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League of Legends |OT3| Lizards are red, golems are blue. Give a leash or no gank 4 u

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B

Barrel Cannon

Member
I kind of feel sad about the huge shift in jungle changes. But I'm glad in a way because this will change the whole meta. Without change on this scale changing the meta would be too hard. The only thing is I won't be playing till December so I'm gonna be a bit behind when i start up. Hopefully reading LoLgaf daily will keep me in the loop.

P.S. I hope Sejuani somehow benefits from this patch, I need a legendary skin for Sej!
 
D

davidpdong

Member
Guess this answers about the new jungle items.

[ How will the new jungle items, Hunter's Machete and it's upgrades, influence laning? ]: "We tried to ensure that jungle items were non-optimal to laners. This doesn't mean that there's no possibility that someone may buy the AP Spirit Stone mid lane to help farm wraiths or do fast Dragons and Barons. We're open to the possibilities and will address problems only if they are actual problems."
 
I

inky

Member
Was this posted? Sorry if it was:

Hey guys. Continuing from my initial discussion of preseason itemization changes, which you can read here, I wanted to talk about new alternatives to items that are getting removed as part of the overall rework.

As you know we have a lot of old items that exist in a weird twilight space between useful and confusing, and it¢s traditionally been very hard to find a place for these items to exist and be satisfying to use in the current environment. In a lot of cases, we¢ve decide to remove items that were either identified as having pretty negative consequences for the game or warped freedom of itemization around themselves. While making these items better or more satisfying to use might have been an option, if the core purpose of the item seemed flawed it was targeted for removal.

I¢ll walk through some of the more sweeping changes and try to explain our thoughts behind them as well as what replacements achieve a similar functionality.


Meki Pendant & Rejuvenation Bead – Removed

These items have been removed because they were mostly superfluous item paths that constrained early game purchases and mid-game upgrades. Everything that builds out of Meki Pendant and Rejuvenation Bead has been modified to build out of Regrowth Pendant and Faerie Charm.

Alternative: Regrowth Pendant and Faerie Charm

These items will sit at a much smaller price-point but build into many more items overall, allowing players to have much greater flexibility when building items out of regeneration items.


Madred¢s Bloodrazor - Removed

Madred¢s Bloodrazor has traditionally been a weak pick overall. On the surface, it appears to counter high health targets. However, its odd build path and the fact that it does magical damage make the Bloodrazor awkward in many situations. It doesn¢t do as much damage as other alternatives to high hit point targets, nor is the build path something lenient enough to let you quickly build it to counter high health targets. As a jungle control item it is surpassed by Wriggle¢s Lantern in many ways, especially for sustains, invades and jungle vision.

Alternative: Blade of the Ruined King

This item first debuted in Twisted Treeline, and was meant to be the ¡high health counter¢ for ranged attackers. Against moderate DPS / high health targets, Blade of the Ruined King attacks these characters where it hurts the most – the fact that their DPS is consistent over time. By draining a percentage of their current health on every strike, Blade of the Ruined King seeks to burn down high health targets by both outlasting and kiting them.

Blade of the Ruined King also works well for on-hit ranged attackers, providing them a form of combat sustain that is independent of the amount of damage done by their main attack. On-hit Teemo or On-hit Kog¢maws have traditionally fared poorly in being able to output sustained damage in a fight because life steal was so anti-synergistic with their builds. Blade of the Ruined King not only fits the % damage profile that Madred¢s Bloodrazor once occupied but also supplies life steal for these character builds.


Force of Nature - Removed

Force of Nature has been the go-to high MR item for tanks who want to counter magic damage. The item, however, is kind of confusing. Is it a movement speed option for fighters and tanks? Or is it meant to be a regeneration item in sieges? Force of Nature¢s odd stat combination made it particularly difficult to make it feel like a quality purchase. One of its attributes was probably redundant or unnecessary on your character.

Alternative: Spirit Visage

Spirit Visage is getting a slight touch up for the preseason. It will now build out of Negatron Cloak instead of Null Magic Mantle, and Spirit Visage¢s passive is getting a bump in power. Additionally, there are a lot more Tier 2.5 items that offer Magic Resistance, allowing you to more easily spec into Magic Resistance without wasting slot efficiency.


Ionic Spark – Removed

Ionic Spark is a bit of a confusing item right now. Ionic Spark only fully synergizes with one or two champions (Shen, Gangplank), but it¢s good to have an effective wave clearing option for characters that lack an innate ability to quickly deal with waves of minions. For a proc-build, Ionic Spark is awkward because it grants a very inconsistent proc that does some damage but is inferior to Wit¢s End in a lot of cases.

Alternative: Statikk Shiv, Tiamat, Wit¢s End

Tiamat has been vastly upgraded as a passive wave clearing item, while Wit¢s End has always been the traditionally stronger option for Attack Speed / On-hit builds.


Elixir of Agility – Removed

Right now Elixir of Agility serves a single purpose in the game – to make the winning hyper-carry exponentially more powerful than the losing one. This has some general negative effects: Due to the multiplicative factor of attack speed and critical strike, the raw DPS increase is always better for the winner than the loser in this case. It also strongly pigeonholes viable end-game carry builds to take advantage of critical strike, as it is the cheapest and most powerful form of DPS boost.

Alternative: None

We don¢t want an item in the game whose sole purpose is to pigeonhole end-game carry builds and provide exponential damage increase to a single class. While there should be purchasable buffs that help close out the game, a 250 Gold item that typically only benefits a single player on the winning team seemed a bit superfluous.


Heart of Gold – Removed

Heart of Gold is a deeply conflicted item. Gold over Time items are designed to be a tradeoff of early game power versus reliable scaling further on in the game. However, Heart of Gold is a Health item, a statistic that is primarily dominant early game rather than late game. It helps create a lot to passivity, but worst of all it contributes to passive snowballing. While the intent of the item was to help out gold-starved characters that were traditionally weak, there are much better ways to solve this than an item that also makes their direct competitors stronger.

Alternative: The other Gold per 10 items

We don¢t want to see an item in the game that lets you passively win your lane and close off options for your opponent. The other 3 Gold per 10 items have all been upgraded with either much more flexible build paths in terms of what they can build into or additional ways to generate real and imagined incomes. From Gold per 10 upgrades that let you keep the Gold per 10 when fully upgraded to alternate gold gain passives, the other 3 Gold per 10 items have become much more flexible in their final builds.
Click to expand...

http://eune.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?p=4862528#post4862528
 
D

dimb

Bjergsen is the greatest midlane in the world
inky said:
Ionic Spark – Removed

Ionic Spark is a bit of a confusing item right now. Ionic Spark only fully synergizes with one or two champions (Shen, Gangplank), but it¢s good to have an effective wave clearing option for characters that lack an innate ability to quickly deal with waves of minions. For a proc-build, Ionic Spark is awkward because it grants a very inconsistent proc that does some damage but is inferior to Wit¢s End in a lot of cases.

Alternative: Statikk Shiv, Tiamat, Wit¢s End

Tiamat has been vastly upgraded as a passive wave clearing item, while Wit¢s End has always been the traditionally stronger option for Attack Speed / On-hit builds.
Click to expand...
Well dang. Ionic Spark is my favorite item and I love having it on Lulu. I hope she'll be okay with attack speed builds, but I guess it depends on what Statikk Shiv is. Also the loss of FoN is going to hurt Sejuani unless its regen is put on something else. Spirit Visage is not the same Rito.
 
S

scy

Member
Nasus may gain viability with the reduced early gank pressure. He's already fairly good at escaping 1v1 pressure.

Edit: Wickd builds Ionic Spark on Irelia. Better nerf Wickd.
 
Inskipp

Inskipp

Member
scy said:
Nasus may gain viability with the reduced early gank pressure. He's already fairly good at escaping 1v1 pressure.
Click to expand...
He's still gonna have mana- issues early game imo, since he needs to expend a lot to both farm + shrug off pressure.
 
S

scy

Member
Just going to leave this here.. sneakily.. :3

Sightstone (650 Gold)
+125 Health
Unique Passive - Refresh (Ward) : Starts with 4 charges and refills each time you stop by your shop.
Unique Active - Ghost Ward: Consumes a charge to place an invisible ward that reveals the surrounding area for 3 minutes. You may have a maximum of 2 wards from this item at once.

Upgrades to...

*is dragged away by internal Riot teams*
Click to expand...

Mmmm...
 
B

Blizzard

Banned
"The other 3 Gold per 10 items have all been upgraded with either much more flexible build paths in terms of what they can build into or additional ways to generate real and imagined income"

What do they mean by 'imagined' income?
 
S

Somax

Member
Very interesting informations... it looks like they are trying to explore a much wider design space with new and reworked items.
I'm fairly optimistic, even if I'm crying for the Volibear expulsion from the jungle...
 
V

VanillaCakeIsBurning

Member
New items looks great so far.

This rework is very much needed. I mean, we've been using the same set of items since beta right?There have been some changes and additions but nothing of this scale to my knowledge has occurred throughout the game's lifetime.
 
E

erragal

Member
Can't wait for Season 3. Experimenting with new item builds and champions in different roles is going to be a ton of fun.

Sightstone is -amazing-. So excited to play support and be able to explore interesting items late game to expand team fight presence without losing consistent ward coverage. You'll still need to buy additional wards but the saved money will add up over the course of the game. Of course rushing it too early can be a mistake as well.
 
H

Hero

Member
Sightstone sounds amazing. Should contribute to less gold spend on wards overall and doesn't take up a precious inventory slot that doesn't give the support anything in return.
 
G

garath

Member
Hero said:
I would hope so. 400 gold is a huge investment and a large risk. I think 300 would be more reasonable.
Click to expand...

Ferrio said:
I don't know, oracles is powerful way way way powerful, I'd like to see it nerfed. A 5-7 minute timer on it.
Click to expand...

I second a nerf. Or at least just leaving it alone. It is way powerful. An early oracles costs the opposing team way more than 400 gold currently.

Sightstone sounds awesome. I'll buy it on all my characters.
 
F

Ferrio

Banned
garath said:
I second a nerf. Or at least just leaving it alone. It is way powerful. An early oracles costs the opposing team way more than 400 gold currently.

Sightstone sounds awesome. I'll buy it on all my characters.
Click to expand...

Not to mention pinks aren't really used terribly much cause of oracles. Nerf oracles in a way that there's a reason to pick one over the other.
 
I

inky

Member
Sightstone sounds pretty nice.

I actually thought they were going to put a limit on the number of wards you could get, and behold, more wards for everyone!
 
F

Ferga

Member
"Jungle monsters now attack the nearest target rather than attempting to chase their original attacker to make their behavior more consistent"

Does this mean junglers no longer need leashes? Level 1 monsters have to be really weak or they are going to need alot of damage on blue/red on the first run.

It might discourage level 1 counter jungling because people won't be so split up in the jungle now since mid doesn't have to split himself from the group to leash.

Either way, i'm excited. Hate the season 2 jungle. To hell with utility tanks.

If i can play trundle, I will be a happy man. That pillar is one of the strongest tools in the game imo.
 
Inskipp

Inskipp

Member
Hero said:
I would hope so. 400 gold is a huge investment and a large risk. I think 300 would be more reasonable.
Click to expand...
You're talking as if the payoff/benefit wasn't currently worth it.

Oracle denies a lot of map awareness from the opponent. I would be surprised to see it remain intact.
 
B

Blizzard

Banned
Ken said:
Pantheon is terrible.
Click to expand...
You need to play with Kiunch's raging Leona. Pantheon Leona is funny if you're on Mumble and coordinate it, even though that's probably not viable late game (though I guess you could send an AD carry top).

This picture is for soda cop...first time I may have ever seen someone complaining about sejuani. She ganked top like 3 times in the first 5 minutes, and wukong was raging so hard. She had great timing on dashes, slows, and ults. Also, first morde ranked win! I'm so clueless with him though, I kept forgetting to move the ghost.

In my defense I don't think Karthus was AD -all- game. (or if he was I didn't notice)

sejuanihysl7.jpg
 
B

Boken

Banned
Why cant you get out of the 1000s

crimsonheadGCN said:
Are you sure? Because the option is greyed out when I right click them.
Click to expand...

you can only leave people messages if you had a conversation window open with them before they went offline


Also:
"If you're a mana based tank, there's always the possibility of getting a Sheen and upgrading it to the Tank version of Sheen."

"Phantom Dancer has had its' statistics extensively readjusted. It lost a *lot* of movement speed and a little bit of attack speed. It's also slightly cheaper and thus less slot-efficient.

It's been known for a while that Phantom Dancer was just too good but nerfing it would've caused a drastic effect on AD carry mobility / balance for a while. We've shifted some statistics around into other items that AD carries can easily fit into their builds and now PD doesn't have to be the king of both AS, Crit and MS.

On the plus side, it now has Ignore Unit Collision on it though. How useful that passive is, I'm not sure - but it is something that people have been asking for quite a while on their carries."

Ionic Spark removed but...
"Correct - it's good on Volibear too.

Statikk Shiv's name sure sounds...lightning-y...."
 
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