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[pigeon]

What's wrong with that? I guess I don't see the problem with having a twitch in jungle if it works, who cares if he's usually an adc? Making the jungle harder is just going to cement the very strong junglers that we have now as the only ones that can jungle.

The problem I see with having Twitch jungle is that lots of junglers have invested portions of their kit in being good at jungling. If you can just take an ADC or a mage and go do it, then those junglers will never be competitive, because they've invested power in something that's essentially worthless.

It's kind of the opposite (or maybe the contrapositive) of the top lane problem. If you dn't ever need something in your kit, then every champion who has that in their kit is just not good.

Making the jungle harder is just going to cement the very strong junglers that we have now as the only ones that can jungle.

I don't think so, because the very strong junglers right now are the ones with very strong ganking, not very strong clears. Lee Sin isn't the strongest jungle clearer, he's one of the strongest gankers. If clearing matters more, he's less good.

 

[Stone Ocean]

Azir is probably going to be stupid strong with the bug fixes and the base AD buff next patch.

 

[zkylon]

those changes will probably be on PBE today, so they don't need to be too specific. they're experimenting

well hurry the fuck up rito -_-

Azir is probably going to be stupid strong with the bug fixes and the base AD buff next patch.

i don't think so, i think he'll be pretty good in the current meta but he's too awkward for most ppl to be proper op

 

[brian!]

bjergsen has a pretty good haircut

 

[Stone Ocean]

Bjerg's hairdo has nothing on Rekkles'

 

[brian!]

they basically have the same haircut to me

 

[Stone Ocean]

they basically have the same haircut to me

Rekkles' looks... "eviler"

 

[Tizoc]

Question regarding abilities that enhance the next auto attack: If the enhancement would deal magic damage, would it apply the effect of Liandry's Torment?

 

[dimb]

Why don't I see other people playing Soraka?

 

[Newt]

Why don't I see other people playing Soraka?

After seeing more of her, I don't think she's very strong. She just doesn't seem to do much in large scale teamfights.

 

[Stone Ocean]

Question regarding abilities that enhance the next auto attack: If the enhancement would deal magic damage, would it apply the effect of Liandry's Torment?

As a rule of thumb, no. Only a very select few abilities do this.

 

[zkylon]

is patch 4.18 this thursday?

 

[Stone Ocean]

is patch 4.18 this thursday?

Probably. They should announce the maintenance later today.

 

[Kenny Blankenship]

tried essence reaver and boots of lucidity on ashe, and it didn't go horrible. decent cdr to spam ult is pretty fun.

 

[drawkcaB]

Is making the jungle harder to clear supposed to knock down Lee Sin or Elise? I don't really get it.

Neither do I.

Let's suppose that Lee Sin and Elise are picked because of their ganking ability and they sustain well in the jungle. Some other champions gank very well too, but don't sustain as well so why pick them? You've identified that's a problem, so you hit their sustain but increasing the difficulty of the jungle camps - but that affects those "sub-optimal" junglers too.

Want to make Naut, Sej, etc. a real decision vs. Lee Sin and Elise? Kill their late game utility. Just nuke the shit out of it already. Make them utterly irrelevant unless fed.

Their reasoning - again - is painting a bulls-eye around a thrown dart, and so I don't buy it one little bit. Real reason for upping jungle difficulty? No more level 3 ganks. Less pre-6 ganks.

I do like the idea of items that accentuate an advantage or cover a disadvantage, in practice. We all know how this will turn out though: one or two of the items and "enchants" will be blatantly better than the others. So whatever.

 

[dimb]

After seeing more of her, I don't think she's very strong. She just doesn't seem to do much in large scale teamfights.

I dunno, it's still working for me. Depends on the silence, but she doesn't have a momentum swing kind of ultimate like you have on Sona or Janna.

 

[zkylon]

"one of the new jungle items allows you to use your Smite on enemy champions. Still figuring out what effect is going to be (damage + slow, just a crazy slow, ???). "

the fuck

also i'm no jungler but if i were i would probably play the shit out of fun ones like lee and elise that have tons of cool spells and mobility and damage rather than boring ass one trick ponies like nautilus.

like i get that "generalist" kits are bad but kits that are only good for one single thing aren't that interesting either

so ofc it's like different tastes and whatever but i'm still always confused why some ppl clamor for tank junglers back

like what do you see in someone like nautilus

 

[Newt]

"one of the new jungle items allows you to use your Smite on enemy champions. Still figuring out what effect is going to be (damage + slow, just a crazy slow, ???). "

the fuck

also i'm no jungler but if i were i would probably play the shit out of fun ones like lee and elise that have tons of cool spells and mobility and damage rather than boring ass one trick ponies like nautilus.

like i get that "generalist" kits are bad but kits that are only good for one single thing aren't that interesting either

so ofc it's like different tastes and whatever but i'm still always confused why some ppl clamor for tank junglers back

like what do you see in someone like nautilus

I'm fine with Elise/Lee Sin. Khazix is shit designed champ tho, and he has to go.

 

[drawkcaB]

like what do you see in someone like nautilus

Personally? Ganks are more interesting, better initiation, more interesting to use in teamfights, more enjoyable ult, better aesthetics and champ feel, more unified less meandering kit.

All subjective though. I prefer bruiser/tank junglers anyways.

 

[PhillipCostigan]

Patch will probably be tonight.

PBE is down, btw.

Also:

With the caveat that this could still get pulled, changed, etc., one of the new jungle items allows you to use your Smite on enemy champions. Still figuring out what effect is going to be (damage + slow, just a crazy slow, ???). Mainly just very excited about the patterns that emerge when Smite has more pulls on its usage so that Smite becomes a multidimensional choice.

 

[drawkcaB]

Patch will probably be tonight.

PBE is down, btw.

And there's no shows in particular for my wife and I to watch tonight. Excellent.

 

[Ferrio]

Patch will probably be tonight.

PBE is down, btw.

Also:

Wow... never thought I'd see the day. I mean... at that point why shouldn't everyone run smite?

edit: I just had a brilliant idea. Have smite scale with how many jungle creatures you've killed.

 

[pigeon]

As always, I'm bad at the game and need to play survivable champs to not die all the time, so tank junglers ftw.

More seriously, I just like playing survivable initiators with cc, even in the jungle. Get your laners fed, defend objectives, make a splash in teamfights.

 

[Lone_Prodigy]

I'm going to try jungle Karma now.

After seeing more of her, I don't think she's very strong. She just doesn't seem to do much in large scale teamfights.

I kind of agree. You don't get optimal usage of your passive since you're already close to your team, your R is helpful but not a game-changer, Q is negligible, and you can't heal someone unless you're super-close. Your E if placed correctly can negate an assassin trying to blow up your ADC.

Then again my reflexes suck so I get confused trying to do like 10 things at once (land a Q, land an E, heal someone, pop R, use Talisman to engage/disengage, Crucible someone who's CC'ed/low, use Locket, Exhaust someone). Old Soraka was easier in that regard: button-mash Q, longer-ranged heal, point-and-click E.

 

[dimb]

Wow... never thought I'd see the day. I mean... at that point why shouldn't everyone run smite?

Because you need an upgraded jungle item for it to not just smite.

 

[Ferrio]

Because you need an upgraded jungle item for it to not just smite.

Oh I didn't see the "item" part, bad reading comprehension.

 

[PhillipCostigan]

Because you need an upgraded jungle item for it to not just smite.

^^ this.

 

[Tizoc]

As a rule of thumb, no. Only a very select few abilities do this.

Cool thanks.

4.18 this thursday?

 

[Kotetsu534]

The jungle is a lot more interesting when each player is trying to accomplish different things. Something like the old Gankers vs. Controllers vs. Farmers triangle. Right now there's little trade off - you just pick a strong brawler and you can gank, control the enemy jungler, and farm quickly. Not every matchup between strong junglers should be a mirror match in strategy (or involve Nunu).

Edit: Of course, I'm sure the real reason a lot of people want tank junglers to come back is so they never feel forced to pick tanks when they play top or support.

 

[Ocho]

I like new Soraka. Decent peel for ADC during TFs. Her ult is game changer if you have awareness (can turn around fights in other lanes). Harass is fine lane phase.

Works best with champions with stuns, since E is kind of broken. A stunned target? E + Q for death.

Combos I tried: Lux + Soraka combo of death. Syndra + Soraka combo of death.

 

[Type2]

I do not want there any encouragement for a jungler to not gank baked into the jungles changes. Counter ganking, defensive/ offensive warding and ganking are the only things that drop the pve aspect of the role. If they create a rock paper scissors thing with the jungle items that covers at least three styles and works it could be interesting. Especially considering you could mix something like an early gank jungler with a farming item that opens up many possibilities.
Based on quill coats design they seem to think vision is the tool ancient golem junglers need so maybe smiting a camp will lower your trinket CD or something.
I wonder what other objectives they plan on adding.

 

[zkylon]

Personally? Ganks are more interesting, better initiation, more interesting to use in teamfights, more enjoyable ult, better aesthetics and champ feel, more unified less meandering kit.

All subjective though. I prefer bruiser/tank junglers anyways.

i dunno i find champions like sejuani or nautilus or amumu to be completely boring in teamfights.

like not gonna say i played these champions more than once or twice but i feel like someone like elise that jumps around and ccs and deals damage and changes forms is way more fun and dynamic than just using your single high impact spell and then running around doing aoe chasing carries.

maybe it's not a thing about junglers but tanks just generally being rather boring in that they all have a pbaoe spell and/or a shield. like new sion looks like a fun tank but everyone else i'm like ehhhh

 

[Type2]

I'm really just hoping for more item diversity to create more variations in gameplay.I want to see what they cook up for everyone.

 

[brian!]

they should add a nemesis system

 

[Edwardo]

Nvm Summoning Insight and Reflections are owned by Thorin anyways.

 

[Tizoc]

Now this was a nice match, I was Xin top against Fiora
http://matchhistory.eune.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/EUN1/974256085/205390904

Our Kog was trash sadly, but our Blitz helped us pull through mostly be calling the shots once the enemy team took baron :V
They managed to get our turrets sadly, and their Corki was going AP.

During my laning phase I just waited for Fiora to attack me then I walked away then charged at her once her W had gone :V
Did this a couple times long enough to scare her or score kills off of her.

By mid to late game I was wracking kills and assists. Come end game we take them down at mid, rush their nexus and take the win.

 

[drawkcaB]

i dunno i find champions like sejuani or nautilus or amumu to be completely boring in teamfights.

Yes, but you asked specifically about Naut. Amumu isn't particularly interesting. Sejuani is essentially Amumu with an extra skill shot, so no she's not much better. My like for her is down to aesthetics. Frozen amazon lady riding a giant pig is kinda neat. Her VFX and SFX are very satisfying.

Naut though? Nah. I find his initiation is more interesting because there's timing and risk involved, his damage being tied to his shield means you need to decide what you want to do with it. His passive alone and trying to apply it to as many targets as possible makes him mechanically more interesting than other tanks. Proper usage of his skills during ganks (i.e. not leading with Q) or when peeling is super fun. Locking down a target for ~5s is a troll-ish joy that I don't find in many other champions. Naut gets really fun once you start to explore off-builds like AD bruiser Nautilus when you get the opportunity to go that route.

You want boring in teamfights? That's Elise to me. Fucking cocoon bot and not much else once late game comes around. Frankly, the exciting part of ganking with Lee Sin, Elise, and Kha is the initial burst of damage. Their ganks, mechanically, aren't inherently interesting to me.

 

[Purple Cheeto]

I find it hard to say why I dislike him without using slurs, but basically he's an egomaniac, obnoxious whiny one trick pony bitch that thinks he's hot shit because he is popular with an equally delusional fanbase that actually thinks they are learning anything from a guy that can barely play a single champion in high level while getting destroyed with pretty much any other champion while jungling against stuff like Qtpie dicking around, all that just because he can climb the ladder easily playing against plat and under players.

Imagine if Pewdiepie was a talentless asshole. That's what Nightblue is to LoL streamers.

So he's the new HotShotGG?

 

[dimb]

Yes, but you asked specifically about Naut. Amumu isn't particularly interesting. Sejuani is essentially Amumu with an extra skill shot, so no she's not much better. My like for her is down to aesthetics. Frozen amazon lady riding a giant pig is kinda neat. Her VFX and SFX are very satisfying.

Sejuani is not like Amumu. Amumu is pretty foolproof in that his kit is more forgiving, and with all of his AOE centered and easily spammable you just turn everything on and mash all the buttons. Sejuani has CC chains that should be managed to maximize the slow potential.

Just because a champion is hopping around doesn't necessarily make them interesting. Like...Elise is always going to lead with the stun, and then just spam everything else for damage.

 

[Ghost is Bad]

hey man if smite works on champs idgaf im just running shyvana and clear the entire map in like 2 minutes.

 

[Nekofrog]

Man I really felt like riot was achieving something earlier on this season with the jungle. Pantheon, vi, wukong, xin, nocturne, they were all seeing regular play and not just "oh I don't have anything left in my pool" play

So what did they do? Nerf every single one of them. If not directly then indirectly with item nerfs.

And we are back to Lee sin khazix stagnation

 

[drawkcaB]

Sejuani is not like Amumu. Amumu is pretty foolproof in that his kit is more forgiving, and with all of his AOE centered and easily spammable you just turn everything on and mash all the buttons. Sejuani has CC chains that should be managed to maximize the slow potential.

Sejuani = Amumu in the sense that both wade into team fights to maximize their kit and are AoE specialists. I agree with you, just didn't feel like spelling it out.

Man I really felt like riot was achieving something earlier on this season with the jungle. Pantheon, vi, wukong, xin, nocturne, they were all seeing regular play and not just "oh I don't have anything left in my pool" play

All of whom are perfectly fine, with ~50% or better win rates save Nocturne who needs some love on his ult like the change that was proposed a few months ago. You can't blame Riot for this shit for brains community that would rather play Lee Sin and have a small chance to do the world's most awkward Insec than play champions who are actually effective.

 

[dimb]

Man I really felt like riot was achieving something earlier on this season with the jungle. Pantheon, vi, wukong, xin, nocturne, they were all seeing regular play and not just "oh I don't have anything left in my pool" play

These are all fighters. The large champion pool you are reminiscing over was more limited than you're giving it credit for. S4 jungling was pretty terrible throughout its entirety.

 

[Nekofrog]

Sejuani does not equal amumu. Sejuani is a strong beautiful woman with giant ta tas who rides a pig into battle. Amumu is an orphaned mummy with a crush on a pyromaniac and a strong sense of loneliness

Jeez guys

These are all fighters. The large champion pool you are reminiscing over was more limited than you're giving it credit for. S4 jungling was pretty terrible throughout its entirety.

Oh I know.I love me some tank junglers but I'm talking in the sense of not having the game be the Lee sin show exclusively. I'd rather have alternatives like that than almost none at all

 

[Bacon]

Anyone ever wish you could load up a previous patch? Like I remember feral flare being really strong but I'd like to go back and see just how strong it was in its heyday. I'm sure there is a lot of cool stuff you could see if you could go back to old patches.

I also realize how infeasible this is lol.

 

[PhillipCostigan]

no preseason stuff in today's PBE update

just last minute 4.18 fixes

move along folks

 

[drawkcaB]

Boooooooooooooooooooooo

 

[zkylon]

akali vs yasuo in this ranked game, let's see who throws the hardest <3

also ghost skarner spamming xddd

 

[Vincent Alexander]

New Sion out yet?!

 

[Ken]

akali vs yasuo in this ranked game, let's see who throws the hardest <3

also ghost skarner spamming xddd

yasuo always gets banned in my games