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[clemenx]

Bjergsen streaming to ~60k people. Haven't seen figures like that in some time.

I wonder how much Faker would do on Twitch. 20k atm on Azubu.

 

[Newt]

Never forget that Rex bait. Never in my life have I been more baited.
Bait can be observed at min 12:10

 

[zkylon]

That game is lewd even by my standards

yea i really like the elaborate costume design

i dunno

also here's the shitty pic you chose with proper transparency

 

[Stone Ocean]

Never forget that Rex bait. Never in my life have I been more baited.



Bait can be observed at min 12:10

I like how he just turns around.

 

[Jeff-DSA]

I think you're just...not doing something right.

Tell me, how do you handle AP ranged tops with her. I'm at a loss other than just stalling out and surviving laning. I mean, the last two times I've played her up there I've had my jungler feed the lane, but even with that I end up becoming ineffective in lane after they hit their power spike. Since her W is worthless to abilities, how do you avoid just getting wrecked by ranged attacks and skillshots?

I really like Fiora, but she seems so weak in the current top lane meta.

 

[Stone Ocean]

yea i really like the elaborate costume design

i dunno

also here's the shitty pic you chose with proper transparency

That image is giving me invalid file for whatever reason. And it's not shitty! I just need to learn how to do proper transparency.

Also that costume design with butt sliders is quite something

 

[Ferrio]

yea i really like the elaborate costume design

i dunno

Kinda neat she keeps her sword in her hair.

 

[Diprosalic]

Bjergsen streaming to ~60k people. Haven't seen figures like that in some time.

well he is the greatest midlane in the world.

 

[zkylon]

That image is giving me invalid file for whatever reason. And it's not shitty! I just need to learn how to do proper transparency.

the trick is not using mspaint

Also that costume design with butt sliders is quite something

you're a butt slider

Kinda neat she keeps her sword in her hair.

i wish someone made a tailoring game

you just make silly costumes like that

like reccettear but you get to design your own suits of armor

 

[Sofo]

That GAF vid with the bait made me laugh IRL, so many times it has happened to me. Q_Q

I have temptations to buy Riven to play Top? Someone stop me. I just feel _nothing_ for any of the champions usually played top... but I know I should learn some. I can basically only play Teemo top, and only because it's so god damn brainless.

I also don't want to buy Ryze because he's so buttugly (first world rito problems I know).

Help!

 

[zkylon]

play lizzy top

she the best

also

I think people would agree with you that blue buff makes a lot of champion balance problematic - especially since it synergizes well with other items.

I tried a couple different iterations of blue buff - these were on the whole about as problematic or far less satisfying than the current one, so in the end - I simply nerfed the duration of the buff so that you couldn't maintain 100% uptime if you had control of both blue camps (which is a lot of the problem with it as a Siege tool.)

so shorter duration for blue buff doesn't sound that bad

 

[Stone Ocean]

How about making blue more impactful?

Cut the time by like half but make it be basically URF mode.

the trick is not using mspaint

But I'm using Gimp, watdo

you're a butt slider

 

[PhillipCostigan]

Tell me, how do you handle AP ranged tops with her. I'm at a loss other than just stalling out and surviving laning. I mean, the last two times I've played her up there I've had my jungler feed the lane, but even with that I end up becoming ineffective in lane after they hit their power spike. Since her W is worthless to abilities, how do you avoid just getting wrecked by ranged attacks and skillshots?

I really like Fiora, but she seems so weak in the current top lane meta.

let me know when you're playing later and I might spectate one of your games.

Add my NA account: nemesisND1derboy

 

[drawkcaB]

so shorter duration for blue buff doesn't sound that bad

This highlights the issue I've had with Xyph for a while now. He's very good at solving problems, he is however bad at defining those problems:

I simply nerfed the duration of the buff so that you couldn't maintain 100% uptime if you had control of both blue camps (which is a lot of the problem with it as a Siege tool.)

When is this an actual problem? Competitive matches which have the coordination necessary to stagger the buffs don't have this. He's throwing a dart then painting the bulls-eye around it. The problem with sieges is that it's entirely comp dependant. No wave long range AoE wave clear? You're going to have shit siege/anti-siege. Blue buff has little to do with it. Want to help teams with poor siege? Re-evaluate Ohmwrecker.

 

[zkylon]

How about making blue more impactful?

Cut the time by like half but make it be basically URF mode.

But I'm using Gimp, watdo

i don't like gimp one bit

This highlights the issue I've had with Xyph for a while now. He's very good at solving problems, he is however bad at defining those problems:



When is this an actual problem? Competitive matches which have the coordination necessary to stagger the buffs don't have this. He's throwing a dart then painting the bulls-eye around it. The problem with sieges is that it's entirely comp dependant. No wave long range AoE wave clear? You're going to have shit siege/anti-siege. Blue buff has little to do with it. Want to help teams with poor siege? Re-evaluate Ohmwrecker.

i think he means having control of both blue buffs means the losing team is pretty much fucked when it comes to sieges, not necessarily staggering the cooldowns or whatever

i don't really think that's a big problem but i dunno

i'm just dying with anticipation

 

[Jeff-DSA]

let me know when you're playing later and I might spectate one of your games.

Add my NA account: nemesisND1derboy

Will do.

 

[Leezard]

So there's more jungle changes going around
http://boards.pbe.leagueoflegends.c...RM-preseason-2015-experimental-jungle-changes

The systematic changes are very likely to cause some champs to have real trouble clearing, and some champs to do too well. As we get further along and start to have more data, we'll be making champion changes if needed.

That being said, we're expecting to see a lot more variance in the health and speed of junglers in their clear, especially in the cases of people who have crazy gank or team fight power.

Return of the S1 jungle? It used to be tough to jungle for many champs.

 

[dimb]

Second, we’re planning to increase the base difficulty of the jungle.

RIP Sejuani.

These jungle changes will probably not help clear out the cancer that is Fiddle/Rammus/Mummy.

 

[zkylon]

so tldr

stronger jungle monsters

weird buffs when smiting monsters (improved vision and stuff?)

tons of new items focused on role (gankers, power farmers) that can be enchanted like boots so they're useful later on

uhhh

 

[Ferrio]

Making the jungler harder? Ugh that's a step back.

 

[zkylon]

i thought i heard a lot of ppl say s1 jungle was way more interesting?

 

[Bacon]

Sounds interesting in theory, I'll hold off judgment until I see how the changes are implemented.

 

[Leezard]

i thought i heard a lot of ppl say s1 jungle was way more interesting?

It was. S2 jungle is the easiest the jungle has ever been, and the worst the jungle has ever been. In S1 you actually had to make specific paths in the jungle (e.g. you had to start golems for some champs, start wolves into blue for some) to make some champs work. It was not a perfect jungle and going back to that exact jungle right now would throw the game into chaos, but it actually made some champs too low to gank after the first clear. Nowadays just about anyone can and will go red-> small camp -> blue -> gank. There was definitely more variety in the jungle in S1.

 

[Stone Ocean]

Season 1 jungling was brutal hard. It was kinda unbalanced but also was pretty interesting.

I'm curious to what Riot will cook up.

 

[drawkcaB]

i think he means having control of both blue buffs means the losing team is pretty much fucked when it comes to sieges, not necessarily staggering the cooldowns or whatever

i don't really think that's a big problem but i dunno

i'm just dying with anticipation

Nope. Going by some other stuff he's said in the past regarding item and system changes he's done, he's likely being literal.

i thought i heard a lot of ppl say s1 jungle was way more interesting?

Nope. That's just people pulling that shit out to prove their hardcore LoL cred. The same idiots how say stuff like timers ruin the game. It was different. Interesting isn't the word I'd use.

RIP Sejuani.

These jungle changes will probably not help clear out the cancer that is Fiddle/Rammus/Mummy.

Tentatively agree on Sej. We've seen supposedly apocalyptic changes that turned out to be much ado about nothing in practice. But she's already on the brink, so it doesn't look good. And agreed on Fiddle/Rammus/Amumu, clearing safely is not an issue.

I've said it once and I'll say it again - don't make my jungle pool irrelevant and I'll be ok.

Nowadays just about anyone can and will go red-> small camp -> blue -> gank. There was definitely more variety in the jungle in S1.

Variety in jungle picks > variety in jungle paths. Do I start wolves or golem is not an interesting choice.

 

[PhillipCostigan]

Looks like Thorin got the sack from onGamers

 

[V_Arnold]

Fiddle/Amumu is the "cancer" now?
What the fuck is this alternative reality?

In mine, a Lee Sin can counterjungle, clear and gank all the same time. No matter who you are. Oh, except if you are Kha'Zix.

Yaay. But maybe I see the aforementioned junglers in the worlds... oh wait

 

[KiwiLannister]

Hope they realize that ganking junglers being strong is good for the game. When they tried feral flare it failed because it let players ignore their teammates. The best part of the jungle role is being able to influence all of the lanes. I think it's going be incredibly difficult to not have ganking junglers be the strongest without creating a bunch of more toxic jungle playstyles in the process.

More viable jungle champs is always nice though.

 

[pigeon]

It sounds like they want to increase the base difficulty of the jungle so that individual monster characteristics and champ characteristics matter to jungle routes, with the goal of having each jungle champ have a different route that provides them similar xp/gold per minute and the opportunity to stretch this by taking on less ideal camps, spending health to get more farm. i.e., Fiddle prefers to clear wight and golems because of single-target CC, Sejuani prefers wraiths because she has AoE clear power, etc.

I'm really interested in Smite bonuses, although I think they should improve the UI for smite kills if it's going to be that important. Just have the button light up more when you're near an enemy you could get a buff from by Smiting and they're in death range. But not Baron, obv.

Also I just realized that Smite bonuses means everybody is Nunu now

 

[Leezard]

Variety in jungle picks > variety in jungle paths. Do I start wolves or golem is not an interesting choice.

You had more variety in jungle picks in addition to more variety in jungle paths, not instead of. Granted, it is not possible to make an exact comparison due to there being more champs out today. You had to make a choice of being a good ganking jungler that went low when clearing and being a tanky, safer jungler with worse ganks. Now you always pick the ganking jungler because those are very safe anyway.

 

[pigeon]

I mean, real talk. If karma and twitch are in the jungle, jungle's too easy.

 

[Stone Ocean]

Apparently Azir has a bug that if you ult a Jayce gate you get like 3 waves of minions worth of gold and XP because Jayce's gate is coded as actual minions

lol

 

[Ferrio]

Usher in an era of extreme counter jungling again. Shyvanna will reign supreme again.

I mean, real talk. If karma and twitch are in the jungle, jungle's too easy.

Jungle doesn't have to be hard. Is hitting minions in lane hard? No. Difficulty in the jungle should come down to how you affect lanes and how your opponents affect your jungle. Making camps harder just shrinks down the jungle pool.

 

[brian!]

edwardo it is ok to admire ppl for how hot they are

 

[zkylon]

Looks like Thorin got the sack from onGamers

yea sounds like it

good riddance, his bridge-burning persona was never amusing, i dunno why he couldn't just keep his mouth shut and let his actually decent articles do the talking for him

Apparently Azir has a bug that if you ult a Jayce gate you get like 3 waves of minions worth of gold and XP because Jayce's gate is coded as actual minions

lol

lol

back like when trynda ulting thru lux ult would also give him minions heh

 

[Ghost is Bad]

new meta

azir hard counter to jayce.

 

[dimb]

I was pretty close to asking for Bjergsen's haircut at the barber today. Really close.

 

[zkylon]

feralpony posted this on reddit

If you think back to the earlier iterations of the jungle at different points in League history different traits have been valuable. A long time ago sustain was king, if you didn't have Warwick or Fiddle levels of sustain you simply couldn't jungle.

More recently we gave junglers a lot of sustain, to the point where basically any champion could jungle. This had it's pros as well as it's cons. One of the cons is that junglers started getting picked entirely for early game dueling/ganking power. - See Lee Sin, Elise, Kha'zix etc as both clear speed and sustainability were guaranteed.

There are more examples of this (clear speed, early ganks, etc) and we feel there is a middle ground we can hit where more of these attributes are valued. Shifting up the difficulty of the jungle is meant to push us towards that "perfect center point" where more attributes of junglers are valued and differentiated. You might choose a jungler with fast clears to try to outlevel and carry into the mid/late game, while I might choose a jungler with strong ealry game to shut you down, or you could counter with a high sustainability jungler who is difficult to shut down/overpower. A live game is never finished so we won't hit this perfectly, but this is a large step the right direction.

sounds reasonable

 

[pigeon]

Usher in an era of extreme counter jungling again. Shyvanna will reign supreme again.



Jungle doesn't have to be hard. Is hitting minions in lane hard? No. Difficulty in the jungle should come down to how you affect lanes and how your opponents affect your jungle. Making camps harder just shrinks down the jungle pool.

That's my point.

It's not good for the game to have ADCs in the jungle. We should absolutely shrink them out. ADCs literally get a buddy explicitly because killing minions is hard for them when somebody else is around.

Difficulty in the jungle being only about ganking is what we have now, and it puts a bunch of champs permanently out of meta while empowering champs that have perfectly good lanes of their own to go jungle because they have gank tools and no requirement to have a good clear.

 

[dimb]

Is making the jungle harder to clear supposed to knock down Lee Sin or Elise? I don't really get it.

 

[Ferrio]

That's my point.

It's not good for the game to have ADCs in the jungle. We should absolutely shrink them out. ADCs literally get a buddy explicitly because killing minions is hard for them when somebody else is around.

Difficulty in the jungle being only about ganking is what we have now, and it puts a bunch of champs permanently out of meta while empowering champs that have perfectly good lanes of their own to go jungle because they have gank tools and no requirement to have a good clear.

What's wrong with that? I guess I don't see the problem with having a twitch in jungle if it works, who cares if he's usually an adc? Making the jungle harder is just going to cement the very strong junglers that we have now as the only ones that can jungle.

feralpony posted this on reddit

sounds reasonable

Pretty much the same thing said every jungle iteration. Making the jungle harder isn't going to magically make it more diverse (How does that even work?). It's just going to force people to pick the same damn junglers everytime. Now granted there's the same damn junglers everytime currently, but you're not forced to... you can do weird shit like karma jungle..least the option is there.

 

[V_Arnold]

The problem is that while ONE gank overweighs at least two full camp clears (and potentially more in implied gain), they *really* need to make it feel like a good prospect to stay in the jungle if ganks are not your flavor.

 

[Bacon]

The problem is that while ONE gank overweighs at least two full camp clears (and potentially more in implied gain), they *really* need to make it feel like a good prospect to stay in the jungle if ganks are not your flavor.

They had that in feral flare and everyone hated it.

Although I suppose with this smite thing it may offer benefits to your laners without having to gank? Like providing vision in the topside/botside river for a few moments or something? It will be interesting to see what they cook up regardless.

 

[Kenny Blankenship]

Not sure what they're trying to accomplish with the jungle changes. They had a pretty good champ pool during feral flare period, lee,elise,khazix were still good during that time and thats when wukong and panth were good picks. Then they nerf flare,wukong,eve and panth and now its all lee and khazix that are picked.

 

[Pandaman]

Is making the jungle harder to clear supposed to knock down Lee Sin or Elise? I don't really get it.

no, it's supposed to make you want to pick nautilus.

 

[Edwardo]

I hope Thorin still does a show similar to summoning insight. I enjoyed it and watched it pretty much every week.

edwardo it is ok to admire ppl for how hot they are

Ok good

 

[zkylon]

i dunno why you guys are focusing only on one aspect of the whole thing -_-

like jungle will be harder

but items will be different and those weird smite buffs and all that thing

i feel like riot probably shouldn't have been so vague with what's prolly the most delicate topic in the whole game (and they say mids are primadonnas). that was kind of extremely stupid

and i hope feral flare never comes back

 

[PhillipCostigan]

i dunno why you guys are focusing only on one aspect of the whole thing -_-

like jungle will be harder

but items will be different and those weird smite buffs and all that thing

i feel like riot probably shouldn't have been so vague with what's prolly the most delicate topic in the whole game (and they say mids are primadonnas). that was kind of extremely stupid

and i hope feral flare never comes back

those changes will probably be on PBE today, so they don't need to be too specific. they're experimenting

 

[Ferrio]

i feel like riot probably shouldn't have been so vague with what's prolly the most delicate topic in the whole game (and they say mids are primadonnas). that was kind of extremely stupid

Changing the jungle has way bigger impact on the game than changing top/mid/bottom. So even non junglers should be critical of the changes.

 

[Stone Ocean]

I was pretty close to asking for Bjergsen's haircut at the barber today. Really close.

Barber king