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[Mafia] NX Launch Night |OT| Back of the Line!
- Thread starter CzarTim
- Start date
Fire could only do his actions once. They probably didn't want him wasting them in n1. Hence, he sent the kill.
we're back on either cahoots with Darryl or he could do both which makes N1 seem a bad decision.
Roy's distanced himself pretty hard from Darryl so far. He hasn't voted on him though, could be just sweet nothings
LaunchpadMcQ
Banned
Honestly, I'm not sure why they did it like this (maybe they thought they would have longer, this is the shortest game we've had in gafia), but why else put Fireblend out in the open like that?
They would have had to guess that there arent any more investigative town roles, though, as it was still early game. Even the swapping could have relied heavily on knowing who was who and where their abilities would land, by omission of who was using these abilities. Plenty of this game has relied on misinformation, so giving the mafia a manner in which to control the flow of information is not unfounded.
So if roy is mafia tracker, either:
1. There's another mafia out there who killed last night
OR
2. He can kill and track on the same night
This excludes the possibility that roy is not a tracker and he was somehow informed of the Darryl lick.
LaunchpadMcQ
Banned
They wouldn't have had Fireblend do the kill if the tracker can kill and track?
The bigger issue is what's behind door #3 if Roy has been doing the kills
This is a fair point. I guess I just assume that they would have sent out the tattletale command which was then useless anyway and save Fire for a rainy day. Like I said, I'm operating under the assumption of one left but as we discuss more and more, only two total scum from the start isn't consistent with what they did.
Option #3 is the last remaining mafia is super duper powerful haha.
LaunchpadMcQ
Banned
The last mafia is the guy with the list who keeps coming out to check on us.
I'm assuming the issue here is that, if Roy is doing the killing, why has the last person NOT been doing the killing, what power have they been using every night? Because we've seen nothing to indicate another PR working at night.
LaunchpadMcQ
Banned
That's what I said with different words and less snark.
He could have switched two different people to prevent a killblock. They did go for Ouro after all.
LaunchpadMcQ
Banned
Because he is too busy licking
Ok, well if Roy is only tracking or only killing and he has been the killer then door number 3 can only be Darryl or me. If I'm being forced to be Lickitung over here every night and all scum is conforming to a rule of either kill or do your action then I would never be the killer because I've always had to lick. And before someone says "well you didn't lick anyone night 1" then you'd also be saying that I bussed the highest utility scum player.
I don't get why any other player can't be door 3, like Launch.
Maybe he licks people.
Explain to me why I threw Fire under that bus with no regrets then? I'm licking people and announcing my presence to them each night, Fire still had two pretty strong roles still available. Wouldn't this have been the reverse situation of him bussing me?
Roy knew that I licked you, only 3 people should have known that. Myself, you, or a tracker.
Lone_Prodigy
Member
Isn't that Tim?
Maybe he thought you had a chance. I don't know. I can't say I'm following the train of thought here at all.
Right, but Roy could still be a mafia tracker and ANYONE else could be another mafia PR.
So this is going under the assumption that Roy is lying about being a tracker? Because I can guarantee you he's a tracker.
I don't think there is a train of thought to follow honestly, Launch did a big Phoenix Wright post and then some large assumptions were made that we don't know are true or not.
This is true too, Roy could have just been tracking all of these nights and someone else was doing the kill. Or he could just do both, we don't actually know.
LaunchpadMcQ
Banned
No, the assumption here is that Roy is the tracker, and he may have been using his ability, even. But, that this ability is instead a mafia ability.
Odd wording?
You are right. I can't guarantee you and him aren't mafia. I can just guarantee that I've had absolutely nothing to do with it.
I guarantee you satisfaction
That's more like the Darryl I'd expect. Anyway, what do we do from here? We need to know whether roy is a tracker or not and then past that, if he is scum aligned, we need to know if he could only use one ability a night or both.
Sir, please, I am the one handing out the licks. Only I can guarantee satisfaction.
I was most definitely not satisfied when it happened
I notice your avatar even displays the cowlick proudly. No need to be ashamed.
LaunchpadMcQ
Banned
I found something interesting.
If Roy watched Blarg N1, didn't see him move, why the fuck didn't he say anything (vague or explicit) about Blarg's bullshit claim?
If Roy watched Blarg N1, didn't see him move, why the fuck didn't he say anything (vague or explicit) about Blarg's bullshit claim?
eh, maybe a very light hint towards the end but nothing substantial
LaunchpadMcQ
Banned
Not even a retrospective "sorry guys I couldn't say anything"?
Unfortunately, he did. I already checked on this myself. I quoted this same convo to you earlier:
I assumed he meant that because he, himself, was a PR then he is confused why he didn't show up on the watcher report but he could have just as easily been calling it bullshit because he watched Blarg and saw nothing.
OK maybe this does hint a little more
LaunchpadMcQ
Banned
Ok thanks for the legwork guys.
Still, I think Roy has been using his ability. Mafia #3 is the one doing the kills now
Still, I think Roy has been using his ability. Mafia #3 is the one doing the kills now
Might I suggest we not jump to weird conclusions? We don't even know that roy has to choose whether to kill or track, hell we don't even know that roy is scum even though I find him to be the most likely at the moment.
LaunchpadMcQ
Banned
If we can't assume he can't kill and track, I think we've got nothing lol
I mean, using connections are fine, but just because Fire had a stipulation like that doesn't mean they all do. At this point, I'd like to see some defense from roy, I think a lot of us have suspicion on him for different reasons and him talking might make those worse or better.
LaunchpadMcQ
Banned
I'm just saying, a good part of my suspicion is that Fireblend carried out the kill because Roy couldn't and they thought his ability was better suited for N1 use.
A good part of my suspicion is that roy soft claimed a PR on day 2 and has not been killed yet. I understand that they had to get the hard claim of Burb on night 2 but why squidy over roy on night 3? Nah, mafia would have jumped on that especially after I made a big deal about not wanting to question roy yesterday because he might be important.
So I come back from work to see I am now suddenly the prime suspect? Great, now I have to defend myself while I am tired from work.
Yes, I know my first two reads have been completely useless. I first tracked Blarg because , well, it is Blarg and when he would start with his crazy ass antics, I wanted to have some more information to judge them. This is how I knew his lightning rod claim was complete bullshit, Burb would have also seen me that night, because my action would have been attracted to Ourob (or somebody else if he got switched).Note: I would have never seen Blarg move, even if his claim was true, because I would suddenly be tracking someone else.
Second night I tracked Squidyj because from Archer I thought he was a very good player, and if he had a PR (or was scum) I would want to know as soon as possible to help/attack him. Again I got no result.
Now, the game was in a phase where most of the Role claims were already out in the open, and we probably hadn't many more day phases to go. Also, who did and didn't role claim became a topic of discussion at the end of day 3. So I knew that if I tracked somebody and AGAIN got no results, I would be in trouble if I was forced to roleclaim. Scum could very easily implicate me. Therefore, I tracked Sorian, because he was the only one with a kind of verified night action that could be confirmed by TWO separate people. Unfortunately, he licked one of the prime mafia suspects so the whole "Roy got it from the scum chat" scenario became a possibility in some people's eyes. Basically, I got very unlucky with my track targets.
Now, about me being a mafia tracker and not a town tracker: Judging from launch his post, the main argument is that if I am mafia, we would have let Fire do the kill and me track, purposely putting a very powerful mafia PR at risk so that I could gather information? Sorry to say, but that is quite a stretch. The only scenarios where that would make sense, is if:
- Me and Fire are the only two mafia members. That means a mafia team with 1 guy with a track ability and 1 guy with 3 one shot abilities. In my eyes that is weak as fuck, if you look at what town confirmed has. I doubt Tim sucks this much at game balancing.
- The third mafia member is super strong with an even better PR. Now, some of you have already mentioned that we haven't seen any results from other mafia PR. If the third member would really be so powerful, don't you think we would have seen his super power in effect already? We didn't, so which power could he have that is so important that we are willing to risk Fire for it, but yet it hasn't shown up yet? I don't think there is a mafia member with an even better PR than fire because we would have seen something already.
Also, I want to ask: if I were a mafia tracker that tracked Squidyj during N2 and didn't get any results, why would we target him during N3? Not only would we have known he wasn't a PR, we would purposely make my eventual role claim harder. Targeting Squidyj would make no sense.
Yes, I know my first two reads have been completely useless. I first tracked Blarg because , well, it is Blarg and when he would start with his crazy ass antics, I wanted to have some more information to judge them. This is how I knew his lightning rod claim was complete bullshit, Burb would have also seen me that night, because my action would have been attracted to Ourob (or somebody else if he got switched).Note: I would have never seen Blarg move, even if his claim was true, because I would suddenly be tracking someone else.
Second night I tracked Squidyj because from Archer I thought he was a very good player, and if he had a PR (or was scum) I would want to know as soon as possible to help/attack him. Again I got no result.
Now, the game was in a phase where most of the Role claims were already out in the open, and we probably hadn't many more day phases to go. Also, who did and didn't role claim became a topic of discussion at the end of day 3. So I knew that if I tracked somebody and AGAIN got no results, I would be in trouble if I was forced to roleclaim. Scum could very easily implicate me. Therefore, I tracked Sorian, because he was the only one with a kind of verified night action that could be confirmed by TWO separate people. Unfortunately, he licked one of the prime mafia suspects so the whole "Roy got it from the scum chat" scenario became a possibility in some people's eyes. Basically, I got very unlucky with my track targets.
Now, about me being a mafia tracker and not a town tracker: Judging from launch his post, the main argument is that if I am mafia, we would have let Fire do the kill and me track, purposely putting a very powerful mafia PR at risk so that I could gather information? Sorry to say, but that is quite a stretch. The only scenarios where that would make sense, is if:
- Me and Fire are the only two mafia members. That means a mafia team with 1 guy with a track ability and 1 guy with 3 one shot abilities. In my eyes that is weak as fuck, if you look at what town confirmed has. I doubt Tim sucks this much at game balancing.
- The third mafia member is super strong with an even better PR. Now, some of you have already mentioned that we haven't seen any results from other mafia PR. If the third member would really be so powerful, don't you think we would have seen his super power in effect already? We didn't, so which power could he have that is so important that we are willing to risk Fire for it, but yet it hasn't shown up yet? I don't think there is a mafia member with an even better PR than fire because we would have seen something already.
Also, I want to ask: if I were a mafia tracker that tracked Squidyj during N2 and didn't get any results, why would we target him during N3? Not only would we have known he wasn't a PR, we would purposely make my eventual role claim harder. Targeting Squidyj would make no sense.
In regards to the last point, squidy is just a strong player in general and it's becoming increasingly obvious that town has no more PRs (except maybe you). In terms of one mafia member left vs. 2. I don't know, maybe the last guy has something ridiculous like a double vote or double kill or something. I really don't know anymore. After everything we've talked about, it's really come full circle for me and the biggest offender of this whole game is that mafia should have killed you last night and they didn't.
That too I guess but I can't believe that someone actually thought we'd go for the obvious bait. Queue the debate on how that's what the mafia WANTS us to think because it was actually Launch all along or its not or it was etc. etc.
That's why debating over mafia kill intent is so difficult. You basically have to read their mind.