why bother.

Humans spend a lot time filtering unnecessary information.

Exactly. people who don't know how to talk properly on the internet like we have learned, are simply not worth considering. should have known better than to use the words that we make assumptions towards. :^)

 

[Tal Shiar Agent]

But why does it need a distinction? You don't call the rest of the house the "woman cave" or anything, why can't it be called the Theater room, the Entertainment room, or you know, just the lounge?

Imagine you invite a bunch of friends, both male and female, what would sound better to everyone "This is my man cave" or "this is the theater room, which i designed myself"?

Calling it the Man cave reeks of insecurity, exclussion and the need to assert some sort of dominion which is incredibly silly for what is a glorified lounge.

Exactly my point. When man is used as an adjective like that it just denotes insecurity and toxic masculinity.


Masculinity is both toxic and fragile.

 

[Cagey]

Of course, when used as a direct dismissal of a person.

When used in generalities "those SJW types..." it refers to a shorthand that we all understand. Again I've seen liberals default to it because it's very descriptive. It's akin to the word "white knight" that was popular in feminist circles a few years ago.

When I hear "those SJWs" from a liberal, I instantly know what they mean: typically a younger millennial, maybe someone who was brought up with liberal politics and lacks nuance on the subjects beyond a first or second year college course, raging about it in all caps on tumblr or Facebook. It's not just being a liberal advocate: It's those people who seem to be shadow boxing "enemies" with every sanctimonious word.

But hey. I wouldn't use the word. I know too well how it's also associated with some real cavemen...

Which is the irony in the "reverse dog whistle" claims about the term itself.

 

[Corronchilejano]

erm... what? if you life with your girlfriend/wife, most parts of the home and the decoration will be mandated by her and most women don't wanna see stiupid toys from manchildren in their livingspace.
a "mancave" is perfectly acceptebal.

I've a shelf full off all my D&D stuff and my gf doesn't mind at all it being in the living room.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

But why does it need a distinction? You don't call the rest of the house the "woman cave" or anything, why can't it be called the Theater room, the Entertainment room, or you know, just the lounge?

Imagine you invite a bunch of friends, both male and female, what would sound better to everyone "This is my man cave" or "this is the theater room, which i designed myself"?

Calling it the Man cave reeks of insecurity, exclussion and the need to assert some sort of dominion which is incredibly silly for what is a glorified lounge.

This is how I see it. I don't give a shit if someone wants a "man cave," but that term is going to make it clear to others that you have some insecurity about yourself. Like candles for men.

 

[Inferno313]

I've a shelf full off all my D&D stuff and my gf doesn't mind at all it being in the living room.

*Fistbump*

I've got a shelf full of Amiibo in the living room, and my GF has a shelf full of Harry Potter Funko POPs.

I've got a poster of Batman next to my side of the bed and she's got a poster of Harry Potter.

It's a good way to live.

 

[injurai]

This is how I see it. I don't give a shit if someone wants a "man cave," but that term is going to make it clear to others that you have some insecurity about yourself. Like candles for men.

My friend has a "man cave" and he keeps a well stocked supply of candles. It's called a man cave not because of what goes in it, but because a guy decors it and sets it up to his liking. That is all.

 

[kirblar]

Preaching to the converted? SJW became a bannable word on GAF almost immediately after it became a thing.

The funny thing is, outside of GAF, I thought it actually became a pretty useful word to describe the relatively new culture of people who abrasively rage on the internet in the name of liberal issues. I've seen many liberals themselves use it - and not ironically or sarcastically, or just to describe opponents.

Not everyone who is a liberal or in favour of liberal activism thinks the phenomenon of liberal ragers are a good thing.

The problem is that without very specific context, you can't tell if someone's using it in the original sense or in the way it's used by the right wing today (such as by Bill O'Reilly on Faux News) where it means "any progressive" instead of "person who uses progressive ideas as a pretense to be an asshole to people."

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

My friend has a "man cave" and he keeps a well stocked supply of candles. It's called a man cave not because of what goes in it, but because a guy decors it and sets it up to his liking. That is all.

But we just call a place decorated by a woman a "house" or "apartment." Why wouldn't his own space be named similarly?

 

[DrGonzo615]

But why does it need a distinction? You don't call the rest of the house the "woman cave" or anything, why can't it be called the Theater room, the Entertainment room, or you know, just the lounge?

Imagine you invite a bunch of friends, both male and female, what would sound better to everyone "This is my man cave" or "this is the theater room, which i designed myself"?

Calling it the Man cave reeks of insecurity, exclussion and the need to assert some sort of dominion which is incredibly silly for what is a glorified lounge.

What difference does it make to you what somebody calls a room in their house? Ive never heard "man cave" in a manner that wasnt tongue-in-cheek BTW.

 

[Coffee Dog]

The problem is that without very specific context, you can't tell if someone's using it in the original sense or in the way it's used by the right wing today (such as by Bill O'Reilly on Faux News) where it means "any progressive" instead of "person who uses progressive ideas as a pretense to be an asshole to people."

I mean, this problem could be solved by simply asking them to explain, thereby starting a conversation between two people who might not have the same (or even similar) perspectives, or maybe someone you agree with that is simply using a different interpretation of the word.

However, this would require engaging with someone's opinion and it's just easier to assume when you're right 95% of the time anyway.

 

[Jenenser]

but woman aren't the victim in that scenario?

i think calling it "victim" is to much.

you could argue that the man is the "victim" in the first place if he isn't allowed to display his shit in the livingroom.

and yes, i would give my woman the full control over every other room and i would let her decide how she wants to decorate it.

if shes ok with your shit everywhere, than a mancave is not needed.

I've a shelf full off all my D&D stuff and my gf doesn't mind at all it being in the living room.

if this is the case, no mancave needed. (but i bet you had more useless stuff before you 2 moved together and you had to throw some or it is boxed up and in some storagespace.

 

[Grover]

I've a shelf full off all my D&D stuff and my gf doesn't mind at all it being in the living room.

thats because she gets together with her gal pals to roll some characters when you leave the house

"time for a wisdom saving throw Brittany"

 

[The Kree]

It's not more annoying than those other words they're afraid to say in it's place.

 

[RedNumberFive]

This whole "man cave" thing is a pretty strange thing to get worked up about. Have we really run out of more important things to get offended at? How does having a beer tap, some sports memorabilia, and a plasma screen in the basement promote "toxic masculinity"? You've got to pick your battles here.

 

[injurai]

But we just call a place decorated by a woman a "house" or "apartment."

That's not true. A guy can decorate those as well. A man cave is just the room that is explicitly setup by a guy to reflect his interest and hobbies. A room where he might escape for some alone time. Women have rooms like these too, just women cave or lady cave never caught on for obvious reasons.

These rooms when not really setup to reflect a single person are usually just called a den, the study, the office, etc.

 

[FStop7]

"skinny fat" is the one that irritates me the most. Someone using that in a serious manner is insta-ignored.

 

[PSqueak]

What difference does it make to you what somebody calls a room in their house? Ive never heard "man cave" in a manner that wasnt tongue-in-cheek BTW.

In the greater scheme of things, it doesn't matter what a room is called, but you know, you might have noticed already, but we are in a thread discussing terms that people find annoying, and wouldn't you know it, "man cave" is one a bunch of people find annoying, does it matter? not really, but you can bet your marbles it is totally on topic.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

This whole "man cave" thing is a pretty strange thing to get worked up about. Have we really run out of more important things to get offended at? How does having a beer tap, some sports memorabilia, and a plasma screen in the basement promote "toxic masculinity"? You've got to pick your battles here.

No one's offended by it. Just seems like people insecure that others caught on to their insecurity. It's no different than laughing at all the "FOR MEN" branded shit some dudes can't not buy over the alternatives. Axe survives on these dudes, and it's gotten so far that diet soda has spinoffs just for dudes who can't buy the word "diet." I really really don't give a shit what people call their rooms

 

[Platy]

erm... what? if you life with your girlfriend/wife, most parts of the home and the decoration will be mandated by her and most women don't wanna see stiupid toys from manchildren in their livingspace.
a "mancave" is perfectly acceptebal.

There are lots of problems on this, including but not only : Dictatorship in decoration, neither of you liking (or acepting) what other like and you having to "hide" the stuff you like

 

[entremet]

In the greater scheme of things, it doesn't matter what a room is called, but you know, you might have noticed already, but we are in a thread discussing terms that people find annoying, and wouldn't you know it, "man cave" is one a bunch of people find annoying, does it matter? not really, but you can bet your marbles it is totally on topic.

The whole thing started not so much because of the term but some posters arguing it promotes toxic masculinity.

That's were the contention comes from.

I don't care for the term myself.

 

[TheLostBigBoss]

Social Justice Paladin

That works

Always going on about their alignment and how right they are, and how anyone who deviates from lawful good is horrible.

So annoying!

 

[Corronchilejano]

This whole "man cave" thing is a pretty strange thing to get worked up about. Have we really run out of more important things to get offended at? How does having a beer tap, some sports memorabilia, and a plasma screen in the basement promote "toxic masculinity"? You've got to pick your battles here.

Cringing at something doesn't mean it offends you, you just dislike it. That means nothing, no one gets worked up by it.

I find musicals cringe worthy, that doesn't mean they offend me.

 

[RowdyReverb]

I dislike the term "Dudebro". It's vague and used too often to dismiss characters with some degree of male bonding.

 

[PSqueak]

thats because she gets together with her gal pals to roll some characters when you leave the house

"time for a wisdom saving throw Brittany"

Now im just picturing him entering his house and finding his GF and a bunch of her friends playing D&D and they just stare at him awkwardly for a moment until he quietly leaves.

 

[kirblar]

I mean, this problem could be solved by simply asking them to explain, thereby starting a conversation between two people who might not have the same (or even similar) perspectives, or maybe someone you agree with that is simply using a different interpretation of the word.

However, this would require engaging with someone's opinion and it's just easier to assume when you're right 95% of the time anyway.

I can do context.

I've learned a lot of other people simply can't. Learning to lowest-common-denominator your speech patterns is an unfortunate reality of the world.

 

[Jonm1010]

But we just call a place decorated by a woman a "house" or "apartment." Why wouldn't his own space be named similarly?

Call it a man cave, a game room, whatever.

What you are speaking about speaks simply to the function and design of the room. A room that essentielly is designed around a particular guys interests. Typically sports, games, social interaction and movies. Woman often have these type of hobby rooms in middle to affluent houses as well.

Trying to extrapolate this to some generalization about men who use the term is the definition of reaching.

Most times man caves exist because a man feels his influence isn't given much say in the rest of the house or because he understands his hobbies do not exactly need to be spread out all over the rest of the communal space of a house and ham up the aesthetic. That is my experience working part time for an interior design company through college.

 

[RedNumberFive]

No one's offended by it. Just seems like people insecure that others caught on to their insecurity. It's no different than laughing at all the "FOR MEN" branded shit some dudes can't not buy over the alternatives. Axe survives on these dudes, and it's gotten so far that diet soda has spinoffs just for dudes who can't buy the word "diet." I really really don't give a shit what people call their rooms

So what you're saying is that if you're not proudly displaying your amiibo collection in your dining room, you're somehow insecure? Confining your hobbies to a man cave instead of having to brush aside 10-sided die, is toxic masculinity? It just seems like one of those things you do when you become an adult.

 

[cubicle47b]

But why does it need a distinction? You don't call the rest of the house the "woman cave" or anything, why can't it be called the Theater room, the Entertainment room, or you know, just the lounge?

Imagine you invite a bunch of friends, both male and female, what would sound better to everyone "This is my man cave" or "this is the theater room, which i designed myself"?

Calling it the Man cave reeks of insecurity, exclussion and the need to assert some sort of dominion which is incredibly silly for what is a glorified lounge.

I just got done decorating a new apartment with my girlfriend and it's interesting to me that when I made sure decisions about decor were made 50/50 (we both had to make sacrifices), the idea of a guest bedroom was thrown out in favor of her having her own space to do with what she pleased. I think people, regardless of gender or age, need to feel some sort of control over the space they live in. Kids want to decorate their own bedrooms. Adults need their own spaces too. For a long time the home was the woman's domain and she made the decisions about how it looked. A man cave or office was a natural response.

 

[Gotdatmoney]

No one's offended by it. Just seems like people insecure that others caught on to their insecurity. It's no different than laughing at all the "FOR MEN" branded shit some dudes can't not buy over the alternatives. Axe survives on these dudes, and it's gotten so far that diet soda has spinoffs just for dudes who can't buy the word "diet." I really really don't give a shit what people call their rooms

I dont really think man cave indicates insecurity at this point tbh. Its just sorta becone the name for "room dude designed" because generally decorating has been associated with women. Obviously in this day and age men also do a lot more interior design.

The "For Men" branding extends to everything honestly. Go to a store. Mens section. Womens section. Its really not a big deal.

 

[Vampire On Titus]

But why does it need a distinction? You don't call the rest of the house the "woman cave" or anything, why can't it be called the Theater room, the Entertainment room, or you know, just the lounge?

I think the term "man-cave" is pretty corny. But even if it doesn't need a distinction; who cares if he uses one? "Ladies night out" doesn't need a distinction. You could say "I'm going out with my friends." But why does it matter if there is one?

Calling it the Man cave reeks of insecurity, exclussion and the need to assert some sort of dominion which is incredibly silly for what is a glorified lounge.

Reeks of insecurity? I could imagine several scenario's where it's just some knowingly corny remark. That's the only way I've ever heard it said. I don't think most people really take their "Man Caves" as seriously as your post might suggest.

 

[The Elite]

I like having a space to do my stuff. If someone calls it a man cave I am not the least bit bothered by it. Not sure why anyone would care one way or another. Seems like an odd thing to get caught up over.

 

[RedNumberFive]

I dont really think man cave indicates insecurity at this point tbh. Its just sorta becone the name for "room dude designed" because generally decorating has been associated with women. Obviously in this day and age men also do a lot more interior design.

The "For Men" branding extends to everything honestly. Go to a store. Mens section. Womens section. Its really not a big deal.

Going on the comments in this thread, apparently it is a HUGE deal.

 

[devilhawk]

I think it meant that for a hot-second, but language is fluid and with the internet it changes faster than ever.

Nowadays, it's almost exclusively used by MRA and Gamergate types towards anyone who is even slightly more progressive then them.

You need to step outside the video game internet bubble.

I see it used by people that couldn't even tell you what MRA and Gamergate are. The type of people that call videogames "Nintendos."