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[rezuth]

So before people continue to argue can someone link me to a thread or something where people discussed the extra 11mins? If no one exists I would be happy to hear what people think of it.

 

[Catalix]

So before people continue to argue can someone link me to a thread or something where people discussed the extra 11mins? If no one exists I would be happy to hear what people think of it.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=403245

 

[Erigu]

The first 3 seasons were obviously made up one after another, so it's not like they can magically think up something to connect all the loose shit together.

Again, they put all the loose shit there.
It might have been a good idea to think about possible scenarios to eventually resolve all that before doing so. It might have been a good idea to try and keep those in mind while writing further episodes in order to avoid inconsistencies. Heck, it might even be part of the writer's job.
But they didn't do all that, presumably because they were too busy trying to sell their BS in interviews and such ("we totally know the answers to our mysteries when we introduce them, don't worry! it will all make sense!").

I don't understand how you can bitch about the statue/egypt stuff when we got all the answers to the story stuff that matters.

Yeah, it was just random, ultimately pointless filler. Well, "pointless" as far as the narrative is concerned anyway: in our world, it alimented the buzz. People would debate and theorize over that stuff for months/years. And isn't that what matters the most, in the end?
It's not hard to see where those guys' priorities lie. And they're not storytellers' priorities. They're salesmen's priorities.

to act like the entire show is shit, or that season 6 was terrible JUST because of stuff like that, is really cynical and not getting the whole point.

What was the point, again?

There's lots of great stuff that came out of season 6 and we got lots of interesting answers/episodes (most notably the Richard episode, which basically explains the entire show

Not quite, no. It was idiotic and inconsistent.
Jacob's rationale for bringing people on the island and letting them fence with a murderous smoke monster?
"I can't step in, that would be cheating... but you could do it for me by becoming my representative and intermediary and that would be entirely fair!"?
And that explains the Others' future actions how?

even without knowing about the light stuff).

Especially without knowing about the light stuff. That way, you don't end up wondering "OK, so the cork was blocking... what again? evil? magical life-light? what? or they're different corks? the first one was a metaphor for the island? was the "evil" actually the Man in Black? but I thought Jacob, not the island itself, was keeping him there? until Widmore whispered in his ear, Blackie just wanted to leave, not to destroy the island, so... urgh"

It's obvious that Lindelcuse changed the point of the show from mythology-based to character based (and they kept talking about character this character that) in season 6, because they knew people would rage about mythology stuff and they were just pre-damage controlling.

We certainly agree about that.

I know this is the case but I still don't hold it against them because season 6 was still satisfying in many ways

And definitely not about that.

You can be pessimistic and blame them and troll people if you want but most logical people aren't that negative. They know when there's bright spots and weak spots.

They also know works of fiction don't all have equal parts of "bright spots" and "weak spots".
Lost was weak as shit.
The conflict with the Others never made sense, the one with Widmore barely made more, the time travel stuff was gratuitous, the Backgammon Brothers' actions were nonsensical and the rules and stakes of the Ultimate Showdown a convenient fog.
Not that the "it's a character's show, guys!" aspect fared much better.

the last 10 minutes or whatever it was were just amazing. Beautiful ending.

If you don't stop a second to think about it, I guess...

The numbers and Walt are certainly important, but they're expendable

Remove all that "expendable" stuff, and you have a show that gets cancelled pretty early on. It's what hooked the viewers. There's a reason Lindelof/Cuse kept adding more. Not that "expendable".

So were the lists of people The Others had people NOT on Jacob's list for candidates? That would be why they were brought to the temple for protection as the smoke monster could kill them. And also why Mr. Eko died to the smoke monster as he was someone The Others tried to drag off. If so, that was actually some pretty good writing.

Wut? What part is "pretty good writing"?
The one where Jacob's Others are given lists of "good people" to kidnap for some unclear reason but let the precious candidates out in the wild (even if Smokie can't kill them directly, that doesn't sound like such a great idea)?
The one where they finally take them in the temple for protection three years after the crash?
The one where Smokie kills Mr. Eko because... he hates the "good people" that the Others want to kidnap for some unclear reason? (And why did he spare him the first time around, by the way?)

Eva had one of those controversial endings that actually solidified the series' greatness for me. I felt they struck a meaningful balance, providing just the right amount of thought-provoking mythological payoffs, while also pushing each of my favorite characters to their absolute breaking point. Significant consequences were dished out in spades. When it was all over, the ample amount of lingering mysteries were fun to speculate on, because they were still interesting.

Between the introspective nature of the final episodes and the apocalyptic tragedy featured in the movie, I couldn't have been more satisfied. For better or worse, it sort of became a gold standard for measuring my level of satisfaction with other convoluted mythology-heavy series finales, especially LOST.

When people talk about the end of Evangelion, it often feels like they're not talking about the End of Evangelion... "There's a movie, too! Didn't you know?" ^_^;
And I can see some similarities with Lost, sure, but...

repeat that 100 times until it sinks in.

I guess that's the part where I tell you for the nth time that you should seriously consider learning to read? You never disappoint.
So, yeah, I too can add emphasis, check this out:

We will say this: season 6 is not about time travel. It’s about the implications, the aftermath, and the causality of trying to change the past.

Oooooh...

I never understood why the "Hurley Bird" was even considered a mystery to begin with. It made some noise that Hurley interpreted as his name, and Sawyer promptly told him he was an idiot. Seemed open and shut in the same scene.

It was a reeeeally big bird, it appeared twice, both times in season finales, and both times it creeped the hell out of the protagonists (*, *). Also, even the subtitles agreed with Hurley about the noise.
So yeah, Sawyer quipped a joke at Hurley's expense, but the guy basically never stops with that, so y'know...

But yeah, I don't know why one would actually expect some kind of pay-off for such a silly "mystery". It's a bit like the magic numbers or the hieroglyphs in the Swan countdown: meant to be intriguing, but "come on, show, are you fucking kidding me?"

 

[Salmonax]

It was a reeeeally big bird, it appeared twice, both times in season finales, and both times it creeped the hell out of the protagonists (*, *). Also, even the subtitles agreed with Hurley about the noise.
So yeah, Sawyer quipped a joke at Hurley's expense, but the guy basically never stops with that, so y'know...

Whoa, I never made the connection between the two birds, especially since I still don't hear the damn thing saying "Hurley." Neato.

No question they liberally peppered the show with random junk the fans could either research (like literary or scientific character names) or just speculate wildly about like this bird. For me it added some interest along the way, but a lot of it was definitely inconsequential.

 

[Angry Fork]

response

I guess we just have different opinions on what we wanted/got out of lost. It would've been nice to get more mythology answers, but I kept watching for all the main stuff. What would happen to the survivors, the backstory for important people like Desmond, Ben, etc. stuff like that. While at the same time they answered important stuff about Jacob, Smoke monster etc. And when it comes to the mythology stuff, a lot of it was half-answered in a way that satisfied me. For example with the statue, once I saw the foot in season 3 (i think it was this season) I was like holy shit I have to know more etc. and then they showed the entire statue in season 5, and that was enough for me. It was an incredibly cool moment, and even though it would be nice to see people building it or something, I felt like it was a good halfway compromise. We saw more of the statue, but we didn't see everything, but that's good enough for me because it lets me guess the rest. I guess when it comes to lost i'm pragmatic in a way or something.

I just really don't care much about inconsistencies when the overall picture is still fine. I've watched tons of other highly acclaimed stuff, The wire, mad men, breaking bad, etc. they're all amazing and I know Lost isn't at that caliber, but it's still my favorite show (I won't call it the objectively best show though obviously).

The reason I'm okay with Lost not explaining everything is because 1. they explained enough for me to feel satisfied, and resolved all of the things I cared about most and 2. I know we'll never get something as unique and special again, when it comes to cool mythology, sci fi, intrigue, mystery etc. Lost is by far the biggest "grab you" show ever for me, where you're just constantly like HOLY SHIT episode after episode, finale after finale. Lost gave me so many amazing moments that i'm okay with the finale/last season being meh (I actually don't think it was this bad, i'm just saying it for the sake of argument, i thought it was alright with good points, meh points and bad points, where as the other seasons were mostly amazing or good at least). I don't think that completely ruins the rest of the show though, at all, but I guess we differ on that.

 

[Catalix]

Not quite, no. It was idiotic and inconsistent.
Jacob's rationale for bringing people on the island and letting them fence with a murderous smoke monster?
"I can't step in, that would be cheating... but you could do it for me by becoming my representative and intermediary and that would be entirely fair!"?
And that explains the Others' future actions how?

The Others' actions and motivations throughout the series really don't make a lick of sense.

Wildly inconsistent and annoyingly obtuse, they truly are Jacob's people.

When people talk about the end of Evangelion, it often feels like they're not talking about the End of Evangelion... "There's a movie, too! Didn't you know?" ^_^;
And I can see some similarities with Lost, sure, but...

Heh, yeah I tend to treat both endings as a whole. They don't completely mesh 100%, but they adequately compliment each other in certain aspects.
As for the link... it's a fair assessment =P

 

[SpeedingUptoStop]

The Others' actions and motivations throughout the series really don't make a lick of sense.

Wildly inconsistent and annoyingly obtuse, they truly are Jacob's people

Others actions can really be explained by the group being entirely comprised of liars and misfits who do anything to get ahead. Only way they survived that long on that island is by cheating, really.

 

[Yaweee]

Others actions can really be explained by the group being entirely comprised of liars and misfits who do anything to get ahead. Only way they survived that long on that island is by cheating, really.

And that's basically everybody that has been to the Island. Everybody wants its power and has their own interpretation of the what the Island really is.

 

[Erigu]

So... What? Richard was a slacker?
The fact they kidnapped people based on those lists pretty much implies Jacob still had quite a bit of influence, right?

 

[TheExodu5]

I agree to a certain extent. BSG S4 was hella clumsy, and downright goofy with the plot and exposition. But I think the characters were mostly served well. I felt the relationships were explored to the fullest and they had some awesome conflicts and resolutions along the way, in spite of the needlessly convoluted mythology.

It's slightly different with Lost S6. I wish the characters were given something much more meaningful to do over the course of the season. They were slaves to the season's incredibly limp plot and mythology most of the time. The individual scenes and character interactions felt hollow to me. Also, the dialogue was... lacking, to say the least lol.

Yeah that's how I feel. People seem to think Season 6 was character driven, but I disagree entirely. Season 6 is where the characters became hollow shells and, as you say, were slaves to the poorly thought out mythology. Everything felt so very forced to me.

I think that's the best way to pinpoint it. In both cases, the plot went to shit. In BSG, the characters still felt real, but in LOST, they didn't.

If you disagree with me, fair enough. That's just how I feel.

 

[SpeedingUptoStop]

GRRM didn't like the ending to BSG either, alienating nerds of every stripe.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

I guess that's the part where I tell you for the nth time that you should seriously consider learning to read? You never disappoint.
So, yeah, I too can add emphasis, check this out:

Oooooh...

yeah, you sure showed me. that quote is about seeing the characters flaws, the things they still clung onto even in death. it iwas never about @changing the past@ you can't do it. WHATEVER. HAPPENED. HAPPENED. you're the one who should learn to read.

 

[Erigu]

with the statue, once I saw the foot in season 3 (i think it was this season) I was like holy shit I have to know more etc. and then they showed the entire statue in season 5, and that was enough for me. It was an incredibly cool moment, and even though it would be nice to see people building it or something, I felt like it was a good halfway compromise.

Seeing more of the statue explained why it had four toes (Egyptian gods are cartoon characters!), but that was it.
It's not like I wanted to see people building it (besides, it's a TV show: they can barely CG a submarine in there so I wouldn't expect much), but it would have been "kinda nice" to know why people built a statue there at all, for example. That doesn't sound like a top priority when you're stranded on a magical island. And then, there would also be the "how": it's a pretty big statue.
And of course, why Taweret? What was up with those murals depicting a smoke monster? Was he somewhat less bloodthirsty, back then? Was it our smoke monster? When did that happen? Before Jacob or not? What was up with those hieroglyphs showing up here and other, even on modern maps and in DHARMA stations? What was up with Jacob hiding a piece of paper in a big fucking ankh? Was he just trolling the viewers?
They hint at connections, at some kind of significance, and then... "what? nah, that never mattered, you were watching the show all wrong!"... and then they put more hieroglyphs on the Blu-ray collection. And an ankh. Naturally!
That's J.J. Abrams' "mystery box" theory taken to its logical, cynical conclusion: if you manage to sell the box, who cares if it's actually empty? That's the suckers' problem.

I just really don't care much about inconsistencies when the overall picture is still fine.

And I wouldn't say it is at all, with all those inconsistencies...

I've watched tons of other highly acclaimed stuff, The wire, mad men, breaking bad, etc. they're all amazing and I know Lost isn't at that caliber, but it's still my favorite show (I won't call it the objectively best show though obviously).

Not so obvious to some, apparently. ^_^;

that quote is about seeing the characters flaws, the things they still clung onto even in death.

I already knew you couldn't read, no need to provide further evidence.

 

[Catalix]

Others actions can really be explained by the group being entirely comprised of liars and misfits who do anything to get ahead. Only way they survived that long on that island is by cheating, really.

I just find it hard to believe that everyone of them has to be such an evasive asshole all the time. I don't see a believable reason for that group's consistent trait. For being such a supposedly clever bunch, why were they not employing some very basic persuasion tactics? Their recon and recruiting process was overtly jank and counterintuitive as it could possibly be. Dogen and Lennon... why so hostile? You'd think they'd notice how unnecessarily detrimental their approach was a lot sooner. So in addition to being a pack of thieves and liars, as far as I'm concerned, they come off as straight up idiots.

 

[Blader]

I just find it hard to believe that everyone of them has to be such an evasive asshole all the time. I don't see a believable reason for that group's consistent trait. For being such a supposedly clever bunch, why were they not employing some very basic persuasion tactics? Their recon and recruiting process was overtly jank and counterintuitive as it could possibly be. Dogen and Lennon... why so hostile? You'd think they'd notice how unnecessarily detrimental their approach was a lot sooner. So in addition to being a pack of thieves and liars, as far as I'm concerned, they come off as straight up idiots.

They know/believe they are special, that they're the chosen people of Jacob and the island, but can't really explain why. They're basically a community of Bens; they have a collective superiority complex that they can't/won't explain, and hinge mainly if not entirely on faith.

 

[Salmonax]

Lost is by far the biggest "grab you" show ever for me, where you're just constantly like HOLY SHIT episode after episode, finale after finale. Lost gave me so many amazing moments that i'm okay with the finale/last season being meh (I actually don't think it was this bad, i'm just saying it for the sake of argument, i thought it was alright with good points, meh points and bad points, where as the other seasons were mostly amazing or good at least).

I feel pretty much the same way. Lost didn't turn out to be as neatly planned out or resolved as we'd probably hoped and the quality did slip, but that doesn't change my opinion that it was a thoroughly enjoyable bucking bronco of mythology-laced twists and turns the for the majority of its run.

I think the writers' willingness to get in over their heads with the mythology for the sake of amazing twists is precisely what resulted in the tangled mess of Christmas lights that couldn't be undone at the end. Would I rather the show had fewer wild and wooly plot developments and a more sensible, cohesive mythology? My personal answer is "probably not," which is why I guess I'm at peace with what the show ultimately was.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

Seeing more of the statue explained why it had four toes (Egyptian gods are cartoon characters!), but that was it.
It's not like I wanted to see people building it (besides, it's a TV show: they can barely CG a submarine in there so I wouldn't expect much), but it would have been "kinda nice" to know why people built a statue there at all, for example. That doesn't sound like a top priority when you're stranded on a magical island. And then, there would also be the "how": it's a pretty big statue.
And of course, why Taweret? What was up with those murals depicting a smoke monster? Was he somewhat less bloodthirsty, back then? Was it our smoke monster? When did that happen? Before Jacob or not? What was up with those hieroglyphs showing up here and other, even on modern maps and in DHARMA stations? What was up with Jacob hiding a piece of paper in a big fucking ankh? Was he just trolling the viewers?
They hint at connections, at some kind of significance, and then... "what? nah, that never mattered, you were watching the show all wrong!"... and then they put more hieroglyphs on the Blu-ray collection. And an ankh. Naturally!
That's J.J. Abrams' "mystery box" theory taken to its logical, cynical conclusion: if you manage to sell the box, who cares if it's actually empty? That's the suckers' problem.








And I wouldn't say it is at all, with all those inconsistencies...


Not so obvious to some, apparently. ^_^;



I already knew you couldn't read, no need to provide further evidence.

nobody cares what you think idiot. you've never made a strong argument, all you keep going on is about how things never made sense. how things were "made up" and how we're all fools for having watched the "worst show" for six years.
maybe they don't make sense in that brain of yours, but the story, the plot and characters makes sense. a majority of people loved the show and people in this forum loved it as well.
you're just a sad human being that has to hold on to the notion that if you are enough of a contrarian people might just give you enough attention. you're sad erigu, really sad.
this is so typical of people, you in particular, that take pieces of quotes to "prove" your so called point if you had one to begin with. the fact that you keep throwing personal insults tells me all I need to know about you.

 

[SpeedingUptoStop]

I just find it hard to believe that everyone of them has to be such an evasive asshole all the time. I don't see a believable reason for that group's consistent trait. For being such a supposedly clever bunch, why were they not employing some very basic persuasion tactics? Their recon and recruiting process was overtly jank and counterintuitive as it could possibly be. Dogen and Lennon... why so hostile? You'd think they'd notice how unnecessarily detrimental their approach was a lot sooner. So in addition to being a pack of thieves and liars, as far as I'm concerned, they come off as straight up idiots.

Yea, a lot of them were idiots too, hence how they all were fucked up by the end. :lol

 

[Catalix]

Yeah that's how I feel. People seem to think Season 6 was character driven, but I disagree entirely. Season 6 is where the characters became hollow shells and, as you say, were slaves to the poorly thought out mythology. Everything felt so very forced to me.

I think that's the best way to pinpoint it. In both cases, the plot went to shit. In BSG, the characters still felt real, but in LOST, they didn't.

If you disagree with me, fair enough. That's just how I feel.

For sure. It seems the writers purposefully tried to portray the characters with broader strokes in S6, probably to give the show's final arc a more mythic tone, filled with easy to grasp archetypes. On a certain level, I find that interesting. I really do.

But when I also factor in the unintentional drop in script quality, it ends up hurting Darlton's creative decision for that particular season even more. As a result, it mostly falls flat for me.

They know/believe they are special, that they're the chosen people of Jacob and the island, but can't really explain why. They're basically a community of Bens; they have a collective superiority complex that they can't/won't explain, and hinge mainly if not entirely on faith.

Well of course you'd defend them. =P

I see what you're saying, but it doesn't make their community as a whole any less dense. Geez, even back in the 1950s they were already a bunch of unapologetic douchers. My god, Jacob, could you fail any harder lol?

 

[evilwart]

Seeing more of the statue explained why it had four toes (Egyptian gods are cartoon characters!), but that was it.
It's not like I wanted to see people building it (besides, it's a TV show: they can barely CG a submarine in there so I wouldn't expect much), but it would have been "kinda nice" to know why people built a statue there at all, for example. That doesn't sound like a top priority when you're stranded on a magical island. And then, there would also be the "how": it's a pretty big statue.
And of course, why Taweret?

Although it never outwardly explained, the reason for the statue always seemed obvious once it was revealed to be Tawreret. Egyptians found the island. Egyptians noticed that fertility increased on the island (like with Jin). Egyptians believed their fertility goddess, Taweret, was responsible and built a statue in her honor.

I agree that from a mythology standpoint, some aspects of lost like the statue were handled badly, in the sense that they seemed more important than they actually turned out to be. I mean, you'd think a broken statue of a fertility goddess would have something to do with the fertility problems. I guess inn the end, the statue just wasn't that relevant anyway.

 

[Catalix]

Yea, a lot of them were idiots too, hence how they all were fucked up by the end. :lol

yup, guess you're right :lol

That'll do, Sayid. That'll do.

 

[thekad]

Has that guy pointed to a television show he does like?

 

[Yaweee]

Has that guy pointed to a television show he does like?

GRRM or Erigu? For GRRM, I'm not entirely sure. He just seems to be really down on how various sci-fi/fantasy shows have ended.

For Erigu, it is hard to tell. Over a quarter of his posts on GAF have been bitching about LOST.

 

[Catalix]

Seeing more of the statue explained why it had four toes (Egyptian gods are cartoon characters!)

lol, awesome

Although it never outwardly explained, the reason for the statue always seemed obvious once it was revealed to be Tawreret. Egyptians found the island. Egyptians noticed that fertility increased on the island (like with Jin). Egyptians believed their fertility goddess, Taweret, was responsible and built a statue in her honor.

I agree that from a mythology standpoint, some aspects of lost like the statue were handled badly, in the sense that they seemed more important than they actually turned out to be. I mean, you'd think a broken statue of a fertility goddess would have something to do with the fertility problems. I guess inn the end, the statue just wasn't that relevant anyway.

That's how I interpreted it. and I actually like the open-ended nature of the statue's origins. The various clues are present, but I can easily put them together myself in a logical way.

 

[Erigu]

nobody cares what you think idiot.

You're doing a shitty job at ignoring me, then.

you've never made a strong argument

See, MrPliskin? Now, that's irony.

Know what? I'll pretend for a second that it isn't completely pointless and help you out with the latest nonsense you graced us with. No need to thank me, just promise you'll seek professional help from now on.

Lindelof: What we’re trying to do there is basically say to you, “God bless the survivors of Oceanic 815, because they’re so self-centered, they thought the only effect [of detonating the bomb] was going to be that their plane never crashes.” But they don’t stop to think, “If we do this in 1977, what else is going to affected by this?” So that their entire lives can be changed radically. In fact, it would appear that they’ve sunken the Island. That’s our way of saying, “Keep your eyes peeled for the differences that you’re not expecting.” Some of these characters were still in Australia, but some weren’t. Shannon’s not there. Boone actually says that he tried to get her back. There are all sorts of other people that we don’t see. Where’s Libby? Where’s Ana Lucia? Where’s Eko? These are all the things that you’re supposed to be thinking about. When our characters posited the “What if?” scenario, they neglected to think about what the other effects of potentially changing time might be and we’re embracing those things.

Lindelof: We don’t use the phrase “alternate reality,” because to call one of them an “alternate reality” is to infer that one of them isn’t real, or one of them is real and the other is the alternate to being real.

Y'know, a bit like the real world on one hand, and some limbo-like afterlife on the other. Guess that one theory is off the table already, then! Good to know!
[That's also a nice example of them trying to sound smarter than they are and falling on their face in the process. No, "alternate reality" doesn't infer that it's not actually real. It's even in the damn word: "reality". Idiot.]

Lindelof: Should you infer that the detonation of Jughead is what sunk the island? Who knows? But there’s the Foot. What do you get when you see that shot? It looks like New Otherton got built. These little clues [might help you] extrapolate when the Island may have sunk. Start to think about it. A couple of episodes down the road, some of the characters might even discuss it. We will say this: season 6 is not about time travel. It’s about the implications, the aftermath, and the causality of trying to change the past.

So yes, they are talking about time travel stuff, here. And they're telling viewers that's the right track.

Now, yes, they also said that season 6 "wasn't about time travel". Maybe they meant that the characters wouldn't actually travel like they did (many times) in the previous season... Or maybe that's just their idiocy acting up and they're contradicting themselves. They do that a lot. But the rest of the interview is pretty damn clear. When you can read, that is.

this is so typical of people, you in particular, that take pieces of quotes to "prove" your so called point if you had one to begin with.

Irony!

the fact that you keep throwing personal insults

Irony! (like, just above, in the same post... dude, seriously?)
And if that was about my saying you can't read, please realize that's actually the charitable theory.

For Erigu, it is hard to tell.

Ah, come on... This shit again?
(and I just linked to a post of mine where I listed a few titles, too...)

 

[Zeliard]

Haha, just got wind of the George R. R. Martin/Damon Lindelof feud. Amusing stuff.

 

[Iceman]

Haha, just got wind of the George R. R. Martin/Damon Lindelof feud. Amusing stuff.

Damon's followup is pretty dang funny (immature, but funny):

I've just been informed George is working on his feud response. I'll have it in FIVE YEARS! #NOYOUDINT

 

[teiresias]

The way George RR Martin avoids this problem is by never writing an ending to ANYTHING.

 

[Basileus777]

Lindelof is interviewed about it here:

http://insidetv.ew.com/2011/04/05/thrones-author-lost/

 

[Aristion]

Erigu quotes Lindelof like scripture. Incredible stuff. You have an incredible ability of knowing LOST trivia, I wonder how it pans out in the real world.

 

[Iceman]

Lindelof is interviewed about it here:

http://insidetv.ew.com/2011/04/05/thrones-author-lost/

That's a pretty good read. Love Lindelof. His thoughts embiggen my spirit.

 

[Yaweee]

Nice bit from the article that kind of sums up my thoughts:

In regards to what Martin did say about the ending of Lost, it seems like in the article there’s a fear of finishing off his series in a way that angers fans. Is that something that you can relate to?
Sure, although I think it’s not a foregone conclusion. The cynic in me says that there’s nothing that you can do to avoid that. [Fellow exec producer] Carlton [Cuse] and I were certainly aware of that. When we announced the end-date of the show, about two days or three days later the Sopranos finale came on, and we both thought it was, like, completely and totally, empirically brilliant. We were shocked to learn that there were a lot of people who thought it was a cop-out. At that moment in time, we had just negotiated the ending of Lost, we kind of looked at each other and said, “We’re screwed.” But the Ice and Fire saga doesn’t really have a mystery at its core. It’s more of a sprawling sort of epic. You’re talking about a resolution that’s going to be more dependent on who lives, who dies, who’s in charge, who’s good, who’s bad. When you take a show like Battlestar Galactica or Lost, which do have mysteries built in, and deep and dense backstory mythologies, it’s a very different landing to stick.

I don't think Martin has much to be afraid of, as they aren't really playing the same game.


The interview with Lindeloff really is great. Kind of a "one year later" retrospective, in a way.

 

[Zeliard]

Lindelof is interviewed about it here:

http://insidetv.ew.com/2011/04/05/thrones-author-lost/

Pretty classy and level-headed stuff from Lindelof in that interview, all told.

Twitter is really an awful place for any meaningful discourse.

 

[Erigu]

Lindelof is interviewed about it here:
http://insidetv.ew.com/2011/04/05/thrones-author-lost/

Lindelof: [...] it’s not entirely a fair fight.

Heh. No, probably not, Damon...

Erigu quotes Lindelof like scripture. Incredible stuff. You have an incredible ability of knowing LOST trivia, I wonder how it pans out in the real world.

In that case, picture this if you will:
I have a computer. And access to the internet.
Crazy story.

But, yeah, I probably know too much. And that's bad. Just like knowing too little would be.
And criticizing the show a while after it ended is bad, too. Then again, so was criticizing it when it was still on and "not even over yet, you hater! it's too early to tell!"
Bulletproof.

Pretty classy and level-headed stuff from Lindelof in that interview, all told.

And he used "empirical" / "empirically", like, three times, too!
Unfortunately, only the first one counts, so that's just 10 points. Too bad he didn't manage to stick a "paradigm" in there somewhere; that one's 15 points.

Still...

But the Ice and Fire saga doesn’t really have a mystery at its core. It’s more of a sprawling sort of epic. You’re talking about a resolution that’s going to be more dependent on who lives, who dies, who’s in charge, who’s good, who’s bad. When you take a show like Battlestar Galactica or Lost, which do have mysteries built in, and deep and dense backstory mythologies, it’s a very different landing to stick.

(psst, hey! stick to your story, man! "it was all about the characters", remember!)

 

[legend166]

My biggest problem with season 6 was the Temple Others. Well, the whole Temple thing, really. What an utter waste of time that was. Why did those characters exist? What was the point?

 

[Blader]

Erigu quotes Lindelof like scripture. Incredible stuff. You have an incredible ability of knowing LOST trivia, I wonder how it pans out in the real world.

>implying Erigu can function in the real world

Spoiler

oh god i've spending too much time on 4chan

 

[SpeedingUptoStop]

My biggest problem with season 6 was the Temple Others. Well, the whole Temple thing, really. What an utter waste of time that was. Why did those characters exist? What was the point?

People wanted to see the temple, wanted to set into motion the too vague zombie plot, test alliances, show that the island they returned too is more hostile than the one they left, get the gang familiar with forces at play that are even older than the dharma they've known, present the audiences with pawns for MiB to wipe out, present a couple fresh characterizations to the season so it wasn't all old faces, throw out a couple more mysteries like the Dagger & mythology, force the gang to stay in one place for even a little while so they didn't all run off after they returned, other general setting the pace things.

There were a lot of holes they should have filled in at The Temple, but I don't think it served 0 purpose at all/

 

[gdt]

Great little interview with Lindelof. Nice looking back too.

 

[WillyFive]

My biggest problem with season 6 was the Temple Others. Well, the whole Temple thing, really. What an utter waste of time that was. Why did those characters exist? What was the point?

To get rid of The Others for good. They were the last ones that were left that we knew about.

Basically cleaning up as much as they could from the series so that they can focus on the climax.

Besides, we got an awesome sequence out of it.

 

[Blader]

My biggest problem with season 6 was the Temple Others. Well, the whole Temple thing, really. What an utter waste of time that was. Why did those characters exist? What was the point?

The last 15 minutes of "Sundown" make the whole Temple arc worthwhile.


(Not that a lot of time was spent at the temple anyway.)

 

[gdt]

People wanted to see the temple, wanted to set into motion the too vague zombie plot, test alliances, show that the island they returned too is more hostile than the one they left, get the gang familiar with forces at play that are even older than the dharma they've known, present the audiences with pawns for MiB to wipe out, present a couple fresh characterizations to the season so it wasn't all old faces, throw out a couple more mysteries like the Dagger & mythology, force the gang to stay in one place for even a little while so they didn't all run off after they returned, other general setting the pace things.

There were a lot of holes they should have filled in at The Temple, but I don't think it served 0 purpose at all/

The Temple is the weakest part, but it really isn't that bad. We were in full on Temple mode for 3 episodes. WKD, The Lighthouse (we follow Jack and Hugo leaving, and besides, good episode) and Sundown where shit gets blown up to kingdom come (good episode too).

People over exaggerate The Temple.

But Dogen and Lennon sucked. I did like the more frank and easygoing conversations between Jack and Dogen though. Rewatching that episode recently, I couldn't for the life of me figure out why those two fucker wouldn't just talk. They were activively fucking up their mission, and it's by farrrr the most blatant example of shutting up dudes who know shit for no fucking reason.

 

[SpeedingUptoStop]

The last 15 minutes of "Sundown" make the whole Temple arc worthwhile.


(Not that a lot of time was spent at the temple anyway.)

It was only featured at all in like, 4 episodes total, but it left quite the impression on some people.

 

[~Kinggi~]

Im re-watching Lost on the high resolution BLU RAY TM disc format by Sony Corporation and i have to say Locke is the best thing since sliced bread.

 

[ErasureAcer]

I'm up to Catch 22 on my rewatch! Woohoo shit gets good again.

 

[Catalix]

I liked the idea of the temple. It's a great setting in and of itself. They've alluded to its existence over the years, so my interest was already piqued. I definitely saw the potential it would've served for fresh interactions and interesting payoffs.

But quickly, all that potential gets washed down the drain. The Others' society is completely devoid of any substance. I have no idea what their beliefs and motivations are on a tangible level. Not fleshing out the Temple's inhabitants was a real missed opportunity. They're just one more meaningless obstacle for our heroes to bide their time with, until they eventually get swept under the rug. And the few natives that we do get some insight on treat Jack and crew like utter shit for no clear reason. It's an unpleasant experience.

 

[gdt]

Dammmmmmmmnnnnn just watched Sundown.

Awesome episode, the flash sideways was great.



Side note, they really fucked up Sayid in the final stretch :/. I would've much preferred a man who truly lost out to his dark-side. Would've been really tragic.

Or at least build up his last minute heroics better.

 

[gdt]

Sweet Jesus Happily Ever After. That underwater scene is such a gut punch.

Desmond Hume=Boss of the Afterlife.

 

[overcast]

Christ Erigu, give it a damn rest.

But yeah the temple part wasn't so good..

 

[gdt]

Now it's time for Everybody Loves Hugo. Solid-to-good episode.

Then the rest of the episodes is probably my favorite stretch of the show. Knockout after knockout for me.

Spoiler

Totally excluding Across The Sea.

 

[WillyFive]

Hugo is such a great character, funny, grounded, and important.