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[keeblerdrow]

Only works if he's playing all the Oaths. He wasn't.


Here's the allies deck I was running last night.


3 Drana, Liberator of Malakir
4 Kalastria Healer
4 Zulaport Cutthroat
1 Lantern Scount
4 Drana's Emissary
1 General Tazri
3 Cliffhaven Vampire
3 Retreat to Emeria
3 Oath of Gideon
2 Captain's Claws
3 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Sorin, Solemn Visitor
2 Ob Nixilis, Reignited

3 Shambling Vent
3 Ally Encampment
4 Caves of Koilos
4 Scoured Barrens
4 Evolving Wilds
4 Swamp
3 Plains

SB: (still don't know what I'd want to board out my main plan against, so I did a transform into BW controllish)
2 Secure the Wastes
3 Grasp of Darkness
2 Flaying Tendrils
1 Murderous Cut
1 Ultimate Price
2 Read the Bones
2 Crux of Fate
2 Hallowed Moonlight

 

[Haines]

When will limited be on.

Next weekend?

 

[Infinite Stars]

When will limited be on.

Next weekend?

Limited(Sealed) is today. It's on right now, Marshal's in the booth 50 feet from me.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Flooded 3rd game round 2 while my opponent had a 6 lands and drew only gas.

3-0 dreams are dead.



I see how it is MTGO draft a pile get rewarded draft a synergy deck, get manascrewed one round after another. I didn't even get to enjoy my deck properly since the first round game 2 my opponent was manascrewed and all the following games I'd flood. Sodium is reaching critical levels.

 

[Santiako]

When will limited be on.

Next weekend?

Today and tomorrow on twitch.tv/magic

 

[Ashodin]

the SCG open is funnier to watch anyway - just watched a guy rage quit on cam

 

[Angry Grimace]

"Mono" Black Eldrazi is pretty damn busted in Standard too.

 

[Joe Molotov]

Took my Burn deck out for a spin last night. It's a pretty standard decklist.

4x Goblin Guide
4x Eidolon of the Great Revel
4x Monastery Swiftspear
4x Wild Nacatl
2x Grim Lavamancer

4x Lightning Bolt
4x Rift Bolt
4x Lava Spike
4x Boros Charm
4x Atarka's Command
2x Lightning Helix

12x Fetches
6x Shocks
2x Mountains

Went 3-2, but two of my wins came against budget Rakdos Aggro decks. My other win was against Affinity and then I lost against Elves and Delver.

 

[Haines]

Flooded 3rd game round 2 while my opponent had a 6 lands and drew only gas.

3-0 dreams are dead.



I see how it is MTGO draft a pile get rewarded draft a synergy deck, get manascrewed one round after another. I didn't even get to enjoy my deck properly since the first round game 2 my opponent was manascrewed and all the following games I'd flood. Sodium is reaching critical levels.

Ive heard wizards toyed with ideas of fixing the mana system. I assume they pretty much just landed on the scry rule? I like the variance it adds, but it can make games hit the great back and forth come a lil less often.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Ive heard wizards toyed with ideas of fixing the mana system. I assume they pretty much just landed on the scry rule? I like the variance it adds, but it can make games hit the great back and forth come a lil less often.

Well I mulliganed to 5 and only drew lands.

But anyways reserves are up, I got linvalad twice now it's time for retribution, I got a Linvala

 

[Haines]

Limited(Sealed) is today. It's on right now, Marshal's in the booth 50 feet from me.

Jealous. Thats cool.

Today and tomorrow on twitch.tv/magic

Right on. Is it draft tmrw ow sealed again

 

[Haines]

Well I mulliganed to 5 and only drew lands.

But anyways reserves are up, I got linvalad twice now it's time for retribution, I got a Linvala

In my finals match for first last night

Mulligan to 5, 1 land each time

I keep at 5 with 1 land scry away a spell, im on the play so i play my land and have 4 cards

I draw a second green land. Everything needs black. I have 10 black and 7 green in my deck.

I never draw another land, and discard 3 cards before he beats me down for win while i draw a black card on his last swing.

Worst game i ever played, in the most important game ive played lol

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

In my finals match for first last night

Mulligan to 5, 1 land each time

I keep at 5 with 1 land scry away a spell, im on the play so i play my land and have 4 cards

I draw a second green land. Everything needs black. I have 10 black and 7 green in my deck.

I never draw another land, and discard 3 cards before he beats me down for win while i draw a black card on his last swing.

Worst game i ever played, in the most important game ive played lol

Yeah it always sucks you're there to play magic not become salty

Spoiler

and win

.

Qu'elle surprise playing Linvala makes you win games. Game 1 I skipped over my main phases and couldn't play a land anymore so essentially gave my opponent an extra turn and I was already on the play, still won though.

Edit: I give up I can't 3-0 a draft today no matter what I pull or which archetype I go for.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Been messing around with this complete brain-dead smashy-smashy deck

It cost $190 and has 1 card from Khans of Tarkir and 0 fetches, so its fun in its own way. Also, occasionally busted when you curve out perfectly.

Deck: "Mono" Black Eldrazi Stompy

//Creatures
4 Thought-Knot Seer
2 Eldrazi Mimic
4 Matter Reshaper
4 Wasteland Strangler
4 Bearer of Silence
2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
2 Blight Herder
3 Reality Smasher

//Spells
2 Complete Disregard
1 Spatial Contortion
1 Warping Wail
1 Ob Nixilis Reignited
2 Transgress the Mind
3 Grasp of Darkness

//Land
4 Caves of Koilos
2 Ruins of Oran-Rief
3 Sea Gate Wreckage
8 Swamp
4 Llanowar Wastes
2 Mirrorpool
2 Blighted Fen

//Sideboard
2 Flaying Tendrils
4 Duress
1 Transgress the Mind
3 Infinite Obliteration
3 Self-Inflicted Wound
1 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
1 Murderous Cut

Display deck statistics

 

[Haines]

Opened my winning packs

I got the shiny full art bfz mountain

How do I look up what that cards worth. I can't figure it out. It's card 267. I assume it's only worth a couple bucks at most I'm just curious first shiny land. Purdy.

 

[The Technomancer]

Opened my winning packs

I got the shiny full art bfz mountain

How do I look up what that cards worth. I can't figure it out. It's card 267. I assume it's only worth a couple bucks at most I'm just curious first shiny land. Purdy.

This one?

http://www.cardkingdom.com/catalog/item/202941

Eight bucks apparently

 

[Etrian Oddity]

So what are the frontrunners in the speculation market?

Mina and Denn are super cheap right now, do they expect to spike?

Hissing Quagmire I'll probably wind up getting 4x since I love Sultai and Abzan colors.

Sylvan Advocate is $3.50 on Channel Fireball. Buy or wait?

Warping Wail is definitely a buy, no?

 

[Giant Panda]

Why is Wizards having such a hard time finding a regenerate replacement? Couldn't they just have New-Regen X (When this creature dies, you may pay X. If you do return it to the battlefield tapped)?

 

[Haines]

This one?

http://www.cardkingdom.com/catalog/item/202941

Eight bucks apparently

Thanks a bunch duder.

Ill probably just play with it.

Still not a fan of this randy guy. Sutcliff outclasses him so much.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

MTGO has to ruin everything I open an ELdrazi displacer and it just decides to have a hiccup and pick Utmara Entangler instead. I contacted customer support and will ask for a refund. The deck I built in the end is really wacky and I wanted to build around the displacer.

If I'm gonna lose against the displace I'm gonna go crazy. I'm starting to think MTGO drafting is unhealthy for me.

 

[SigmasonicX]

Why is Wizards having such a hard time finding a regenerate replacement? Couldn't they just have New-Regen X (When this creature dies, you may pay X. If you do return it to the battlefield tapped)?

That would cause the creature to shed auras, counters, and equipment, plus retrigger enter-the-battlefield effects and trigger leave-the-battlefield (and death?) effects. An ideal regenerate replacement would prevent the creature from leaving the battlefield in the first place.

 

[Angry Grimace]

That would cause the creature to shed auras, counters, and equipment, plus retrigger enter-the-battlefield effects and trigger leave-the-battlefield (and death?) effects. An ideal regenerate replacement would prevent the creature from leaving the battlefield in the first place.

Sounds like Regenerate is a good solution. The problem with regeneration is mostly the wording and actual way it works is clunky.

 

[The Technomancer]

The problem with Regeneration was mostly just the name. Rename it like Withstand or something and everyone gets it

 

[SigmasonicX]

The problem with Regeneration was mostly just the name. Rename it like Withstand or something and everyone gets it

I've said before that a possible solution would be to replace "regenerate target creature" with "the next time target creature would die this turn, it regenerates instead", removing the use of "player regenerates creature" but keeping "creature regenerates itself", and maybe also spelling out that it becomes tapped.

 

[Haines]

Can i comment as a newbie to magic on regenerate?

Its the only, and incredibly confusing card to me. Now dont misunderstand me. What regenerate does is incredibly simple. Once you understand it, its easily played with.

I actually dont like it. Every time i go to play it, i cant figure out when im supposed to play the card or activate it if its good for me.

Again, its probably totally fine. But after playing hearthstone since launch and magic since bfz now its the only mechanic to ever give me massive headaches. Magics mechanics are so well done from what ive played with, it just kind of sticks out like a sore thumb

 

[Haines]

MTGO has to ruin everything I open an ELdrazi displacer and it just decides to have a hiccup and pick Utmara Entangler instead. I contacted customer support and will ask for a refund. The deck I built in the end is really wacky and I wanted to build around the displacer.

If I'm gonna lose against the displace I'm gonna go crazy. I'm starting to think MTGO drafting is unhealthy for me.

Thats unnacceptable when you pay that much money. Ive heard there cs is good, so i hope you get some sort of compensation.

 

[Haines]

I've said before that a possible solution would be to replace "regenerate target creature" with "the next time target creature would die this turn, it regenerates instead", removing the use of "player regenerates creature" but keeping "creature regenerates itself", and maybe also spelling out that it becomes tapped.

The becomes tapped part, is def the part that need explained better.

Sorry for the posts in a row, im too lazy to edit.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Thats unnacceptable when you pay that much money. Ive heard there cs is good, so i hope you get some sort of compensation.

Usually they are rather generous with refunds you can just be banned arbitrarily w/o a warning if they feel you're abusing the system.

First time I timed out. My deck just had so much things to do tap down, attack, search, animate, switch P/T, put markers on creatures,... It surprisingly almost worked kinda. My opponent showed no mercy, as he needn't, and held onto life as barely as possible until time took hold. Another issue was that MTGO would not take my F6 and F2 keys meaning I had to skip all actions manually slowed me down a lot.

The becomes tapped part, is def the part that need explained better.

Sorry for the posts in a row, im too lazy to edit.

I remember when my friends and I learned of regenerate we thought you could use it to tap down the creature... That was like more than a decade ago though.

 

[Haines]

Usually they are rather lavish with refunds you can just be banned arbitrarily w/o a warning if they feel you're abusing the system.

First time I timed out. My deck just had so much things to do tap down, attack, search, animate, switch P/T, put markers on creatures,... It surprisingly almost worked kinda. My opponent showed no mercy, as he needn't, and held onto life as barely as possible until time took hold. Another issue was that MTGO would not take my F6 and F2 keys meaning I had to skip all actions manually slowed me down a lot.



I remember when my friends and I learned of regenerate we thought you could use it to tap down the creature... That was like more than a decade ago though.

Thats the one thing im still realllly adjusting to in magic. Im not sur e if i would like online better, but in hearthstone you have a set time to do your turn.
Then i go to events and i swear people win game 1 and go fuck it im taking as much time as i want from now on and it drives me nuts. Take your time and think about your turn, but magic limited format is really not that complicated unless you have a major board stall.


The more i realize the problems i have with magic are the people im playing against, the more i consider online. Like the one guy i played, i couldnt even tell if his lands were tapped, im not even kidding, his buudy next to him even told him, and he whined, i had to count his mana used every every turn so i would know.

So i might possibly go magic online, the only thing that holds me back is the issues it has and people will be much better than me after years of playing on that system.

And with 2 kids i dunno if i have the time to invest so im also curious to see if hearthstone gets a major revision soon as rumoured.

 

[Giant Panda]

I've said before that a possible solution would be to replace "regenerate target creature" with "the next time target creature would die this turn, it regenerates instead", removing the use of "player regenerates creature" but keeping "creature regenerates itself", and maybe also spelling out that it becomes tapped.

Yeah, if they don't want anything to actually change mechanically, then it shouldn't be too hard to change the wording a bit to make it more intuitive.

 

[Haines]

So after watching lots of sealed tonight. I have a question for you guys.

Do you think a limited format that ends up in a ton of board stall represents a healthy and fun format, or the alternative?

Ive heard a lot of people praise it for being back to magic basics etc. Im curious to hear your thoughts. Seeings as this thread kind of dies once it hits the community, id like to promote some discussion.

Excited for draft grand prix tmrw

 

[kirblar]

Formats that go long (in general) >>>>> fast formats.

 

[Infinite Stars]

Formats that go long (in general) >>>>> fast formats.

Yup. That's part of why Origins was bleh as a format: you had the really aggressive colour pair(Red White) and if you couldn't survive that you'd lose to that deck. UB was awful in Origins IIRC for this reason. Hilariously, this is coming off of Tarkir, where for the entire block 6 Mana was almost expected to be reached(at least in my experience).

The issue with BFZ's games going long is that it became games of "Who can get their win con first" and not a strategic game. Plus, it was so synergy focused that games were long until the Allies player got Blademaster active/Eldrazi Player got Bala Ged.

 

[WanderingWind]

What? How else would you look at the benefits of "endurance" without comparing it to a similar card without one?

I don't see the design space it opens up. The only color that regularly deals direct damage to creature outside of combat is red, which is already the color that best handles artifacts. Green and white will interact with them the exact same way as usual, and blue and black will still have difficulty removing them. Thus, you can't really make a card with endurance significantly stronger than the same card without it, unless you're specifically aiming to make red slightly stronger and black slightly weaker.

I feel like what you guys really want is "planeswalkers, but artifacts".

...I don't understand how that's not clear, tbh. When talking about design, you're not constrained to things that have already been done before. Taking a mechanic and purposely placing it within the confines of an already existing card is about as useful for exploratory design as taking something like Morbid and sticking it on a card that says "if a creature died this turn, target player loses the game" and then saying it's too powerful. You can take any mechanic in existence and do something similar. It's a good exercise to look for potential flaws, but it's only one test.

And yeah, artifacts with planeswalker style counters is a design space not explored yet. It hasn't been done, therefore - whether you agree with it being good - it's 100 percent wide open design space. Contraptions that need counter investment to become powerful. Contraptions that offer splashy effects but lose counters instead of gaining them. Contraptions that synergize with creatures with "tinker" keyword. Contraptions that maybe work stronger with others on the field. Etc.

X+Y also isn't really all that valid of a complaint. Enchantment + creature. Creature+spell. Artifact + Creature. Land+spell. Land + artifact. Creature + land. These are all things that already exist. It's a staple of Magic design.

Now, I'm not saying the mechanic is just 100 percent totally the bestest thing ever, but ITT, when somebody comes up a with a mechanic we have got to do better in registering valid - and not knee jerk buzzwordy - critiques.

 

[Infinite Stars]

You could make UB have an Anti-Proliferate as a mechanic It's not damage, and it makes sense flavorwise(Blue knows how to stop Machines because Knowledge, Black knows because it's powerful to know it.)

Tinkerer's Arrogance 4U

~ Costs 1 less for each Contraption on the battlefield.

Anti-Prof(You may remove a counter from each permanent in play.)

Draw a card.

"In the old days, You could destroy an Empire with the death of a single person. Now it's just a single cog in the machine."-Cedric Rohdan.

 

[noquarter]

Thats the one thing im still realllly adjusting to in magic. Im not sur e if i would like online better, but in hearthstone you have a set time to do your turn.
Then i go to events and i swear people win game 1 and go fuck it im taking as much time as i want from now on and it drives me nuts. Take your time and think about your turn, but magic limited format is really not that complicated unless you have a major board stall.


The more i realize the problems i have with magic are the people im playing against, the more i consider online. Like the one guy i played, i couldnt even tell if his lands were tapped, im not even kidding, his buudy next to him even told him, and he whined, i had to count his mana used every every turn so i would know.

So i might possibly go magic online, the only thing that holds me back is the issues it has and people will be much better than me after years of playing on that system.

And with 2 kids i dunno if i have the time to invest so im also curious to see if hearthstone gets a major revision soon as rumoured.

With the problems you seem to be having in playing at your LGS, you should just learn MTGO. It really isn't that difficult, and I believe you already paid the $10 to start. Just build a deck with the gold bordered cards and play it in the begginers rooms. After a match or two look up a video about MTGO for new players (sure there is one out there) or read an article talking about shortcuts for it.

After a little bit of time you will get really used to it. Honestly, knowing what the F keys do and where you would like to actually put auto-stops at is the biggest obstacle to overcome. After that it gets a lot easier.

Also, since you are new to it you don't have the built in disgust to V4 that happened to me. After the forced switch I just kind of fell off of MTGO.

 

[Corsick]

With the problems you seem to be having in playing at your LGS, you should just learn MTGO. It really isn't that difficult, and I believe you already paid the $10 to start. Just build a deck with the gold bordered cards and play it in the begginers rooms. After a match or two look up a video about MTGO for new players (sure there is one out there) or read an article talking about shortcuts for it.

After a little bit of time you will get really used to it. Honestly, knowing what the F keys do and where you would like to actually put auto-stops at is the biggest obstacle to overcome. After that it gets a lot easier.

Also, since you are new to it you don't have the built in disgust to V4 that happened to me. After the forced switch I just kind of fell off of MTGO.

I'm curious, with how they've changed payouts, is going infinite harder now? And if so, what's the best way to go infinite? I know you have to be good, but there must be an "easiest" path to take. Last thing I did was make a cloudpost pauper deck I think and that was at least a year ago. I want to get back into the game, but the costs are always a demotivator.

 

[Angry Grimace]

4 Color Abzan is a drizzling shit of a deck that someone probably should have gotten fired for enabling. Like seriously how fucking high was Sam Stoddard when he was like "well we better make sure to put in typed duals so people can still play Siege Rhino!" like was this dumb fucker actually concerned about the viability of Siege rhino?

 

[Haines]

What time does the grand prix stuff start today

 

[Haines]

With the problems you seem to be having in playing at your LGS, you should just learn MTGO. It really isn't that difficult, and I believe you already paid the $10 to start. Just build a deck with the gold bordered cards and play it in the begginers rooms. After a match or two look up a video about MTGO for new players (sure there is one out there) or read an article talking about shortcuts for it.

After a little bit of time you will get really used to it. Honestly, knowing what the F keys do and where you would like to actually put auto-stops at is the biggest obstacle to overcome. After that it gets a lot easier.

Also, since you are new to it you don't have the built in disgust to V4 that happened to me. After the forced switch I just kind of fell off of MTGO.

I started to play it then the free time went to watching that making amurder doc with the wifey. My next step was going to be looking up shortcuts, cuz the default ones suck.

I was hoping lr would have an episode about how to setup your magic onlinge config etc but i dont see one.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet is a filthy Magic card that's going to be everywhere once SOI comes out and competing options at the 4-drop slot rotate out.

 

[ultron87]

...I don't understand how that's not clear, tbh. When talking about design, you're not constrained to things that have already been done before. Taking a mechanic and purposely placing it within the confines of an already existing card is about as useful for exploratory design as taking something like Morbid and sticking it on a card that says "if a creature died this turn, target player loses the game" and then saying it's too powerful. You can take any mechanic in existence and do something similar. It's a good exercise to look for potential flaws, but it's only one test.

And yeah, artifacts with planeswalker style counters is a design space not explored yet. It hasn't been done, therefore - whether you agree with it being good - it's 100 percent wide open design space. Contraptions that need counter investment to become powerful. Contraptions that offer splashy effects but lose counters instead of gaining them. Contraptions that synergize with creatures with "tinker" keyword. Contraptions that maybe work stronger with others on the field. Etc.

Artifacts with loyaltyish counters isn't really the thing we were talking about though. It was non creature artifacts that also have a "toughness" that you can Lightning Bolt. You seem to be suggesting something different, which is I guess charge-ish counters the opponent can remove with damage? I still don't quite see why that's any different than an artifact creatures with a Phantom Nantuko type ability that removes counters on damage, but I could at least imagine there are possibilities. I'd still like to see a card you think this would allow that couldn't be done within the existing rules.

X+Y also isn't really all that valid of a complaint. Enchantment + creature. Creature+spell. Artifact + Creature. Land+spell. Land + artifact. Creature + land. These are all things that already exist. It's a staple of Magic design.

Most of those, like Enchantment Creatures which you've brought up a lot, all worked with almost no additional rules or complexity baggage. Anyone that has played Magic saw an enchantment creature, read the type line, and instantly knew what it meant. So it was a flavor hit for the world and it allows there to be decks that played enchantments but also got creatures. The fact that the base concept was so understandable and easily implementable is what let them get a little crazier with Bestow and the rules behind that.

The proposed original mechanic had a lot of rules implications like certain target creature spells being able to hit non creatures and damage being marked on non-creatures (which leads to bad times if they get animated) for a mechanic that looked like a strict downside in some games and blank text in other games. It just didn't seem worth it. But once again, show some cards that that the concept makes possible and we can talk.

Now, I'm not saying the mechanic is just 100 percent totally the bestest thing ever, but ITT, when somebody comes up a with a mechanic we have got to do better in registering valid - and not knee jerk buzzwordy - critiques.

Way to put down the opposing viewpoints in a discussion where basically everyone listed actual reasons for the things they think and explained them.

 

[Haines]

Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet is a filthy Magic card that's going to be everywhere once SOI comes out and competing options at the 4-drop slot rotate out.

Second prerelease a younger player had that card. Attacked me and i just blocked and killed it without even my sphynx of the final word dieing. Idk if he thought id be scared to block or what but i was so happy lol.

 

[Etrian Oddity]

Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet is a filthy Magic card that's going to be everywhere once SOI comes out and competing options at the 4-drop slot rotate out.

Abzan Charm says goodbye

Also, if it becomes HUGE, guess what? You can board in Virulent Plague. It killed Jeskai tokens, and it is a trump card against Eldrazi tokens and soon Zombie tokens.

 

[GregLombardi]

http://www.channelfireball.com/videos/top-8-ultimates/

Do you guys remember when some n00bs in this thread said Ugin wasn't a good card? :0P

Haha, how time changes impressions! Card is insane.

Though I totally agree with #1 on the list, and it isn't Ugin.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Abzan Charm says goodbye

Also, if it becomes HUGE, guess what? You can board in Virulent Plague. It killed Jeskai tokens, and it is a trump card against Eldrazi tokens and soon Zombie tokens.

lol "dies to abzan charm"

 

[keeblerdrow]

My friend at the open is telling me all vendors there were completely sold out of dark dwellers, Kalitas, and sylvan advocate by lunch time yesterday. They seem like good pick ups now if you want to play them in the next few weeks.

 

[WanderingWind]

Artifacts with loyaltyish counters isn't really the thing we were talking about though.

Way to put down the opposing viewpoints in a discussion where basically everyone listed actual reasons for the things they think and explained them.

Yes, it is. Or more precisely, that was my take on it. Part of the group brainstorming. The other take was too close to artifact creatures, IMO.

Secondly, simply throwing out "reasons" without backing them up isn't constructive. For instance - "this is a boring mechanic' isn't a reason. It's a feeling. Saying "this isn't interesting" isn't a reason. "I don't see/understand why this mechanic should exist" isn't a reason. There is no reason to get offended by being asked to show your work. If you do, great, the above doesn't apply.

And by the by, I used "we" for a very specific reason. I've been guilty of the above, same as anybody else. It was a call for all of us to do better when somebody posts a custom card or mechanic. We're - all of us - quick to shit on it/them. All I'm saying is be constructive, explain beyond "nah, don't think it's fun" or just don't engage. It's sort of shitty otherwise.

 

[Santiako]

So GP Vancouver is back on stream, but they didn't stream the first draft :|

edit: parts of the draft will be shown between rounds. The fuck wizards, why are you so terrible at streaming-

 

[WanderingWind]

Did you just ask why Wizards was bad at something not made of cardboard?