PhillipCostigan
Member
why did it "make" you play less games?
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League of Legends |OT11| going
- Thread starter zkylon
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why did it "make" you play less games?
BreezyLimbo
Banned
uh
hm.
I mean..isn't ranked play supposed to be for someone who wants to do ranked and not..casual players? Casual players can still play normal ._.
Maybe it means he got to diamond in less games this time around >
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wut
how have i not answered this question already
queue times = super long = i dont want to sit in queue for 10 minutes to get a game that may or may not have 5 people on the opposing side as a premade.
full stop, that easy
PhillipCostigan
Member
uh
hm.
I mean..isn't ranked play supposed to be for someone who wants to do ranked and not..casual players? Casual players can still play normal ._.
Maybe it means he got to diamond in less games this time around >
I don't think Neko is diamond?
Anyway, that attitude of "ranked isn't for casuals" stinks to high heaven. I've played shit tonnes of League, been playing it for 4 years. I am not a League casual by any means, but I never really liked playing ranked because it was a strictly solo/duo experience. I'd rather play League with my friends, and dynamic queue allows me to do that while also earning a rank. Our data shows that I'm not alone. The majority of League players prefer to play with friends, and with dynamic queue a lot of those players are now able to play ranked with their friends. Combined with role selection and bigger premades, player behaviour has increased massively and games are far more positive.
We recognised the issues with queue times at higher MMRs and are actively working on systems and tuning to make that better, as well as fixing the other issues with the queue.
We're making a lot of changes to improve queue times, and the chances of you playing against a premade 5 at your elo is close to 1 in 1000. So unless you've been the most unlucky person when it comes to who you get matched against, it's a boogeyman scenario you don't even have to worry about. Especially considering how few ranked games you've played.
Normal is a fucking joke and you know it.
Stone Ocean
Member
Ranked as a whole just isn't as fun for me as it used to be between getting placed in the bottom of Silver for no reason and how awful this season's meta has been.
I'm not sure I'll bother getting back to gold let alone try climbing again and this whole dynamic queue discussion makes me think it's not even worth bothering with playing rank anymore.
I'm not sure I'll bother getting back to gold let alone try climbing again and this whole dynamic queue discussion makes me think it's not even worth bothering with playing rank anymore.
Holy shit what the hell. I'm D1 0lp at the moment and I'm in champ select with a rank 40 challenger and 3 high master players. Legit excited for this game. Unlucky that i got adc though.
http://www.lolnexus.com/EUW/search?name=Talentz®ion=EUW
http://www.lolnexus.com/EUW/search?name=Talentz®ion=EUW
Until I get back to the queue times of the old system 6 months ago, I sincerely doubt my interest is coming back. Why even bother implementing a new system if it at the very least isn't as functional at its base to how it worked before
I know you're a rioter but come on, you have people here that you've known for years telling you that the system is not working in a way that fosters them to continue playing, as much as they may all love the game itself.
Nothing changed about what I do or did to warrant the increased times. In the 6 months I've only gone from plat2 to plat 1, and if my only option for less than 10 minutes is to queue as a role I don't want to play to get a faster game then what the heck is the point.
I know you're a rioter but come on, you have people here that you've known for years telling you that the system is not working in a way that fosters them to continue playing, as much as they may all love the game itself.
Nothing changed about what I do or did to warrant the increased times. In the 6 months I've only gone from plat2 to plat 1, and if my only option for less than 10 minutes is to queue as a role I don't want to play to get a faster game then what the heck is the point.
PhillipCostigan
Member
because that's not how it works. With something like this you can't release it and have it perfect immediately. Data from real world scenarios and the 100 million players around the world as opposed to a small internal or PBE selection is necessary to get it right. We are committed to getting it right, we're actively working on and releasing improvements.
I'm not telling you the queue times don't suck, and I'm not telling you it's functioning as it should be. What I'm saying is that we're actively trying to fix the issues while also trying to make it so that people get their roles and have fair matches. It's a balancing act that requires a lot of tweaking to get right and we will get it right, it's just not going to happen overnight because that's not how this stuff works.
Sorry I don't buy it. I can go in as to why if you'd like but it'd likely just be more pointless venting about a subject that you have no control over and I have no influence in. I just see a game I love to play being less accessible than it was 6 months ago and I don't have the patience for it.
Black-Wind
Member
I feel like the Dark Star release is gonna be like the Zero Mech release ... as in the most expensive one will have the tamest recall for W/E reason (I LOVE my Mech Sion buuuut his recall could be sooo much more interesting than turning into a box. But w/e, he's awesome).
Cause the Thresh recall looks meh AF but Varus does a whole awesome bendy rig animation. Which is strange cause Thresh already doesn't seem like he has enuff particle effects to make an expensive skin worth it imo so I would think that the recall was straight fire. .
Cause the Thresh recall looks meh AF but Varus does a whole awesome bendy rig animation. Which is strange cause Thresh already doesn't seem like he has enuff particle effects to make an expensive skin worth it imo so I would think that the recall was straight fire. .
PhillipCostigan
Member
It sucks that you don't believe me. I implore you to speak to anyone who works on matchmaking sytems and they'll tell you the same: the system won't be perfect until it's released on live servers with a heap of load and a lot of data to work on. You develop, test, release, measure and iterate to make it good.
And at the very least I can pass along your feedback to the team because I don't want people having a shit experience and feeling like nobody is listening to them or taking on board what they're saying.
I'm trying to give you guys as much context and information as I can. Whether you choose to believe what I'm saying or not is up to you, but I'd like to think that at this point I've at least earned a modicum of trust.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
tbf, lately I've had short queue times, Plat 2 atm(Rising quickly).
And the games have mostly been fairly matched?
Eh. I dislike queuing up against obvious party queue groups. I hate being matched up with duos and trios who end up usually sucking and blaming you.
Currently mixed thoughts. There are very few games where I say 'I lost because I got matched up badly', but when those games happens, it happens~
And the games have mostly been fairly matched?
Eh. I dislike queuing up against obvious party queue groups. I hate being matched up with duos and trios who end up usually sucking and blaming you.
Currently mixed thoughts. There are very few games where I say 'I lost because I got matched up badly', but when those games happens, it happens~
I don't mean I don't believe you, what I meant was I believe that there was a baseline of acceptable use for me. The old system passed it, the new one does not and has not for 6 months now. It hasnt gotten any better or any worse, it's just there. I fully acknowledge that I play off of peak hours, but that was also true 6 months ago and I was seeing queue times of 2 to 4 minutes on average.
And after being teased for those six months of "dw soloq is coming back guys" by riot didn't help my opinion of the way things are done now.
So how does the new dynamic Que affect me as someone who is in Low ELO?
Hey, back off.
She maybe a cancer, but she is my kind of cancer.
Hey, back off.
She maybe a cancer, but she is my kind of cancer.
Black-Wind
Member
Is it bad that I sometimes leave games where the FF wont go through but I'm confident that it's a L?
Like last night we were getting stumped, Kat was 3/7 vs a fed Teemo mid and I was being camped and tower dived top vs a damn Yorick. They had 20 more kills on us and I tried to FF twice ... but 3 people were in a premade and refused to vote yes.
IMO you don't HAVE to vote yes ... but that doesn't mean I have to play with you. I tried to FF twice, we're getting stumped, our mid's now useless, I can't protect the ADC that I only saw twice that game and it's like 3 at night ... told em I'm done and dipped. I logged on today and someone on my team honored me so I'm guessing it was the one other Solo person on my team who did that. I always assume I'm gonna get reported for that but really ... if it simply comes down to 1 person refusing to vote yes or a premade refusing to FF leave after 2+ attempts.
Like last night we were getting stumped, Kat was 3/7 vs a fed Teemo mid and I was being camped and tower dived top vs a damn Yorick. They had 20 more kills on us and I tried to FF twice ... but 3 people were in a premade and refused to vote yes.
IMO you don't HAVE to vote yes ... but that doesn't mean I have to play with you. I tried to FF twice, we're getting stumped, our mid's now useless, I can't protect the ADC that I only saw twice that game and it's like 3 at night ... told em I'm done and dipped. I logged on today and someone on my team honored me so I'm guessing it was the one other Solo person on my team who did that. I always assume I'm gonna get reported for that but really ... if it simply comes down to 1 person refusing to vote yes or a premade refusing to FF leave after 2+ attempts.
Well you exclusively play blind pick so yes. Don't expect quality games in blind pick.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
so uh
what the hell do I build on ilalalaioaiaoiaoi
what the hell do I build on ilalalaioaiaoiaoi
Also this is probably one of the biggest fuck ups I've ever seen riot do. There's no defending this Costy.
I'm not gonna go all Talentz and be like "lol silver players making decisions at riot". But this is really, really bad. I expect some changes to be made in response to this crazy backlash on all social media.
I'm not gonna go all Talentz and be like "lol silver players making decisions at riot". But this is really, really bad. I expect some changes to be made in response to this crazy backlash on all social media.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
newt
to be fair
I've lost the majority of games with you while we queued up with multiple people
My solo ratio is higher >_>;
Why steraks
What do I build after steraks, it only stacks to 150 health? Doesn't provide benefits other than that?
Fake edit-Huh, I confused Steraks for uh, Jaurims fist. COSTY TELL THE ART DEPARTMENT THESE TWO ITEMS ARE CONFUSING :X
edit-edit-Apparently Jaurims builds into steraks, didn't see that in the build path. Just saw frozen mallet and titanic hydra. I'm blind, nvm.
to be fair
I've lost the majority of games with you while we queued up with multiple people
My solo ratio is higher >_>;
Why steraks
What do I build after steraks, it only stacks to 150 health? Doesn't provide benefits other than that?
Fake edit-Huh, I confused Steraks for uh, Jaurims fist. COSTY TELL THE ART DEPARTMENT THESE TWO ITEMS ARE CONFUSING :X
edit-edit-Apparently Jaurims builds into steraks, didn't see that in the build path. Just saw frozen mallet and titanic hydra. I'm blind, nvm.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
2/8 sivir
better blame the 2/3 maphite for 'no map awareness'
Sometimes I do have bad games
But I never tread on anyone else unless they do it first, and all I can say to that is: git gud, don't blame others, do your best.
It has nothing to do with single games, it's just the way you play. Nothing to do with good/bad games.
I don't want to get to into it, but even the game you're bringing up, your lane opponent was able to roam and put other lanes far behind.
I'm not trying to insult you or anything, even your most played champion is Nasus, which is pretty much the definition of a solo q champion.
Black-Wind
Member
Hey, I played ranked recently.
Even worse shit shows. Win or Eating a L it seems like it's always a stump.
Need I share some of my ranked matches with you?
I just love this one with the 0/10 Yi .
At least with normals I can chill and say "Ehh, I'm learning stuff regardless on a champ I don't know how to play .. w/e". In ranked it feels like people get super antsy and freak out so they end up doing stupid shit (Like dieing to fizz 3 times in the first 4 mins of the game or trying to force a gank when both the laner and JG are so low they can be killed with ease)
Shit's strange.
The problem is, even with your ranked games you're playing with like a 30% w/r at bronze 2. Try climbing to at least silver 5. Silver 5 is the average so you`re playing below average atm.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
Team games start with being able to play competently by yourself. If you lose a lane before top or mid can do anything, that's on you. It doesn't matter whether the perception was that you got 20 man ganked, because you probably died long before that and started tilting.
Newt, it's ok. It's natural to try and blame someone else. But when the jungler is trying to dive 2 towers, or your bot dies 3 times before the opposing lane gets any ganks, you don't go around saying 'YOU LET YOUR LANE ROAM' when it was clearly past the laning phase and you lost your tower.
Trust me bruh, the problem isn't other players. You're the one who'll troll pick when your comp doesn't look 'good' or you just dodge all day. It's fair to say you can't be also blaming others when you're doing things like that.
if there's one thing i've learned in the past few weeks is that my severe reduction in play has severely reduced my ability to actually play well. my TPs are like 25% as effective as they used to be, my laning is still fine but i don't look at the minimap near as much as i used to and this gets me killeded, and i dunno if irelia is bugged or something but some games i press Q and it takes like 1.5 second to actually cast it for some reason, even in melee range
and yet still i climb
just like last season, when i had like a 48%winrate but still went from gold1 to plat2 during the season.
and yet still i climb
just like last season, when i had like a 48%winrate but still went from gold1 to plat2 during the season.
I mean, Lyte left the company.
Stone Ocean
Member
My problem with the whole queue thing is that why was it necessary to actually touch solo queue? Ok, so people like to play with their friends and Riot wants to make ranked more accessible, that's good! But go work on ranked 5s instead of changing something people enjoyed.
This is the equivalent of TT being the main map of the game and Riot just removing it and putting SR in it's place because hey, 10 players > 6. No shit people are gonna be pissed. I don't buy the whole "Riot lied" and "b-but muh expression of skill" bullshit but that doesn't mean I'm not annoyed with this whole "playing with friends and teamwork yay!" thing Riot has been pushing for a while.
This is the equivalent of TT being the main map of the game and Riot just removing it and putting SR in it's place because hey, 10 players > 6. No shit people are gonna be pissed. I don't buy the whole "Riot lied" and "b-but muh expression of skill" bullshit but that doesn't mean I'm not annoyed with this whole "playing with friends and teamwork yay!" thing Riot has been pushing for a while.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
Hrm.
The Diamond changes make sense. That is, you might get a role other than the 2 selected. And that's because as you go up higher in rank, players specialize in 1-2 roles, so top/mid/bot being popular enough, it would simply be inefficient and increase the queue times by restricting those players to those two roles. Yes, it's counter intuitive to what the system is supposed to be there for, but in high elos there's no other choice to lower queue times.
They're remedying this by decreasing the amount of players you can queue upwith down to 3, but IMO they should just revert Diamond+ to 'solo' queue. That is, 2 people at the most or, 1 player would be the best. If Dynamic queue is there for more casual players, than if you're diamond you're not a casual player, so lowering the amount of people who queue up together will lessen the queue times, maybe even remove the role selection in D3+(Again, if you've reached that far, then it makes sense that you'd have a good knowledge of all roles in order to compete at that high level.)
Granted that would mean that those who specialized in 1 or 2 roles would have a harder time getting D1+, but that's what differentiates the good players versus the bad, nein?
The Diamond changes make sense. That is, you might get a role other than the 2 selected. And that's because as you go up higher in rank, players specialize in 1-2 roles, so top/mid/bot being popular enough, it would simply be inefficient and increase the queue times by restricting those players to those two roles. Yes, it's counter intuitive to what the system is supposed to be there for, but in high elos there's no other choice to lower queue times.
They're remedying this by decreasing the amount of players you can queue upwith down to 3, but IMO they should just revert Diamond+ to 'solo' queue. That is, 2 people at the most or, 1 player would be the best. If Dynamic queue is there for more casual players, than if you're diamond you're not a casual player, so lowering the amount of people who queue up together will lessen the queue times, maybe even remove the role selection in D3+(Again, if you've reached that far, then it makes sense that you'd have a good knowledge of all roles in order to compete at that high level.)
Granted that would mean that those who specialized in 1 or 2 roles would have a harder time getting D1+, but that's what differentiates the good players versus the bad, nein?
Black-Wind
Member
Ok, I'mma try to go hard with my rate of playing ranked and see if I can get to that. I admittedly don't play ranked often but now I will save Normals for testing out champs.
I just don't know what to do when I play safe yet people are dropping like flies in 1v1s with in the first few mins.
Stone Ocean
Member
Allowing people to queue up as up to 3 players in high ELO is probably to help with queue times. That's a very good change.
haven't watched the video or read the article (kind of super busy day so won't be able to until really late) but i think there's kind of a problem in understanding and communicating what ranked is supposed to be
like the problem i have with new ranked is that new ranked is actually no different from draft pick in any way. it's literally the same mode. the solo aspect of before made it different and was an effective way to measure your ability to 1v9 and even if i think that's completely stupid in a team game, it at least made sense
new ranked is like draft pick "but for reals you guys" and it's kind of no longer a measure of anything since you can be carried by four friends and play on your own the next day, or maybe just have fun with friends as a premade of 3 or whatever
and i think more people playing ranked is a really strange goal to have when it involves drastically changing what ranked is. like "more people than ever are playing ranked" is a lie in itself because ranked is no longer the same thing. you can't say that because the real quote would be something like "more people are playing new mode than people played old mode". you didn't show new players how cool ranked is, you changed ranked so it would appeal to them
and then as a player, why wouldn't you play ranked? it's literally the same as normal draft, except you get a cool skin at the end. and it has stat tracking. there's no downside to it, it'd just be stupid to play normals
again i personally think that measuring your solo skill is dumb since this is a team game and imo team skill should be the way your ranking is measured, not your ability to 1v9. if anything i think solo ranked is a dumb casual mode and ranked 5s is the actual serious way of playing the game. if you asked me i think they should remove everything but ranked 5s and hey if you don't have enough friends to do that just be serious about normals. this is not something that'd be very popular i bet and prolly not worth getting into here, but that's how i feel about ranked
in any case, i personally have very little stake in this since i don't really care about ranked, but i like league and i wish i had the impression that riot knows what the hell they're doing about it. it does feel like they fixed something that wasn't broken and the achievement they have to show for it is very unconvincing for me. i don't want them to revert the changes either, but i think they're FAAAAAAAAAAAAAAR from done with this and they've definitely screwed it up big time. definitely alienating a big part of ur playerbase is not something you want to ever do
//end rant
VERY IMPORTANT
breezy, i'm already working on the ot and won't like to throw away what i have done already, so sadly i'm gonna have to ask to be patient and let me finish it. gonna do this on the weekend. sadly i've been sick these past few days and dobs gave me little notice, but i'll get it done
i'll try to work it out with dobs next time a little sooner, i like doing the ots but we're busy ppl and don't always get to do it on time
it should be up by sunday at the latest, pls have some patience
like the problem i have with new ranked is that new ranked is actually no different from draft pick in any way. it's literally the same mode. the solo aspect of before made it different and was an effective way to measure your ability to 1v9 and even if i think that's completely stupid in a team game, it at least made sense
new ranked is like draft pick "but for reals you guys" and it's kind of no longer a measure of anything since you can be carried by four friends and play on your own the next day, or maybe just have fun with friends as a premade of 3 or whatever
and i think more people playing ranked is a really strange goal to have when it involves drastically changing what ranked is. like "more people than ever are playing ranked" is a lie in itself because ranked is no longer the same thing. you can't say that because the real quote would be something like "more people are playing new mode than people played old mode". you didn't show new players how cool ranked is, you changed ranked so it would appeal to them
and then as a player, why wouldn't you play ranked? it's literally the same as normal draft, except you get a cool skin at the end. and it has stat tracking. there's no downside to it, it'd just be stupid to play normals
again i personally think that measuring your solo skill is dumb since this is a team game and imo team skill should be the way your ranking is measured, not your ability to 1v9. if anything i think solo ranked is a dumb casual mode and ranked 5s is the actual serious way of playing the game. if you asked me i think they should remove everything but ranked 5s and hey if you don't have enough friends to do that just be serious about normals. this is not something that'd be very popular i bet and prolly not worth getting into here, but that's how i feel about ranked
in any case, i personally have very little stake in this since i don't really care about ranked, but i like league and i wish i had the impression that riot knows what the hell they're doing about it. it does feel like they fixed something that wasn't broken and the achievement they have to show for it is very unconvincing for me. i don't want them to revert the changes either, but i think they're FAAAAAAAAAAAAAAR from done with this and they've definitely screwed it up big time. definitely alienating a big part of ur playerbase is not something you want to ever do
//end rant
VERY IMPORTANT
breezy, i'm already working on the ot and won't like to throw away what i have done already, so sadly i'm gonna have to ask to be patient and let me finish it. gonna do this on the weekend. sadly i've been sick these past few days and dobs gave me little notice, but i'll get it done
i'll try to work it out with dobs next time a little sooner, i like doing the ots but we're busy ppl and don't always get to do it on time
it should be up by sunday at the latest, pls have some patience
keep in mind that the people you're going up against are probably just as bad at the game as the people on your team dropping like flies
learn how to drop people like flies
become the fly dropper
drop your enemies
fly to silver
Stone Ocean
Member
I actually hadn't thought of that. Ranked is just normals without garbage MMR now lol
Also don't worry about rushing the OT, just make sure it pisses Newt off yeah?
Troubled Bat
Member
I'm going to do all that I can to get that Dark Star Thresh. He's my most favorite support, and definitely deserves a skin.
I actually think the auto fill changes are the worst part of this whole thing because literally the point of NCS from my perspective was to remove those games where you have to fill.
If that's coming back then the changes have kind of failed in terms of providing any benefit to me.
If that's coming back then the changes have kind of failed in terms of providing any benefit to me.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
Hrm.
Let's say there's 22 players queued up.
9 of those players are in 3 man groups.
And let's say 2 of those 3 man groups get in a match, meaning that it takes out 4 players from the pool along with the other 6.
So you have 12 players left, and 3 of those are in a group. Theoretically, the system would want to find another 3 man group to play against that group, nyet? So not only do the solo queue people have to wait until another person queues up, but the 3 man group has to wait for the system to open it's net wide enough to queue them up against just solo players.
So let's say that the system does open up and let's the 3 man team group up with 2 randoms, against 5 randoms. The last 2 players left get screwed out of a game until 8 other people queue up.
So I don't think it lowers queue times for high elo? In fact it says this-
Which can be extrapolated to mean that allowing people to queue up together only works in a system where the pool of players is big, meaning that the higher you go, the lower amount of possible opponents. It's why they're lowering it to 3 max, to test it out(As they say, they need more information.)
no problem
I wasn't going to make a thread without your input
respectfully speaking- I always thought this dynamic queue thing was an awful idea. It is a known fact randoms hate going up against an organized premade.
Granted its not the reason I reduced my playtime and purchasing dramatically. Just don't have 50+ mins to waste in a match very often. plus I never feel like I get anything done much when I play. Got 70+ heroes but there is no way I can ever hope to play them.
Only solution I have is go Overwatch route and provide a weekend gamemode that allows me to switch during the game and sell off my items (and buy new items). This way if a match goes 50+ mins I can at least get a chance to switch to some of my favorite heroes
Granted its not the reason I reduced my playtime and purchasing dramatically. Just don't have 50+ mins to waste in a match very often. plus I never feel like I get anything done much when I play. Got 70+ heroes but there is no way I can ever hope to play them.
Only solution I have is go Overwatch route and provide a weekend gamemode that allows me to switch during the game and sell off my items (and buy new items). This way if a match goes 50+ mins I can at least get a chance to switch to some of my favorite heroes
BreezyLimbo
Banned
illaoi is pretty fun
Going to be unpopular in a site like this which is part of the hardcore audience but thank god Riot isnt' giving 2 shits about Reddit and the hardcore crowd.
Anectdote and all but all of my coworkers that already played (group of 6-7) lol are playing even more and now we play together which is something we never did before. Same goes to my group of friends. Yeah we all suck and are silver-gold. Who cares? We're loving dynamic queue. No, we still suck and aren't getting boosted or anything like that. Is just fun playing togheter whatever mode we want.
Lol at casuals shouldn't play ranked.
Anectdote and all but all of my coworkers that already played (group of 6-7) lol are playing even more and now we play together which is something we never did before. Same goes to my group of friends. Yeah we all suck and are silver-gold. Who cares? We're loving dynamic queue. No, we still suck and aren't getting boosted or anything like that. Is just fun playing togheter whatever mode we want.
Lol at casuals shouldn't play ranked.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
After having nearly 200 games in ranked, I kinda agree? Like, ranked isn't any harder than it was before. It's more or less the same. Perception has to do alot with it, ie if you go against a premade or get queued with a 4 man those matches will stick out to you more than 20 other games you had.
I'm a newer player that never experienced solo-que, but I will say that playing with and against premades as a solo player comes with a lot of negatives that you can't track with things like after game reports. Often the premade is on voice coms and there is little to no communication in chat and when you make a mistake or one of their players is unhappy with something you do, you have 3 or 4 people ganging up on you. And against a premade, even if you win the game getting dived by 3 to 4 people constantly because you are ahead of one of their laners is not fun. 3-4 player premades straight up make the game less fun for solo players, whether they are on your team or against you.
Also I see a lot of talk about data shows this or that without any transparency about what that data is and how it is being interpreted.
Also I see a lot of talk about data shows this or that without any transparency about what that data is and how it is being interpreted.
If i'm to take stuff like this as fact, I need to see the polling data, how the question is asked and how it was interpreted. Everything I am seeing points to the conclusion that it is more than just a vocal minority and the majority of players want solo que back.