SigmasonicX
Member
I don't understand why you guys have a problem with devoid. If anything, I thought it was odd that the drones in ROE were colored.
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Magic: the Gathering - Battle for Zendikar |OT| Lands matter (but nothing else does)
- Thread starter SigmasonicX
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I thought it was fine because it further emphasized the difference between the drones and the "true" Eldrazi.
I kinda wish they kept that distinction even with Devoid; just have Eldrazi Drones with colored mana costs, not the big guys.
As for Devoid itself, it's a bad mechanic in my eyes because in the majority of contexts it barely matters. I've seen comparisons to colored artifacts, but the fact is that a lot more cards care about whether something is an artifact than whether something is colorless. So for Devoid to matter, you need a lot of "colorless matters" cards in the set, which feel redundant with the rest of Magic where almost every colorless card is an artifact.
Morph in the last block helps, but I still feel like Devoid was a poor design solution.
Lazy vs Crazy
Member
It's starting to look like maybe this set did need the full art lands to sell.
I'm super casual but I was going to buy a couple fat packs or a box for a kitchen table draft after Pax because stuff started off looking neat. Everything since then has been really unexciting, so I'll probably keep not buying much Magic.
I'm super casual but I was going to buy a couple fat packs or a box for a kitchen table draft after Pax because stuff started off looking neat. Everything since then has been really unexciting, so I'll probably keep not buying much Magic.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
The payoff is apparently Ghostfire Blade aka "invisible lightsaber." That or Herald of Kozilek/Forerunner of Slaughter.
Lazy vs Crazy
Member
It is pretty close to a waste of a mechanic. It allows you to attach a ghostfire blade to a colored creature, dodge Ugin's minus, dodge protection (which they just all but removed from the game) and almost nothing else. It's the marquee mechanic of the set, should be impactful on the level that morphs were in Kahns, but it just kinda does nothing.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
There are uncommon reward guys like Herald of Kozilek and Forerunner of Slaughter. I don't know if that's enough to really justify playing Devoid as a theme in constructed and unless there are common Devoidlords (would be a good name for a rock band), possibly not in limited either. Then again, most of the Eldrazi are at least decent enough creatures on their own, but its kind of a bummer if you assemble a bunch of them and the deck still doesn't do anything interesting.
SigmasonicX
Member
I think you have it backwards. Cards were made to look for colorless cards instead of just Eldrazi so that they could better interact with artifacts from older sets, and Eldrazi were made devoid to work with Limited and for flavor. Devoid is parasitic, but the "colorless matters" cards are not.
For example, Forerunner of Slaughter could have given just Eldrazi haste, but it helping colorless creatures makes it less parasitic.
Besides, MaRo has stated that for most of design and development, devoid wasn't actually a mechanic, but rather they just used the color indicator. Thus, it isn't actually a marquee mechanic.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
if that means we'll get another gitaxian probe and dismember I'm all for it.
I think you're right on everything here. Colorless tribal is, in the case of this block, Eldrazi tribal, but has better hooks to the last core set and last block. I think it works well.
Also, for what it is worth, it comes off as kind of "weird", which fits with the Eldrazi upending the natural order. A bunch of inter-dimensional monsters that exile things, interact with the exile zone, recognize each other only by their shared lack of color, to the point where they would confuse a thopter as their own? I kind of like it as a flavor win.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
So I guess we are never getting any lands that make tokens without sacrificing themselves ever again? I can get the power level concerns to a degree in theory but I don't think it happens that often in reality. Like Urza's Factory and Vhitu-Ghazi, the City Tree were STRONG cards but not degenerate. Given how nerfed LD has been though maybe there is no other option.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Its supposed to be the Eldrazi sucking away your essence
Works with Herald of Kozilek, can't be countered by Gainsay and..........er.........um..........
"God's Beard!"
Member
I was about to get super hype for that card but then I realized that it said "creature".
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Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
So I guess we are never getting any lands that make tokens without sacrificing themselves ever again? I can get the power level concerns to a degree in theory but I don't think it happens that often in reality. Like Urza's Factory and Vhitu-Ghazi, the City Tree were STRONG cards but not degenerate. Given how nerfed LD has been though maybe there is no other option.
this land is insane doesn't come into play tapped, produces coloured mana, can spawn tokens when you need them at instant speed, ramps you from 7 to 9
nvm it doesn't produce coloured mana, disregard everything the scan just looked so blue I assumed it did.
Don't misunderstand, I know this card and Foundry of Consuls are quite good, I was just talking about a change in design philosophies at WOTC R&D
Etrian Oddity
Member
This set is fucking trash
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
There's actually been a bunch the last in M15 with Sliver Hive, Worldwake had that tapped land that puts an 0/1 plant into play when it ETB, Innistrad required you to exile a creature from the graveyard,...
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
After a lot of reflection I've come around on Devoid, I like everything we see on the Zendikar side, and I think my complaint really is focusing down to one point:
Enormous basically vanilla creatures aren't actually intimidating to anyone who's been playing for more than six months, and I can't see any Eldrazi we've seen so far impacting constructed outside of some fringe Modern combo deck. Jesus christ make them do something
We haven't seen anything like competitive colorless enablers, which might have been what pushed it over. Unless there's some really good uncommon creature that does drop colorless costs by 2 I don't see why anyone should bother focusing on the Eldrazi.
The negativity is almost all around Constructed. The Draft format might still be amazing, or at lest quite fun, which is what I'm holding out for.
Enormous basically vanilla creatures aren't actually intimidating to anyone who's been playing for more than six months, and I can't see any Eldrazi we've seen so far impacting constructed outside of some fringe Modern combo deck. Jesus christ make them do something
We haven't seen anything like competitive colorless enablers, which might have been what pushed it over. Unless there's some really good uncommon creature that does drop colorless costs by 2 I don't see why anyone should bother focusing on the Eldrazi.
The negativity is almost all around Constructed. The Draft format might still be amazing, or at lest quite fun, which is what I'm holding out for.
"God's Beard!"
Member
They think people are going to play this piece of shit nerfed Remove Soul in their constructed decks and use the exile clause to power out their Eldrazi Processors.
Apparently this and Fathom Feeder into Ulamog's Nullifier is their plan for Eldrazi decks.
Devoid isn't just a bad mechanic, it's a total cop-out. Remember when Maro was talking about how it was a problem that they couldn't make cheap dragons with the lore of Tarkir? Why not just take random elves and warriors and give them "Dragonvoid: This creature counts as a dragon"? That's just as bullshit to me as taking cards with a colored mana cost and declaring them to be colorless. Couldn't make enough wedge cards for a full block? No problem: Just stick "Abzanvoid: This card is white, black, and green" on Glory Seekers and mana elves. SO ELEGANT!
This set is such a fiasco. The planeswalkers and expeditions are the only good things about it so far, at least for constructed.
This set is such a fiasco. The planeswalkers and expeditions are the only good things about it so far, at least for constructed.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Devoid is a fine mechanic...in an environment where protection is relevant. Turns out they decided to phase that mechanic out, and with it like the only reason anyone cares what color their non-creature spells are
Oops
Etrian Oddity
Member
The frightening thing is that the day will come when Khans rotates out and we're left with this abortion of a block.
Gets Deathmist Raptor and Siege Rhino, I think this will see play. The exile clause will be relevant for Raptors and den Protector at least.
I feel like people are overestimating how big a deal the Devoid stuff is supposed to be. It wasn't even supposed to be a keyword - it's just an identifier for the Eldrazi as a faction. It's more like a souped-up watermark than an actual mechanic. The issue is that there is no actual mechanic for the Eldrazi beyond the "exile shit" concept which seems severely underdeveloped.
...which is probably why people are frustrated that omnipresent Devoid doesn't actually do anything.
...which is probably why people are frustrated that omnipresent Devoid doesn't actually do anything.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
[QUOTE="God's Beard!";178808066]They think people are going to play this piece of shit nerfed Remove Soul in their constructed decks and use the exile clause to power out their Eldrazi Processors.[/QUOTE]
or circumvent giving value by putting the card in the graveyard. Den Protector and Delve just make the graveyard another resource.
Is there any proper graveyard hate in standard atm?
Annoying it's only creature though
or circumvent giving value by putting the card in the graveyard. Den Protector and Delve just make the graveyard another resource.
Is there any proper graveyard hate in standard atm?
Annoying it's only creature though
Etrian Oddity
Member
Anafenza shuts graveyard resources down
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
only after she comes into play and only for creature cards.
[QUOTE="God's Beard!";178809350]
[/QUOTE]lol
Infinite Stars
Member
Yeah, this set isn't exactly getting me excited for the Pre-release/drafting it. I mean, a good Draft Deck is mostly commons/uncommons, but the rares are still a great part. All I'm seeing that I'd like to pick up once the set drops is a Zada, the new Merfolk guy, and Gideon.
Let's see, if I don't do my one draft a week of MTG for BFZ the entire time it's in draft(6 months, right? Spring Set comes out April/May usually), I'd have roughly $450 in extra money. I'll have to think on this more, but that'd be enough to get a Trostani EDH Deck and about 3/4ths of a cheap Modern deck.
Let's see, if I don't do my one draft a week of MTG for BFZ the entire time it's in draft(6 months, right? Spring Set comes out April/May usually), I'd have roughly $450 in extra money. I'll have to think on this more, but that'd be enough to get a Trostani EDH Deck and about 3/4ths of a cheap Modern deck.
The hope is that what's next will crush.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
The rares don't bother me from a draft perspective. I'd rather have this than the bomby problems of FRF honestly.
I actually like that counterspell. It hits (and exiles) Siege Rhino and a lot of other problem creatures. Still waiting to see more processors to see if the pay off is worth it. There's so many cards that exile, but we haven't seen much worth doing with the exiled cards.
Don't forget, lands are colorless. The colorless-matters stuff also works with awaken.
shrapnelmagnet
Member
"God's Beard!"
Member
I'm still holding out for Satyr Wayfinder-level Processor-enablers at common.
I'm giving you a chance, Wizards! Save this set!
I'm giving you a chance, Wizards! Save this set!
shrapnelmagnet
Member
My Ugin's Construct deck is getting better with every card.
I love that card for real, though.
I love that card for real, though.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
They should make an Un- reprint with an additional clause that requires you to say "Well that went horribly awry" when casting this.
Looked at the top decks from GP Oklahoma and Chris Lopez Elves looked much stronger than the one that went 3/4 of Andrew Sullano, I guess difference in matchups
I would have guessed counterspell... Just not a creature-only counterspell.
How is the transition to 3 blocks working with Khans? Will we get Khans - Zen - Whatever's next or will they rotate Khans out as soon as the 2nd 2 set block hits and we won't have a full size standard until the third 2 set block lands?
Joe Molotov
Member
Tormod's Crypt, but it's about to rotate.
Infinite Stars
Member
When next Block comes out, we'll have DTK-ORI-BFZ-OTG-BLOCK2A-BLOCK2B(Obviously with no 2B yet)
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