KILLZONE 2 - input lag now? if you want a reskinned COD4, go play WaW
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Cellbomber
Member
I'm trying to wait for the game to be released before playing the demo. Not sure I can resist anymore.
How tough is it to set up a UK account? What info do you need?
How tough is it to set up a UK account? What info do you need?
lowrider007
Licorice-flavoured booze?
Omar Ismail said:
Really ?, perhaps I'm better at the game than I thought I was then becuase I think it's acutally quite hard to die unless your just standing there letting people shoot at you.
Blablurn said:
Not sure tbh but I'd like to know how long it took you.
DenogginizerOS said:
Sniper shots to the chest/heart are insta-kill in MP. Assault weapon fire is basically two to three shots and the enemy is done - this game is not like Gears or Halo - when you get hit, you go down (something a lot of people are going to have to adjust to as well).
Sorry for directing it at you as if that was you- I only say it in a general address to anyone reading, as I always have this awareness that each post is open to input from multiple people with different ideas. Sorry for misusing the word "you" there. I should have said "People will laugh all they want," or something. Because they have already about the stick flick thing, :lol ("FLICK YOU" written in bullet holes was hilarious).Zeliard said:
Seriously though, the lag input's there, and it's not intentional. You say in your recent post that it's the realistic sense of weight that everyone's been referring to, but I say, "Then why's that same lag in the menu and in the trigger presses?" My finger already physically traveled the action of the R1 button, so I've gotta press and wait a 6th of a second for the in-game trigger finger to move too? But hey, don't bother thinking as deeply into it as me. You're fine with it as it is, and it's time to move on. Meanwhile, my line of reasoning to you guys is that if you don't mind it fine, but your rationalization for it is incorrect: it doesn't help the immersion at all because it's clearly input lag applied to everything, including menus which don't have nerves and muscles, and trigger fingers which we physically already went through the act of when we pressed the button that's supposed to simulate a trigger.
If I remember correctly KZ1 already had input lag too.matticus said:
1,2,3,4,5: enemies take a LOT shots to kill. yes, i'm shooting the head too.
just something I've noticed and I don't think it fit's into the 'realistic' catagory that GG is aiming for as you say.
maybe it's funner this way? Maybe their heads are made out of titanium?
Yeah that would be good information to know, to save me the discomfort of doing the tests with a wire restricting my movement. But I think I'm all done with testing. I think my last KZ2 one pretty much said everything that I needed to. I've also got the support of several Playstation.com members in GG's thread about investigating the issue. I'll tell you one thing: I have a little tiny bit of new-found appreciation for Resistance 2 now.matticus said:
Why on earth people would want "quick flicks" of the controller to react with immediacy is beyond me. That's not realistic at all, and would allow for easy mistakes with honest slip ups. It's far more functional as is, where you need a bit more time, force and strength to move the cursor/rifle aim. I'd imagine it's the same reason the flick test doesn't work in many other games/shooters as well. Quick flick responses imply that the rifle you are holding is as heavy as a feather or something. Not exactly realistic.
I've posted this before, but honestly, aiming and controls are spot on. Just different.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=14684717&postcount=32753
I've posted this before, but honestly, aiming and controls are spot on. Just different.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=14684717&postcount=32753
lowrider007
Licorice-flavoured booze?
nib95 said:
Yes they are spot on, but 'input lag' isn't, these are too separate issues, cakefoo is showing up the input lag in the game, not the weight issue that GG intended for you to feel in the game, there's noway GG intended that there's was a delay in the game picking up your button presses, yes the feeling of weight was no doubt intentional, but the input lag was not, people are confusing the two.
I'm fine with it tbh, but at the same time I can see the point cakefoo is trying to make.
Dubbedinenglish
Banned
McBacon said:
Be warned I will shank you and steal KZ2.
*puts on ninja suit*
the only thing that bothered me about the demo (and other FPSs are guilty of this as well) that showed up was the handling of splash & penetration damage from the rocket laucnher.
After you take out the bridge I turned to face the area where Helgan are scattered around (left). Some are at a second level with a railing and there's one on top with a rocket launch of his own (IIRC). I lined up a shot on a guy and the only thing separating us was a thin piece of railing. My shot hit the edge of the railing by his head and I assumed it was a kill but saw him firing still. Fired another shot (again with down the barrel view) and it hit on the front of his (thin) cover. I picked up the rifle and sniped the back of his head, killing him. Not fun when I rocket explodes mere inches from his head and he doesn't die.
Another spot is at the end of the first section where the two Helgan troop carriers unload and there's a helgan on a mounted gun with a small shield. On another playthrough I carried a fully loaded RL over to test it out and emptied it on the guy on the mounted gun. I tried hitting the little shield in front, tried right/left, slash damage from the wall behind, nada.
I've played through the demo at least 10 times and that was the only thing that bothered me. The RL just didn't seem to go through much, I tried it in a lot of areas/circumstances. I haven't tested for penetration with rifles at all though.
regarding controls, I've been using alt 2 with sensitivity at around 75%. I might leave look hold at default so I can crouch and look without both fingers on the left side having to continually mash R1 & R2 but other than that I've never played a demo more. RE5 is a close second.
After you take out the bridge I turned to face the area where Helgan are scattered around (left). Some are at a second level with a railing and there's one on top with a rocket launch of his own (IIRC). I lined up a shot on a guy and the only thing separating us was a thin piece of railing. My shot hit the edge of the railing by his head and I assumed it was a kill but saw him firing still. Fired another shot (again with down the barrel view) and it hit on the front of his (thin) cover. I picked up the rifle and sniped the back of his head, killing him. Not fun when I rocket explodes mere inches from his head and he doesn't die.
Another spot is at the end of the first section where the two Helgan troop carriers unload and there's a helgan on a mounted gun with a small shield. On another playthrough I carried a fully loaded RL over to test it out and emptied it on the guy on the mounted gun. I tried hitting the little shield in front, tried right/left, slash damage from the wall behind, nada.
I've played through the demo at least 10 times and that was the only thing that bothered me. The RL just didn't seem to go through much, I tried it in a lot of areas/circumstances. I haven't tested for penetration with rifles at all though.
regarding controls, I've been using alt 2 with sensitivity at around 75%. I might leave look hold at default so I can crouch and look without both fingers on the left side having to continually mash R1 & R2 but other than that I've never played a demo more. RE5 is a close second.
I have an idea what all you are complaining about the so-called "LAG" in controls, but having finished whole SP camapign twice - on both normal and veteran level (now starting Elite) - I have to say that I haven't even noticed that "lag" before all of you started to point that issue out.
Controls are great and works great for the game logic and mehanics as presented in game.
No problems whatsoever here.
Controls are great and works great for the game logic and mehanics as presented in game.
No problems whatsoever here.
lowrider007 said:
Ok fair enough. But we are talking what, a 4-5 frame delay out of 30 fps. That's like what, 1/7th / 1/6th of a second? Come on now, we're not super human enough for that shit to matter to anyone but the most anal. I never even noticed it and I've completed the game 4 times and have about 60+ hours in to the multiplayer (mainly the BETA several onths ago). It's NEVER affected my play time with the game.
I wouldn't even be surprised if it was just a standard technological deficiency. I think you guys are honestly making a mountain out a mole hill. Just seems like one more annoyingly petty little gripe that many are latching on to complain about. When the truth of it is, it has little significance on anything, especially on how the game realistically performs or plays. Which is why no reviewer, developer, QA tester etc has even made a point of it.
.
dreamer3kx
Member
When the game launches ill enjoy it while some of you guys look for lag and other shit.
one more thing that I found insanely cool was the AI. I was in the last warehouse area and it was just me and one helgan (sans-helmet). I peeked around the left side of a stack of containers and hit him a few times and then moved right and started to reload, planning to nail him from the backside. I turned the corner and he was gone so I kept running around the stack and was eventually past where I started (I essentially ran a lap around the stack of containers). I paused to scan left and right, figuring he had moved to other cover only to hear "come here weakling!" from behind me. I spun around and it he seemed to be trying to melee but i hip-fired and put him down. completely unexpected and intense.
nib95 said:
The game has a small amount of input lag AND arguably a greater than average amount of acceleration in the right stick look movements... the majority of players either have no problems with this, or adapt pretty quickly and then are either happy with it or not bothered by it. I can understand that the way the controls are set up might bother some people, and that's fine, but I suspect the responsiveness of the controls in KZ2 is pretty unlikely to be changed in the future.
(PS. the acceleration is slightly tighter in MP than in Campaign.)
CrushDance
Banned
This thread sucks, hurry please Bruce.
zoukka said:
I don't think the lag was ever the problem. They just tried to blame their apparent lack of skill or practise with the game on that. The main issue is the sensitivity, lack of auto aim or control difference to other shooters. Not the super human tact on split second delays.
Confidence Man
Member
jett said:
No, this is exactly why demos are valuable.
When it comes to the feel of the game and how it moves/controls, this is a make or break issue with some people.
I think it's pretty sloppy, personally. When it comes to the correlation between what your thumbs are doing on the sticks and the movement on the screen, there is no "different but equal"; it's either more or less in sync, more or less precise; and less is worse, plain and simple.
nib95 said:
Superhuman :lol
You can see the lag clearly in the video posted by Cakefoo even without the slow-mo. And even more so, it's easier to "feel" the lag than seeing it. I really don't think it's a dealbreaker or anything, but it still is there when it really shouldn't.
lowrider007
Licorice-flavoured booze?
nib95 said:
4-5 frames would probably equate to about 130ms lag (?) I think, probably more, I'm not great at maths tbh, anyway it's one of those things that is very noticeable for a minority, some people are quite sensitive to input lag, I've came across this topic in regards to TFT monitors before, all you have to do is type 'monitor input lag' into google and you'll see it's a big issue for many PC gamers, the reason why it isn't such a big issues for console users is that it's usually harder to detect input lag using a game pad as they are not as responsive as mice, but as this game seems to have about double the input lag than most games it is being picked up by some people which is understandable.
It's just one of those things, I know with a mouse my input lag threshold is around 45ms, more than that and I can't play the game, which is one of the reasons I sold my last panel, it had an average input lag of 60-70ms, which was intolerable, but using a control pad for games on that panel it was very hard to notice, now at 130ms, even with a control pad I can detect the input lag in KZ2, now I don't think it's game breaking, but it is there, and I can see that for some it would be quite annoying.
It's just one of those things where some people are extremely sensitive to it, and others are not, my second system's (PC) TFT monitor has about 65ms lag on it and I have people use that system to play games via lan all the time, no one finds the lag an issue, I however can't play games on that system becuase of it.
These things effect us all differently.
No one should be called a retard for being particularly sensitive to input lag, it's not their fault, moaning about the weight in the game ok, that's silly, the weight is intended, but like I said before, the input lag is not.
Now I'm going for a beer and a bag of chips, laters.
zoukka said:
Seriously, have you fucking lost your mind? Or has trolling really come to complaining about a 1/7th of a second delay? Seriously....
If there really was any noticeable lag, don't you think one of the hundreds of BETA testers, journalists or QA testers would have mentioned it by now? Yes they would have. But this is just yet another example of certain people trying to nit pick or find anything to complain about. My honest feeling is that many can't admit they just aren't used to the controls or new aiming style, and want to try and blame it on something else. We're seeing droves of people coming back and saying "you know what, I was wrong about the controls" after giving the game some more time.
But all this over a 1/6th, 1/7th second delay lol....wow. I wouldn't even be surprised if that split second delay is just the finger in the game pressing the trigger and nothing else.
Zedsdeadbaby
Banned
I think people should accept that there's obviously something that needs changing when many people are complaining about the input. I'm fine with the delay as well but at the same time I think it needs to be looked at simply because it's affecting the experience for a hell of a lot of others. It's not fair to go all 'fuck you I'm fine'.
Kill Your Masters
Member
Then they just would've delayed this outcome till the release day, so who cares.jett said:
Confidence Man
Member
JB1981 said:
:lol
I'm still getting the game, dumbfuck. Quit acting like the issue isn't valid enough to discuss.
There is no lag. It's just that so many people suck at this game. Go back to playing COD4 and don't buy this game if this is such a game breaker for you.
I'm having NO trouble switching between the KZ2 demo and any other game, including Resistance 2 which does have notable auto-aim and feels very light in comparison. I don't really see what the big deal is about the 'weight' of KZ2's controls.
I'm having NO trouble switching between the KZ2 demo and any other game, including Resistance 2 which does have notable auto-aim and feels very light in comparison. I don't really see what the big deal is about the 'weight' of KZ2's controls.
Rapping Granny
Banned
cakefoo said:
:lol :lol WOW FUCK MEEEEEEEEEEE!!
At the beggining, he knows that he's nitpicking, " this is me trying to find the lag...shoots couple of rounds.... there is no lag but if you look closely and can slow down time while you play this game, you can experience it"
:lol :lol wow seriously.
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