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Magic: the Gathering - Battle for Zendikar |OT| Lands matter (but nothing else does)
- Thread starter SigmasonicX
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table size also comes into play. Once place i draft at simply doesnt have space for anything more then cards on the table.
phazedplasma
Member
man I love twoo
"God's Beard!"
Member
Playing at the CFB Game Center is the absolute worst. Shoulder to shoulder and half your mat is overlapped by other people's mats.
Etrian Oddity
Member
Terrible.
Infinite Stars
Member
Jace, Price Unbound
[QUOTE="God's Beard!";182985272]Playing at the CFB Game Center is the absolute worst. Shoulder to shoulder and half your mat is overlapped by other people's mats.[/QUOTE]
Yeah it's what might push from going.to fmn to a Sunday draft instead that has wayyyy more space. Idk. And then I'm building my deck after the draft and everyone close to me just stares at it..felt pretty gross.
Yeah it's what might push from going.to fmn to a Sunday draft instead that has wayyyy more space. Idk. And then I'm building my deck after the draft and everyone close to me just stares at it..felt pretty gross.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
It skullfucks draw-go. That's reason enough for me.
edit: Got my hands on a Sunken Hollow... I know lands' value always goes up, but I'm fighting temptation to pull the trigger on Cinder Glade and Hollow.
So does everything right now. Honestly think control is legit bad right now. I mean, that's kind of why 4/5C Goodstuff is an undesirable deck for WOTC to make good. It's better than everything, the only thing Jeskai Black loses to is other midrange decks.
I'm glad there are non-blue strategies out there that work. But this is ridiculous. They need to get more of this card into the market yesterday.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
It's still in circulation. Short of just printing Jace: Origins, we're at maximum Jace saturation. It was even a core set. You can still buy fat packs and packs at MSRP. This is the most amount of Jaces that Jace could Jace even Jace Jace Jace Jace Jace Jace.
Forgive Me
Banned
i got jace on my origins draft last night, its only mtgo but it still feels so good
at least if i never use him i can trade him for like 6 drafts
kind of hate myself for buying into this online nonsense but game stores around me have bad schedules with my worktime and it just feels more important than something like cockatrice, must be some sick money spending gambling brain chemistry
at least if i never use him i can trade him for like 6 drafts
kind of hate myself for buying into this online nonsense but game stores around me have bad schedules with my worktime and it just feels more important than something like cockatrice, must be some sick money spending gambling brain chemistry
They could sneak it into a Clash Pack. There are event decks. Jace Vs Bulbasaur is always a thought. They could make it a promotional card at a tournament. They could get more out there if they wanted. And they should. A $100 card in standard that's a 4x is not a healthy thing.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
But it's not a supply issue. The card is widely available in print right now. The fixes you're talking about are for an expensive card that isn't currently in print. It's expensive because it's an automatic 4 of in two different formats and has even crept into Legacy. If it sticks in Modern and Legacy (not sure to be honest) the prices we're seeing now will seem quaint.
It's going to be legal for another, what, 9 months? Yeah, good luck with that. :lol
I really have been put of standard since Theros, is the current environment fun? The last time there was a $100 standard card (Jace 2.0) the meta really sucked. You either played CawBlade or lost to CawBlade.
Curious cause I might actually buy into the current standard if it is, otherwise I'll just wait for rotation and draft until then.
Curious cause I might actually buy into the current standard if it is, otherwise I'll just wait for rotation and draft until then.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Jace vs Ugin the dream
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
I don't get it. Good luck with...? I are confused.
It's a supply issue because Origins isn't a heavily purchased or opened set. That's why there's so much out there still on shelves at MSRP. People aren't snapping the set up, even for this one chase rare -- it's that poorly received. It's like Voice of Resurgence in Dragon's Maze again, except Jace is heavily played.
It wasn't a supply issue with Courser of Kruphix or Windswept Heath or, by your logic, Hangarback Walker, but all of those cards saw inclusion in supplemental products and saw their prices come down and availability increase. Why wouldn't we do that here, save the obvious problems with running off double-sided cards compared to single ones?
That the market is saturated. It's only begun, my friend. Soon, everyone and their mothers are going to want Jaces.
Joe Molotov
Member
Jace should have been the BFZ Game Day promo.
Joe Molotov
Member
Also, he should be a commander in Commander 2015.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Well, they haven't released any sort of sales numbers for Origins that I can see. MaRo's last mention of it was before the state of design and as of last month they hadn't collected the data, so I'm not sure where you're getting that from. Link?
Sure, but that's not what I meant by saturation. I meant as in "You don't get more available than being available in a set that is still being opened and which is still in print for MSRP." If it's still being played in eternals after that stops being the case, then supply comes into the equation. Right now you can walk down to Mom & Pop Card Scalpers R Us and buy a box of Origins.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Really excited for the Izzet commander deck.
Purely anecdotal, just based on seeing it on shelves in every store in the area. Not backed up with any hard data.
Either way, $100 for a single, standard legal card in what has to be one of the most plentifully printed sets ever is a black mark they should fix. The only caveat is that he's not oppressively good.
Wondering what the general consensus on what this article may mean http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/making-magic/themata-2015-10-26
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Insane Rosewater Ramblings
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Eh. It's a problem, sure, but it's not one they can fix by just printing more of it. After all, it's sitting right there on the shelf right now. Clearly, having more of it on the shelf isn't going to fix the price issue.
You don't think they can crater the price by making it widely and directly available?
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Well, clearly not. It's widely and directly available right this very minute.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
They're not going to though. They've basically never done that.
He's very clearly talking about putting the card into supplemental products.
The only way you can fix a card is banning it. Jace isn't overpowered by any stretch.
I would argue they cratered Elspeth in that Duel Deck printing. I feel like doing that here would effectively do the same thing. I guess we're on Jace Vs Ugin or bust at this point.
divisionbyzorro
Member
Jace will not be reprinted until Modern Masters 3, which will be the next time that they do DFCs.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Elspeth cratered Elspeth. No seriously, that's a perfect example of reprint equity. She was due to crater anyways due to having very little long term value outside of casual.
Ugin and Jace have long term value in Modern; e.g. reprinting them later on has a lot of value, whereas putting Elspeth 3 in basically anything is mostly meaningless.
Modern Masters 3 will not go all the way to Origins though;assuming the pattern stays the same, it will go through Return to Ravnica.
SigmasonicX
Member
I thought it was interesting as an exploration of major breakthroughs in Magic design, but it got a bit too silly even for me when 100-year-old MaRo came in talking about how AIs design Magic cards now.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
I am aware. Which is why I've been talking about how that's not a fix. Even if they were already to have planned an MSRP available product all that would happen right now is that product would be jacked up in price. The card isn't expensive because it's hard to get. It's expensive because it's a two mana Planeswalker that is played in modern, standard and even legacy.
EDIT: Jebus I butchered the hell out of that sentence.
Here are the snippets I found interesting amongst all the rambling:
"Your turn, Laurel." Laurel's the codename for a set in my future, so I don't know the real name for it. He's 59.
"We've messed around with double-faced cards forever, but the logistics of printing has always been a pain. So when we found out that one of our main printers finally cracked it, that we could have double-faced cards every set and we could consistently pair them up with other cards so we didn't have to use checklists, it was exciting. The goal of Laurel was to really take advantage of what this printing technology would allow, so when the team came up with"
"Oh," I say, "We're the themata. You gathered all the major discoveries you made about Magic design and brought us here. But why?"
"Magic's in trouble. Next year is its 75th anniversary, and the plan is for it to be the game's final year. A bunch of us old-timers, the humans that used to do the design back in the day, are trying to see if we can fix the problem. The AIs have given up. They claim it's unsolvable."
"Why do you need us?" Shake asks.
"We're a bunch of old people. None of us have done Magic design for decades. We'd come to accept that we don't have the capacity to solve the problem, but then we realized that perhaps one of us once did. Maybe the secret to saving Magic rests in a solution that one of us already made. So we used memory scanners to isolate all our discoveries, all the mental patterns that led us to making big leaps in how we changed the game. Each one of us then used some new technology from a scientist, a long-time Magic player, to bring all of our past selves here."
"Erik was worried that having to create a brand new zone just to put the cards removed from exile was clunky and that the graveyard logistically made it cleaner. I did a little soul searching. I re-examined why exactly I was so dead-set against things returning from exile. I realized that my actual issue was that I needed exiling things to be a real cost that the game didn't let you easily undo. That when something is exiled, there aren't ways for you to just bring it back. Only being able to return the opponent's exiled cards didn't let that happen. Yes, a card can come back, but it's because an opponent weighed the cost and allowed it to happenand even then it goes back to the graveyard, which is harder to access."
"So you went back on an unbreakable rule you'd made for yourself?"
"I realized that the game is all about new discovery, and if our goal is to keep exploring new design space that I have to be willing to re-evaluate old decisions. I don't have the luxury of absolutes. Good design means no previous design rules are off limits from re-examination."
The old man and I look at each other and smile.
"That's it. That's why the AI can't solve this. It's unwilling to break old rules. There must be some old design space we've made off limits that we can carve new design space out of. We've forgotten that Magic is the game that breaks its own rules."
The biggest takeaway I have from that is that they want to do even more double-faced cards and the main problem they have with it is printer logistics.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
"I realized that the game is all about new discovery, and if our goal is to keep exploring new design space that I have to be willing to re-evaluate old decisions. I don't have the luxury of absolutes. Good design means no previous design rules are off limits from re-examination."
I do like this thought. They've done it recently with the breaking lands back up through blocks. I wonder what it's hinting at for the future. I wonder what other self-imposed constraints they're willing to break moving forward.
I do like this thought. They've done it recently with the breaking lands back up through blocks. I wonder what it's hinting at for the future. I wonder what other self-imposed constraints they're willing to break moving forward.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Just kill her, the newest iteration is once again utterly boring. Just make Koth the main red Walker. He was awesome, I run him in my creatureless red deck.
Well, there's always that elephant that shall not be named but rhymes with Preserved Mist
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
A beautiful dream, eh?
"I realized that the game is all about new discovery, and if our goal is to keep exploring new design space that I have to be willing to re-evaluate old decisions. I don't have the luxury of absolutes. Good design means no previous design rules are off limits from re-examination.
This is the part that has my brain turning circles as to what it could mean
divisionbyzorro
Member
Wait until they get to triple-faced cards...
http://tabakrules.tumblr.com/post/100530619404/duel-masters-triple-faced-cards#permalink
At least 2R would have made Chandra cube playable. Now she has to compete with Chandra's Phoenix, Flamewake Phoenix, Sulfuric Vortex a.k.a. things that are nonbos with Ancient Tomb. And you just know Randy is going to milk this Chandra for all her worth since she's from a recent set.
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