Support NeoGAF

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

I had a game in draft today where all my answers lined up perfectly for what my opponent did.

I won with just a 2/1 enchanted with the black cartouche over 5 turns. 2 magma sprays, the -1/-1 counter from cartouche killed his 4/4 with 3 -1 counters, dispersed his 4/2 token and commit on his 4 drop. Insult the turn he held up the fog and then the manticore that deals 3 on ETB.

That had to be so frustrating. He didn't get to block once and my deck was not a fast deck. I just played all the 2 drops I got with little cohesion so I wouldn't get run over and could make trades but Insult // Injury was enough to make racing a possibility.

 

[Firemind]

it seem Magic has now become game that play in a limited event or two every couple months

one of us one of us

 

[Imperfected]

I tried a draft, and walked away feeling like everyone else was either rare drafting the fuck out of it or had taken some amazingly bad advice on drafting priorities.

Then again, I want literally none of the cards I walked away with despite winning, so maybe they were in the right of it.

 

[Violet_0]

I want to give a shout-out to the Dutch magic players for being super friendly and helpful and correcting my numerous small mistakes (I was completely sober, I swear) without making a drama out of it, btw

 

[Imperfected]

I want to give a shout-out to the Dutch magic players for being super friendly and helpful and correcting my numerous small mistakes (I was completely sober, I swear) without making a drama out of it, btw

This has been true of every draft I've been to, I will say. I've never had a rules dispute that couldn't be solved in a completely amicable manner by both players acting like adults with a reasonable sense of fair play. Even when one of the parties involved wasn't actually an adult!

 

[Daedardus]

You can always start with an abzan midrange and then upgrade to CoCo as you acquire the cards.

I think I have almost all of the pieces needed for CoCo except for CoCo itself, Chords, the new combo and 2 extra Kitchen Finks. Decided to pick up a Kalitas and some Grim Flayers instead and go for the more black oriented build. It will blend in more nicely with the rest of the playgroup I play with.

 

[Ashodin]

Ayyyy Noah

 

[Wulfric]

He sure likes his Cats with midriffs.

I also like my cats with midriffs. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

I still haven't found Atraxa or Breya for MSRP yet.

Walmart still has the Japanese ones. Not sure about English.

Early Magic art was mostly Jesper Myrfors' art school buddies and up-and-comers they met through gaming channels (conventions, etc.) Even once they got more of a budget, the amount of work for fantasy illustrators was orders of magnitude smaller at the time given fewer hobby games and a far smaller videogame industry. Magic has honestly been one of the main brands actually driving that higher bar.

It's a good thing they put so much emphasis on the art. WotC commissions a crazy amount of work each year. I consider Blizzard their only equal in terms of quality. Maaaybe Fantasy Flight, since they share a lot of talent.

That being said, I hope Magic still exists by the time I get my portfolio up to standard. :O

Ayyyy Noah

So jealous, Rob Alexander is there too I think? You should check out his sketch prices.

Good luck tomorrow btw

 

[alternade]

I still haven't found Atraxa or Breya for MSRP yet.

LOL I have 3 cases of the C2016 decks.

 

[Angry Grimace]

The zombie deck is pretty damn fun. But that one that did well in the Comp league is obvious a budget list since I'm imagining Liliana (both of them) works in that list.

 

[Imperfected]

The zombie deck is pretty damn fun. But that one that did well in the Comp league is obvious a budget list since I'm imagining Liliana (both of them) works in that list.

It's basically just value zombies, zombie lords, and zombie anthems, yeah. That's why I love it, it's like the most brain-dead tribal deck you could ever run. "Here and monsters and things that make those monsters more monstery. Ikuze!"

There are arguments against Last Hope, though. Most of that decklist already plays out of the graveyard without her, and it's got enough to do at 3CMC.

 

[Santiako]

I think I have almost all of the pieces needed for CoCo except for CoCo itself, Chords, the new combo and 2 extra Kitchen Finks. Decided to pick up a Kalitas and some Grim Flayers instead and go for the more black oriented build. It will blend in more nicely with the rest of the playgroup I play with.

In the end, it's really about what fits your playsytle.

Ayyyy Noah

Is he playing tomorrow?

 

[Angry Grimace]

It's basically just value zombies, zombie lords, and zombie anthems, yeah. That's why I love it, it's like the most brain-dead tribal deck you could ever run. "Here and monsters and things that make those monsters more monstery. Ikuze!"

There are arguments against Last Hope, though. Most of that decklist already plays out of the graveyard without her, and it's got enough to do at 3CMC.

I think it's just wrong to not play Last Hope in the 75. There are marches that Last Hope can win on its own.

There are four Nissas in Standard and 1 Jace. What a time to be alive.

 

[Imperfected]

I think it's just wrong to not play Last Hope in the 75. There are marches that Last Hope can win on its own.

Oh yeah, out of the sideboard at least. I completely forgot that his sideboard was basically just nothing, LOL.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Oh yeah, out of the sideboard at least. I completely forgot that his sideboard was basically just nothing, LOL.

Death's Majesty is probably a 1 or 2 of in the main board imo. That's another card that can just win the game by itself and all of its abilities are synergistic with the deck. More than the Zombie anthem.

 

[Imperfected]

Pretty sure he can ditch the Scarab Feasts in his sideboard. Maybe he's anticipating a match-up I just haven't foreseen, but I feel like that's a card you put in your board that never, ever comes out of it.

 

[Xis]

Random conjecture:

Amonkhet really reminds me of Theros. Top-down design, similar technology level, based on real-world mythology. Minor enchantment theme. Gods. Minotaur tribal.

Is spring 2018 too soon for return to Theros?

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Amonkhet doesn't compare much to Theros imo. Amonkhet and Kaladesh feel a bit like window dressing, like taking the faintest cultural lense to gaze through.

You can find the influences in Theros on every card, almost to a fault.

 

[Imperfected]

I just feel like too much of Amonkhet's card art/inspiration revolves around the Crop/Trials stuff, which is not particularly interesting because it's immediately and blatantly obvious that the whole thing is a scam.

Maybe if they spent Amonkhet presenting the idea and waited until Hour of Devastation to reveal the sinister truth it would be interesting enough to justify it, but when you've pretty much established that it's all a big dog and pony show before the concept is even fully presented, it doesn't do much to justify having like 90% of the cards devoted to it.

They still need to work on the balance between "narrative" cards and "these are just cool things about the setting not related to this myopic story we're telling" cards. It's one of the problems of injecting the Gatewatch everywhere: they really tilt the scales toward the second group by their nature.

 

[OnPoint]

Amonkhet doesn't compare much to Theros imo. Amonkhet and Kaladesh feel a bit like window dressing, like taking the faintest cultural lense to gaze through.

You can find the influences in Theros on every card, almost to a fault.

I'll give you Kaladesh, but Amonkhet basically feels like an episode of Sliders in a bizzaro Ancient Egypt with the Gatewatch.

 

[Ashodin]

In the end, it's really about what fits your playsytle.



Is he playing tomorrow?

A friend and I are going to dream crush him.

 

[charlequin]

Amonkhet doesn't compare much to Theros imo. Amonkhet and Kaladesh feel a bit like window dressing, like taking the faintest cultural lense to gaze through.

For most people putting it next to Kaladesh is the perfect demonstration why it's the opposite of that. Amonkhet is (as befits a top-down design) far more thorough and comprehensive in its setting reference than KLD was.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

For most people putting it next to Kaladesh is the perfect demonstration why it's the opposite of that. Amonkhet is (as befits a top-down design) far more thorough and comprehensive in its setting reference than KLD was.

I'll give you Kaladesh, but Amonkhet basically feels like an episode of Sliders in a bizzaro Ancient Egypt with the Gatewatch.

Kaladesh is much more shallow but Amonkhet doesn't go particularly deep in cultural appropriation and pop culture references either.
Nagas and Minotaurs don't scream Egypt, Jackals barely have a presence and the mummies are discount goods with little mysticism to them. I like having male angels but I can't marry them to the plane.
The architecture appears a bit outlandish almost sci fi still.


I overall like the design of Amonkhet both in limited play and the world they build sans Gatewatch. I don't like much of the art direction but there's as many outstanding pieces of art as there are failings.

 

[charlequin]

Kaladesh is much more shallow but Amonkhet doesn't go particularly deep in cultural appropriation and pop culture references either.

It's got mummies, sphinxes, pyramids, animal-head gods, hieroglyphics, curses, crocodile monsters, flesh-eating scarabs, the Nile flooding, Cleopatra, and King Tut. I think that's literally 100% of everything anyone knows about stereotypical ancient Egypt.

 

[traveler]

But the sphinxs fly....

What kind of amateur hour production is this?!?!

 

[OnPoint]

It's got mummies, sphinxes, pyramids, animal-head gods, hieroglyphics, curses, crocodile monsters, flesh-eating scarabs, the Nile flooding, Cleopatra, and King Tut. I think that's literally 100% of everything anyone knows about stereotypical ancient Egypt.

That's 100% of anything I also could have argued for haha

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

It's got mummies, sphinxes, pyramids, animal-head gods, hieroglyphics, curses, crocodile monsters, flesh-eating scarabs, the Nile flooding, Cleopatra, and King Tut. I think that's literally 100% of everything anyone knows about stereotypical ancient Egypt.

It qualifies at a cursory glance. It's missing almost all of the mysticism that is associated with it, the mummies and sphinxes hardly even qualify. It's missing the cradle of civilization feeling, for obvious story reasons.

It's an egyptian coloured theme park.

But the sphinxs fly....

What kind of amateur hour production is this?!?!

Kamigawa had Dragons and Kirin w/o wings that could fly they even adopted Krin just recently again in Tarkir once again w/o wings and flying.

 

[Imperfected]

Yeah, the fact that you go into it immediately knowing the whole thing is a sham (in-setting) makes it hard to get much of a sense of wonder or awe from any of it.

"Here's a monument to a bitch god who's been turned into a pawn in some inane Gatewatch shell game. Here's the puppet god's 'holy' trial. Here's a card about the worship of the god. Hey! Don't forget, it's all a sham, okay?"

Again: push that off to the second part of the block, maybe? Give me a minute or two to feel like Bontu is actually kind of cool before you push that whole chunk of the setting off a cliff.

 

[Yeef]

Yeah, the fact that you go into it immediately knowing the whole thing is a sham (in-setting) makes it hard to get much of a sense of wonder or awe from any of it.

"Here's a monument to a bitch god who's been turned into a pawn in some inane Gatewatch shell game. Here's the puppet god's 'holy' trial. Here's a card about the worship of the god. Hey! Don't forget, it's all a sham, okay?"

Again: push that off to the second part of the block, maybe? Give me a minute or two to feel like Bontu is actually kind of cool before you push that whole chunk of the setting off a cliff.

Eh? The gods were there before Bolas (including 3 more that are missing), odds are they will be there after whatever happens in HOU as well. We don't know, yet, how much of Amonkhet's culture is Bolas' influence and how much of it was originally there before he came and messed with things. It's entirely possible that the trials existed before Bolas for some other purpose.

 

[Imperfected]

Eh? The gods were there before Bolas (including 3 more that are missing), odds are they will be there after whatever happens in HOU as well. We don't know, yet, how much of Amonkhet's culture is Bolas' influence and how much of it was originally there before he came and messed with things. It's entirely possible that the trials existed before Bolas for some other purpose.

If you told me that the current Dragonlords are actually just blimps that kobolds have made out of their hollowed-out shells and the whole thing is a Weekend At Bernies affair, I'm not going to really give a shit how cool the Dragonlords were before they became animatronic or how many of the cool Dragonlord-related things predate it. I'm going to be focusing on the fact the they're now just airships made out of dragon corpses.

This is a bad example because obviously that would be rad, but you get the point.

 

[Infinite Stars]

Walking Ballista was a mistake of a card. I know they don't design for Modern but by God it is a pain in the ass to deal with. 16-Sol Lands the deck is so, so dumb

 

[ajf009]

Walking Ballista was a mistake of a card. I know they don't design for Modern but by God it is a pain in the ass to deal with. 16-Sol Lands the deck is so, so dumb

I loveee Walking Ballista as a card, it alone convinced me to swith to colourless Eldrazi Tron
Its an instant win with the Devoted Druid combo now also.

 

[Santiako]

GP Richmond (Amonkhet Limited) is streaming
https://www.twitch.tv/magic

Walking Ballista was a mistake of a card. I know they don't design for Modern but by God it is a pain in the ass to deal with. 16-Sol Lands the deck is so, so dumb

Yeah, I didn't like Eldrazi Tron in the beginning (I thought it was just worse than Bant), but it has proved me wrong. The deck is growing and growing since it has game against everything.

 

[Ashodin]

Omg Hazoret

Here's my pile

 

[Santiako]

Archfiend of Ifnir AND the two rare sphinxes?!

You better make day 2!

 

[red13th]

Omg Hazoret

lol this is great

 

[Infinite Stars]

I loveee Walking Ballista as a card, it alone convinced me to swith to colourless Eldrazi Tron
Its an instant win with the Devoted Druid combo now also.

I know it's an instant win, but dear God is it dumb. At no point should it be coming down turn 3 as X=3 and be able to wipe a board and still live.

GP Richmond (Amonkhet Limited) is streaming
https://www.twitch.tv/magic




Yeah, I didn't like Eldrazi Tron in the beginning (I thought it was just worse than Bant), but it has proved me wrong. The deck is growing and growing since it has game against everything.

That's my fundamental issue with Eldrazi Tron: it violates the color pie by letting a deck with no colors have everything. They've got the best board wipe, the best creatures(not named Death's Shadow), the best ramp, etc.

That just seems incredibly unhealthy for the color pie that one deck has all these answers while having no color. I mean, even Affinity has to splash colors in order to get cards to help them.

 

[Santiako]

I know it's an instant win, but dear God is it dumb. At no point should it be coming down turn 3 as X=3 and be able to wipe a board and still live.

That's my fundamental issue with Eldrazi Tron: it violates the color pie by letting a deck with no colors have everything. They've got the best board wipe, the best creatures(not named Death's Shadow), the best ramp, etc.

That just seems incredibly unhealthy for the color pie that one deck has all these answers while having no color. I mean, even Affinity has to splash colors in order to get cards to help them.

Yeah, and when we see a ban for Death's Shadow (and going by Wotc's past behaviours, we will), I think we are at risk of Eldrazi Tron just taking over the format.

 

[ajf009]

Yeah, and when we see a ban for Death's Shadow (and going by Wotc's past behaviours, we will), I think we are at risk of Eldrazi Tron just taking over the format.

What makes you think we'll have a ban?

 

[Santiako]

What makes you think we'll have a ban?

They've always banned something when a deck becomes too dominant, and Death's Shadow is very dominant and format warping.

 

[ajf009]

They've always banned something when a deck becomes too dominant, and Death's Shadow is very dominant and format warping.

Idk, any deck with a white sideboard shits on it, rest in peice makes goyf, traverse & Grim Flayer useless, path+condemn ends DS easily. Hell last week at my lgs modern night I brought jeskai flash and easily beat 2 death's shadow decks. I agree 100% it is a strong deck, just not too strong

 

[Daedardus]

They've always banned something when a deck becomes too dominant, and Death's Shadow is very dominant and format warping.

It's strong but I don't consider it too dominant or format warping. At the top of their popularity both infect and affinity had a bigger meta share but Wizards didn't take action against them. The deck can also be easily interacted with. I foresee more problems with Eldrazi and Ballista since they are all bullshit cards that hard to interact with. Easiest thing to do is to counter them but Cavern blocks that.

 

[duxstar]

I think the next standard season will be dominated by Blue control decks, which has always been a fear of mine. Early testing says everyone is trying their best to make control viable, and Commit // Memory will be the card to do it.

It allows blue to tap out for card draw/Answers without having to actually worry about the card that comes down, tap out to wipe the board and the opponent has gideon ? No problem Commit, magma spray the token, then when you have 7 or 8 lands just Memory to draw a new 7, and hold up essence scatters and disallow's.

The thing I'm struggling with in building a g/w deck right now, is I have a deck that is pretty decent agains the mardu and control matchups but just folds to g/b. Even with 2 descend upon the sinful in the side, cards like watchers of the dead just aren't good enough to deal with the graveyard, and normally getting through 1 ishkanah is possible, but 2 of them just feels impossible.

I feel like theres some shell of a g/w delirium deck with traverse out there, but I'm not exactly sure what that gives you over G/B, just because Grim flayer. It sure is nice when wizards decides to push your colors pie with a mythic 2 drop that's actually really good, where's voice of resurgence, or fleeceman lion again guys =[.

Grim flayer just comes down and takes over the game, and gets them to the late game in Ishkanah.

Just in case you guys didn't know ....... but Blossoming Defense is fucking amazing right now, So many control decks running around, that think they have the answer, and then you pull a blossoming defense out, and it ends the game. My list is REALLY tight right now otherwise i'd try to fit 2 more in, I couldn't even make room for 2 tireless trackers.

In case anyone is interested // has any suggestions

4x Heart of Kiran
4x Cast Out
4x Lambholt Pacifist
4x Glorybound Initiate
4x Thraben Inspector
4x Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
3x Rishkar, Peema Renegade
3x Rhonas the Indomitable
3x Archangel Avacyn
2x Blossoming Defense

2x Evolving Wilds
2x Scattered Groves
2x Aether Hub
7x Forest
6x Plains
3x Canopy Vista
2x Westvale Abbey
1x Geier Reach Sanitarium

Sideboard
3x MangleHorn
1x Declaration in Stone
2x Gideon's Intervention
2x Descend upon the Sinful
1x Watcher of the Dead
1x Ishkanah Graft widow
2x Lifecrafter's Bestiary
1x Selfless Spirit
2x Dissenter's Deliverance


I tried to remember what the old G/W decks did that was so good, and that was just fucking curve out beastily, the old deck wanted to do Oath of nissa, into Sylvan Advocate, into Nissa, into Gideon, into Archangel Avacyn.

Well this deck kind of takes a different tone
Most of the time your 1st land is setting up your turn 2 and turn 3 plays.

Here are some thoughts on the creatures right now
Thraben Inspector - 1 drop that replaces itself, and can hold down the fort against aggro

Lambholt Pacifist - Probably the most important card in the entire deck (ok maybe behind Heart of Kiran, and Gideon). A 2 mana 3/3 is at a premium right now, avoids shock/magma spray in the main, and gets under essence scatter/Censor, then it leaves them 2 options

1. Hold up counterspell magic for your other stuff, and face a 4/4 coming at them every turn, which will end the game quick
2. Tap out to deal with this and then you have a window to resolve your other spells.

Lambholt Pacifist also crews heart of Kiran, turns on Rhonas when he's flipped, get's out of grasp of darkness range with 1 gideon emblem, blocks really well against any red aggressive deck, and then also becomes a 6/4 trample with rhonas activation, I've joked that it's the best card in the deck.... but it really is, once its flipped it blocks scrapheap scrounger's profitably and they have to kill it.

Rishkar - Extra mana is always a good thing, and pumping your pacifist/inspector on the first few turns feels good, then theres always the added benefit of them thinking your tapped out for your archangel avacyn, but having 1 mana open to get around censor/hold up a blossoming Defense

Rhonas - Turns any early creature into a trampler to deal with any tokens, and also is a huge threat on turn 3. Sometimes your best option against the aetherworks marvel decks is to go aggro as hell, and Rhonas will do that, Thraben Inspector into Lamhbholt pacifist, into Rhonas, Rhonas pumps the pacifist, your swinging 11 on turn 4, Also one of your best cards against Ishkanah, the tokens dont mean anything if you can get through the last few points of damage anyway. Drawing multiples sucks, but the first one ensures that you aren't going to get Fumigated out of the game, and they have to worry about any creature you have post fumigate/board wipe. turn 5 you wiped my board and stabilized at 4 ? ok, untap lambholt pacifist, pump it, swing 5. I've been pretty impressed with him, and extremely underwhelmed anytime i've played Nissa, she's just not good right now, and all the gw decks that play her are making HUGE concessions for her, oath of nissa to make sure they hit double green into double white, and her tokens dont help your bad matchups, oh my 0/1 plant just died to grim flayer.

Avacyn/Gideon/Heart of Kiran - Come on, do i really need to tell you what they do?

Glorybound initiate - This might be the one that most people just dont have, but like i said getting under essence scatter/censor is huge, and this card provides a clock, while also being able to crew heart of kiran, it also has a huge benefit of gaining you extra life when you really need it, as soon as i see walking ballista its the first card that get's cut, but in the main deck is provides early aggression, plays around censor on turn 3 to crew your heart of kiran, and is a solid beater. It does all the things that you want sylvan advocate to do, without having to wait till turn 6. including huge life point swings, Attack exert, pump with Rhonas twice, gain 8 life is a big deal, risky, but the card provides options.

I could literally go into just a long a rant about the cards that I'm not playing, and my sideboard, but I think ill stop now, since no one reads these things anyway lol

 

[kirblar]

Being able to get Memory off of a Gearhulk EoT is absolutely ridiculous. They close one loophole and just open another.

 

[GregLombardi]

Being able to get Memory off of a Gearhulk EoT is absolutely ridiculous. They close one loophole and just open another.

Before any of the current bannings I felt gearhulk should have been banned. But...6 mana, you would think that people shouldn't be able to get there fast enough. I'm not actually sure anymore.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

Being able to get Memory off of a Gearhulk EoT is absolutely ridiculous. They close one loophole and just open another.

Is it a new loophole? Or have we not had instant/sorcery splits before? I honestly can't remember.

I will say that that hitting Memory off of Geahulk felt like cheating when I did it in the beta. Even better because I did it to stop a Stitchwing that my opponent had pitched an Amalgam to.

 

[kirblar]

Is it a new loophole? Or have we not had instant/sorcery splits before? I honestly can't remember.

I will say that that hitting Memory off of Geahulk felt like cheating when I did it in the beta. Even better because I did it to stop a Stitchwing that my opponent had pitched an Amalgam to.

We just haven't had instant/sorcery splits before.

The split card rules are still really broken and dumb.

 

[charlequin]

hey guys remember when all the aftermath cards were terrible and no one would play them in constructed

good times

It qualifies at a cursory glance. It's missing almost all of the mysticism that is associated with it, the mummies and sphinxes hardly even qualify.

It has ceremonial holy objects, cards concepted to show the integration of religion with life (one two), even showcasing spiritual faith in colors that usually don't show that off, it has a story beat centered on belief ( one two), it has a story-central element of oracular prophecy (one two three), and it showcases the traditional path of the dead, up to and including the heart-eating crocodile.

It's missing the cradle of civilization feeling, for obvious story reasons.

It's literally a fertile valley in the middle of a vast desert where nothing can live.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

It's strong but I don't consider it too dominant or format warping. At the top of their popularity both infect and affinity had a bigger meta share but Wizards didn't take action against them. The deck can also be easily interacted with. I foresee more problems with Eldrazi and Ballista since they are all bullshit cards that hard to interact with. Easiest thing to do is to counter them but Cavern blocks that.

Condemn is playable that's a tad format warping.

 

[Santiako]

Idk, any deck with a white sideboard shits on it, rest in peice makes goyf, traverse & Grim Flayer useless, path+condemn ends DS easily. Hell last week at my lgs modern night I brought jeskai flash and easily beat 2 death's shadow decks. I agree 100% it is a strong deck, just not too strong

It's strong but I don't consider it too dominant or format warping. At the top of their popularity both infect and affinity had a bigger meta share but Wizards didn't take action against them. The deck can also be easily interacted with. I foresee more problems with Eldrazi and Ballista since they are all bullshit cards that hard to interact with. Easiest thing to do is to counter them but Cavern blocks that.

Well, yeah, it's not unbeatable. Even Eldrazi in the Eldrazi Winter was beatable, but the deck is definitely warping the format around it (People are maindecking relics and condemn for example) and it's far and away the best deck. I think it would be probably fine in the long run but going by previous behaviours I think it'll eat a ban before the end of the summer (probably street wraith or shadow itself).

I think the next standard season will be dominated by Blue control decks, which has always been a fear of mine. Early testing says everyone is trying their best to make control viable, and Commit // Memory will be the card to do it.

To be fair, isn't this true at the release of every set? People will try their hardest to make U/X control viable. Not saying it won't be good, mind you.

hey guys remember when all the aftermath cards were terrible and no one would play them in constructed

good times

I've said from the beginning that people were really underestimating them. Cut // Ribbons specially, that cards will be very frustrating to play against. Having that inevitability in the graveyard for free is going to make stalemates go away fast.