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Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Dead Man said:
If it can be done, I don't think it should be excusable if someone chooses not to do it just because they were at a disadvantage.
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London riots spreading through UK
- Thread starter kottila
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If it can be done, I don't think it should be excusable if someone chooses not to do it just because they were at a disadvantage.
BlazingDarkness
Member
Pazuzu9 said:
All of the people standing around were part of the scum
The film wasn't done by the BBC, it was from a bystander I believe
My parents beat me when I was young for different wrong doings lol. Guess it's an Asian thing. But resenting them is out of the question. I respect their hard angle take on things and appreciate everything they did for me and the reasons why. This no hitting business is silly. Yes it should be a last resort, but it shouldn't be out of the question either.
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Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
storafötter said:
I agree that education is extremely important, but surely you know there are people out there who simply refuse to learn. I went to public school and there were always a few assholes who not only didn't want to learn (and thus usually skipped class), but would actively disrupt other people's efforts for their own entertainment. These kind of people can't be reasoned with using kindness and light-handed punishments. They are willfully and happily ignorant and mean.
nib95 said:
Totally agree, it shouldn't be out of the question - that's a part of this whole problem. Teachers haven't been able to physically defend themselves from, or even to restrain kids in this country for years - same with police etc - this has stripped all power from them and given it to the kids, which is a huge factor in all of this, I think.
Vivalaraza
Member
IamMikeside said:
This is just today's British culture at it's very finest though isn't. Everyone a journalist, politician, doctor, financial expert...nobody's a policeman apart from the police though! That said really good to see communities coming together amidst all this. After all this is done we need to ensure that we stick together as much as we can. It will take alot of effort for society to recover to where we were before all this let alone improve on it.
I NEED SCISSORS
Banned
I disagree with the media's overly thought out breakdowns of why this is happening.
It's not too complicated: people want free stuff and to cause destruction, and will use any excuse and any means necessary to get it. It's not the government at fault, the police, the upper class, poor schooling, poor job prospects blah blah blah - it's being a bad person driven by greed.
This may have supposedly started over a gang member being shot by police, but it's really been pure self-interest from day one. I have no sympathy for any of them.
It's not too complicated: people want free stuff and to cause destruction, and will use any excuse and any means necessary to get it. It's not the government at fault, the police, the upper class, poor schooling, poor job prospects blah blah blah - it's being a bad person driven by greed.
This may have supposedly started over a gang member being shot by police, but it's really been pure self-interest from day one. I have no sympathy for any of them.
storafötter
Member
Zefah said:
I fully agree with that, unfortunately it is a bit frowned upon to use other methods than the kind and light handed punishments.
Betta Lines
Member
There was a guy just talking on BBC News 24 who witnessed the whole thing. I'm pretty sure they said he worked for the BBC. He said there were police just sat in their vans at either end of the street. Nobody thought to tell them? It can't have just been scum standing around.BlazingDarkness said:
Vivalaraza said:
Ageed, though I think the communities that have been coming together are largely made up from 'outsiders' - be they foreigners who have immigrated and whatever else.
I really don't see a great sense of community in this country in general, but I think that's something we really need to improve upon.
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Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Sneds said:
I'm not talking about a little messing around with friends in the back of the class or occasionally making snide comments to the teacher. I'm talking about outright acts violence against other students or the teacher, loud shouting of profanity, bringing stereos and playing music in class, etc.
Vivalaraza
Member
IamMikeside said:
Well yeah it's not as good as it could be, or should be, but it's something.
The one thing I fear is the stereotypes which already exist will be even further reinforced in the mindset of the public. That could lead to further problems, most probably not like this, but general tension within communities.
Another thought, as much as there is need for the society as a whole to help foster and environment where these things don't happen again, I strongly believe leadership needs to emerge from within the rioting communities. They will take much better to their own promoting change than being told.
I think the whole situation sucks...... everybody has lost sight......this started last week because a man, wanted for questioning, shot a gun at armed Police (British general duty police DONT carry guns), and one of the police was a pretty good shot and fired back.
The man is dead, and my deepest condolences to his family, partner and kids. Now the family quietly and peacefully protested out the from of the Police station....as they have every right to do.
But this is where it all went wrong. Some stupid idiot has decided that he's gonna start something and then every body thinks that they are in on it then BBM is used (Come on RIM, you really needed to shut down BBM UK, half the reason this has spread so quickly is because of BBM)!!
Now look where the country is...both the PM and his Deputy (who I think look alike) were on holiday. This has gotten out of hand. The country has to stand strong...these thugs and rioters are preaching about how they have had a misjustice and its just a government plot against black muslims...come on give us a break....are you that closed minded. Its not about you! Stealing is wrong, rioting is wrong (esp in this case - Egypt is not, I lived there I know what it was like). be at east united, but you can't even do that.
All those rioters and looters and idiots and people who have posted on FB and Twitter about what they managed to get hold of have it coming to you. It was mentioned that those caught during the riots would have their pension permanently cut, never again, so they better go and find a job, with a criminal record. Do you think you made the right choice.
Sorry that was my rant! Peace out.
The man is dead, and my deepest condolences to his family, partner and kids. Now the family quietly and peacefully protested out the from of the Police station....as they have every right to do.
But this is where it all went wrong. Some stupid idiot has decided that he's gonna start something and then every body thinks that they are in on it then BBM is used (Come on RIM, you really needed to shut down BBM UK, half the reason this has spread so quickly is because of BBM)!!
Now look where the country is...both the PM and his Deputy (who I think look alike) were on holiday. This has gotten out of hand. The country has to stand strong...these thugs and rioters are preaching about how they have had a misjustice and its just a government plot against black muslims...come on give us a break....are you that closed minded. Its not about you! Stealing is wrong, rioting is wrong (esp in this case - Egypt is not, I lived there I know what it was like). be at east united, but you can't even do that.
All those rioters and looters and idiots and people who have posted on FB and Twitter about what they managed to get hold of have it coming to you. It was mentioned that those caught during the riots would have their pension permanently cut, never again, so they better go and find a job, with a criminal record. Do you think you made the right choice.
Sorry that was my rant! Peace out.
There are problems that need to be addressed about the education system among many other things. However right now the police need stop these riots by any means necessary. All the rioters do is strike fear into their own local communities. Once everything is under control they can have their peaceful protests and mass rallies. I would attend myself, sadly I don't think these idiots would be interested.
Vivalaraza
Member
TruskyMX said:
Agree with much of what you said but the bolded bit is wrong. He didn't shoot and that is something which needs to be looked at also. Not that it makes the riots okay, not at all...but that was a cock-up and the Police could do with less cock-ups.
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Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
nib95 said:
Oh, they can be reformed, maybe. I doubt they can be with light handed punishments, though.
I think the looting started because those in Tottenham realised the police were stuck in the area around their station. This allowed idiots to go and ransack the retail park without fear of being caught. Obviously people in nearby areas caught onto this the next night and looting spread to the areas around Tottenham, mainly Hackney and Enfield. Since then it has kept escalating.
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Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
nib95 said:
Anyone found guilty of firebombing homes and businesses deserves nothing less, in my opinion.
The idiots who simply took advantage of already broken windows to steal some stuff have no sympathy from me, but yeah, they probably shouldn't be put to death just for that.
Zefah said:
A lot of unruly kids actually end up being diagnosed with issues like ADHD, varying levels of autism, personality disorders, depression, bipolarism etc etc etc
All of which are manageable to different levels.
You know what? I look at what's happening at the moment, and I can't help but think of Fight Club's Project Mayhem. A disaffected generation who feel they've been let down by society and thus have no stake in it.
nib95 said:
hear hear.
Gentleman Jack
Member
CrazyDude said:
Widest-scale riots I can remember would be the ones immediately following Hurricane Katrina in 2005. No memory of anything quite as violent or chaotic in the 6 years since.
neutralgamer02
Member
nib95 said:
Those calling for those things are just as bad as the loiters in my eyes. I understand that the crimes the kids are committing are angering and should be punished, but calling for the extermination of them is simply ridiculous, and borderline mental.
Anyway, even if we did kill them all, there would be more within another generation that are produced due to the way society seems to be in the UK. It would be better to find a way to minimize the amount of kids who have this type of mindset, so this sort of thing doesn't happen again. Those saying it isn't possible aren't trying hard enough. There are other European countries that don't seem to have these problems. Why can't something be learned from them to help your fix youth problems?
BlazingDarkness
Member
0242: Gloucestershire Police say they are dealing with what they called a "gathering" in the Brunswick area of Gloucester.
There has been some disorder around the city, with roaming youths setting fires in bins.
And a major fire has taken hold at the old Brunswick Road campus of Gloscat (Gloucestershire College of Art and Technology), a large 60s building that has been derelict since the college moved in 2007. It's next to Gloucester library which reports suggest is also on fire.
There has been some disorder around the city, with roaming youths setting fires in bins.
And a major fire has taken hold at the old Brunswick Road campus of Gloscat (Gloucestershire College of Art and Technology), a large 60s building that has been derelict since the college moved in 2007. It's next to Gloucester library which reports suggest is also on fire.
Smiles and Cries
Member
leadbelly said:
Come on Kim you know you want to speak out too
Manos: The Hans of Fate
Banned
Loiters?neutralgamer02 said:
Uggh, where the fuck is that slow motion cat video now.DECK'ARD said:They've finally burnt a library
You don't have to be the guy on the Monopoly game box to be a social elitist.Vivalaraza said:
It is merely the difference between enfranchisement and disfranchisement.
When efforts are made by the state to keep certain social, racial, religious or economic groups unprosperous or impoverished while keeping certain other groups prosperous then it will always lead to a form of social elitism and more accurately social injustice.
Many countries who are supposedly a part of the "civilized world" practice an unofficial form of apartheid where certain groups are promised the illusion of equality but they secretly ensure those groups will never truly be socially or economically equal to the group or groups which harbor the majority of the political and financial power.
Whether you are enfranchised or not, people who always tend to look down on the disfranchised while grouping them together into negative stereotypes are social elitist.
The negative side effects of disfranchisement has nothing to do with race, creed, color or religion. If one were to look throughout history, specifically at every group or sub-group who have suffered disfranchisement, they have all demonstrated the same or similar behavior which was in turn ridiculed by the then enfranchised members of society.
storafötter
Member
DECK'ARD said:They've finally burnt a library
They are trying to get rid of anything that can teach them decency.
storafötter
Member
Sneds said:
I hope you aren't trying to blame the welfare state for this. The UK was a classical example in welfare state after the second world war. However Scandinavian countries have since then taken much bigger steps and have achieved a lot of success with welfare state opposed to riots, social and economic problems (ahem like class problems). Welfare states can encourage of course certain problems, but the reason for such is rooted in other things than the welfare system itself. If it really was a problem mostly due to the welfare system, wouldn't the most generous countries with the welfare system have bigger problems? Scandinavia proves otherwise.
glaringradio
Member
Why are you even comparing the welfare system in the UK to that of Scandinavia? Have you ever actually went and signed on at a DSS anywhere in the UK? It's fucking depressing to say the least.storafötter said:
storafötter
Member
glaringradio said:
It is a valid comparison if people are saying that the problem lies primary in the welfare system. There exist countries without the same problems with welfare system. You think our welfare system is not overcomplicated or confusing, along with high taxes?
Anyways I have to go to bed now. Night folks and hopefully some more stability by tomorrow.
storafötter said:
I'm not blaming the welfare state but other people have. You can look through this thread and find posts were people talk about people having a lack of social responsibility due to reliance on the welfare state. There were posts were people seemed to assume that the rioters were all on benefits.
Edit: see the post below mine for a good example!
glaringradio
Member
It's a valid comparison if every welfare system in every country is exactly the same. You've just said yourself that Scandinavia has a welfare system which works, which is fantastic and everything, but the welfare system in the UK (in my opinion) is one which breeds laziness and a false sense of entitlement. Fuck most people I know who are on unemployment benefits are youngsters who use their dole money to cover their drink and drugs whilst their mum buys all their food. The only people I know on it who are legitimately trying to get out of the system and back into employment fucking hate being on it because of the label which comes with it.storafötter said:
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