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MAG |OT| 256-Player Battles, Lots of Teamwork, Not So Much Auto-Aim
- Thread starter J-Rzez
- Start date
Click said:
In what? The beta? They should give out some hefty bonuses though. You'd think they'd want to help people get to max level faster to be able to play around with trees for balancing, along with getting all the weapons to give some input.
My other recommendations outside of either getting rid of the knife all together with infinite pistol-only ammo is to make the knife context sensitive when in proper range. Right now, with lag, with that sprint boost, things are out of control getting knifed 10' away after drilling them with a couple shots. First time you see someone kill 3 people with a single swipe is funny, after that, it's annoying.
Sprinting, that's fine with the faster speed if you fix the knife, but also make it so if you get hit while using super sprint it knocks you out of it. Or, make it only work with the two lowest armors.
That new sniper rifle is garbage. It'll never get used on live, just like the current middle of the road one. I'd say since the new AR and LMG (MMG) got buffed, why not make another sniper rifle with some devastating damage, but even more recoil than the current T3 sniper, OR, make it do the same damage just with faster firing/lower recoil. Each should cost a lot more weight to use. Plus, how the hell isn't the Barrett in this as a model?
Finally, 10th Vet. Once you hit that you should be able to get access to some new weapons and armors. Let the armor look cooler, and give out some "slightly" buffed weapons. Possibly buffed top tier weapons.
J-Rzez said:
No, not the beta.
Zipper gave us bonus XP boosts for playing Acqui., Inter., and Dom. yesterday when they implemented the extra character slots.
It didn't last though. Hopefully they'll bring back the bonuses, just with different values. Sabotage should give +20% XP, Acquisition +50%, Interdiction +100%, and Domination +50%. Directives should always give +100% XP on top of the bonuses of each game mode and "Happy Hour." However, none of these XP bonuses should count towards MVPs.
Lagspike_exe
Member
My first choice was SVER and I was quite happy about it.
Click said:
Yeah, like I said above they didn't change a thing, and if they did somehow, it didn't make a shred of a difference.
Make knives context sensitive I say, pistols only with infinite ammo. I'd rather that than the debacle the beta is now. Cheap ass valor and of course Raven who exploits every single bug/glitch or OPness in the game. I've seen one, one teammate doing that so far, and iirc, he got vote-kicked.
the_prime_mover
Member
Picked this up recently on the cheap in anticipation of Move. I am glad I didn't run out and buy this new. Gunplay and graphics are horrible. Knife seems to be a kill from 10ft away in one hit without even slowing the wielder down. Also, even though I can hear my own foot steps I can never hear anyone elses meaning that people can run up behind me and I have no indication that they are there.
To go along with the sorry graphics is a nausiating blur effect whenever I get shot, or an explosion goes off, or sometimes when I am running. It is worse then the effect that Bioshock uses.
Upgrade paths seems to be pretty anemic and the stock weapons are very unsatisfying. Why does a sniper take 3 body hits to kill, but I need to be somewhere around lvl 11 before I even have the opportunity to try out a new sniper rifle? Then, if I do take that path I will need to either respec or get to level 20-something to get a better assualt rifle. Nevermind that in order to level you have to get a lot of points and someone who is a high level and has a fully tricked out LMG will destroy me every time. Leveling based gameplay that unbalances the game in favour of higher levels and provides no rank based matchmaking is very frustrating.
The spawning system is horrible as well. About 20+ seconds between death and respawn when you can get headshot coming out of your base... Suppression (TDM) is almost useless with this amount of downtime. I can either decide to sit around for 20+ seconds while I bleed out, hoping that someone will revive me and then potentially miss my respawn window and have to wait another 20 seconds, or I can bleed out almost immediately in order to respawn quicker but then have to run all the way across the map in many cases.
I haven't even advanced to level 8 yet so I can't play the Massive part of this action game, but even when in the 128 player maps it never feels more involved then an average BF:BC2 game. While I have my complaints about that game, I would still suggest that anyone who has not played MAG play that instead (though I do like how you can't just damage objectives for the win in MAG).
I never got into Socom but the way people talk about Zipper I expected something much better than this. At least now I know to avoid the new Socom. I will throw it back in once Move is available, maybe that will provide me with a better and more engaging experience.
To go along with the sorry graphics is a nausiating blur effect whenever I get shot, or an explosion goes off, or sometimes when I am running. It is worse then the effect that Bioshock uses.
Upgrade paths seems to be pretty anemic and the stock weapons are very unsatisfying. Why does a sniper take 3 body hits to kill, but I need to be somewhere around lvl 11 before I even have the opportunity to try out a new sniper rifle? Then, if I do take that path I will need to either respec or get to level 20-something to get a better assualt rifle. Nevermind that in order to level you have to get a lot of points and someone who is a high level and has a fully tricked out LMG will destroy me every time. Leveling based gameplay that unbalances the game in favour of higher levels and provides no rank based matchmaking is very frustrating.
The spawning system is horrible as well. About 20+ seconds between death and respawn when you can get headshot coming out of your base... Suppression (TDM) is almost useless with this amount of downtime. I can either decide to sit around for 20+ seconds while I bleed out, hoping that someone will revive me and then potentially miss my respawn window and have to wait another 20 seconds, or I can bleed out almost immediately in order to respawn quicker but then have to run all the way across the map in many cases.
I haven't even advanced to level 8 yet so I can't play the Massive part of this action game, but even when in the 128 player maps it never feels more involved then an average BF:BC2 game. While I have my complaints about that game, I would still suggest that anyone who has not played MAG play that instead (though I do like how you can't just damage objectives for the win in MAG).
I never got into Socom but the way people talk about Zipper I expected something much better than this. At least now I know to avoid the new Socom. I will throw it back in once Move is available, maybe that will provide me with a better and more engaging experience.
weekend_warrior
Banned
the_prime_mover said:
Felt the same way after playing the beta. Picked it up anyway and after 200+ hours MAG is easily my GOTY (until GT5 comes out). Once you've played enough DOM/ AQC games to really "get it", I think you'll find there's an incredible experience to be had. The feeling you get as part of a massive war, as you run around defending positions, repairing gates, destroying APC's, reviving and healing teamates, always looking for something to do to help the team. It's insane.
My advice is to avoid the Sabotage and especially the suppression game types, put your respec point into medic, and just watch your teamates backs, revive and heal them, learn from watching them play. Your primary loadout for AQC/DOM should be med kit, repair kit, rocket launcher (defending), med kit, smoke nades, rocket launcher (attacking).
the_prime_mover
Member
weekend_warrior said:
Fair enough. I appreciate the insight. I don't generally like having to invest large amounts of time in something in order to discover the fun, but I am not opposed to playing this until I have at least unlocked access to the larger game modes. At the moment I have my first 4 points into medic and then was thinking about putting points in weapons but wasn't sure what speciality I wanted. Maybe I will just spec the sidearms.
weekend_warrior
Banned
J-Rzez said:
My God, you sound like such a typical Sver player. QQ our guns don't work, QQ Raven's knife is OPed, QQ Ravens map is broken, QQ this, QQ that. The MAG forums are filled with people like this, it's unbearable. Valor's the faction with the legitimate beef but it's always Sver bitching and moaning. For 3/4's of the games release Sver has been the OPed Faction while Valor and Raven had to deal with it. But as soon as you lose your map advantages and the playing field levels off, now all of a sudden it's not fair. But but but Zipper only gimped us because we were so awesome and used such incredible team work to win compared to the other 2 loser factions.
Fucking excuses.
weekend_warrior
Banned
the_prime_mover said:
It's hard to give advice about this stuff with the impending uber patch. Right now, to get the most bang for your buck I'd do this:
First 2 point- Med Kit
Second 2 point- Rez for Med kit
After that it's really up to you. I like getting a red dot dight for my favortite gun (AR for me, maybe you like the LMG more), the increased repair speed is very useful, as is the advanced grenades, the AP mines too. Definitely avoid the side arm tree, not worth it until you can unlock the knife perks.
When you get to level 10 respec. Get med kit- improved healling- improved rez. You'll make tons of xp healing and reviving teammates.
weekend_warrior said:
There's no excuses. Anyone can be cheap with that damn knife. There's no QQ to that. We KICKED the person using it on our team. Raven's knife being OP is new to me. But, said build with knife talents and run speed is bullshit. Everyone's complaining about it, except the people who love exploiting it, no matter what faction they're on. Are you enjoying exploiting it? Some of said people on the forums admit to using it because it's broken and pisses people off, so yeah.
FACT IS, when I drill someone with 2-3 shots from a sniper, they have lighter-med armor, they should die from the SASR. Not that they continue running at me and knife me from 10' out. Explain that please, if you can.
Right now, I'm content with the way things are balanced. And considering I'm going on my 5th vet, I've played on all sides, thus I know what I'm talking about. My KDR also says I have an idea what's going on too.
Everyone is complaining about the knife due to power, and that run speed is giving them an advantage with lag on their side where guns are useless. Look at the official forums, and people complaining here.
Das, you guys really need to take a hard look at this knife issue. I was just in a game now in Valors map where these Raven guys were running around with all the speed stuff along with the jammer/motion detector shit. That's all they did. No one could hit them due to the latency/run speed, and they'd go running into groups of players slashing away killing at least 1-2 people per swipe. Everyone has to stop what they're doing, focus on said knifers, and that leaves them open to the others actually using there guns.
People really need to play MAG until at least level 40 and all game modes multiple times to even begin understanding what this game is about. If you play for only a few hours, of course this game will suck. You'll get owned over and over, you don't have a good weapon selection, no character and weapon upgrades, and no protection against the various electronics people run around with all the time.
I just don't understand how certain people can whine so much about a game they haven't really even experienced, nor know how to properly play. I can understand the legitimate complaints, but some of the ones I've been reading around here are derived from ignorance, impatience, lack of experience, and/or lack of skill.
It's like people trying to review MMOs after having only played it for 10-20 hours. You just can't get a true understanding of a complicated online game in that short of a time period. I'm not saying MAG is a MMO, but it sure isn't some Duty clone that any kid with ADD can just pick up and play and be good at it. You actually have to learn how to play MAG (and also learn how to play a shooter without auto-aim).
I just don't understand how certain people can whine so much about a game they haven't really even experienced, nor know how to properly play. I can understand the legitimate complaints, but some of the ones I've been reading around here are derived from ignorance, impatience, lack of experience, and/or lack of skill.
It's like people trying to review MMOs after having only played it for 10-20 hours. You just can't get a true understanding of a complicated online game in that short of a time period. I'm not saying MAG is a MMO, but it sure isn't some Duty clone that any kid with ADD can just pick up and play and be good at it. You actually have to learn how to play MAG (and also learn how to play a shooter without auto-aim).
weekend_warrior said:
I hope you realize Valor and Raven were the ones bitching non-stop on the forums about SVER being OP'd for 7 months straight, until Zipper finally decided to nerf the shit out of us and buff the shit out of Raven and Valor (after having read all that bitching from them). Now that we've been fucked in almost every patch, a lot of non-diehard SVER players have left the PMC and most of the good clans have been long gone. There's a reason why most good clans and players choose Valor. It's because of their OP'd guns.
SVER has the worst guns and we keep getting nerfed every patch. The only SVER gun that's even worth using now (not beta) is the AG-94 and it's not even that great (IMO, SCAR-LW is better). Valor has an OP'd KP5, Mk 46 Mod 1, shotgun, and assault rifles. Their sniper rifles have more ammo per clip than SVER's. Hell, even their handgun is also better than SVER's handgun.
What I just wrote isn't a "grass is greener" comment nor are they "excuses." I'm just stating facts. Ask any truthful MAG vet. that has recently played for both factions a good amount. They'll all tell you the same thing. I have a level 60 alt. on Valor that I still play almost daily (just not as much as my SVER account). I seriously wonder if you've ever vetted out of Valor or if you've ever played as SVER. Because I have and so has J-Rzez.
Also, please be specific and tell us all what "legitimate beef" Valor has about anything? The only things they can bitch about is that their Acquisition map layout doesn't make much sense (but can still be defended successfully and will be faction neutral eventually) and that their muscles are cartoonish.
the_prime_mover
Member
Click said:
I am going to take this personal as it seems to reflect my post (on this very page) exactly. I do fit all of your points and you are probably right. However, as a gamer adrift in a sea of options, it is difficult to just pick up a game and say, "o.k., this is my goto for the next 100+ hrs".
Some games do require a bit to get into and MAG may very well be deep and rewarding after a heavy investment. Unfortunately it's presentation and the imbalance that arises, not from a lack of experience, but a lack of gear does make it very difficult to find a reason to come back to it.
With all that said I am willing to put some more time in if only to try out the other game modes.
Mikey Jr.
Member
Ok, been playing this game.
Damn, what the hell. I'm level 8 sver, and I unlocked the first gun, and got some better accuracy.
When I'm shooting guys, the hit marker will come up several times, but they just DO NOT GO DOWN. Is it because I'm only level 8? I shoot them point blank, several red x's come up, they run away. The end. Pretty aggravating.
Damn, what the hell. I'm level 8 sver, and I unlocked the first gun, and got some better accuracy.
When I'm shooting guys, the hit marker will come up several times, but they just DO NOT GO DOWN. Is it because I'm only level 8? I shoot them point blank, several red x's come up, they run away. The end. Pretty aggravating.
the_prime_mover said:
My post was directed towards you... and several other people in this thread.
Like I've said many times, MAG is too deep and complicated to judge based on only a few hours of playtime. One of my oldest complaints about the game is that it's not very newb friendly. The first 30 or so levels really suck and it makes people like you want to quit the game before unlocking everything the game has to offer and experiencing what MAG is really about.
Zipper has taken a lot of steps to reduce the "grind" and make leveling up more fun. However, players still need to have some patience and learn the game before they will realize just how great of a FPS MAG is.
I am a huge critic of games, especially online games. Even if I really enjoy many aspects of a specific title, I will still call out the legitimate flaws I personally believe needs to be fixed. I've complained about a lot of things wrong with MAG. The majority of my complaints have been fixed by Zipper throughout the past 8 months. Their beta is a complete overhaul of the game and will give us 3 more new maps and a new game mode. I can honestly say MAG is one of, if not the best FPS I've ever played, supported by a dedicated (albeit gimped) post-release development team.
Then again, if you're coming from a game like KZ2, MAG may not be your cup of tea. There is no auto-aim and MAG's graphics most likely won't satisfy graphic whores... which is the majority of GAF.
Mikey Jr. said:
Some people wear heavy armor, which requires 1 or 2 more bullets to kill compared to regular or light armor. People lag. Some people side-strafe and drop-shot (dolphin-diving / prone, get up quick). Most people have the health upgrades too (120 health instead of 100). Point is, there are many factors as to why certain players don't die as easily as others. Once you've learned how to aim and lead your bullets to where you think your opponent will be running, people usually die in 1-2 seconds.
Again, MAG is not very newb friendly. Your first 30 levels will most likely suck unless you're naturally talented at the game. My advice is to purchase the Medical Kit first. Stick around the FRAGO areas (solid blue box on your screen) and keep reviving and healing your teammates. Use the LMG (RTK-74 VIa) and don't run around too much, since you don't have a Sensor Jammer nor any character upgrades. Always be moving around but don't run unless you have to get away from heavy fire. Watchout for snipers and grenades because without upgrades, you'll die in 1 hit. Oh, and look at your mini-map on the top right to see where your teammates and enemies are.
Try to unlock Improved Healing and Improved Resuscitation asap (you don't need to get the regular Resus. to get the Improved version). Not only will it help you and your teammates out, it is also the best way to point-whore and level up fast. After that, work on the Athleticism tree. Get Imp. Damage Resistance and Shot Detection. Improved Stealth is extremely important because it'll hide you from everyone (even when running) other than people carrying a Motion Sensor (only if you're running). Once you get Explosive Resistance and Increase Health, MAG won't be as frustrating of a game to play.
Some people prefer to upgrade their weapon(s) of choice before going down the Athleticism tree. It's up to you if you want to die more often or kill more often. After you've gone down the Athleticism tree, upgrade your weapon(s). If you like using the LMG, stick with that. Just make sure you have at least a Foregrip on it. Obviously Reload Speed, Reflex Sight, and Imp. Stability are nice to have too.
AG-94 (SVER's 2nd tier assault rifle) is what I personally use. It's also what most good SVER players use. However, you need to have good aim because it takes 1 or 2 more bullets to kill people compared to the LMGs and 3rd tier AR. You should eventually try out the AG, but it takes a while to save up enough points to fully upgrade it. It also costs a lot of CC to carry it in your loadout.
After you've upgraded everything I've listed above, you should be around or over level 30. This is when the game starts to shine. You're not too gimped anymore but you're still far from being a complete character. Time to work on getting the Sensor Jammer so you can run around without fear of turning into a red dot on your enemies' screen. Respec after you get the Sensor Jammer because Imp. Stealth will no longer be required to have... as long as all of your loadouts include the Jammer.
Once you get the Sensor Jammer, work on the Personal Defense tree so you can go around knifing people with ease. When knifing, always try to swipe at people's back because it's a guaranteed 1-hit kill.
If you make it this far, you're probably in your 50s and almost level 60. You may have some spare points. Imp. Repairing, Advanced Grenades and Explosives (especially adv. explosives) are nice to get. Increased Endurance is also good to have. If you have enough points, Chemical Resistance is awesome against teams that have people who spam the gas grenades in and around objective areas.
Anyway, hope this helps. If your team sucks or if you're up against good clan(s), simply press the Quit button. I personally don't ever quit out of games (unless my clan is split up or if we join a game already in progress) but I highly recommend newbies use this function because it'll save you time and won't make you frustrated, quitting the game as a result.
Lagspike_exe
Member
Uh, seems like the majority of v1.02 patch didn't get through for some reason.
I knew that knife nerf didn't go into effect, I hope it's heavy handed because it needs to be toned down a lot. Especially when used by all the cheap pricks running around with with the knife upgrades and speed boosts. Getting knifed 10' out due to latency or glitches suck.
It's going to really piss off some people if it does finally get fixed. As I've said before, right now the game in beta is a First-Person Stabber than shooter.
What is up with these SMGs now too? The Valor and Raven ones are strong now in live, but in beta they're even worse. I try to run around and pick up their weapons anymore, it's the only way to stand a fighting chance.
Hmm... now the question is to vet again or not. Wish you got something cool for each time you vet. Cooler looking armor, weapons, or totally new weapons and such. Or do I keep going inflating my KDR?
It's going to really piss off some people if it does finally get fixed. As I've said before, right now the game in beta is a First-Person Stabber than shooter.
What is up with these SMGs now too? The Valor and Raven ones are strong now in live, but in beta they're even worse. I try to run around and pick up their weapons anymore, it's the only way to stand a fighting chance.
Hmm... now the question is to vet again or not. Wish you got something cool for each time you vet. Cooler looking armor, weapons, or totally new weapons and such. Or do I keep going inflating my KDR?
TGateKeeper
Member
are the game servers down? i keep getting disconnected.
darkwing said:
It is a pain. I am level 6 I think and its annoying to be knifed non stop and not have time to shoot anyone, nor knife them. Its weird I see guys running up and start shooting and then I die by knife even though they are a good 10 yards away.
I hope I am not that bad at this game.:lol
backbreaker65
Banned
Das-J said:Beta patch goes live in the next couple of hours - Your feedback, as always, is appreciated!
Das-J, take a look at TTP's video of how the move works currently in the MAG beta. He shows some things that you guys really need to take a look at, its a great video, one that I think will help you guys make a better move supported game.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-mDqfkJ_eQ
SolidusDave
Member
gluv65 said:
Holy shit, TTP makes awesome tech presenting videos.
TheExecutive
Member
That was an interesting video of MAG w/ Move.
Sniping looks like it's more precise than with other guns. Then again, I wonder if TTP / Bloody_Marcel was high level enough to have all the gun upgrades though. Because it looks like he doesn't have any red dot / ACOG sights on his guns. Character / weapon upgrades are extremely important in how guns handle and perform.
I'm too used to DS3 to switch to Move, but I'm sure there will be a lot of people who will get MAG just to try out and even use the Move controller full-time. This controller has the potential to sell many titles that casual fans might otherwise never take a look at.
Have you guys decided what icon you'll use to signify a Move user, Das? You said something about the playercard having an indicator to show that you've been owned by a Move user, lol.
Sniping looks like it's more precise than with other guns. Then again, I wonder if TTP / Bloody_Marcel was high level enough to have all the gun upgrades though. Because it looks like he doesn't have any red dot / ACOG sights on his guns. Character / weapon upgrades are extremely important in how guns handle and perform.
I'm too used to DS3 to switch to Move, but I'm sure there will be a lot of people who will get MAG just to try out and even use the Move controller full-time. This controller has the potential to sell many titles that casual fans might otherwise never take a look at.
Have you guys decided what icon you'll use to signify a Move user, Das? You said something about the playercard having an indicator to show that you've been owned by a Move user, lol.
weekend_warrior
Banned
This beta fucking pisses me off. Back to getting sniped by LMG's, knifers running wild, and I've wasted all my armory points on shitty guns. Also, why does the respec meter stop at 5000/5000?
weekend_warrior said:
You die faster and quicker, yes. But if you're good at the game, you can also kill quicker and easier than in retail because every gun is uber in the beta.
LMGs still needs to be properly nerfed. I have yet to see Zipper get it right in the 8 months MAG has been out. They are extremely OP'd again in the beta so I hope the next update will tone it down a lot. Here's to hoping for the best... again.
They should just let everyone respec anytime they want. It's a beta for crying out loud. People are supposed to be playing around with different loadouts and weapons so we can provide feedback to Zipper. They're limiting our ability to test things out.
Das-J will be on the next Zipline podcast to talk about MAG beta...
http://blog.mag.com/blog/2010/09/zipline-episode-20-preview/
http://blog.mag.com/blog/2010/09/zipline-episode-20-preview/
SolidusDave
Member
Walmart lists "MAG 2" for January 25th next year.
I guess if there is any truth to it, it just will be a MAG re-release with Move, DLC etc.? No way they'll release a second game after just one year
http://www.walmart.com/ip/MAG-2-PS3-PlayStation-3/14669228#ProductDetail
I guess if there is any truth to it, it just will be a MAG re-release with Move, DLC etc.? No way they'll release a second game after just one year
http://www.walmart.com/ip/MAG-2-PS3-PlayStation-3/14669228#ProductDetail
So I finally downloaded and installed the 406 MB beta patch today (took forever) and noticed no real difference in the knife except for the fact that you actually have to be really close to someone to kill them now. I believe it's still a 1-hit kill anywhere on the body, which is still overpowered. But at least you have to be really close to your enemy now in order to kill them.
I'm torn in what I think about the runnning / walking speed enhancements. In a way, it makes the game much, much faster, more fun and adrenaline-inducing. However, it takes away a lot of the tactical aspects of the retail game that I've grown accustomed to and enjoyed. People are just running around like acid-crazed, 'roided out Rambos, knifing and/or shooting everyone they see. If you stay still in the beta, you're most likely going to die if you're playing against good players that exploits the overpowered run speed + 1-hit knife kill + Sensor Jammer combo.
Oh, it was interesting listening to Ben / Das-J and his colleague who are responsible for the maps of MAG.
I'm torn in what I think about the runnning / walking speed enhancements. In a way, it makes the game much, much faster, more fun and adrenaline-inducing. However, it takes away a lot of the tactical aspects of the retail game that I've grown accustomed to and enjoyed. People are just running around like acid-crazed, 'roided out Rambos, knifing and/or shooting everyone they see. If you stay still in the beta, you're most likely going to die if you're playing against good players that exploits the overpowered run speed + 1-hit knife kill + Sensor Jammer combo.
Oh, it was interesting listening to Ben / Das-J and his colleague who are responsible for the maps of MAG.