Chord is fine though, I don't have an issue with tutor effects, especially ones that require you to overextend your board to max out w/.
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Magic: the Gathering - Shadows over Innistrad |OT| Blue's Clues
- Thread starter SigmasonicX
- Start date
- Status
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
[QUOTE="God's Beard!";202376575]I know I shouldn't be surprised at the calibur of player in cockatrice any more, but I've made three rooms titled "2/3 competitive" now and I've gotten 3 rage quits in the first game in a row.
Why even play on a testing platform if you're going to have so much emotional investment in games that mean absolutely nothing?[/QUOTE]
Its not any different in MTGO's free rooms. If you play a game for free people will quit if they won't win. Hell, I wouldn't play Lantern on purpose.
Why even play on a testing platform if you're going to have so much emotional investment in games that mean absolutely nothing?[/QUOTE]
Its not any different in MTGO's free rooms. If you play a game for free people will quit if they won't win. Hell, I wouldn't play Lantern on purpose.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
I don't think so either but if you consider Melira a problem then I'd argue chord is the actual problem there.
So, the big, big problem Modern's had as a format post-PT Philly is that the huge prevalence of infinite loop effects to end/virtually win games was not healthy.
Pod/Abzan and Twin were two sides of a coin - part of the reason Twin was so good was that it could go over the top of infinite life. Karn and Infect were buffed because of this, it allowed decks to make an end run around it, while decks like Zoo were hurt.
Now, with Twin banned, you're left w/ the Melira shell as the last obnoxious infinite life/damage generator, but it's a lot harder to hit than Twin because of the splash buff to Infect. This isn't really a new problem, but it's kind of the last nagging issue from my big ban list a few years ago (along with SSG, which should get itself banned eventually.)
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Wait let me redact viscera seer is the problem in Abzan if there is one.
I hope they don't ban anything too integral to the deck to make it unplayable. It's just too consistent IMO, if there's a problem to be fixed.
I kind of agree with this. The free sac outlet + scrying sets up a lot of situations that would be otherwise improbable. If we're going to ban something, let's ban this.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Maybe we should just list cards that aren't problematic. I'll start
Plains
Squee, Goblin Nabob
Juggernaut
Plains
Squee, Goblin Nabob
Juggernaut
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
For some reason I had to think of Norin the Wary, the annoying little bugger.
Yeah it makes it so even after expending all your resources to finish the infinite life combo that you'll just find the finisher immediately.
"God's Beard!"
Member
I see a lot of decklists with 2 copies of Mindwrack Demon in them. People who are afraid of the trigger probably don't realize that the best way to stifle it is to play a second demon. A lot of games I have to consider whether I want to play a turn 3 Mindwrack, but if I have two in hand it's a no-brainer.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
I played against a soul sisters deck splashing red for norin and Purphuros, those Champions of Parish got huge.
Good thing Zoo won actual, real life tournaments in that period then.
GP Porto Alegre: Naya Zoo takes 1st, 16 copies of Wild Nacatl in the Top 4
SCG Modern Open Dallas: Atarka Zoo takes 1st, Naya Zoo 3rd
Zoo or other decks sporting Nacatl were always relatively reasonable choices post-Fate and pre-Eldrazi Winter. You're misrepresenting how "playable" the deck, and especially Wild Nacatl, were in that period in addition to how dynamic that period was for deck variety in high level play. If you were a big spike you'd probably be on decks like Amulet Bloom, Twin, Affinity, Infect, or Jund but that doesn't mean that Zoo and/or Nacatl weren't relatively reasonable choices. That was especially true depending on the meta of the moment, which did shift frequently in that period.
Grand total of 0 appearances in an American, Asian, and European Grand Prix top 8 that year. Brazil has a lot of issues that are going to warp the attendance relative to other areas.
One SCG event and a GP in Brazil do not a good decision make. If you were playing the deck, you were making a mistake. This is not a "metagame" thing, this is a "lower than expected player quality" thing.
One SCG event and a GP in Brazil do not a good decision make. If you were playing the deck, you were making a mistake. This is not a "metagame" thing, this is a "lower than expected player quality" thing.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Sometimes you just get the Ojutai/Always Watching combo out and win instantly. Surprisingly I've been doing pretty well with this against the Pro Tour adjusted meta. Negate is just too good against a bunch of these decks and nobody is playing sweepers that kill either Ojutai under an AW or Archangel of Tithes at all.
Maybe I should board 4 Negates lol
Deck: UW Always Watching
//Lands
4 Island
12 Plains
4 Port Town
4 Prairie Stream
//Spells
4 Always Watching
4 Declaration in Stone
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Stasis Snare
//Creatures
2 Archangel Avacyn
4 Archangel of Tithes
4 Dragonlord Ojutai
2 Hidden Dragonslayer
4 Knight of the White Orchid
4 Reflector Mage
3 Stratus Dancer
//Sideboard
3 Dispel
3 Negate
3 Invasive Surgery
2 Angelic Purge
2 Silkwrap
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
1 Planar Outburst
Display deck statistics
Maybe I should board 4 Negates lol
Deck: UW Always Watching
//Lands
4 Island
12 Plains
4 Port Town
4 Prairie Stream
//Spells
4 Always Watching
4 Declaration in Stone
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Stasis Snare
//Creatures
2 Archangel Avacyn
4 Archangel of Tithes
4 Dragonlord Ojutai
2 Hidden Dragonslayer
4 Knight of the White Orchid
4 Reflector Mage
3 Stratus Dancer
//Sideboard
3 Dispel
3 Negate
3 Invasive Surgery
2 Angelic Purge
2 Silkwrap
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
1 Planar Outburst
Display deck statistics"God's Beard!"
Member
One of the reasons I don't play Sultai over Bg is because I love playing 4 Blighted Fen so much.
keeblerdrow
Member
Sometimes you just get the Ojutai/Always Watching combo out and win instantly. Surprisingly I've been doing pretty well with this against the Pro Tour adjusted meta. Negate is just too good against a bunch of these decks and nobody is playing sweepers that kill either Ojutai under an AW or Archangel of Tithes at all.
Maybe I should board 4 Negates lol
Deck: UW Always Watching
//Lands
4 Island
12 Plains
4 Port Town
4 Prairie Stream
//Spells
4 Always Watching
4 Declaration in Stone
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Stasis Snare
//Creatures
2 Archangel Avacyn
4 Archangel of Tithes
4 Dragonlord Ojutai
2 Hidden Dragonslayer
4 Knight of the White Orchid
4 Reflector Mage
3 Stratus Dancer
//Sideboard
3 Dispel
3 Negate
3 Invasive Surgery
2 Angelic Purge
2 Silkwrap
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
1 Planar Outburst
That decklist is screaming to me for some Eldrazi Displacers.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Then I'd have to play something other than 4 Islands, 8 duals and a pile of Plains
[QUOTE="God's Beard!";202446377]One of the reasons I don't play Sultai over Bg is because I love playing 4 Blighted Fen so much.[/QUOTE]
My experience is that pretty rare that Ojutai is literally the only guy on board because he happens to draw you more guys on his own.
pelicansurf
Needs a Holiday on Gallifrey
I wasn't following GP Toronto, so I thought I had made a super sweet discovery with BW Control/Tokens..
Then I see two of those decks in Top 8.
Goddammit.
Here is my final list:
BW Control.dec, Built with Decked Builder
http://decks.deckedbuilder.com/d/193613
Have to focus on getting the few pieces I'm missing.
Then I see two of those decks in Top 8.
Goddammit.
I adjusted the deck list sort of for this reason, since yeah, I can only imagine that whoever sticks the first planeswalker wins. Obviously, if it's the mirror, whoever has the Secure the Wastes/Westvale combo and no Anguished Unmaking to kill it is heavily favored. In overall terms, I imagine super clunky and slow.
Yeah, I brought in an extra Anguished unmaking, I have ultimate price, I have 3x declaration, Ruinous Path, and 2x Ob Nixilis. My sideboard is super toolkit-y, so I can adjust what kind of removal I can play on the fly.
Here is my final list:
BW Control.dec, Built with Decked Builder
http://decks.deckedbuilder.com/d/193613
Have to focus on getting the few pieces I'm missing.
I believe I posted a list that was BW Control/Tokens in here before Shadows even dropped. Glad it's an actual archetype!
charlequin
Banned
I guess we still have 18 days left before we're as late as the KTK announcement, but I still really thought they would've announced Kaladesh by now.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Seems like announcements have been coming a lot closer to release these days. The problem is partially that they have a totally loaded release schedule already with EMA, CN2 and EDM already announced.
The interesting thing is that EMA seems like a weird blow-off to me. I'm not really sure how not having any GPs to support this is gonna help. I guess it just tells me that GPs must not make very much money if its not worth it to just change the format of a freakin' GP to something that would probably draw huge crowds like the MM2 and MM1 ones did.
That's amazing tech. Doesn't even die to Avacyn.
Well, technically it did Top 8 GP Omaha in 2015 that was just a couple weeks before the Fate bannings came down though so it's not within the period we're discussing.
Let's just toss out a few results from the very few sizable Modern events we get. Obviously those don't count.
So, you're arguing that it was just a coincidence that Nacatl won, and additionally placed well, at those two large tournaments on the same weekend? Several decks utilizing an unplayable card managed to spike two tournaments, each with several hundred players, on the same weekend and it wasn't as a result of a unique shift in the meta? Remembering the details of a meta going into a weekend that long ago make it pretty hard to argue for the meta but the number of decks in the Top 8 at both tournaments would, at least to me, seem to indicate something more than just a coincidental spike for Nacatl decks.
I'm not saying the deck was great or even one of the top 6-7 decks I would have chosen on any given weekend, especially with broken garbage like Amulet Bloom out there, but the earlier assessment of Wild Nacatl remains pretty hyperbolic in comparison to it's relative playability within the time frame. It was hardly only occasionally going "5-0 on MTGO" or whatever but I don't think we're going to reconcile our differences of opinion here.
I'll continue to maintain that Nacatl wasn't terrible/unplayable and the period in question had a good diversity with a healthy amount of push-pull between several archetypes that allowed even Tier 1.5-2 decks like Elves, Merfolk, Death and Taxes, Bogles, Ad Nauseum, and Lantern Control to Top 8 the few Modern GPs we had.
/shrug
It was trash.
Just because it does well at a lower level event (and I consider that Brazil event and SCG open as such) does not mean it's a good, well-positioned deck in a competitive tournament.
These tournaments are outliers, it's 1 GP in a region with severe issues, and a non-main event Modern tournament.
Just because it does well at a lower level event (and I consider that Brazil event and SCG open as such) does not mean it's a good, well-positioned deck in a competitive tournament.
These tournaments are outliers, it's 1 GP in a region with severe issues, and a non-main event Modern tournament.
New Storm Scale article by MaRo, this time about Ravnica and Return to Ravnica. I love these kind of articles.
A but surprised at some of the rankings, like cypher.
A but surprised at some of the rankings, like cypher.
Thoughts on Kaladesh:
It's obviously an artifact plane, but the flavor is a bit different than Mirrodin or Esper. Mages are few and far-between and most people lead lives reliant on technology. From a limited perspective, I think Red will be the pivot color. That is, the two major themes will be artificers and mages; Artificers focused in Jeskai colors and Mages in Jund. Whatever the "E" mechanic is, I've got to imagine it's equipment-adjacent, since it was originally in Mirrodin, where equipment premiered.
It's obviously an artifact plane, but the flavor is a bit different than Mirrodin or Esper. Mages are few and far-between and most people lead lives reliant on technology. From a limited perspective, I think Red will be the pivot color. That is, the two major themes will be artificers and mages; Artificers focused in Jeskai colors and Mages in Jund. Whatever the "E" mechanic is, I've got to imagine it's equipment-adjacent, since it was originally in Mirrodin, where equipment premiered.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
people liked cypher? People audibly groaned at the Dragon's Maze prerelease when they got a Dimir pack,
myself included
SigmasonicX
Member
You see people asking for more cipher cards often on Blogatog, and people were very positive when it was first unveiled. Even after more cards were shown, the main comment was that it would be better if it wasn't overcosted, not necessarily that the mechanic itself was bad. Though really, there's not much design space for an effect that matters on your turn only both before and after combat, even if you do go into other colors.
Anyway, my comments on the article:
* Surprised that detain did so well, especially since it seems more like giving a word to something they already do all the time but without a marker to show that it's happening (like tapping the creature or putting an aura on it).
* For scavenge, a big issue is that when the creatures are actually on the battlefield, they tend to be extremely dull and/or weak. Combined with the high cost for scavenging, there was little appealing about the RTR cards. I think the mechanic would work out better if they spiced it up next time.
* I was surprised that graft got such a bad rating. I mean, sure, I often forget it exists and I think the mechanic is weird to have on more than a few cards, but I was expecting more like... a 6, I suppose.
charlequin
Banned
Detain is a well-concepted tempo-control mechanic, it's just strong and plays to spikey blue-white players' favorite way to play (see also: Reflector Mage.) Graft is a feel-bad because you can only use it when another creature enters play so it's awkward a lot of the time.
divisionbyzorro
Member
Graft is also miserable on MTGO.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
People didn't like overload? I really liked it.
Graft is MISERABLE on MTGO. I can't count the times I have accidentally put a counter on an opponents creature.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
That's only one card, one every blue player plays.
I'm also boros and radiance was good awful. Battalion was serviceable but I can count on 1 hand how often I triggered it.
Mizzium Mortars, Vandalblast and obviously Cyclonic Rift are all great and heavily played in EDH.
And the new Mizzix's Mastery is just plain broken.
Radiance is meh. Can give bonuses to your opponent's creatures if you're not careful.
Battalion is much more Boros' speed.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Detain could 100% become evergreen if they ever needed to in the future, although I don't suspect they will
I am genuinely shocked that Graft scored that low. It remains one of my all time favorite mechanics from Ravnica and that era of Magic in general
I am genuinely shocked that Graft scored that low. It remains one of my all time favorite mechanics from Ravnica and that era of Magic in general
Joe Molotov
Member
Awesome blue creature, thanks RoboRosewater!
Infinite Stars
Member
I'm not surprised that Convoke/Populate are high up, because both are actually really good as mechanics. I do agree with Maro's statement about Populate needing more Tokens, but Selesyna has arguably the best(balance and possibility wise) mechanics from all sets it's in(Simic is probably a close second, considering graft is kind of confusing.)
A Serious Man
Member
Displacer/Brood Monitor is going to be the bane of standard. East West Bowl basically just jammed it into the Aristocrats shell and put 3 people into the top 25 of GP Toronto with it. Once someone refines the deck things could get ugly.
Infinite Stars
Member
Brood Monitor is a bad card for what it is. The better option is Vile Redeemer. Chump attack, go Redeemer with 3 Creatures having died, go infinite with whatever means you want.
A Serious Man
Member
Redeemer's trigger is on cast.
charlequin
Banned
Oddly enough, this exact mechanic has never been printed on a creature (every example has some other funky cost or something associated with it.) The closest it gets is Forced Adaptation.
Lazy vs Crazy
Member
Juggernaut used to be banned. Or is that the joke?
Infinite Stars
Member
Welp, missed that. Still don't think that Brood Monitor is where the deck wants to be, as it's a shitty card by itself that isn't a slam win with just one other piece(See Twin, because Pestermite/Exarch are not good cards by themselves.) Even the worst card in Anafenza Company's combos still gives you sac stuff. The combo needs 6 Mana to work and requires zero interaction from your opponent, and I'm fairly certain that's not likely even in Standard.
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