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Magic: the Gathering - Oath o/t Gatewatch |OT| Look again, the mana is now diamonds!
- Thread starter SigmasonicX
- Start date
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I sell on eBay. Make sure to get a bubble mailer to ship that in, don't use a regular envelope for something that expensive. and use a post-it note/tape to steal off the top of the toploader so the card doesn't slide out in the envelope and accidently get bent or something. At such a big price you may want to get deliver confirmation in addition to tracking. PayPal/eBay make it pretty painless to just print off a shipping label to paste to the mailer.
SigmasonicX
Member
What are you talking about?
https://www.reddit.com/r/EDH/comments/3z0elv/losing_offcolor_fetches_in_edh_decks/
lolololololololololololololol
This is the definition of administration with too much time on its hands.
lolololololololololololololol
This is the definition of administration with too much time on its hands.
Dumb as hell if true.
SigmasonicX
Member
Wanting to exclude fetchlands that don't fit your Commander's colors is really dumb.
I also take issue with them wanting to change how Mindslaver and other player-controlling abilities interact with commanders. The card says in reminder text that you make all decisions for that player (besides conceding), and that should include where the commander goes when it leaves the battlefield.
I also take issue with them wanting to change how Mindslaver and other player-controlling abilities interact with commanders. The card says in reminder text that you make all decisions for that player (besides conceding), and that should include where the commander goes when it leaves the battlefield.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Goddamn if you think BFZ drafts are fucking horrible I encourage you to log onto MTGO and try 8th Edition Draft I mean what in the actual fuck
Opened up a pretty horrible 2HG pool with my wife. We will probably end up losing 3 of 3 games. So many almost able archetypes, but nothing to take any of them ask the way. Lucky we opened up 5 rare lands, so we have fixing in one deck.
Also just found out that the FNM spot I'd going to be pushing 2HG as well. Fantastic.
Also just found out that the FNM spot I'd going to be pushing 2HG as well. Fantastic.
Why? BfZ drafts are fucking horrible, regardless of how badly designed previous sets may have been.
GoutPatrol
Forgotten in his cell
How much do these flashback drafts cost?
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
You should try a draft which has mostly vanilla dudes and dudes with landwalk.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
I could have predicted this
"God's Beard!"
Member
Funny deck from a BFZ draft with friends?
Again, just because certain sets were constructed in a worse way, especially for draft, doesn't mean BfZ gets off the hook for being disappointing to draft. It's obviously not the worst set to draft, not even close.
I admit that calling BfZ drafts "fucking horrible" was hyperbole though. That should probably be reserved for other sets.
divisionbyzorro
Member
Maro's opinion on this is one I really agree with; it is by far the cleanest and "best" solution to the color identity "problem" in my opinion. You don't need a restriction on which cards you can put in your deck because the mana rule (you can only generate mana in your general's color identity) does that for you.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Ehhhh I don't want some kind of B/W reanimator deck busting out big green and blue guys
Exactly.
divisionbyzorro
Member
Okay, that's reasonable. I hadn't really thought about that.
I just see no reason why you shouldn't be allowed to play Yasova Dragonclaw in a Bant deck, or Obelisk of Alara in any deck, etc. But I see your point.
"God's Beard!"
Member
I'd call BFZ below average and still probably the best Standard-legal draft set of the year, which is pretty bad.
- MM2
- BFZ
- ORI
- DTK/DTK/FRF
- FRF/FRF/KTK
These are all so far below the quality of triple KTK that it's actually pretty sad.
But I like casting Painful Truths in my 2-color EDH decks :-(
don't play swiss
Joe Molotov
Member
I had way more fun with ORI than BFZ.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Seconded
"God's Beard!"
Member
I got bored so quick with ORI. I didn't like BFZ either but I didn't like the draft formats this year in general. MM2 was ok for a while.
I just did another one on cockatrice for fun and I finally got the Thrummingbird + Tumble Magnet combo to work.
Round 3. Game 2. Opponent show and tells. He puts Emrakul. I place Mindslaver. He scoops. Tournament ends? I get 100 points? What?
charlequin
Banned
Fetchlands are obnoxious as hell in Commander any time someone ever tries to use the mana from one the same turn they play it so I'm in favor of anything to keep people from using them, honestly.
BFZ isn't even really that bad as a draft format in the historical view. It's better for draft than for anything else!
I'd rather draft BFZx3 than ZENx3 any day
Maro is ignant as fuck about Commander. He wants all kinds of dumbass shit for the format because he's trying to apply abstract rules that sound nice in his head without any appreciation for what they'd do to real games in practice.
Right now there are two rules that enforce the color identity stuff, the card inclusion rule and the mana generation rule. They might not both be necessary, but you have to look at the consequences of eliminating one. If you get rid of the mana rule, you let decks with theft effects make effective use of colored abilities on cards they steal; that's pretty minor but it does make already good decks better. If you get rid of the card inclusion rule, though, you open up the door to all kinds of nonsense reanimation shenanigans and potentially more efficient solutions in things like hybrid cards, both of which lead to decks that are more homogeneous than they are now.
On that basis, you're for banning all tutors in Commander?
It starts as a 1/4. If you go to change it to a 4/1, I bolt it in response, then it becomes a 4/1 with 3 damage marked on it and dies. You never get the chance to change it back into a 1/4.
As far as I know, Maro's only beef is with the way hybrid mana is dealt with. The whole point of hybrid is that it's supposed to be an "OR" operator, but EDH treats it as an "AND," as in, a mono-white deck should be able to play Boros Reckoner.
Personally, I don't see the harm in allowing a mono-black deck to run Nightveil Specter, Unmake or Tasigur. I feel like color identity should be exclusive for mana costs and inclusive for abilities (So a mono-white deck could play Tazri, but a non-white deck couldn't). But then, I don't like EDH to begin with, so I don't necessarily have a super-informed opinion on the matter.
blindrocket
Member
recently got back into magic, and I've been curious about Oath. What are your guys thoughts on this card? I kinda like it and have been thinking of ordering a playset, even if it isn't tournament viable, It looks like a fun card to play casually with.
I think that it's a great card. I'm not sure that it's "run a play set good" due to the CMC but it's great.
Isn't it the buy a box promo or something? Well, it's some kind of a promo anyway. I saw another version of it with Goblins facing the other direction.
divisionbyzorro
Member
The points are all well taken. I guess I just think that it's dumb that there are cards you can hardcast under the mana restriction but aren't allowed to put into your deck.
blindrocket
Member
I don't run off color fetches as it is.
I'm torn on tutors and sac lands of any sort in commander. One of my favorite parts about commander is the high variance. I'd be for less stuff that makes the games play any one which way consistently. I also don't like dragging the games out.
That said, I play tutors in some decks, and sac lands like evolving wilds, but never actual fetches. But I kind of wish you couldn't.
That said, I play tutors in some decks, and sac lands like evolving wilds, but never actual fetches. But I kind of wish you couldn't.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Fuck every UG player who gave that color combination a bad name in the format. I've been playing UG in one form or another for years but everyone assumes these days you're just doing one of cookie cutter tutoramp goodstuff decks
WoTC should just publish an official ruleset and ignore everything the "EDH committee" says. It's ridiculous that they have any say in how the format is run.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Zzzzzzzz. Opponent was going off with Bloom in turn 3 and I quit because I don't need to watch him beating off in the corner and he got mad. I don't think I owed it to him to let him go off but I guess he thought he should.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
No. Bolt will always resolve and the land will be a 4/1 at some point.
Basically eggs in a nutshell for me.
I hate people who feel the need to run decks that basically are solitaire
charlequin
Banned
At very least I'm in favor of people using less of them. Banning all of them is pretty drastic.
Right, this is exactly what I'm talking about in terms of Rosewater not really having an educated opinion. It's true that in the exact moment of casting a spell from your hand, hybrid is an "or" -- you spend blue or green mana for the cost, or whatever. Nothing actually changes about that in EDH.
What's different is what the deck-building rules are actually intended to care about. Magic is full of numerous ways to play cards in decks that, one way or another, don't color-support them -- reanimation, cascade, hybrid, Mycosynth Lattice, etc. The point of the Commander color identity rule is that the format doesn't care about technicalities of what you "could" do in the game if you got a chance to enact a workaround, it cares about a very exclusionary concept of color. The entire idea is specifically to make fewer cards available to each deck because that makes color/general choices more meaningful and reduces how many staples exist. If you blow it open and let hybrids and reanimation targets and all this stuff in, you're making a chance in pursuit of a low-priority goal (surface-level aesthetics) at the expense of a more important one (actual gameplay results.)
Are you kidding? Think about this for a minute. You're WotC, do you:
a) let an external group who created far and away the most popular casual format ever continue to run it, allowing it to stay super-popular while you make extra money selling decks to the people who play it, or
b) take it over, causing yet another pointless PR flap and pissing off some (more) of your top-level judges, thereby committing to spending actual money developing and maintaining the format when the absolute best-case scenario is that you don't fuck it up and it stays as popular as it would have otherwise.
Making a petulant play to "take over" the format would be a super bone-headed move.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I mean I'm not trying to be a dick (even though I probably was) but I really don't need to keep sitting there when he's got two Amulets out and is saying shit like "and then I float THIS and then bring it back to my hand and float THIS..."
Not sure why he got upset, half the fun of combo is getting ragequits.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Because he wanted to climax
shrapnelmagnet
Member
lol
I have a buddy who played Channel+Emrakul and on turn two, any time he'd tap two Forests and I could feel the cards being cast I'd just scoop and move on.
It actually led me to play more combo-y decks. Infinite mana + Legacy Weapon is fun. This one person we play with doesn't really recognize that it's a laregely unbeatable scenario and plays on, which is interesting.
"I play a land."
"Before combat, I exile it."
PS: Do you guys think a UG Madness deck could be appropriated for a MP deck? Like, 4-5 player games? It seems strong 1v1 but likely loses steam...
It's not that WoTC should "take over" as much as they should keep casual formats hands-off. This includes Maro's hands as well as Sheldon's. Allowing the RC to make major changes to EDH based on their own stagnant playgroup is a very good way to irreparably divide the playerbase.
Maybe it was a bit too much to say that the RC should have absolutely no say in how the format is run, but they certainly shouldn't be able to ruin multiple commanders and make the format less accessible for completely arbitrary reasons.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
The thing about Modern is that people constantly bitch about "diversity" when arguing against banning [Card or Deck], when diversity actually sucks in practice because there's a million decks which are 1% of the meta which you can't beat without sideboarding so there are just some matchups you can never beat (and conversely, some matchups which that deck can never beat). It's not actually interesting gameplay and in the case of some decks like Amulet Bloom, the deck is literally never interesting to play against. This is why I laugh in the face of anyone who bitches about Twin - Twin is at least an interactive deck, which is why its not getting banned ever.
I guess the thing is that I really like some of the matchups - 2 out of the 4 matches I played today were legitimately awesome matches, but the problem is that its random as all fuck and full of dumb linear shit you can't interact with in any real way unless you happen to have and draw the correct sideboard cards, but none of those decks get popular enough to get hit with serious bans because they fold completely to certain sideboard strategies and if 2 or 3 dudes actually have those, you basically can't win a tournament. But those decks are still miserable pieces of shit to play against.
I don't think the answer is to ban Goryo's Vengeance or Summer Bloom, even. It's to give players bigger sideboards in Modern. Really.
/rant
I guess the thing is that I really like some of the matchups - 2 out of the 4 matches I played today were legitimately awesome matches, but the problem is that its random as all fuck and full of dumb linear shit you can't interact with in any real way unless you happen to have and draw the correct sideboard cards, but none of those decks get popular enough to get hit with serious bans because they fold completely to certain sideboard strategies and if 2 or 3 dudes actually have those, you basically can't win a tournament. But those decks are still miserable pieces of shit to play against.
I don't think the answer is to ban Goryo's Vengeance or Summer Bloom, even. It's to give players bigger sideboards in Modern. Really.
/rant
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