Americanmushroom
Banned
waitn i'm moving to indonesia and internet only works with 3G/4G ... am i screwed?
Kotaku: Next Xbox will require online connection to start games
- Thread starter Wario64
- Start date
Uno Venova
Banned
Anyone have a link to the 60% online article.
Oppo
Member
Another point –
...that 30-40% of (estimated) unconnected current 360 customers will shrink as a percentage on 720, if they must to connect to get their game on. The number is higher now simply because they don't have to connect.
But if those new customers get that 720 home and want to play Alan Wake 2, and get a prompt to login, you can bet a big chunk of them will do their best to figure out a way to get that thing online, if they have to.
...that 30-40% of (estimated) unconnected current 360 customers will shrink as a percentage on 720, if they must to connect to get their game on. The number is higher now simply because they don't have to connect.
But if those new customers get that 720 home and want to play Alan Wake 2, and get a prompt to login, you can bet a big chunk of them will do their best to figure out a way to get that thing online, if they have to.
I believe that the number of people who plug in their ethernet/wifi, download something, then unplug it again until next time, is vanishingly small. No one does that, or so few as to be completely negligible. You're arguing about a rounding error.Miles Quaritch said:
Are there consumer Durango units out there? I understand there are devkits but this sounds like BS, unless they're instructing developers to build in auto save functions for dropped connections or something. How would that even work? If it notices a disconnect over three minutes it just shuts the console off or dashboards? Unlikely.
I hope MS makes their reveal soon just to stop the reactionary hit grabbing headlines.
I hope MS makes their reveal soon just to stop the reactionary hit grabbing headlines.
Thats nothing to do with progress, thats choice and many people prefer optical media and always will which is why we are many years away from a DD only future (even Sony said that themselves).
I can't believe any of this, sorry
And even though I have a stable internet connection 24/7, I just don't fucking want thiss - this is bullshit and puts another obstacle between me and my games. And what if their servers go down? Or when they get hacked? Or when I visit relatives or friends with unstable or no internet at all?
Don't do this Microsoft
And even though I have a stable internet connection 24/7, I just don't fucking want thiss - this is bullshit and puts another obstacle between me and my games. And what if their servers go down? Or when they get hacked? Or when I visit relatives or friends with unstable or no internet at all?
Don't do this Microsoft
Windom Earle
Member
So what if due to increased ad revenue, monitoring, etc. MS sells this thing at $150?
Its less than 50% who have Gold accounts though, closer to 40% from what i have read.
At the same time however we've gotten a lot of nice features on PCs and consoles already from just being online immediately whenever we boot up the system, and we have games like Demon's Souls already that blur it. Maybe I'm being shortsighted or something, but it seems to me you can accomplish plenty as it is with a de facto alwyas online system, which is what the HD consoles effectively are already in addition to smartphones and tablets, none of which REQUIRE online unless a program specifically needs it (though this is a reason I've ignored Angry Birds Seasons as a downtime game). In fact, the Live subscription will be the REAL thing holding things back, with the reasonable assumption anyone can pay online like with the PS3 you get games like Demon's Souls, that kind of multiplayer still came to 360 but you might be able to go a few steps if you design it so that offline play is a very very rare occurrence left to those actively avoiding it or without internet at all, rather than including those who don't want to pay the Live fee.
EDIT: Actually, as for optical discs... I'll leave this here. In the end optical still curbstomps all else if we need raw storage space, the real question becomes if we can even use this practically without blowing the bank.
DragonSworne
Banned
Holding back progress? Optical media makes it so I don't have to download 40gb+ movies and games in the next gen. Where's the benefit in spending hours downloading something?
There's nothing that always online would add to the console. It would only be a step backwards.
NullPointer
Member
And if you enjoy single player games, and dislike ads and DRM, this kind of direction sounds horrific.
Beer Monkey
Member
They can shove it up their ass.
And this from somebody who has paid for Live for 10 years. If they do this, they won't just be losing that 40% of offline customers. They'll be losing people like me.
TheGreyHulk
Member
The world is not ready for DD. The infrastructure is not there yet, ISP caps are a hindrance, connection speeds are a hindrance, retailers, etc.
Europe still buys plenty of disc based PC games IIRC.
DD is the future, but you have to make a smart transition to that future.
Europe still buys plenty of disc based PC games IIRC.
DD is the future, but you have to make a smart transition to that future.
BadAss2961
Member
Yup, shit happens.
There's been times where my internet has gone done due to bad weather, and I had to wait nearly a week before the company would come down to fix it. The Xbox would be useless during times like that where you'd probably need it most.
While i'll admit that I wouldn't mind seeing Microsoft fail, I don't believe they'll go through with "always online" until I hear it from them. It's just a horrible idea... I've fallen victim to it before with Ubisoft's old DRM on PC -- it sucked. To build a whole console around that is just laughable.
MS may be thinking about the right thing, the sooner the world gets on broadband the better for all of us, but they are approaching it wrong. They must really be banking hard on exclusive 3rd party support if they are so confident about this, or they could be in the same disastrous overconfident mentality Sony was after the ps2.
These threads really do bring out the often hilariously impassioned hatred towards Microsoft.
soulassssns
Banned
While this wont affect me here at home, it would while I am deployed onboard the ship.
BRocknRolla
Member
Exactly what I was thinking. I was just about to offer the example of Apple too. Just in fact listened to a Planet Money podcast about a very similar topic a few weeks ago.
Windows has ridiculous penetration world-wide but MS makes peanuts next to what Apple is making. MS may well be moving toward focusing on the bigger fish across the board, Xbox included.
Good lord, to say nothing of bandwidth caps that so many countries deal with. You'd have to give up gaming altogether if you were forced to download games in some regions.
quickwhips
Member
I hope your a troll or like eating crow.
Windom Earle
Member
I fully agree, but the market they are going for could eat it up.
It isn't even that cut and dry. There are plenty of people with broadband that simply have lackluster service. Anybody who has used Comcast as their ISP can attest to this. And unlike making XBL more reliable, this is completely and totally out of Microsoft's control.
Getting kicked out of a purely single player game every time an ISP shits the bed would be ridiculous.
Dreamgazer
Member
People seemed really riled up about this, but I wonder how many folks are really going to turn their back to the Xbox after being content up until this news. I really believe once MS shows something, most will backpedal. Gamers panic, puff their chests up, and cave once they're shown something they want. Its not the "always online, always connected" feature they're going to sell you on.
These guys sold folks on Kinect (after folks proclaimed they didn't want motion controls), took a strong retail gaming hiatus for 2+ years while riding the backs of 3rd parties, and still lead in sales in America. They've sold you a box they knew was busted, charged you for access to internet you already pay for, and have publicly stated they're not in it for games multiple times from multiple sources. While some things like the red ring thing was no doubt negative, some of it is just perceived as negative. There's nothing wrong with offering an entertainment box. There's nothing wrong with putting games on a lower tier. If we as consumers don't like it, we can opt to not buy it. There are alternatives. But I think the fear is that, alot of us will like it. Alot of us have liked it. The press has suggested that MS is beginning to shift its focus and have implied that this is undesirable. But I would argue MS has been on this track for a long time. And during that time, we as gamers and those in the media have been complicit. Their E3 presentations focused on Facebook and Twitter, Kinect and Smartglass, Netflix,TV apps, and tangential DLC. Those were the takeways in the gaming headlines. We want what we say we don't.
From what I remember, a great deal of press have applauded their E3 presentations where they showed fewer exclusive games when compared to Sony. I remember our media commenting more on Cirque De Soleil, remaining members of the Beatles, and apps that MS secured first. Presentation over content. I don't say that to demonize them, cause its nothing to demonize...its what we've shown we like. Sony was pushing out various games as if it was a middle child vying for attention from its parents, with little fanfare outside of well...its fansSo my thinking is if you like your 360...if you've liked your 360 for years now...then you're likely going to like 720, so don't worry. They're going to stick to the same thing they've been doing. I don't see how this one feature negates everything else. They're going to show you the same type of things that wowed you before...the same things that hooked you before. Sure there will be new bells and whistles, that's to be expected, but in principle...it'll be the same Xbox you've loved. How much of the core Xbox experience is changing that much?
This is either the most amazing sarcasm post or the saddest fanboy post I've read in awhile.
I can't tell orz.
Yep another reason why we are many years away from DD only, can you imagine having to download 50gig games and movies with the current internet infrastructure and download caps people have.
soulassssns
Banned
as well as American hatred. Sometimes.
IHaveCandy
Banned
I think MS thinks its consumers will put up with anything. Look what they've put up with so far.
$100 20 GB HDD
$100 Wifi receiver
Confusing point scale to make things seem cheaper
4 years of a defective console
8 years of a console that scratches games
8 years of paying for an online P2P service
Being sold services free elsewhere
Being sold that a week early demo is a feature when they just delay Silver
Barely bothering to release first party games for 3 years.
At this point, I think MS thinks they can do whatever they want and their consumer base will eat it with a smile.
$100 20 GB HDD
$100 Wifi receiver
Confusing point scale to make things seem cheaper
4 years of a defective console
8 years of a console that scratches games
8 years of paying for an online P2P service
Being sold services free elsewhere
Being sold that a week early demo is a feature when they just delay Silver
Barely bothering to release first party games for 3 years.
At this point, I think MS thinks they can do whatever they want and their consumer base will eat it with a smile.
Darkmakaimura
Can You Imagine What SureAI Is Going To Do With Garfield?
I see your point but there are still factors that make this a bad idea. Sure, it can be assumed people required to connect online will make these purchases creating a lot more dough for MS, it still alienates many people who just want to sit down and play with a game without hassle. Reliability for those who do have Internet is certainly a huge factor too, but you know that. I did tech support for one of the major consoles between 07 - 09 and I remember plenty of people who either didn't have Internet, had Internet but couldn't for one reason or another connect their console online or had issues connecting online with the console despite their PC being okay. It ended up with a lot of folks on a daily basis shouting at me how they couldn't download the latest patch to fix a game bug, etc. Even people trying to steal their neighbors bandwidth out of desperation. So yeah, this problem began this generation now it's only going to get that much more worse.
Linkstrikesback
Member
No. No way any of the console makers would be this stupid...would they?
Little Green Yoda
Member
I'm sure this has been brought up numerous times already but we can't discern how many of those offline players are doing it by choice rather than because they don't have (good) internet connections. A lot of people who play single-player only have no incentive to hook up their console online.
Oppo
Member
I don't know how else to explain it.
Some customers spend more than others. Sometimes a lot more. If they are connected, they can pay for Live, music streaming, video rentals, be served ads, buy digital games and DLC. If they're not, they can't.
What's so hard to understand? total number of players is not total profit.
While you have a point, I still don't understand why they would shun or push away potential customers just because they don't have an internet connection. I understand that the connected consumers would bring in more money, but the disconnected consumer is still extra money.
=) No worries, if you answer great, if not, there's always other discussions.
Edit:
I'm having a hard time not quoting your avatar with your silly post here.
Apple, for example, makes gobs of money catering to the top 25% of the market. If they tried to cater to the other 75% they would have to make inferior products with razor thin margins and have poor people wrecking their cache. They would also end up making less money as they would have devote limited resources to the poor 75% which would limit the amount of person hours they could devote to the products for the top 25%.
Well as it is just how often do peoples connection to live get dropped. For me at least its exceedingly rare.
I really just hope if its true that MS is smart enough to actually invest in a lot of extra infrastructure to handle the load, especially at launch of big games. You'd think people by now would have enough experience of seeing not enough server capacity at launch that this would be a no brainer. Guess we'll see if engineers or bean counters won on that.
Beer Monkey
Member
What market?
Don't take your customers for granted. Never throw away a customer. Netflix thought they could tell their disc service customers to guy buy a separate service from streaming. Even that was a huge mistake.
You sure as fuck don't throw away 40% of your customers for some unproven new market.
Yet unlike Sony they don't force people who buy a used copy of Halo or Gears to pay extra for a Online Pass to play on Live.
BadAss2961
Member
File sizes for games are going to increase significantly next gen too. Just look at some of the retail PS3 releases on PSN.
IHaveCandy
Banned
I guess it's like a 2 drink minimum at a bar? If you aren't buying, don't bother wasting space? Not that I agree with it.
If I'm buying a $500 console in 2013 I want it to be as versatile and capable as its progenitors, not less. I want the option to go offline when it suits me, because I've always had the option, valued it, and made extensive use of it.
Uno Venova
Banned
I really need to see where the 40% coming from though, and how old the data is. And I assume it's calculating on 360 owners and not a survey.
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
While this rumor could be entirely false, always-online for the nextbox is something I could easily believe.
I'm actually kinda glad that Halo 4 disappointed me. I can take or leave the Halo series now and MS doesn't have anything else I am attached to.
I'm actually kinda glad that Halo 4 disappointed me. I can take or leave the Halo series now and MS doesn't have anything else I am attached to.
KefkaPalazzo
Member
If by irrelevant you mean winning in NA...sure.
I doubt this is true, I'm thinking all these sites are piggybacking on the initial rumors.
But if it is...damn it Microsoft.
Oppo
Member
It was insanity to charge for multi on original Xbox. And yet...
Not arguing the online situation, I don't support that idea too.
I know it's a bad rumor, and should be treated as is.
The actual situation what I'm referring at is about how next Xbox's bad news are working as click bait.
Jesus dude, does your internet never go out for a few minutes/hours at a time?