-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Magic: the GAFering |OT2|
- Thread starter The Technomancer
- Start date
I just Strnoic Resonated a Lifebane Zombie against someone running G/W in draft. I pulled a banisher priest and auramancer and saw a Planar cleansing. =)
Last night I had 3 newts a Witch and cauldron, elixers, corpse dudes. Black is so freaking fun.
Corrupt is usually left open, jump on it and don't look back.
Last night I had 3 newts a Witch and cauldron, elixers, corpse dudes. Black is so freaking fun.
Corrupt is usually left open, jump on it and don't look back.
Touchscreens. Having the whole draft in one window is super convenient when you're playing without a keyboard.
....but it should be an option to use tabs.
helloresolven
Member
Which is laughable, since the beta is painfully slow and cumbersome.
My wild dream would be that MTGO be a web application. With the power of Javascript and modern browsers across all platforms, it seems like the perfect space for them.
Anyways, does anyone here play Pauper on MTGO?
I really wish I had just gone in on that card- I bought 2 playsets, but I was super low on cash last month.
I scooped up only one playset so I wouldn't be left in the dark once I wanted it. Glad I did. So glad I did.
divisionbyzorro
Member
The short answer? The difference between 41 and 40 doesn't actually matter all that much.
The longer answer is more complicated. It's clear that 60 cards is bad, right? You have to shove a bunch of junk and basic lands into the deck to get it that big. The density of threats in your deck is lower. So 50 cards is way better than 60. And by that same logic, 49 must be better than 50. And 48 is better than 49. And in fact, this logic continues. The smaller your deck, the more likely you are to draw those really really good cards.
The difference between 41 and 40 is negligible, but a 40 card deck is statistically better. Why would you choose to play a deck that was statistically worse, even if that difference is in the tenths of a percentage point? The answer is, quite simply, you shouldn't do it. Adding that extra card doesn't actually make your deck better - in fact, it makes your deck worse.
To put it another way: in any deck of any size, there is a "worst card." Why wouldn't you always cut the worst card from the deck?
And that all makes perfect sense, you put it in a way that was easy to understand.
I guess my difficulty is that sometimes its hard to decide which cards to put in for flexibility's sake. Might toss up between two cards, one that is Essence Scatter, the other that is Negate. Too hard to think about it, let's throw in both.
(just an example, in the real world I'd have Essence Scatter in my Limited deck for sure)
I guess my difficulty is that sometimes its hard to decide which cards to put in for flexibility's sake. Might toss up between two cards, one that is Essence Scatter, the other that is Negate. Too hard to think about it, let's throw in both.
(just an example, in the real world I'd have Essence Scatter in my Limited deck for sure)
CorruptShadow
Member
Yep, always prioritize removal the obvious exception is if there is a bomb in what you open.
Also practicing really helps, use a free online simulator or there are ipad/iphone apps.
The simplest explanation I've heard is this:
In a 40 card deck, you should have the best selection of cards from your pool. Any other card you might want to add is therefore on average worse than the cards already in the deck, and therefore adding that card will always make your deck worse on average.
T
Transhuman
Unconfirmed Member
http://draft.bestiaire.org/
Is a pretty good draft simulator. Just click on "Draft Magic 2014 (M14-M14M14)".
Fireshrieker. Fireshrieker has won me more games than I can count. Fucking Fireshrieker.
I sometimes build 41-card sealed decks nowadays, but I've still come a long way from back when I started playing the format. Draft... not so much, since my LGS only organizes one every few months, so I can't get enough practice with any given expansion before the next one comes around.
I really feel like I've improved over all these years of playing sealed in prereleases (as well as a few premier events using the same format), but there're times when I see a list of cards that's one too many and find myself unable to make a cut, like I have the knowledge to cull my pool down to the best cards, but making further cuts gets progressively harder down to the point I say "screw it" and end up with an extra card in my deck.
I know that doing well in spite of playing 41-card sealed decks constitutes anecdotal evidence at best, but so far I've done quite well even when I was playing that one extra card.
Given statistics, it's true that, for example, given a 40-card deck with +N cards, each of your card drawing spells is less likely to find the card you're looking for, as well as making deck-thinners less useful, and that small chance of not drawing a card can add up over several draw instances, but I think the random factors that come from playing with a shuffled deck have more of an impact than that one extra card.
I really feel like I've improved over all these years of playing sealed in prereleases (as well as a few premier events using the same format), but there're times when I see a list of cards that's one too many and find myself unable to make a cut, like I have the knowledge to cull my pool down to the best cards, but making further cuts gets progressively harder down to the point I say "screw it" and end up with an extra card in my deck.
I know that doing well in spite of playing 41-card sealed decks constitutes anecdotal evidence at best, but so far I've done quite well even when I was playing that one extra card.
Given statistics, it's true that, for example, given a 40-card deck with +N cards, each of your card drawing spells is less likely to find the card you're looking for, as well as making deck-thinners less useful, and that small chance of not drawing a card can add up over several draw instances, but I think the random factors that come from playing with a shuffled deck have more of an impact than that one extra card.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Love that draft site, but I feel as if it's broke somehow. I mean, if I ever drafted this well for real I'd shit myself in glee.
2 Accursed Spirit
1 Child of Night
1 Deathgaze Cockatrice
1 Duress
2 Festering Newt
3 Liturgy of Blood
1 Mark of the Vampire
1 Minotaur Abomination
1 Quag Sickness
1 Tenacious Dead
2 Undead Minotaur
1 Vampire Warlord
2 Brave the Elements
1 Pacifism
1 Show of Valor
1 Siege Mastodon
1 Soulmender
1 Mutavault
11 Swamp
5 Plains
SB: 1 Rumbling Baloth
SB: 1 Accorder's Shield
SB: 1 Staff of the Flame Magus
SB: 1 Capashen Knight
SB: 1 Divine Favor
SB: 1 Fortify
SB: 1 Shadowborn Apostle
SB: 1 Shrivel
SB: 1 Sentinel Sliver
SB: 1 Diabolic Tutor
SB: 1 Vampire Warlord
SB: 2 Vile Rebirth
SB: 1 Dragon Hatchling
SB: 2 Lightning Talons
SB: 1 Pitchburn Devils
SB: 1 Mind Rot
2 Accursed Spirit
1 Child of Night
1 Deathgaze Cockatrice
1 Duress
2 Festering Newt
3 Liturgy of Blood
1 Mark of the Vampire
1 Minotaur Abomination
1 Quag Sickness
1 Tenacious Dead
2 Undead Minotaur
1 Vampire Warlord
2 Brave the Elements
1 Pacifism
1 Show of Valor
1 Siege Mastodon
1 Soulmender
1 Mutavault
11 Swamp
5 Plains
SB: 1 Rumbling Baloth
SB: 1 Accorder's Shield
SB: 1 Staff of the Flame Magus
SB: 1 Capashen Knight
SB: 1 Divine Favor
SB: 1 Fortify
SB: 1 Shadowborn Apostle
SB: 1 Shrivel
SB: 1 Sentinel Sliver
SB: 1 Diabolic Tutor
SB: 1 Vampire Warlord
SB: 2 Vile Rebirth
SB: 1 Dragon Hatchling
SB: 2 Lightning Talons
SB: 1 Pitchburn Devils
SB: 1 Mind Rot
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Yup. Throw in some Rangers Guile in green or Brave the Elements in white and enjoy your poor mans limited bant pants!
BlewHedgehog
Member
For me, keeping to the minimum number of cards is only a rule in limited, where the power level between your best and worst cards is going to be so high. In constructed you're going to play specific numbers based on how frequently you want to see a given card and, as long as the ratios of cards that fill that role to cards in your deck are where you want them, I have no problem going to 61 on occasion.
Got through 2 booster drafts.
First time I made some white blue monstrosity that just had no chance even if the opponent tried to let me win.
Second one I pulled a archangel of thune and wrecked with it to the second round, put green with it, the troll hide and instant hexproof let me keep her alive. Also the giant cat card let me get up to about 50 life one game. But the 2nd round the guy used Chandras outrage on her instantly. Oh well, had alot of fun.
First time I made some white blue monstrosity that just had no chance even if the opponent tried to let me win.
Second one I pulled a archangel of thune and wrecked with it to the second round, put green with it, the troll hide and instant hexproof let me keep her alive. Also the giant cat card let me get up to about 50 life one game. But the 2nd round the guy used Chandras outrage on her instantly. Oh well, had alot of fun.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Condor, then Wall, then frost breath
I think arguments can be made for any of the Blue creatures. If you want to be especially defensive and let your fliers take over the game you could pick Wall of Frost to hold the ground against Green fat while you fly over head. Seacoast Drake also makes a great early defender but can also contribute to your air force. Trained Condor is the most aggressive of the cards but almost all your creatures that can attack right now already have evasion. Condor is best in other color combos where the evasion is more limited in the other color. In terms of pick order I'd go:
Seacost Drake > Wall of Frost > Trained Condor
Drake can shift between offense and defense the best (though it is more a defensive card than an offensive card). It is also the cheapest of your options (can never be too early to be curve conscious) and costs only one Blue in its CMC to cast. Wall of Frost is by far the best defender of these cards and will probably be the best of the three in a Green matchup. This early though and with more flexible options left in the pack, I think I'd err towards the Drake. I feel Wall of Frost is also more likely to table of the three blue creatures present as it tends to be a bit underrated. Trained Condor is good but for the cards you already have I think it contributes the least additional utility.
Seacost Drake > Wall of Frost > Trained Condor
Drake can shift between offense and defense the best (though it is more a defensive card than an offensive card). It is also the cheapest of your options (can never be too early to be curve conscious) and costs only one Blue in its CMC to cast. Wall of Frost is by far the best defender of these cards and will probably be the best of the three in a Green matchup. This early though and with more flexible options left in the pack, I think I'd err towards the Drake. I feel Wall of Frost is also more likely to table of the three blue creatures present as it tends to be a bit underrated. Trained Condor is good but for the cards you already have I think it contributes the least additional utility.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
I just got lectured in my diet by Travis Woo, so I'm good for the evening
I went Condor because I thought it had the most upside with cards like Scroll Thief and Water Servant, but I only ended up grabbing one Servant and no Thieves. Given how the matches played out I think Wall of Frost would have been best, which I'm finding myself thinking a lot lately. I don't think it's a high pick, but it's a nasty ground blocker, which is a very useful attribute to have in blue/white fliers.
Anyway, I ended up going 2-1 with this deck in a Swiss. I think out of the last 20 Core set Swiss drafts I've done, I've 2-1'd at least sixteen of them. Probably more. I remember a 3-0 and 2 1-2s.
Round 1 was the closest I think I'm going to see anyone get to pulling off the lifegain/Bogbrew deck. They had multiple Newts+Cauldrons, Sanguine Blood, bunch of tertiary stuff like Divine Favor and Mark of the Vampire. Didn't see a Angelic Accord but I figured he or she had to have gotten one. Sanguine Blood got me good game one, game two was a slog versus double Cauldron sacrifices holding off basically all of my good creatures for a few turns, and game three I ranched him with Charging Griffin into Air Servant.
Round 2 was pretty close, and I feel like if I'd played tighter I might have won. He had a solid, aggressive RB deck with nice removal in Geyser and Doom Blade. He ended up winning 2-1 in a close one, and I'm probably going to go back and watch the replay to see if I could have played it differently. This is the match where I think Wall of Frost would have been massively better than Condor. He beat me game three with multiple 2 drops beating on the ground, and life totals were pretty even the whole game. Wall of Frost could have held the fort just a bit more for me to get an extra hit or two in and pull it out, I think.
Round 3 I destroyed a bad blue/red deck who liked to scoop way earlier than they should have. Not complaining.
divisionbyzorro
Member
What would you take here?
Your deck so far can't take advantage of Condor, but it is still a 2-power flier for 3CC, which probably makes it the pick here.
There's also a case for the Drake. You need turn two plays, and that guy can block bears or just start pinging away.
I like Wall of Frost over Frost Breath. If this was a UG build that was using Condor to throw beasts over the enemy lines, Frost Breath can be a game winner. In this build I don't think you can use Frost Breath to its full potential, but Wall of Frost can be as good as a Claustrophobia against certain decks.
My pick order is probably Trained Condor, Seacoast Drake, Wall of Frost, Sentinel Sliver, Frost Breath.
BlewHedgehog
Member
Playing AJ Sacher's B/W Humans, do you keep this on a mull to 6?
Plains
Champion of the Parish
Doomed Traveler
Cartel Aristocrat
Blood Artist
Xanthrid Necromancer
Plains
Champion of the Parish
Doomed Traveler
Cartel Aristocrat
Blood Artist
Xanthrid Necromancer
Play or draw? I suspect you probably have to keep either way though.
BlewHedgehog
Member
Sorry, should have said so. It was on the play. I kept, got my Champ Decayed, and sat on one land for 5 turns or so while my opponent seemed to do everything in his power not to kill me. Been stewing over it ever since, but wasn't sure whether or not it was the wrong decision. Just something you gotta roll with, I suppose. You can't be too upset when you can't find a second Mutavault and neglect to replace your Mountain with "Mutavault" scribbled on it with... anything. Whoops.
Been in a brewing mood lately and have whipped up a couple of new standard decks, both having been doing reasonably well.
First one is BUG Zombies. Nothing overly special, but adding blue gives access to diregraf captains and far//away. So far I haven't had any real issues with this deck. If more people played Pillar of Flame online then I imagine it would get smoked.
Second one is a little more creative, a RWB tokens deck with the new M14 tech in the form of Young Pyromancer. This deck is less far along in testing then the zombie one, hence the kind of dogs breakfast of removal. The Gideons are also in there as more of a why not then anything at the moment, I cracked them in drafts and haven't found a use for them yet. Deck is pretty fun though.
First one is BUG Zombies. Nothing overly special, but adding blue gives access to diregraf captains and far//away. So far I haven't had any real issues with this deck. If more people played Pillar of Flame online then I imagine it would get smoked.
Second one is a little more creative, a RWB tokens deck with the new M14 tech in the form of Young Pyromancer. This deck is less far along in testing then the zombie one, hence the kind of dogs breakfast of removal. The Gideons are also in there as more of a why not then anything at the moment, I cracked them in drafts and haven't found a use for them yet. Deck is pretty fun though.
I'd keep on draw, mull on play. While you have a T1 CotP and a T2 Doomed Traveler in play, if you don't hit any black source, you are boned after that. Another plains, Mutavault, or that vault lifelink/deathtouch land does nothing for you.
Drafted a pretty solid U/B/W deck this past Tuesday night. Had a bunch of flyers and removal spells. I got to pull off Phantom Warrior equipped with Fireshrieker and enchanted Mark of the Vampire a few games. 4/4 unblockable lifelink and doublestrike ftw! I went 2-1 though and lost to a dirty mill deck that had 3 Tomb Scour, a Millstone, a bunch of walls and a Jace. That's the only time I went above 40 cards ha. He sideboarded in 3 Melfork Spies on me and wow I undervalued that card. He got all 3 in T2 and I had no way to deal with those little peckers. Definitely will pick some up in my next draft if I'm going blue again.
T
Transhuman
Unconfirmed Member
The witch's cauldron/ festering newt/ tenacious dead deck? Yeah, it's fucking stupid.
No just bubbling cauldron and angelic accord. Infinite angels
Of course the deck was packed with other life gain options and multiple accords
I think the dude was a channelfireball writer too.
T
Transhuman
Unconfirmed Member
An Angel's Accord and Cauldron together alone are strong. One of the guys in my pool always seems to get at least two of each. Plus Festering Newts. Plus Tenacious Dead's. Last draft he also got two Bogbrews (one foil, one non-foil). It was ridiculous.
blindrocket
Member
I bought the Death Reaper intro pack that is built around the Bogbrew Witch + Bubbling Cauldron + Festerning Newt combo. I changed some of the other cards to make it a little more aggressive with some more creature removal, but I did keep it a red and black deck.
It did pretty good at FNM but didn't really do anything against $300-400 decks. ALMOST beat a deck that a guy was playing (that was used in the World Championship from last weekend), but I only got him down to 7 life before it kicked in and he took me down.
It did pretty good at FNM but didn't really do anything against $300-400 decks. ALMOST beat a deck that a guy was playing (that was used in the World Championship from last weekend), but I only got him down to 7 life before it kicked in and he took me down.
4 colored decks are not good unless you have green for Farseek
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Hey guize, Archangel of Thrune and Soulmender are pretty good in draft. Just FYI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wV5wZBVZTlk
huehuehuheuehue
huehuehuheuehue
divisionbyzorro
Member
I saw this when it was posted. The way he wins the match is equally hilarious.
T
Transhuman
Unconfirmed Member
Lands
20x Plains
2x Mutavaut
Creatures
3x Fiendslayer Paladin
3x Precinct Captain
4x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3x Fiend Hunter
3x Silverblade Paladin
3x Archangel of Thune
4x Champion of the Parish
4x Soulmender
Non-creature
2x Brave the Elements
2x Silence
4x Oblivion Ring
2x Door of Destinies
1x Ajani, Caller of the Pride
Thoughts (besides 4 Caverns of Souls), anyone? I'm thinking Imposing Sovereign and Banisher Priest over Soulmender and Fiendslayer Paladin respectively.
20x Plains
2x Mutavaut
Creatures
3x Fiendslayer Paladin
3x Precinct Captain
4x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3x Fiend Hunter
3x Silverblade Paladin
3x Archangel of Thune
4x Champion of the Parish
4x Soulmender
Non-creature
2x Brave the Elements
2x Silence
4x Oblivion Ring
2x Door of Destinies
1x Ajani, Caller of the Pride
Thoughts (besides 4 Caverns of Souls), anyone? I'm thinking Imposing Sovereign and Banisher Priest over Soulmender and Fiendslayer Paladin respectively.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
That was fun to watch but good lord I can't imagine playing that deck
narcosis219
Member
I think that running 4 thalia is too many. She's legendary so you don't necessarily want to draw into another thalia after you have one. 3 is a good number.
Given the number of non creature spells you're playing, thalia may work against you. This is especially true when you're running fewer lands, though you aren't in 20-land territory. You should be fine, but just be aware that your oblivion rings pretty much cost 4 cmc, and you may not get the 4th land as fast as you'd like to in a 22 land deck.
Have you considered a sideboard? The banishers and sovereigns can go in there and come in for creature heavy match ups. I think imposing sovereign is excellent in the main board simply because it's good against aggro and control. It stops hasted creatures and also gives you an extra turn when they cast their thragtusk to block. Many times that 1 extra turn of beating them in the face is enough to win. Also it shuts down restoration angel/snapcaster flash blocks
T
Transhuman
Unconfirmed Member
Sideboard as it stands right now is
1x Path of bravery
2x Blind Obedience
1x Silence
2x Brave the Elements
2x Strionic Resonator
3x Celestial Flare
2x Banisher Priest
2x Seraph Sanctuary
I'll definitely put the fourth Thalia in the sideboard, it was initially three but in playtesting I got lucky and never seemed to draw too many. Imposing Sovereign will go mainboard, and if I can get three more they can replace the Soulmenders.
1x Path of bravery
2x Blind Obedience
1x Silence
2x Brave the Elements
2x Strionic Resonator
3x Celestial Flare
2x Banisher Priest
2x Seraph Sanctuary
I'll definitely put the fourth Thalia in the sideboard, it was initially three but in playtesting I got lucky and never seemed to draw too many. Imposing Sovereign will go mainboard, and if I can get three more they can replace the Soulmenders.
Similar threads
- Locked