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[Angry Grimace]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";128919860]His and Her Planeswalkers

So I spent most of the weekend making proxies and testing Khans spoilers in various Superfriends decks with my girlfriend and her brother-in-law. Here's what I think the two best decks we came up with were:


Abzan Amigos Fantastico

Creatures(17):

• 4 Elvish Mystic
• 4 Sylvan Caryatid
• 4 Courser of Kruphix
• 3 Brimaz, King of Oreskos
• 2 Genesis Hydra

Planeswalkers(10):

• 2 Sorin, Solemn Visitor
• 2 Ajani, Mentor of Heroes
• 3 Nissa Worldwaker
• 3 Elspeth Sun's Champion

Spells(9):

• 3 Thoughtseize
• 4 Banishing Light
• 2 Hero's Downfall

Land(24):

• 1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
• 2 Mana Confluence
• 4 Windswept Heath
• 3 Temple of Plenty
• 1 Temple of Silence
• 4 Llanowar Wastes
• 4 Caves of Koilos
• 4 Forest
• 1 Plains

My deck is more about using disruption and removal to establish a more oppressive board state. Being able toe Genesis Hydra into Elspeth or Banishing Light is huge. Thoughtseize and Hero's Downfall are concessions to cards that the GW base are weak to, like sweepers and Stormbreath Dragon.

Sorin and Ajani are performing at a much higher level than I was expecting, and they turn the early dorks into real pressure. Ajani often felt like the best card in my deck when I could protect it, and Sorin pulled me out of a lot of seemingly unwinnable situations my turning moderate creatures like Nissa lands into massive life swings.

As for cards I tested that didn't make it, Not being able to cast Utter End turn two on the draw off a Mystic really hurts since the faster ramp decks can hit cards like stormbreath or nissa on turn three. Garruk was fun, but he was just worse than an extra Elspeth and having a hard cap of six on Genesis Hydra is just much safer.

Lastly, it only happens in about 1/20 games, but turn two Brimaz off a Mana Confluence is just huge. The only card in the format that can stop this play without Elvish Mystic is Chained to the Rocks, which will probably see less play without Shocks.



G/R Rush Walkers:

Creatures(24):

• 4 Elvish Mystic
• 4 Sylvan Caryatid
• 4 Generator Servant
• 4 Courser of Kruphix
• 1 Nylea, God of the Hunt
• 4 Stormbreath Dragon
• 3 Genesis Hydra

Planeswalkers(10):

• 4x Xenagos the Reveler
• 4x Nissa Worldwaker
• 2x Chandra Pyromaster

Spells(3):

• 3x Crater's Claw

Land(23):

• 4x Temple of Abandon
• 4x Wooded Foothills
• 1x Mana Confluence
• 7 Mountain
• 7 Forest

Her deck was really straighforward but really consistent. All this deck wants to do is drop bombs on turn three, Genesis Hydra to do it again, then close out the game with monstroused Stormbreaths or massive burn from Crater's Claw. It's really fast, surprisingly resilient and just frustrating to deal with. There's nothing like casting an 11/11 genesis Hydra of off Genesis Hydra and grabbing the Nylea to give it Haste and Trample.

As for cards we cut, we tried both Goblin Rabblemaster and Sarkhan the Dragonspeaker. Rabblemaster was insane on turn two and a bit underwhelming everywhere else so we cut it in favor of better bombs. You need to tap out to cast Sarkhan on turn three, so it's too hard to get value off of him early enough to want him. We just kept cutting copies until it ran 0. Honestly, Sarkhan feels like playing Hearthstone.



Couple tips and tricks for the new standard:

• Don't forget that you can bile blight your own Sylvan Caryatids. Killing two of your opponent's or even one when they miss a land drop is huge.
• Instant-speed planeswalker removal is crucial for a lot of decks. By letting Genesis Hydra's cascade resolve then killing the planeswalker in response to the Hydra lets you kill it before they can get their free value. Genesis Hydra is the third best green card after Courser and Elvish Mystic, so be ready to see it everywhere.

[/QUOTE]

I wonder if Anafenza is going to fit into a Abzan deck while Brimaz is still around.

 

[kirblar]

Doesn't really feel good at first glance, tho the insta-discard is neat.

 

[Lucario]

Instant Duress is good.

IM CASTIN IN UR DRAW STEP

holy fuck that card is pushed

 

[kirblar]

holy fuck that card is pushed

It's not, you'd pay 1 mana, 2 mana, and 1 mana, for these abilities normally, but they all have instant (or in the case of raise the alarm, First Strike) tacked on.

 

[Firemind]

Bwahaha, everything can do four damage these days. Brimaz am cry.

Don't like that the second mode can ambush rabblemaster and get value tho.

 

["God's Beard!"]

Bwahaha, everything can do four damage these days. Brimaz am cry.

Don't like that the second mode can ambush rabblemaster and get value tho.

It's not like Brimaz doesn't already die to Banishing Light and Hero's Downfall at the same CMC.

 

[Lucario]

It's not, you'd pay 1 mana, 2 mana, and 1 mana, for these abilities normally, but they all have instant (or in the case of raise the alarm, First Strike) tacked on.

I don't think WoTC would print an instant-speed flame slash at 2 mana these days. Second ability is a Raise the Alarm variant where your tokens survive after killing a rabblemaster.

Third mode is the worst one, but it's still going to be obnoxious to take your opponent's sweeper during their draw step. Seems like a consolation prize against Prognostic Sphinx decks, where the first two modes don't do very much.

None of the modes are good for the restrictive mana cost, but I think the flexibility more than makes up for it.

 

[Hero]

Feels like there should be a card that says whenever you have to choose something you may choose an additional.

Getting two effects out of charms would be a sweet effect. Possibly back breaking with the Command cycle though?

 

[kirblar]

Feels like there should be a card that says whenever you have to choose something you may choose an additional.

Getting two effects out of charms would be a sweet effect. Possibly back breaking with the Command cycle though?

Yeah, kinda breaks the commands.

 

[Angry Grimace]

It's not, you'd pay 1 mana, 2 mana, and 1 mana, for these abilities normally, but they all have instant (or in the case of raise the alarm, First Strike) tacked on.

Instant Duress is really good, though.

Mardu tokens + Sorin + Zurgo = muahahah

 

[ultron87]

Defending/ countering flying is my main concern. Sometimes I won't draw neither the gomazoa nor archetype of imagination and I get fucked.

I'm getting rid of Ephara since I don't need her in the deck. I'm planning on adding 2 lorthos, 1 or 2 Kioras, and maybe 2-3 inkwells. So getting rid/ replacing some creatures is fine. I'm going to get brainstorm too to help me with the draws.

Brainstorm was the first thing I was gonna suggest if there are no card restrictions. I'd probably also consider some sort of back up plan for getting out the big boys in case you can't trigger the Quest. If you're adding green maybe something like Elvish Piper?

 

[SigmasonicX]

Mardu Charm is pretty neat. I like how the second mode is basically to block a morph creature and still keep the warriors. Instant Flame Slash and Duress are also good.

And kirblar, remember that to evaluate charms, you can't just compare each effect to the full mana cost of the charm, but rather you have to look at the versatility; and this card is pretty versatile. Charms generally don't have any effects that would be printed by themselves on cards of the same converted mana cost... except for Boros Charm. I don't think they'd print "deal 4 damage to target player" on an instant even at a cost of RR; it's only allowed to get away with that due to the forced use of white in otherwise red decks.

 

[kirblar]

Mardu Charm is pretty neat. I like how the second mode is basically to block a morph creature and still keep the warriors. Instant Flame Slash and Duress are also good.

And kirblar, remember that to evaluate charms, you can't just compare each effect to the full mana cost of the charm, but rather you have to look at the versatility; and this card is pretty versatile. Charms generally don't have any effects that would be printed by themselves on cards of the same converted mana cost... except for Boros Charm. I don't think they'd print "deal 4 damage to target player" on an instant even at a cost of RR; it's only allowed to get away with that due to the forced use of white in otherwise red decks.

I'm aware, lol.

Grixis Charm was similar and saw next-to-no play. Consider that Thoughtseize/Downfall are in the format.

 

[GamerKingFaiz]

Instant Duress is good.

IM CASTIN IN UR DRAW STEP

Any reason why you would do it in their draw step? Can you cast it right after they draw? What's the difference between casting it in their Upkeep?

 

[v1lla21]

Brainstorm was the first thing I was gonna suggest if there are no card restrictions. I'd probably also consider some sort of back up plan for getting out the big boys in case you can't trigger the Quest. If you're adding green maybe something like Elvish Piper?

That'd be neat. A friend has a couple of them that I could trade him for. I think I'll add in two deadly recluses in there to also help out against flying since I'm taking out the hatchlings.

 

[Hero]

Yeah, kinda breaks the commands.

It's not like the commands see that much play outside of Cryptic though!

Any reason why you would do it in their draw step? Can you cast it right after they draw? What's the difference between casting it in their Upkeep?

Doing so in their draw step you get to see what they drew and you can make them discard it as unless it's an instant they won't be able to cast the spell since it's not a main phase.

 

[GamerKingFaiz]

Doing so in their draw step you get to see what they drew and you can make them discard it as unless it's an instant they won't be able to cast the spell since it's not a main phase.

Interesting, I was under the impression that you could only do it before they draw, not after. Pretty neat!

 

[Exokell]

Interesting, I was under the impression that you could only do it before they draw, not after. Pretty neat!

And more cards to choose from at their draw step, avoiding duress brick.

 

[narcosis219]

Any reason why you would do it in their draw step? Can you cast it right after they draw? What's the difference between casting it in their Upkeep?

In addition to the previous explanations, the key thing to remember is that you do not have priority during your opponent's main phase until they give it up.

Here's what it looks like

-Draw Phase
-Opponent Draws
-Draw Phase ends, so Opponent has priority to cast a spell, if not, then priority passes to you
-You have priority. If you want to cast, then you may, otherwise you pass priority back to your Opponent.
-Main Phase 1 Starts
-Opponent has priority. You cannot do ANYTHING until your opponent either puts one or more things onto the stack and then passes priority to you, or your opponent chooses to end the Main Phase 1, in which case priority passes over to you.

Lots of players aren't aware that you can't cast an instant in your opponent's main UNLESS your opponent has cast a spell or has declared the end of Main Phase 1.

Soooo, it's really advantageous to take it out of their hand right before Main 1 because if it is a sorcery speed thing, they cannot use it.

 

[GamerKingFaiz]

In addition to the previous explanations, the key thing to remember is that you do not have priority during your opponent's main phase until they give it up.

Here's what it looks like

-Draw Phase
-Opponent Draws
-Draw Phase ends, so Opponent has priority to cast a spell, if not, then priority passes to you
-You have priority. If you want to cast, then you may, otherwise you pass priority back to your Opponent.
-Main Phase 1 Starts
-Opponent has priority. You cannot do ANYTHING until your opponent either puts one or more things onto the stack and then passes priority to you, or your opponent chooses to end the Main Phase 1, in which case priority passes over to you.

Lots of players aren't aware that you can't cast an instant in your opponent's main UNLESS your opponent has cast a spell or has declared the end of Main Phase 1.

Soooo, it's really advantageous to take it out of their hand right before Main 1 because if it is a sorcery speed thing, they cannot use it.

Thanks for clearing it up, I understand priority in Main Phases, but I assumed there wasn't priority in Draw Phase because I've never seen anyone cast spells in draw phase, seems pretty unusual, but I suppose we can expect a rise in that if this card sees standard play!

 

[Angry Grimace]

Thanks for clearing it up, I understand priority in Main Phases, but I assumed there wasn't priority in Draw Phase because I've never seen anyone cast spells in draw phase, seems pretty unusual, but I suppose we can expect a rise in that if this card sees standard play!

The only thing that would prevent Mardu Charm from seeing play is if Mardu is completely non-viable.

The only thing you'd ever want to cast in the draw step is discard. There hasn't really been much instant speed discard available to cast there. I mean, its basically just Vendilion Clique, which isn't really discard, either.

Turtle is flavor-town, but frankly, Islandwalk isn't enough to make up the fact that Polukranos is a card.

 

[kirblar]

lol that turtle

 

[SigmasonicX]

Rakshasa Deathdealer is boring but could be pretty powerful. Meandering Towershell is wut, but that's an interesting ability. I'm also pretty surprised to see islandwalk, and a turtle in green. Also, why does that have a Sultai watermark?

 

[ultron87]

Brb. Gotta go build GW TurtleWrath.

 

[Haly]

The turtle needed some kind of ETB effect, this is just silly.

 

[Lucario]

Slaking Turtle <3

 

[SigmasonicX]

Also, why does that have a Sultai watermark?

Just realized, there could be Sultai cards that look at how many cards you have exiled or some such.

 

[kirblar]

Creative reason- the turtles are very mideast.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Tarkir cats ain't got shit on Fleecemane Lion.

 

[Sinatar]

Turtle should have some kind of etb effect, then it'd be pretty rad.

 

[ultron87]

It should probably just have hexproof, due to a shell or whatever. It could be the Green Aetherling.

Also, Temur Ascendancy.

 

[OnPoint]

Feels like there should be a card that says whenever you have to choose something you may choose an additional.

Getting two effects out of charms would be a sweet effect. Possibly back breaking with the Command cycle though?

I dunno, I mean, it could be an enchantment that costs a lot of mana to cast or casts mana to activate that does that. It probably does break the Commands, but hell why not?

Here's two ideas for it:

Entwine Enchantment 3G

Enchantment

Whenever you cast an instant or sorcery where you
must choose one ability, you may pay 3. If you do,
you may choose a second ability to add to the stack

Or

Second Choice 5G

Enchantment

Whenever you cast an instant or sorcery where you
must choose one ability, you may choose a second
ability to add to the stack.

 

[ultron87]

It'd probably be simplest rules wise to have it be something like "... copy that spell, select a different mode and cast the copy."

 

[OnPoint]

I considered that wording. Whatever works, I mean, they're made up cards. I don't think it's something they wouldn't do ever, they'd probably just cost it high, I guess is my point, ultimately.

 

[Angry Grimace]

I dunno, I mean, it could be an enchantment that costs a lot of mana to cast or casts mana to activate that does that. It probably does break the Commands, but hell why not?

Here's two ideas for it:



Or

Those aren't really in green's part of the color pie. Its a red or blue effect (Pyromancer's Ascension, Fork, etc.) and usually its just better and cleaner to let you copy the spell in its entirety.

 

[acheron_xl]

Yeah, that would be red/blue or an artifact. Personally I'd template it like this: "All spells you cast that say 'choose one' instead say 'choose two'" Simple and to the point.

 

[Firemind]

Putrid Leech at rare? And it's worse? oh come on

 

[Lucario]

Choose one —
• Target creature you control gets +1/+1 until end of turn. That creature fights target creature you don't control.
• Counter target spell unless its controller pays 3.
• Creatures with power 3 or less can't block this turn.

 

[Firemind]

Wish it had another useful mode than three mana leak, but not bad I guess. Could find a place in RUG Chord.

 

[kirblar]

This one is really good because the modes are so crazy different and all 3 are super-swingy.

 

[bigkrev]

._.

Temur Charm is insane

 

[divisionbyzorro]

Temur Charm is very good. So far I'm a fan of what all of these charms are doing.

 

[manipulate]

Both those charms look very good.

Edit: I like how the 'fight' thing is getting more prevalent as weird green pseudo-removal, but I'm not sure if targeted removal in green is a good thing overall.

 

[The Technomancer]

The turtle is awesome, but the exile is a bit weird. Couldn't it be:
"Whenever you attack with Turtle, remove it from combat. If you do, at the beginning of your next declare attackers step tap it and its attacking"?

 

[kirblar]

Both those charms look very good.

Edit: I like how the 'fight' thing is getting more prevalent as weird green pseudo-removal, but I'm not sure if targeted removal in green is a good thing overall.

Yeah, I also don't know if it's actually healthy.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

Both those charms look very good.

Edit: I like how the 'fight' thing is getting more prevalent as weird green pseudo-removal, but I'm not sure if targeted removal in green is a good thing overall.

Isn't this basically the best version of it they've printed so far? Outside of limited, nobody plays spells that do nothing but fight creatures. This is probably the first one that gets played.

 

[keeblerdrow]

Setessan Tactics sees some play.

 

[OnPoint]

Yeah, that would be red/blue or an artifact. Personally I'd template it like this: "All spells you cast that say 'choose one' instead say 'choose two'" Simple and to the point.

I was going off of Entwine being on green cards way back when, but an artifact probably makes more sense.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

Setessan Tactics sees some play.

Oh good point. I forgot about that guy. It goes to show just how far they have to push a fight card in order to make it playable.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Deflecting Palm, a.k.a. "Talk to the Hand."

WR

Instant

The next time a source of your choice would deal damage to you this turn, prevent that damage.
If damage is prevented this way, Deflecting Palm deals that much damage to that source's controller.