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Magic: the GAFering |OT2|

C

Crocodile

Member
divisionbyzorro said:
One last bout of nerd rage here and then I'll leave it alone.

I'm officially done with M14 limited. I'm having some serious nerd rage here. The design of this set for limited is complete ass. I hate that the Auras are so good and the removal is so bad. I haven't been recording my games or anything, but I would be willing to bet money that in 80% of the games that I've played, one of the lethal creatures had an Aura on it. Maindecking Naturalize is actually a real thing in this format, and it's ridiculous.

I just lost in the first round (again) with a sweet UG deck with Trained Condors and Tuskers and beefy green dudes (even a cute interaction with a Verdant Haven and that 2/2 hydra that gets counters for your life gained - actually pulled that off once) because my opponent threw Lightning Talons onto Slivers. It's not like my deck didn't have answers (Hunt the Weak, Claustrophobia, even the maindeck Naturalize), but if you don't draw them, you can't rely on your creatures to be answers. Obviously in the game that I won, I drew one of my two Naturalize and just blew him out in combat, but I couldn't make that happen in two out of three games.

It's so frustrating to watch, because I go back and I look at those tournaments, and the guys I lose to almost never actually win the tournament. They win 1-2 matches, but almost never 3. I'm somewhat obsessive about tracking whether or not I lost to the best deck in the draft, not that it really matters (oh look, the guy I was just talking about just got blown out in two games - I guess his opponent drew the right removal). I've only ever lost to the best deck in the draft once - and it wasn't an Aura deck! It was a properly built limited deck with a good curve and a balance of strong creatures and removal. So these all-in decks certainly end up getting punished by the time it's all said and done, but so far I'm having the good fortune of being their punching bag on the way.

Okay okay I'll stop. I know I'm just being really salty and complaining about variance like every other draft scrub out there. But I have feelings too, okay? Let me get my nerd rage out, and I'll go back to constructed where I belong. :)
Click to expand...

Considering Theros is heavy on enchantments, I'd expect quite a few limited games in that format will be decided by "unasnwered dude with an aura on it". I hope you've prepared yourself by then, it probably isn't getting better anytime soon :p
 
B

bigkrev

Member
BTW, I fully expect a bunch of playable, cheap Hexproof guys in Theros.

And I predict it will make me take a long break from Magic and try something new, like one of the Fantasy Flight LCGs

I had a deck with a bunch of Chandra's Outrages in it. I lost to an opponent who put 2 Divine Favors on a Suntail Hawk, and then dropped a Dark Favor on it. Game was a joke.
 
F

f0rk

Member
bigkrev said:
BTW, I fully expect a bunch of playable, cheap Hexproof guys in Theros.

And I predict it will make me take a long break from Magic and try something new, like one of the Fantasy Flight LCGs
Click to expand...

Would make me feel better about just buying into Modern and then playing that and limited while ignoring Standard.

And an update on where my Modern head is at cos I know you guys are dead interested, I think I might say fuck it and buy a Grixis Cruel Control brew as those are my favourite colours and what I really want to play.
 
C

Crocodile

Member
narcosis219 said:
So is the theros black removal spell gonna be "destroy target creature without an aura attached to it"?

I wish
Click to expand...

I wouldn't be surprised to see a "new" Brainspoil in Theros. Given recent removal spells, I wouldn't be surprised if was an exact reprint sans Transmute too :p :(

f0rk said:
Would make me feel better about just buying into Modern and then playing that and limited while ignoring Standard.

And an update on where my Modern head is at cos I know you guys are dead interested, I think I might say fuck it and buy a Grixis Cruel Control brew as those are my favourite colours and what I really want to play.
Click to expand...

If there are any competitively costed Hexproof dudes and/or Auras, they will leak into the Modern format as well so I wouldn't consider that a safe haven.

kirblar said:
Hexproof Wrath. Make it happen.
Click to expand...

What does this mean? A spell with "Destroy all creatures with Hexproof"? That seems super narrow. I think Flying is the only keyword they've targeted in that fashion.
 
D

divisionbyzorro

Member
f0rk said:
Would make me feel better about just buying into Modern and then playing that and limited while ignoring Standard.

And an update on where my Modern head is at cos I know you guys are dead interested, I think I might say fuck it and buy a Grixis Cruel Control brew as those are my favourite colours and what I really want to play.
Click to expand...

Start with this:

http://www.wizards.com/magic/magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/deck/1282

The only reason I haven't built this and started brewing with it is because I don't actually own Damnations, They were on my list to buy this month before Wizards decided they would sell JTMS for $40 on MTGO, so that kinda blew out my budget.

If only we had the allied fetches in Modern...
 
A

An-Det

Member
Crocodile said:
What does this mean? A spell with "Destroy all creatures with Hexproof"? That seems super narrow. I think Flying is the only keyword they've targeted in that fashion.
Click to expand...

"Exile all creatures with an Aura attached to them"

2W instant, make it happen Theros!
 
Y

Yeef

Member
Crocodile said:
What does this mean? A spell with "Destroy all creatures with Hexproof"? That seems super narrow. I think Flying is the only keyword they've targeted in that fashion.
Click to expand...
They could got the merciless eviction route. "Choose flying, hexproof, lifelink or first strike. Destroy all creatures with the chosen ability."

They probably won't, but they COULD!
 
W

WanderingWind

Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Sinatar said:
3WWW and sorcery.
Click to expand...

Won't somebody think of the planar cleansing???

EDIT: Standard is in that weird place right now. Jund and UWR are the two decks of the week, but I don't have Snapcasters or Olivia on MTGO and it's idiotic to pay for them now. But when Theros rolls around, I'm going to make a run at playing in real tournaments and whatnot.

But for now, it's just futzing about with Naya Blitz and Monored.
 
N

narcosis219

Member
Crocodile said:
I wouldn't be surprised to see a "new" Brainspoil in Theros. Given recent removal spells, I wouldn't be surprised if was an exact reprint sans Transmute too :p
Click to expand...

I was thinking along the lines of Go for the Throat and ultimate price, but hey, over costed removal is (not) awesome too!
 
B

bigkrev

Member
Finance question- Is Remand a good Hold or Sell right now? It's overpowered for standard, wasnt it MM, and probably won't be in DD or commander. Any chance it hits 20?
 
K

kirblar

Member
bigkrev said:
Finance question- Is Remand a good Hold or Sell right now? It's overpowered for standard, wasnt it MM, and probably won't be in DD or commander. Any chance it hits 20?
Click to expand...
I could actually see it getting reprinted while the "uncounterable" cycle is in standard. I'd hold your playset and sell the rest when modern season hits?
 
D

divisionbyzorro

Member
The full FTV:20 list is on the mothership. They really frontloaded the good stuff as far as spoilers go.

1. Dark Ritual
2. Swords to Plowshares
3. Hymn to Tourach
4. Fyndhorn Elves
5. Impulse
6. Wall of Blossoms
7. Thran Dynamo
8. Tangle Wire
9. Fact or Fiction
10. Chainer's Edict
11. Akroma's Vengeance
12. Gilded Lotus
13. Ink-Eyes, Servant of Oni
14. Char
15. Venser, Shaper Savant
16. Chameleon Colossus
17. Cruel Ultimatum
18. Jace, the Mind Sculptor
19. Green Sun's Zenith
20. Kessig Wolf Run

Kinda disappointing, actually. I mean, this is as cheap as you'll find JTMS online probably ever, so I feel obligated to buy them on MTGO, but I was hoping for something a little more exciting to go with it.

EDIT: Let me clarify. Nothing in there is Modern legal, playable, and worth spending $40 on MTGO. I don't currently play Legacy, but I feel like if I ever do end up playing Legacy online, I'll (probably) regret not picking these up when I can.
 
B

bigkrev

Member
Yeah, if you are a PTQ player, there is actual nothing in this set for you. Venser is playable, I could see Zenith eventually get unbanned, and Wolf Run will be cool for a few weeks, but otherwise its all Legacy and casual/edh stuff.

Is this the first foil for StP?
 
C

Crocodile

Member
As far as I can tell, FTV 20 is just an Upheaval short of being the perfect FTV Cube product. I'm satisfied. The Jace will make this unaffordable as a set but hopefully the other singles will be cheap enough online or to trade for.
 
W

WanderingWind

Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Oh, christ, glad I didn't preorder FtV now. That is some straight bullshit. Fucking Fyndhorn Elves?

Thanks for the thank you, WotC. We really appreciate you giving back to the players who let you have a job for 20 years like this.

WotC fucking sucks at marketing.
 
C

Crocodile

Member
WanderingWind said:
Oh, christ, glad I didn't preorder FtV now. That is some straight bullshit. Fucking Fyndhorn Elves?

Thanks for the thank you, WotC. We really appreciate you giving back to the players who let you have a job for 20 years like this.

WotC fucking sucks at marketing.
Click to expand...

I on the other hand was hoping that Fyndhorn Elves would be in the set and I'm ecstatic that it got in :)

Which cards do you dislike and given the restrictions (has to be a card from a PT or Worlds winning from the block released that year) what cards would you have chosen instead?
 
W

WanderingWind

Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
I can't imagine why anybody would be anxious for the reprint of a Llanowar Elf clone in a premium set designed ostensibly to celebrate 20 years of the game. I'm not overly fond of playing the contrarian for the sake of being contrary game, but if you're being serious, you can pick up a playset for about 15 cents from just about anywhere.
 
A

An-Det

Member
Fyndhorn Elves is the only one I am disappointed with, it should have been Necropotence. I agree with you, divisionbyzorro, definitely plan on getting some of these on MTGO for the relatively cheap Jaces.
 
C

Crocodile

Member
WanderingWind said:
I can't imagine why anybody would be anxious for the reprint of a Llanowar Elf clone in a premium set designed ostensibly to celebrate 20 years of the game. I'm not overly fond of playing the contrarian for the sake of being contrary game, but if you're being serious, you can pick up a playset for about 15 cents from just about anywhere.
Click to expand...

Llanowar Elf variants have been constructed staples in like EVERY format since the dawn of time. That should definitely make them worthy of being included in a set like this. This is the first time this art has come to paper magic, this the first time the card has ever been foil and this is the first time the card has ever been in the new border. If you own a Cube this printing is a godsend :)

An-Det said:
Fyndhorn Elves is the only one I am disappointed with, it should have been Necropotence. I agree with you, divisionbyzorro, definitely plan on getting some of these on MTGO for the relatively cheap Jaces.
Click to expand...

Necropotence was in From the Vault Exiled. I'd be kind of annoyed if they doubled up cards in the FTV series.
 
W

WanderingWind

Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Seriously, not hating. You like it, cool. Realize I came across kinda dickish. I'm just a bit frustrated that this is all we're getting for the 20th anniversary. I'm pretty sure it "snuck" up on them and they're going to do something cool for the 25th.

Their marketing department is just squandering so many opportunities that it drives a marketing guy like me up a freakin' wall. They simply do not know how to handle their success at the moment.
 
B

bigkrev

Member
Swap the colossus for Bitterblossoum, and you fix all the problems I have with this set. It's a card banned in modern (so its not getting reprinted), and tells far more about the year than Collossus does. Also gives a second marquee card.
 
C

Crocodile

Member
bigkrev said:
Swap the colossus for Bitterblossoum, and you fix all the problems I have with this set. It's a card banned in modern (so its not getting reprinted), and tells far more about the year than Collossus does. Also gives a second marquee card.
Click to expand...

Make this Swap, swap Tangle Wire with Rishadan Port (though Wire is till pretty awesome even if the new art is kind of janky) and swap Chainer's Edict with Upheaval and this FTV is near perfect.

WanderingWind said:
Seriously, not hating. You like it, cool. Realize I came across kinda dickish. I'm just a bit frustrated that this is all we're getting for the 20th anniversary. I'm pretty sure it "snuck" up on them and they're going to do something cool for the 25th.

Their marketing department is just squandering so many opportunities that it drives a marketing guy like me up a freakin' wall. They simply do not know how to handle their success at the moment.
Click to expand...

On that end I agree. That this is the only real celebration of Magic's 20th anniversary is downright embarrassing. Someone, somewhere should be getting flogged with a wet noodle but everybody at WOTC is probably too busy eating celebratory cake everyday to do so.

On an unrelated note, when did Remand become some kind of pariah or deemed completely overpowered? Like I played both Standard formats that Remand was legal in and those formats are often considered amongst the best T2 formats the game has ever had. Diverse decks with diverse strategies. Aggro, Control, Midrange and Combo all represented. I can understand not wanting the card in the same T2 format as Snapcaster but honestly the "Counterspells ruin Magic" mentality has been kind of annoying for a while now.
 
D

divisionbyzorro

Member
Crocodile said:
On an unrelated note, when did Remand become some kind of pariah or deemed completely overpowered? Like I played both Standard formats that Remand was legal in and those formats are often considered amongst the best T2 formats the game has ever had. Diverse decks with diverse strategies. Aggro, Control, Midrange and Combo all represented. I can understand not wanting the card in the same T2 format as Snapcaster but honestly the "Counterspells ruin Magic" mentality has been kind of annoying for a while now.
Click to expand...

The only reason it even gets brought up is because we came back to Ravnica, so naturally everybody wanted a reprint of every card they loved from Ravnica. But Snapcaster really is a bottleneck on the design of instants - you just can't put the two of them in the same Standard (see Warleader's Helix, which turned out to still be a completely playable card).

Remand could certainly come into Standard once Snappy leaves. I don't think that would be a problem.
 
K

kirblar

Member
bigkrev said:
Swap the colossus for Bitterblossoum, and you fix all the problems I have with this set. It's a card banned in modern (so its not getting reprinted), and tells far more about the year than Collossus does. Also gives a second marquee card.
Click to expand...
It is really a rather surprising omission.
 
R

rCIZZLE

Member
Add me for another that is disappointed with the full spoiler. Just one other money card would have made a big difference. Something like Rishadan Port would have made me much more excited.

On the plus side, there will be a lot of GSZ and StP foils available making me getting my playsets without spending money a reality.

bigkrev said:
Yeah, if you are a PTQ player, there is actual nothing in this set for you. Venser is playable, I could see Zenith eventually get unbanned, and Wolf Run will be cool for a few weeks, but otherwise its all Legacy and casual/edh stuff.

Is this the first foil for StP?
Click to expand...

This is the 3rd foil StP as far as I know. 1 FNM (jesus pic, expensive) and 1 judge (new art, relatively cheap)
 
A

acheron_xl

Member
Port should've clearly gotten the nod over Tangle Wire. Mercadian Masques is the first set where the reserve list doesn't apply, so there's no real excuse to me.
 
J

Jaeyden

Member
So what's the market like for good foils on MTGO? Do they see much appreciation after rotations? Are there alot of people interested in foils? I cracked a foil Gideon, foil Archangel of Thune and foil Obzedat in a few different drafts this weekend. I personally don't care whether a card is foil or not but I do want to play with these cards at some time. Should I sell em off and rebuy non-foils or keep em?
 
H

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
Jaeyden said:
So what's the market like for good foils on MTGO? Do they see much appreciation after rotations? Are there alot of people interested in foils? I cracked a foil Gideon, foil Archangel of Thune and foil Obzedat in a few different drafts this weekend. I personally don't care whether a card is foil or not but I do want to play with these cards at some time. Should I sell em off and rebuy non-foils or keep em?
Click to expand...

They sell more than the non-foil version on average, yes.

There isn't like, FROTHING demand though.
 
K

kirblar

Member
Jaeyden said:
So I just DL'd MTGO beta. Interface looks a lot better. Is there any reason not to use it instead of the old one?
Click to expand...
It's slow, trading is bad, it uses windows instead of tabs, making multi-tasking a nightmare.

It's a disaster right now that looks good until you start to actually play with it.
 
H

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
It looks good. But that's about it.

It makes the old FFXIV UI feel snappy and responsive.
 
J

Jaeyden

Member
Yeah, I see that now. Decided I would join a new player phantom draft first to get used to it. My draft started and I had no idea why I was still in the lobby while packs were getting cracked. Finally figured out it was a new window and then on my 7th or 8th pick the game encountered some error and booted me. Now I have file for reimbursement. lol.
 
K

kirblar

Member
Jaeyden said:
Yeah, I see that now. Decided I would join a new player phantom draft first to get used to it. My draft started and I had no idea why I was still in the lobby while packs were getting cracked. Finally figured out it was a new window and then on my 7th or 8th pick the game encountered some error and booted me. Now I have file for reimbursement. lol.
Click to expand...
They actually defended Windows over Tabs on twitter because of "Market Research."

I'd really like to see the receipts.
 
N

noquarter

Member
Jaeyden said:
So what's the market like for good foils on MTGO? Do they see much appreciation after rotations? Are there alot of people interested in foils? I cracked a foil Gideon, foil Archangel of Thune and foil Obzedat in a few different drafts this weekend. I personally don't care whether a card is foil or not but I do want to play with these cards at some time. Should I sell em off and rebuy non-foils or keep em?
Click to expand...
Mythics are always more on MTGO since you need them to redeem Foil sets. Should be able to get a couple dollars over non foil just on that alone. Would look at what the price is in bots then post on the marketplace for a Ticket less or so. There are some people who like foil decks, but the tend to slow down the game and a lot of people just turn off the foil effects anyways.
 
D

divisionbyzorro

Member
noquarter said:
Mythics are always more on MTGO since you need them to redeem Foil sets. Should be able to get a couple dollars over non foil just on that alone. Would look at what the price is in bots then post on the marketplace for a Ticket less or so. There are some people who like foil decks, but the tend to slow down the game and a lot of people just turn off the foil effects anyways.
Click to expand...

The biggest markup is on the junk mythics. A regular one is worth a nickel on MTGO. A foil one is usually worth about 6-7 dollars (because it's necessary for redemption purposes).

Redemption is the reason the MTGO market is so screwed up anyway. You'd think everything would be cheaper, but so many mythics leave the MTGO economy every week never to be seen again that their prices become astronomical.

A good example is Sphinx's Revelation. $35 on MTGO, $20 on paper.
http://www.mtggoldfish.com/card/Sphinx's+Revelation+[RTR]
 
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