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[entremet]

That's everyone standing still on both sides.

Not just standing on one side as is the usual etiquette, with the opposite side for the active escalator climbers. Standing still in both sides.

Interesting stuff.

The theory, if counterintuitive, is also pretty compelling. Think about it. It’s all very well keeping one side of the escalator clear for people in a rush, but in stations with long, steep walkways, only a small proportion are likely to be willing to climb. In lots of places, with short escalators or minimal congestion, this doesn’t much matter. But a 2002 study of escalator capacity on the Underground found that on machines such as those at Holborn, with a vertical height of 24 metres, only 40% would even contemplate it. By encouraging their preference, TfL effectively halves the capacity of the escalator in question, and creates significantly more crowding below, slowing everyone down. When you allow for the typical demands for a halo of personal space that persist in even the most disinhibited of commuters – a phenomenon described by crowd control guru Dr John J Fruin as “the human ellipse”, which means that they are largely unwilling to stand with someone directly adjacent to them or on the first step in front or behind - the theoretical capacity of the escalator halves again. Surely it was worth trying to haul back a bit of that wasted space.

These results, you might imagine, would be enough to see the model introduced instantly at any station where the escalator was sufficiently steep to discourage people from walking up. But there’s a problem: those damn commuters. With the constant (and unsustainable) attention of staff, and three weeks of practice, they eventually became a little more docile, and followed the new regime, satisfying themselves, as the report puts it, with a “great deal of non-verbal communication in the form of head-shaking”. The following week, they immediately went back to normal. And so another trial is under discussion. “It’s like child psychology,” says Stoneman, a father. “It takes four days to get your kid to go to bed and do what it’s supposed to do, and it takes one day for them to stay up, and you’re sitting there banging your head against the wall again.” So if you can’t tell them what to do every two minutes, how on earth do you get them to comply?

It makes sense intuitively. Less crowding, similar to how streams overflow in nature.

But, coming from a mass transit culture myself, it's hard to change these habits!

People want to move.

Apparently standing on both side common in Hong Kong, which is denser than London. That's where the impetus for the experiment originated.

Would Londoners change their habits that drastically?

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...-tfl-stopped-people-walking-up-the-escalators

 

[iMax]

Typical british response

with a “great deal of non-verbal communication in the form of head-shaking”

 

[Nikodemos]

If the escalator is very steep, people aren't likely to climb it. Having people stand on a single side decreases effective carry capacity.

 

[GK86]

New Yorker here: get out of my way.

 

[Crema]

Great to see one of the most morbidly obese countries in the world fighting the good fight against people moving with their legs.

 

[Orbis Tabula]

Huh. Well maybe I was wrong all my life. That's a little jarring. Guess I have to become an advocate for standing now.

 

[entremet]

Huh. Well maybe I was wrong all my life. That's a little jarring. Guess I have to become an advocate for standing now.

It's one of those things that is better for the group/society but apparently sucks for individual schemes lol.

At least those who hate standing.

 

[Rktk]

Londoner here, I walk every time, so I hope the trial remains a trial. It is true though, that during rush hour there is a backlog of people waiting to get on the standing side of an escalator at some stations.

 

[Dryk]

Londoner here, I walk every time, so I hope the trial remains a trial. It is true though, that during rush hour there is a backlog of people waiting to get on the standing side of an escalator at some stations.

I find this notion that a people can be standing in line for that long because they don't want to walk up an escalator confusing

 

[entremet]

I find this notion that a people can be standing in line for that long because they don't want to walk up an escalator confusing

It not super long. Probably takes no more than a minute.

I do it, but on the NYC subway. I also stand on the right. I use that time to extend my reading time.

 

[Dryk]

It not super long. Probably takes no more than a minute.

When you can just walk up the escalator at any time a minute is far too long. Maybe this is because I've never really encountered the sort of congestion being described though.

 

[Mindlog]

Escalators are 99% go with the flow for me. Not really saving much time and if I feel frisky I take the stairs. However, I would never queue for the standing room lane.
Moving walkways.... get the hell out of here with standing on a moving walkway. Can't remember the last time I experienced that kind of barbarism.

 

[entremet]

When you can just walk up the escalator at any time a minute is far too long. Maybe this is because I've never really encountered the sort of congestion being described though.

Nah. I'm good. I don't like rushing like a mad man. I can take my time.

 

[Acheteedo]

I like the free exercise of climbing some steps.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

Great to see one of the most morbidly obese countries in the world fighting the good fight against people moving with their legs.

We are?

 

[ClosingADoor]

But I don't want to stand next to anybody on the escalator.

 

[Trident]

The walk/stand dynamic they describe doesn't account for individual time sensitivity. The ones walking are the ones in a rush - so they walk. The ones standing aren't in a rush - so they stand.

Ensuring that time-insensitive people go faster at the expense of time-sensitive people seems counter-productive.

 

[Timbuktu]

Apparently standing on both side common in Hong Kong, which is denser than London. That's where the impetus for the experiment originated.

Not sure where that came from, I had thought etiquette there has been quite similar to the Brits with standing to the right (if you ignore the influx of mainland tourists). Still, MTR stations in HK are nowhere near as deep as some stations in the London Underground. You don't really get those massively long and steep escalators. Most busy MTR stations were built in the 70s with wide passages and robust material to cope with large volume.

 

[SteveWD40]

We are?

Oddly I think so, isn't it Mexico, US and we might be 3rd / 4th?

It's odd because I NEVER see people here as fat as I saw in the states, but maybe it's just the numbers and once you are "obese" it doesn't matter how obese?

 

[Miles Quaritch]

Oddly I think so, isn't it Mexico, US and we might be 3rd / 4th?

It's odd because I NEVER see people here as fat as I saw in the states, but maybe it's just the numbers and once you are "obese" it doesn't matter how obese?

Yeah, this is why I questioned it. I see some obese people, but morbidly obese, like the ones who use rascals in the US...never seen anyone as big as that.

Maybe they all live up North? Living off the hard work of us Southerners...

 

[MudoSkills]

This is heresy. Let me walk damn you. I used to work by Angel, steepest escalator on the network, and loads of people walk it.

 

[StayDead]

As someone who recently became a London commuter I'll always walk up the escalator.

Half the time you need to move between trains and especially on Thameslink if you miss a train you have to wait 15-20 minutes for the next slow one.

 

[Mr. Sam]

I'll walk, even if it's a really long ascending escalator.

Yeah, this is why I questioned it. I see some obese people, but morbidly obese, like the ones who use rascals in the US...never seen anyone as big as that.

Maybe they all live up North? Living off the hard work of us Southerners...

It's the Scottish letting the side down:

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2007/sep/26/health.medicineandhealth

 

[Volimar]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDuQhwtxJiA

 

[7aged]

When TCR was closed, I was forced to use Holborn station and noticed those signs. Ignored them completely. FU Underground, I'm walking. It's good exercise and allows me to overtake the annoyingly slow tourists..

 

[David Incorporated Esq.]

This is typical on the escalators in Atlanta's airport. But I think that's more because people at Atlanta just don't give a single fuck.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

If I miss a train because of some asshole blissfully staring off into the yonder, a lecture about daily average escalator times isn't going to mean shit to me.

 

[Musha_Soturi]

Yeah my bf told me about this a few days ago. I'm not bothered myself, I always stand on the escalator unless I'm in a rush because I'm lazy. I see plenty of people walking up though, so I don't see how they can make this happen.

 

[Koshiro]

Typical british response

Don't forget the tutting. We've got that down.

 

[The Elite]

New Yorker here: get out of my way.

I love getting from place to place in New York. People walk with a hustle that is completely absent in Toronto. I feel like everyone is finally walking at my speed when I'm there.

Toronto transit removed the walk left stand right signs a few years ago for some similar reason. Most people still adhere to that rule but you still have the folks he decide to stand on the left or the annoying fucks who decide to stand in the middle like they're the mother fucking king of the world.

Then there are the people who walk up the escalator and decide to stop right before they get off because they have difficulty with that last step. I don't understand that.

Good luck with all that, London.

 

[mangochutney]

Huh. Well maybe I was wrong all my life. That's a little jarring. Guess I have to become an advocate for standing now.

It isn't so much standing is better than moving, it is just that everyone is doing the same thing.

If everyone walked up them then you'd have even more throughput and less congestion compared to everyone standing.

So if you want you can still scoff at those standing

This is typical on the escalators in Atlanta's airport. But I think that's more because people at Atlanta just don't give a single fuck.

I remember literally running at full speed up the escalators in Concourse F with a full back pack on to meet a tight connection. Zero fucks indeed were given by me then. Needless to say when I reached the top my legs nearly gave way.

 

[toweringinferno]

Yeah, they had this trial at Holborn station last December. I always walk up the escalators, as it's faster and i'm gonna be sat for about 7 hours at work so i need all the exercise i can get. Thankfully it was only for about 2 days.

 

[Joni]

Of course, leaving one lane open so some people can go fast limits the capacity for the majority. You can put a lot more people on an escalator at the same time if you use both lanes. If you want to walk, there are stairs.

Yeah, they had this trial at Holborn station last December. I always walk up the escalators, as it's faster and i'm gonna be sat for about 7 hours at work so i need all the exercise i can get. Thankfully it was only for about 2 days.

That doesn't work. As long as you do the seven hour sitting in a go, the exercise is pointless. You have to move regularly during the day
.

 

[Freeman]

Active climbing on both sides. You're welcome.

 

[The Elite]

Of course, leaving one lane open so some people can go fast limits the capacity for the majority. You can put a lot more people on an escalator at the same time if you use both lanes. If you want to walk, there are stairs.

There aren't always stairs.

Sometimes they are filled with passengers who are going down them from an unloading train. Sometimes there are simply no stairs at all.

 

[NekoFever]

I find this notion that a people can be standing in line for that long because they don't want to walk up an escalator confusing

At my local shopping centre I frequently see people queuing for the automatic doors when you can walk straight through the manual ones. People are mindbogglingly lazy.

Yeah, this is why I questioned it. I see some obese people, but morbidly obese, like the ones who use rascals in the US...never seen anyone as big as that.

Maybe they all live up North? Living off the hard work of us Southerners...

"Morbidly obese" probably isn't as fat as you think it is. Those people on scooters are morbidly obese, yes, but so are people who are quite a lot smaller than them.

 

[toweringinferno]

Of course, leaving one lane open so some people can go fast limits the capacity for the majority. You can put a lot more people on an escalator at the same time if you use both lanes. If you want to walk, there are stairs.


That doesn't work. As long as you do the seven hour sitting in a go, the exercise is pointless. You have to move regularly during the day
.

I try to exercise as much as i can, so i see that as an opportunity to do so.

There aren't always stairs.

Sometimes they are filled with passengers who are going down them from an unloading train. Sometimes there are simply no stairs at all.

Yeah i haven't seen any stairs at Holborn station

 

[iMax]

There aren't always stairs.

Sometimes they are filled with passengers who are going down them from an unloading train. Sometimes there are simply no stairs at all.

There are stairs at Bank but even the commuters don't use them—they still walk up the escalator because it's faster.

 

[Stupid Sexy Flanders]

I get really scared on upwards escalators for some reason so to me this just means that there'll be someone next to me looking at me weirdly as well as the people behind us

 

[iMax]

Speaking of, does anyone have trouble walking down an escalator that's turned off? My legs just turn to jelly.

 

[Adaren]

I mean, the walking aisle has never been about maximizing throughput. It's about allowing people who a hurry to get to their destination faster. It seems kind of weird to say "This escalator is sufficiently long enough that we aren't going to let people who are in a hurry get up it quicker."

But I'm not in London so maybe I just don't understand. Are these escalators long enough that climbers are exceedingly rare? How big is the backup at the bottom?

EDIT: Article kind of answered my question. 28% throughput increase from double standing, which honestly isn't as much as I'd expect. Londoners can make the value judgment on whether that's worth slowing down people in a hurry, but I'd say it's not worth it.

Escalator height is 24m. I actually walk up an escalator of almost double that height in Boston everyday, and I'm hardly the only one. So I'd expect a fair number of walkers for this London escalator as well.

 

[entremet]

I mean, the walking aisle has never been about maximizing throughput. It's about allowing people who a hurry to get to their destination faster. It seems kind of weird to say "This escalator is sufficiently long enough that we aren't going to let people who are in a hurry get up it quicker."

But I'm not in London so maybe I just don't understand. Are these escalators long enough that climbers are exceedingly rare? How big is the backup at the bottom?

Well the whole conceit for this trial was to help reduce congestion for everyone, including those in a rush.

The Underground is getting more and more users every year and they don't have the funds to retrofit stations or build new ones to alleviate demand.

They're not doing this to frustrate Londoners, but to make sure the system runs smoothly as capacity increases.

 

[Spaghetti]

Not a Londoner, but on my trips there I don't really see a lot of people climbing the escalator and usually spend more time fighting the congestion of people than riding it. I can see why this trial is happening actually.

 

[Adaren]

Well the whole conceit for this trial was to help reduce congestion for everyone, including those in a rush.

The Underground is getting more and more users every year and they don't have the funds to retrofit stations or build new ones to alleviate demand.

They're not doing this to frustrate Londoners, but to make sure the system runs smoothly as capacity increases.

I don't really have a sense of how big the crowds are at the bottom of the escalator. Is it a significant wait just to board?

Aisle v. No Aisle has always been throughput (minor speed up for the many) v. accommodation (major speed up for the few). Which is better depends on the circumstances.

 

[Darkangel]

The walk/stand dynamic they describe doesn't account for individual time sensitivity. The ones walking are the ones in a rush - so they walk. The ones standing aren't in a rush - so they stand.

Ensuring that time-insensitive people go faster at the expense of time-sensitive people seems counter-productive.

If everyone stood side by side then there would be a much smaller traffic bottleneck. The time lost from being forced to stand is offset by the fact that you can get on the escalator quicker.

That's my understanding anyway.

 

[entremet]

I don't really have a sense of how big the crowds are at the bottom of the escalator. Is it a significant wait just to board?

I don't know.

There are some posters that have mentioned using the station in the trial--Holborn.

Maybe they can chime in.

Some already have if you read some of the earlier posts.

 

[travisbickle]

I read about this a couple of days ago. They have a similar method here in Seoul during rush hour. With young volunteers standing by the escalators holding signs to get people to stand on both sides. I think it works and I'd say rush hour traffic in Seoul is as big as London, I've lived in both.

 

[Frodo]

If both sides were walking we would be even faster.

Move your ass, lazy bitches. And you better have your card ready so you don't stop in front of the gate to look for it inside your bag.

Spoiler

Worst thing still is people waiting for the gate to close before they touch or insert they card, tho.

 

[milanbaros]

I wish they would just tell everyone to walk up. The point is to increase speed and flow, not because it is physically tough.

 

[The Elite]

I wish they would just tell everyone to walk up. The point is to increase speed and flow, not because it is physically tough.

I can understand having one side standing for those who can't walk stairs and there is no elevator available.