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Kill la Kill |OT|

Dresden

Member
It's really a problem that Satsuki spent half the series abusing most of the students at her school (that guy at the beginning of episode 1 fucking died!), preaching a philosophy of absolute totalitarian obedience, and encouraging the merciless culling of the "weak" elements at her school, and she's still come out of everything more sympathetic than Ryuuko, the person who fought against her ideology and fought for freedom and individuality.

Gonna ramble for a bit.

Ryuko as envisioned by her creators is that of a girl overwhelmed by her fate, someone who can't deal with the responsibilities thrust upon her, and who is not dealing well with this revelation that the mother she'd sought all along is a monster. A sympathetic figure, really, at least in concept. And as has been pointed out before, a teen. None of these things are bad, and could have made for a good, compelling character.

But it didn't work out that way because she as a character basically doesn't exist. Like, at this point there's no sense that she has any real motive of her own. Endless manipulation from every source around her has turned her into a puppet, and this manipulation in turn was never used as a motivation to give her purpose. We see it in action this episode when she tells everyone to fuck off, or more revealingly, she tells Aikuro that he misled her from the start, too. But all of this didn't happen because she realized it; it's just backlash after Ragyo provokes her. That it all ends up being another bout of puppeteering from the villain just drives home how pointless Ryuko is as a character. We joke about how she keeps losing her way, but really, she never found a way in the first place.

I dunno, I'm kinda bummed out because that brainwashing/forced robing montage could actually have meant something at one point. It's a sequence that shows the things she craves, and their lack is piercing stuff. It's about as invasive and tragic as anything that's happened in the show, and yet it's failed to invoke any real sort of sympathy, because we - at least in this subset of viewers who don't give a fuck about her character - just can't bring ourselves to care. Instead we cheer for the wannabe fascist dictator girl who burned down an entire city. Fucking KLK.
 

Hitokage

Setec Astronomer
Meanwhile, Satsuki has only become immensely more characterized as this has been going on, despite being paper-thin to the viewer at the start.
 
And what would he have done with it had he escaped? Used the information to help develop technology to fight against Life Fibers?

Clearly he deserved to die.

In hindsight, during the school invasion episodes, Takarada's faction was funding development of weapons to fight Life Fibers and the suits he had his gang used matched Sanagayama's group evenly. Not only that he help develop the Nudist Beast ship. To think if Satsuki really thought it out better, she could have had much more resources to fight Ragyo and if she was a more cunning person even get some like Ryuko to work with her in the first place (because honestly Ryuko truly had no reason to fight Satsuki in the first place because she lied through her teeth to lead her on).
 

FluxWaveZ

Member
To think if Satsuki really thought it out better, she could have had much more resources to fight Ragyo and if she was a more cunning person even get some like Ryuko to work with her in the first place (because honestly Ryuko truly had no reason to fight Satsuki in the first place because she lied through her teeth to lead her on).

Hell of a plan, really. Beat up and antagonize those you want to ally yourself with later. Makes sense.
 

Link Man

Banned
Okay, that
Nui
twist was a twist too far. It makes sense in hindsight, but still feels a bit unneeded.

Other than that,
Ryuko looks pretty awesome in Junketsu, and I look forward to seeing what Satsuki and Senketsu can do together
. The show's not too bad if you turn your brain off while watching it, after all.
 

FluxWaveZ

Member
Okay, that
Nui
twist was a twist too far. It makes sense in hindsight, but still feels a bit unneeded.

Thing is, it doesn't even make that much sense
since she has that eyepatch which presumably means that she couldn't heal herself from the attack Ryuko's dad landed on her. Unless she actually has two functioning eyes and she has an eyepatch just 'cause?
 

Nexas

Member
Meanwhile, Satsuki has only become immensely more characterized as this has been going on, despite being paper-thin to the viewer at the start.

I disagree. Satsuki has pretty much no personality beyond stoic resolve. Which is a shame because Trigger passed up a real good opportunity to develop her character after her defeat. She spent years acting as a deplorable human being in an attempt build up an army to defeat her mother, and her coup lasted all of five minutes. You would think after beat down like that she would start to reevaluate the person she has become. Of course we can't have that as that would require the acknowledgement of any flaws on the part of the magnificent Satsuki-sama.

Better off just coming up with another hackneyed existential crisis for Ryuko instead.
 

Link Man

Banned
Thing is, it doesn't even make that much sense
since she has that eyepatch which presumably means that she couldn't heal herself from the attack Ryuko's dad landed on her. Unless she actually has two functioning eyes and she has an eyepatch just 'cause?

Yeah, didn't think about that, though it's an obvious plot hole in hindsight.
 

Kyou

Member
Thing is, it doesn't even make that much sense
since she has that eyepatch which presumably means that she couldn't heal herself from the attack Ryuko's dad landed on her. Unless she actually has two functioning eyes and she has an eyepatch just 'cause?

Pretty sure he stabbed her with the complete scissor sword, which was designed to fight life fibers. It probably stops the healing process and will be key to defeating Nui and Ragyo once and for all
 
Thing is, it doesn't even make that much sense
since she has that eyepatch which presumably means that she couldn't heal herself from the attack Ryuko's dad landed on her. Unless she actually has two functioning eyes and she has an eyepatch just 'cause?

Either she is hiding her real eye behind the eyepatch, or the healing factor from life fibers is limited. After all, when Ragyo has had something severed (head, hand) she had to reattach the part for it to heal, so I figure if the eye was destroyed she wouldn't create a new one. Who knows though.

I quite enjoyed episode 20, now that the pace has picked up a bit the show is starting to hit its stride. Also, dat
penisbike
, Trigger taking lessons from Lotus I see.
 

FluxWaveZ

Member
Pretty sure he stabbed her with the complete scissor sword, which was designed to fight life fibers. It probably stops the healing process and will be key to defeating Nui and Ragyo once and for all

No.
He uses the exact same blade (actually the other half, but whatever) to poke Nui's eye out as Ryuko did to pierce her guts. It doesn't make sense.
 
Either she is hiding her real eye behind the eyepatch, or the healing factor from life fibers is limited. After all, when Ragyo has had something severed (head, hand) she had to reattach the part for it to heal, so I figure if the eye was destroyed she wouldn't create a new one. Who knows though.

This, they don't regrow stuff so much as they can reattach things and have them heal fast.

So no regrowing new hands or eyeballs, but you can reattach them if you can grab em ... and that blade pretty much destroyed her eye. So it seems like it's super healing for Nui at least and not regen.
 

Jarmel

Banned
There is definitely some regeneration going on when you get impaled and thrown around like a ragdoll.

Honestly it's probably bad writing, I wouldn't sweat it.
 

A-V-B

Member
Indeed. The flashback scene would have been pretty great if I cared about Ryuko at all.

You know those villains-of-the-week that get sympathetic backstories about their falls into evilness right before or after they die? Ryuuko is only.. maybe half a rung up from that. Sort of a weird disconnect. It's like, it's super tragic, but they're too far gone now.

It's hard to know exactly how to react, and maybe that's why wanting her to go bad feels so right.

(But yeah, it is hard seeing our original, independent hero becoming a passive muppet, and swallowing that fighting Ragyou justified total fascism from the one protagonist who isn't a loser -- by loser, I don't mean nerdy hopeless bum, I mean someone who loses basically ALL the time.)
 

Soma

Member
And what would he have done with it had he escaped? Used the information to help develop technology to fight against Life Fibers?

Clearly he deserved to die.

Well yeah or else word of that technology would've reached Ragyou at some point thus making her aware of Satsuki's plan of her building up forces against her. You think Takarada (in all his pride-fulness) or any of the other schools would do a good job at keeping quiet about acquiring new-found technology stolen from their enemies? A lot of this is conjecture on my part but she has been shown not to take risks unless absolutely necessary. The way the lower classes in Honnouji Town are treated still sucks but the fact is that she's had to put on the appearance of a school built for conquest to suit her mother's needs while simultaneously building up that force to fight against that exact same person who has some really dark ambitions in mind (for reasons we're still not sure about). It isn't an easy task.

I guess it's either that or let the entire world/country become slaves to clothing which... eventually happened. The one thing that Satsuki worked so hard to prevent actually came to fruition but even with whatever potential backup resources she might've had it's still hard to prepare for what actually happened. So I dunno. I don't think it completely excuses how a lot of people were treated but recent events do kinda show her in a different light in hindsight. I think it'll be interesting to give this show another watch after it's finished to see how scenes might translate differently with new information and context in mind.
 
The ship looks like a SWORD SO,
the theory about the school being a giant Kamui makes even more sense now. Unless it's destroyed by Ryuko, then all goes FUBAR
 

wsippel

Banned
Haven't actually seen the latest episode yet, but I think a previous statement needs to be revisited:

It's very likely Soichiro was already rebelling against Ragyo when the "this will be your wedding dress" scene happened, and he designed both Kamuis specifically for his two daughters. I believe the "wedding dress" thing meant that he expected both of them to unite and fight together at some point in the future. I don't think it ultimately matters who wears which Kamui, they were both created by the same guy for the same purpose, and I assume they were created to complement each other (that's why they have a complementary color scheme). Therefore, neither Satsuki nor Ryuko can ultimately be a villain, them joining forces to take down Ragyo was Soichiro's plan all along.
 

Hitokage

Setec Astronomer
I disagree. Satsuki has pretty much no personality beyond stoic resolve. Which is a shame because Trigger passed up a real good opportunity to develop her character after her defeat. She spent years acting as a deplorable human being in an attempt build up an army to defeat her mother, and her coup lasted all of five minutes. You would think after beat down like that she would start to reevaluate the person she has become. Of course we can't have that as that would require the acknowledgement of any flaws on the part of the magnificent Satsuki-sama.

Better off just coming up with another hackneyed existential crisis for Ryuko instead.
There's the other side to Satsuki's existence that has provoked QUITE the controversy!

Regardless, what I meant is that despite the end product being the same, Satsuki is no longer a character that "just is".
 

Bombless

Member
Finally we got to hear the full song Ad Lib is the piano version of. It'll be on the OST CD2 I guess.

Great episode. I kind of expected a DT
G
joke when the gate opened :D
 

JDSN

Banned
Im surprised they fully committed to the Kishimoto-like hard-on for its boring one note morally reprehensible antagonist, I thought they were going to forcibly try to put some characters into some kind of arc to make the two of them more likable before kicking it into high gear, but nope straight up character assassination to an already stunted one so the other could be perceived as not shit.
 

mjontrix

Member
The eye thing for Nui is because the scissor blade was in decapitation mode when Isshin used it - so whatever it cuts doesn't regenerate. When it's just in normal mode it's essentially like Bakuzan.

Either that or the eye is still there!
 

gloomy

Neo Member
I disagree. Satsuki has pretty much no personality beyond stoic resolve. Which is a shame because Trigger passed up a real good opportunity to develop her character after her defeat. She spent years acting as a deplorable human being in an attempt build up an army to defeat her mother, and her coup lasted all of five minutes. You would think after beat down like that she would start to reevaluate the person she has become. Of course we can't have that as that would require the acknowledgement of any flaws on the part of the magnificent Satsuki-sama.

Better off just coming up with another hackneyed existential crisis for Ryuko instead.

This is honestly how I feel, you'd think the sexual abuse of a parent and the pressures of a master plan completely falling apart would faze someone. But instead she has the emotional response of a desk calculator. I find Satsuki more unbearable than Ryuko.
 

NotLiquid

Member
Man, Satsuki looks so fucking good in whatever she's wearing. Ryuko looks terrible in Junketsu.

Satsuki should just keep Senketsu forever.
 

Oldschoolgamer

The physical form of blasphemy
Satsuki really doesn't have time to do anything but stay focused and take down her evil ass mom. She's a leader and the only one capable of reaching Ryoku.
 

Evilisk

Member
That was one of the best episodes yet. Almost everyone in the cast had a badass moment.

Yeah, almost...

QSCePH7.png


I gotta say, Nonon is really growing on me.

Honestly I thought Nonon's been a bit boring in the past few episode. Yeah she had an action scene but I liked that out of the Deva's she was more the leader/commanding type. Not to say that action Nonon isn't bad but Sanageyama and Gamagoori (and now Tsumugu) already have that covered. Not to mention it doesn't really fit her characterization, having Nonon do things with her own power. She's always had that Marching Band or the Goku Uniform for anything, so it's just weird seeing her fight with the others in close combat.

At least the smug has only been increasing these past few episodes.
 

Gbraga

Member
Honestly I thought Nonon's been a bit boring in the past few episode. Yeah she had an action scene but I liked that out of the Deva's she was more the leader/commanding type. Not to say that action Nonon isn't bad but Sanageyama and Gamagoori (and now Tsumugu) already have that covered. Not to mention it doesn't really fit her characterization, having Nonon do things with her own power. She's always had that Marching Band or the Goku Uniform for anything, so it's just weird seeing her fight with the others in close combat.

At least the smug has only been increasing these past few episodes.

I really didn't like her before, so I guess it makes sense.
 
I don't know if its already been called, but:
Suda51 would make a game out of this and he'll program Ryuuko to do wrestling moves
.
 

Emitan

Member
Is it just me or have we not seen Decapitation Mode in a while?

Ryuko maybe you'd stop losing if you actually used your weapon ffs
 

Reversed

Member
How dull.
Why didn't Ragyo take the half-red scissor from Ryuuko's hands when she had the chance? Don't both half-scissors combined unleash a great amount of power, or am I just nuts?
 

LordCanti

Member
How dull.
Why didn't Ragyo take the half-red scissor from Ryuuko's hands when she had the chance? Don't both half-scissors combined unleash a great amount of power, or am I just nuts?

Ragyo wants her and
Junketsu together for reasons that are currently unknown. She had to give her a weapon or Satsuki would have just cut her up and that is kind of the only one available.

The real question is why Ryuko's hair didn't save her again.
 

rexor0717

Member
Ragyo wants her and
Junketsu together for reasons that are currently unknown. She had to give her a weapon or Satsuki would have just cut her up and that is kind of the only one available.

The real question is why Ryuko's hair didn't save her again.

I'm sure they could have made it expand, but last time it could only reach things around her head.
 
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