• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Magic: the Gathering - Oath o/t Gatewatch |OT| Look again, the mana is now diamonds!

Status
Not open for further replies.
B

bigkrev

Member
[QUOTE="God's Beard!";192951707]I wonder if the reason there's no new Karla Ortiz art in Battle Block is because her talents tend to lie in Innistrad's subject matter. She did mention before that Wizards loves giving her zombie commissions.

I wouldn't be surprised if she did new art for LOTV. Wizards is so confident in her painting Lili that her art was the only marketing for ORI for months.[/QUOTE]

Her art would have stuck out like a sore thumb this block, because 95% of the art is garbage.
 
T

Toxi

Banned
bigkrev said:
Her art would have stuck out like a sore thumb this block, because 95% of the art is garbage.
Click to expand...
I think on the Eldrazi side there is some really great stuff.

But outside of the Eldrazi... Yeah, this is a very ugly block. There are very few I would rank lower.
 
T

Toxi

Banned
[QUOTE="God's Beard!";192952130]Oracle of Dust is one of the highest-quality pieces in all of Magic.[/QUOTE]
I love how serene the image looks until you notice the bodies.

Battle-for-Zendikar-Art-13.png
 
O

OnPoint

Member
[QUOTE="God's Beard!";192951320]The main draw is Lovecraft's absurdly high level of eloquence. Once you get past that all of his stories are, "I'm so shocked that I can't begin to describe this thing but let me describe it to you".

I'm a huge lovecraft nut but it's hard to read multiple short stories from him back-to-back.[/QUOTE]
Got a Kindle for Xmas and the first thing I did was decide to finally read Lovecraft. I am a few short stories into the collection and so far you are absolutely correct. He definitely had a formula he regularly tapped. I like it, but I can see it eventually wearing kind of thin.
 
A

Angry Grimace

Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
[QUOTE="God's Beard!";192951707]I wonder if the reason there's no new Karla Ortiz art in Battle Block is because her talents tend to lie in Innistrad's subject matter. She did mention before that Wizards loves giving her zombie commissions.

I wouldn't be surprised if she did new art for LOTV. Wizards is so confident in her painting Lili that her art was the only marketing for ORI for months.[/QUOTE]

They frequently hire artists in batches for specific blocks.
 
S

Shuggananas

Banned
Questions about evolving wilds, and drafting :

- Do you usually pick up just one or more if you can ? Like if you're gonna play 2 or 3 colors
- Do you count them in your 17-18 land count ?
 
U

ultron87

Member
Shuggananas said:
Questions about evolving wilds, and drafting :

- Do you usually pick up just one or more if you can ? Like if you're gonna play 2 or 3 colors
- Do you count them in your 17-18 land count ?
Click to expand...

One is nice even if you're just two colors and it is great if you're splashing a third color. Playing with no mana fixing at all is pretty inconsistent even for just two colors, so every little bit helps. How high to pick one depends on the format and how much other mana fixing is available. For example, in triple BFZ there wasn't a ton outside of green, so Evolving Wilds was a pretty high pick. In OGW/OGW/BFZ we now have the uncommon tap duals as well, so that takes some pressure off Evolving Wilds. (Though you're seeing Wilds in the third pack anyway, so if you don't have anything yet you are more incentivized to get one.)

Definitely count it as one your lands.
 
S

Shuggananas

Banned
Okay, I had this feeling too with triple BFZ, I even tended to try to get 4 sometimes. I do count them in my land count too
What I like more for fixing in OGW is the ones that produce <> but with some extra effect, works nice as fixing especially for splashed colors
 
I

Imperfected

Member
[QUOTE="God's Beard!";192951320]The main draw is Lovecraft's absurdly high level of eloquence. Once you get past that all of his stories are, "I'm so shocked that I can't begin to describe this thing but let me describe it to you".

I'm a huge lovecraft nut but it's hard to read multiple short stories from him back-to-back.[/QUOTE]

He's also got some interesting stories based around the concept of dream worlds, but the cosmic horror stuff tends to be pretty repetitive, yeah.

Though, amusingly, his better-received works tend to be the ones about fundamentally pretty "beatable" critters. (The Call of Cthulhu, The Dunwich Horror, The Shadow Over Innsmouth.) Even though his name-recognition value in public conscience tends to get him better representation, it'd probably be more accurate for Cthulhu to be... well, kind of a crummy Rare Eldrazi in the 5CMC range. "Wilbur" probably wouldn't even rate above a 3CMC Uncommon.

I can't really think of many stories where he gets that deep into Eldrazi-style "aoens of unknowable and unstoppable horrors" that are especially popular, outside of maybe In the Mountains of Madness? That almost seems more like something that other "Mythos" writers expanded into.
 
J

Jhriad

Member
Attleborotaco said:
Pulled

Foil Goblin Dark-Dweller
Nissa
Kozilek
Forbidden orchard Expedition
Kalitas
World Breaker

I would say not bad for my first ever box
Click to expand...

Gross. So far I've opened about 70 rares/mythics from this set (including my 6 prerelease promos) and those pulls are better than pretty much everything I pulled. The only mythics I pulled are 2x Crush of Tentacles, 2x Sphinx of Bulky Bulk, and 2x Linvala. Can't forget my lucky playset of Hedron Alignment though. This set has been a value black hole so far so I'll probably cut my losses and not open any more product, including drafting, until SOI.
 
G

"God's Beard!"

Member
Imperfected said:
He's also got some interesting stories based around the concept of dream worlds, but the cosmic horror stuff tends to be pretty repetitive, yeah.

Though, amusingly, his better-received works tend to be the ones about fundamentally pretty "beatable" critters. (The Call of Cthulhu, The Dunwich Horror, The Shadow Over Innsmouth.) Even though his name-recognition value in public conscience tends to get him better representation, it'd probably be more accurate for Cthulhu to be... well, kind of a crummy Rare Eldrazi in the 5CMC range. "Wilbur" probably wouldn't even rate above a 3CMC Uncommon.

I can't really think of many stories where he gets that deep into Eldrazi-style "aoens of unknowable and unstoppable horrors" that are especially popular, outside of maybe In the Mountains of Madness? That almost seems more like something that other "Mythos" writers expanded into.
Click to expand...

Look, any horror fiction is going to be a hit if you intro with this passage:
“The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents. We live on a placid island of ignorance in the midst of black seas of the infinity, and it was not meant that we should voyage far.”

H.P Lovecraft's ability to set the tone is so strong. I read a lot of contemporary fiction and I have trouble finding anything that creates anywhere near that kind of weight. I tried some of the New Weird books like the Southern Reach trilogy that try to go for some of that existential terror and it just fell pretty flat. That said, I'm not a fan of Jeff Vandermeer as an author in general. China Mieville has the ideas down and his novels are fascinating, but still lacking in the gravity I'm looking for.
 
Ooccoo

Ooccoo

Member
Jhriad said:
Gross. So far I've opened about 70 rares/mythics from this set (including my 6 prerelease promos) and those pulls are better than pretty much everything I pulled. The only mythics I pulled are 2x Crush of Tentacles, 2x Sphinx of Bulky Bulk, and 2x Linvala. Can't forget my lucky playset of Hedron Alignment though. This set has been a value black hole so far so I'll probably cut my losses and not open any more product, including drafting, until SOI.
Click to expand...

Sphinx is not bulk.
 
A

aidan

Hugo Award Winning Author and Editor
Jhriad said:
Gross. So far I've opened about 70 rares/mythics from this set (including my 6 prerelease promos) and those pulls are better than pretty much everything I pulled. The only mythics I pulled are 2x Crush of Tentacles, 2x Sphinx of Bulky Bulk, and 2x Linvala. Can't forget my lucky playset of Hedron Alignment though. This set has been a value black hole so far so I'll probably cut my losses and not open any more product, including drafting, until SOI.
Click to expand...

Nah, man. You got the garbage out of the way and now you're going to open Expeditions and foil Kozileks in every pack. It's just like playing a slot machine. When things look worse, you've gotta pick yourself up and go harder.
 
A

alternade

Member
Never order from MVP Sports and games on Amazon. This is the second time i've preordered from them well in advance and the products shows up late or damaged.
 
J

Jhriad

Member
Ooccoo said:
Sphinx is not bulk.
Click to expand...

It's only inflated temporarily until supply sates the demand, which isn't exactly high. It can potentially find a spot as the top end for some control deck but as far as mythics go, especially at prerelease prices, at or under $2 the morning after release is essentially bulk. I'm not saying it can't see a good bump if it slots into a deck but I'm not interested in holding the card when I can flip it into other things with a better chance of gains and/or broader playability.
 
R

RuinerPrime

Member
SigmasonicX said:
Card stories - Goblin Dark-Dwellers started out as a blue card (4/4 with flying), but it seems that there's an active push to move "Snapcaster" cards into red.
Click to expand...

I find this really interesting on how Red in the color pie has been developing in the past two years. The use or lose card draw, Prowess & menace, hasty self exiling tokens and now this temporary flashback that I hope to see more of. Did I miss any other developments? Any other directions you want to see red or other colors to go?
 
S

SigmasonicX

Member
Twisted-Gamer said:
I find this really interesting on how Red in the color pie has been developing in the past two years. The use or lose card draw, Prowess & menace, hasty self exiling tokens and now this temporary flashback that I hope to see more of. Did I miss any other developments? Any other directions you want to see red or other colors to go?
Click to expand...

Well, menace and temporary tokens have actually been a part of red for a while, menace especially (just unnamed). I have noticed that recently, red has been getting more creatures with higher toughness than power, but with the potential of power boosting.

As for what I'd like to see, I would definitely like more cards like Goblin Dark-Dwellers and Kozilek's Return, both variations of flashback.

Other than that, I'm more interested in reclaiming old space for red.
* Red hasn't had real ritual effects for a while, but the danger lies in powering up storm decks. I think an easy solution would be to give restrictions on the mana.

Giant's Ritual - R
Instant
Add RRR to your mana pool. Spend this mana only to cast a spell with converted mana cost 4 or greater.

* Wizards doesn't want early land destruction, or returning lands to their owner's hand since the outcome isn't that different from land destruction, but I think this variation could work at sorcery speed: "Tap target land an opponent controls. It doesn't untap during its controller's next untap step."
 
A

Angry Grimace

Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I liked Tears of Valukut as a ridiculously obvious answer to Ojutai and Silumgar.
 
M

Matriox

Member
SigmasonicX said:
Other than that, I'm more interested in reclaiming old space for red.
* Red hasn't had real ritual effects for a while, but the danger lies in powering up storm decks. I think an easy solution would be to give restrictions on the mana.

Giant's Ritual - R
Instant
Add RRR to your mana pool. Spend this mana only to cast a spell with converted mana cost 4 or greater.
Click to expand...
If you thought bloodbraid elf wouldn't get unbanned before... :p
 
R

RuinerPrime

Member
SigmasonicX said:
Well, menace and temporary tokens have actually been a part of red for a while, menace especially (just unnamed). I have noticed that recently, red has been getting more creatures with higher toughness than power, but with the potential of power boosting.

As for what I'd like to see, I would definitely like more cards like Goblin Dark-Dwellers and Kozilek's Return, both variations of flashback.

Other than that, I'm more interested in reclaiming old space for red.
* Red hasn't had real ritual effects for a while, but the danger lies in powering up storm decks. I think an easy solution would be to give restrictions on the mana.

Giant's Ritual - R
Instant
Add RRR to your mana pool. Spend this mana only to cast a spell with converted mana cost 4 or greater.

* Wizards doesn't want early land destruction, or returning lands to their owner's hand since the outcome isn't that different from land destruction, but I think this variation could work at sorcery speed: "Tap target land an opponent controls. It doesn't untap during its opponent's next untap step."
Click to expand...


That is true about menace & tokens I just feel like they have been doing it a lot more in the recent years. Pushing menace as a new keyword has something to do with that.

Yeah Ritual effects are tricky and do feel very Red and/or Black. and land destruction is red but it feels like it's moving toward green with cards like Acidic Slime and the new WorldBreaker and "destroy non creature" effects. stone rain effects at least that cheap are gonna be a thing of the past. Or way to overcosted to ever see play again. efficient land D Will probably never be a thing again unless it's a ghost quarter like effect.

Ritual effects are super unique and I would love it in red exclusivity. Maybe more ritual effects on creatures etb's? but that could be too much(burning tree emissary was really strong in aggressive decks) but not impossible with using some sort of restrictions on mana.
 
T

The Technomancer

card-carrying scientician
SigmasonicX said:
Oath of the Gatewatch survey - Complain about the art here!

LSV wants The Great Aurora and Zendikar Resurgent to be a thing

Card stories - Goblin Dark-Dwellers started out as a blue card (4/4 with flying), but it seems that there's an active push to move "Snapcaster" cards into red.
Click to expand...
Well I tore into them over the story stuff. A full paragraph but it concluded with "I was invested in Elspeth's story on Theros. I was interested in Sarkhan's story on Tarkir. I do not care about Jace, or Chandra, or Nissa, or Gideon"
 
A

aidan

Hugo Award Winning Author and Editor
The Technomancer said:
Well I tore into them over the story stuff. A full paragraph but it concluded with "I was invested in Elspeth's story on Theros. I was interested in Sarkhan's story on Tarkir. I do not care about Jace, or Chandra, or Nissa, or Gideon"
Click to expand...

That'll be my major criticism this time, too. Hopefully they listen. The only thing that makes any sense to me is that they've decided that the story elements draw in more YA and teen players (new money) than older/entrenched players, so they're trying to appeal to that demographic at the expense of players who enjoy and invest in the old style of storytelling.
 
T

The Technomancer

card-carrying scientician
Oh my god the current Gatewatch thing feels like the writing and characters in a BioWare game

I just made that connection but it makes complete sense
 
A

aidan

Hugo Award Winning Author and Editor
Toxi said:
Nah, BioWare writing and characters are more interesting.

...

I know what I said.
Click to expand...

It makes me legitimately sad that their attempt to make the writing feel less childish and more "mature" is to inject awkward sexual tension into every relationship. It's so strange after they handled Alesha's character with delicacy and maturity during Khans block. They're capable of doing better!
 
U

ultron87

Member
aidan said:
That'll be my major criticism this time, too. Hopefully they listen. The only thing that makes any sense to me is that they've decided that the story elements draw in more YA and teen players (new money) than older/entrenched players, so they're trying to appeal to that demographic at the expense of players who enjoy and invest in the old style of storytelling.
Click to expand...

I mean it seems pretty obvious that this is what they're trying to do. Most of the people already playing are going to keep playing the game whether or not the fiction appeals to them.
 
I

Infinite Stars

Member
The Technomancer said:
Well I tore into them over the story stuff. A full paragraph but it concluded with "I was invested in Elspeth's story on Theros. I was interested in Sarkhan's story on Tarkir. I do not care about Jace, or Chandra, or Nissa, or Gideon"
Click to expand...

I 100% agree. Like, even just looking at the small lore the characters have, you totally have a decent base for characters.

Gideon feels guilt for his friend's deaths and wants to save everyone, even at his own expense(Almost like he's a white character) Chandra is afraid to develop relationships/stay in one place because she feels she's to blame for her parents murders, leading to her being quick to emotions in general(Red). If they hadn't white-washed Nissa, they could have her arc be atonement for her sins and realizing that racism isn't cool instead of pining over Ashaya.

The only one of the Gate4 that I can't stand is Jace, and that's because he doesn't have shit for a driving conflict inside himself yet. Maybe they'll give it to him in Innistrad as he realizes that he can't fix everything/be the living Guildpact while trying to save the Multiverse. If anything, I'm willing to bet that the next time we return to Ravnica there's a full on war as a result of Jace vanishing for 2-4 months.

Like, there's ways to go with the characters, to make them not so bland, but Wizards doesn't seem to get it and keeps them as shallow while trying to emphasize story.

It's especially odd because the best Uncharged Realms this Block have been the Drana stuff, or the Tazri one, or even the Noyan Dar one.
 
I

Imperfected

Member
aidan said:
It makes me legitimately sad that their attempt to make the writing feel less childish and more "mature" is to inject awkward sexual tension into every relationship. It's so strange after they handled Alesha's character with delicacy and maturity during Khans block. They're capable of doing better!
Click to expand...

The Garruk/Jace sexual tension is really phoned in.
 
A

Ashodin

Member
Jace's problem is willing to commit to a relationship with Liliana (I stand by the rule that you don't fuck crazy)

Blue's willingness to submit to Black is questionable, since Blue wants to control everything.
 
U

ultron87

Member
Hmm, it is snowing... but I really want to go draft.

We're only supposed to get 1-3 inches so it's not like other places that are getting an actual blizzard. It'll be fiiiiine. Probably.
 
F

Firemind

Member
Mana floods are the worst. Anyone who complains about mana screws have never had the displeasure of drawing half their lands by turn ten.
 
S

shrapnelmagnet

Member
Firemind said:
Mana floods are the worst. Anyone who complains about mana screws have never had the displeasure of drawing half their lands by turn ten.
Click to expand...

Mana displeasure swings both directions just as hard, I'd say. No lands can mean gas in hand, all lands can mean draws are live. Although, I'm sure it depends on the person / deck with regards to which feels worse.

If I had to pick, I would side with you in that I'd rather be sans-land and be open to drawing out of it, rather than flooded. I think opponents are more sympathetic to mana screw than flood, too.
 
T

TestOfTide

Banned
Firemind said:
Mana floods are the worst. Anyone who complains about mana screws have never had the displeasure of drawing half their lands by turn ten.
Click to expand...

Floods are shitty, but the odds of getting mana flooded in a well constructed deck are much lower than getting mana screwed. Plus drawing more lands than you need can be useful for bluffing your opponent and/or discarding cards when your opponent makes you discard.

But if you are finding mana floods to still be a constant problem, then just replace 1-4 basic lands with evolving wilds.
 
F

Firemind

Member
shrapnelmagnet said:
Mana displeasure swings both directions just as hard, I'd say. No lands can mean gas in hand, all lands can mean draws are live. Although, I'm sure it depends on the person / deck with regards to which feels worse.

If I had to pick, I would side with you in that I'd rather be sans-land and be open to drawing out of it, rather than flooded. I think opponents are more sympathetic to mana screw than flood, too.
Click to expand...
At least mana screws are somewhat controllable with mulligans.

dat feeling when you're on the splinter twin plan and you open the second pack...

5ezcvGS.jpg
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Visions of Mana | Review Thread
Analysis Review 2
52
3K
Poppyseed replied
Visions of Mana Releases on Summer 2024, New Footage Revealed Xbox Direct 2024
News Hype 2
52
5K
IFireflyl replied
  • Locked
Coming to Game Pass: Kunitsu-Gami: Path of the Goddess, Flintlock: The Siege of Dawn, Flock, Magical Delicacy and Dungeons of Hinterberg
12
737
Topher replied
Romancing SaGa 2: Revenge of the Seven demo now available
News
25
1K
sigmaZ replied
Sand Land | Review Thread
Opinion Analysis Review
16
2K
adamsapple replied
Top Bottom