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Making A Murderer - Netflix 10-part documentary series - S1 now streaming on Netflix

N

Nokterian

Member
Mikey Jr. said:
Episode 4.

This Brendan kid is pissing me off. Just tell the truth you stupid fuck. He has like 8 different stories. You could say he blasted off to the moon after killing her and he would agree.

This whole family is pissing me off. Feels like everyone has an iq of 5 or some shit.
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How can you be mad at someone who has a very low iq and doesn't even know what the truth is and being in custody without a lawyer or even his mom and being questioned by 2 highly intelligent and trained agents? I feel bad for brendan because he is just the most simple kid in the world. He doesn't know what is right or wrong don't blame him.

Go watch it further before saying stuff like that doesn't make any sense. Saying the whole family pisses you off is not a fair argument. It is even more fucked up that the police of that county has more hate towards that family for no fucking reason and destroying lives instead.
 
D

Dalek

Member
Episode 9 is just the most depressing thing I've ever seen. I feel defeated watching this. Like there's no hope of anything positive. A world where this can happen is just soul crushing.
 
B

Beerman462

Member
Dalek said:
Episode 9 is just the most depressing thing I've ever seen. I feel defeated watching this. Like there's no hope of anything positive. A world where this can happen is just soul crushing.
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The most infuriating part is how invincible the prosecution seems. These fuckers know the law will never touch them.
 
B

BigTastyBurger666

Banned
EthanC said:
Just finished it. It was engrossing and also gross. Felt like they dedicated one episode to a scumbag that was falsely imprisoned by other scumbags, and then spent 9 episodes glorifying a piece of shit murderer. The pretense of his prior false arrest creating a murderer is utter nonsense.
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Even after the Sheriff was recorded in a TV Interview saying if they wanted to get rid of Steven, they'd flat out murder him? And what has come out about the Prosecutor after the trial?

I'm about halfway through the trial at the mo, and I'm still not sure of Avery's guilt or innocence, but there's something seriously seriously wrong with law enforcement in Manitowoc County, certainly enough circumstantial evidence to show a corrupt department from top to bottom.

Also, the Prosecution framing the case based on anyone denigrating the integrity of the police officers involved just smacks so hollow.
 
D

Dalek

Member
I know this is a serious subject, and I'm very upset...But I'm a big fan of this attorney who shows up in the last episode.

graphic-NiriderLauraH_v2015-06-29;092527.jpg
 
L

LaserBuddha

Member
Dalek said:
I know this is a serious subject, and I'm very upset...But I'm a big fan of this attorney who shows up in the last episode.

http://www.law.northwestern.edu/faculty/assets/graphics/graphic-NiriderLauraH_v2015-06-29;092527.jpg[img][/QUOTE]

She can appeal my conviction if you know what I mean.
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I

itsinmyveins

Gets to pilot the crappy patrol labors
AniHawk said:
i think they're the most suspicious ones to be honest. more than the ex-boyfriend or teresa's brother (who just seems like a dull guy out for vengeance).
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Now that's an enticing title of a potential movie thriller.

But yeah, I sort of agree. I don't know. Maybe Avery did it. Maybe not. But the handling of the case and the following trial is oh so scary; seeing it unfold and just pile upon them like an avalanche of incompetence and/or corruption. Harrowing.
 
L

LoserMakesGood

Member
Watching this now. Just started episode 4. My wife has been bawling her eyes out since halfway through episode 3. I don't know what's going to happen, but I know nothing good is coming.
 
scoobs

scoobs

Member
Just finished up the first trial (Steve's) and I thought for sure he was innocent, but after reading all the evidence the show didn't include, its pretty damn clear this fucker is guilty as shit. Him and his nephew, just the scum of the earth. It's also pretty clear the cops were crooked too, but there's zero doubt Steve and his nephew raped and killed this lady.
 
A

AniHawk

Member
scoobs said:
Just finished up the first trial (Steve's) and I thought for sure he was innocent, but after reading all the evidence the show didn't include, its pretty damn clear this fucker is guilty as shit. Him and his nephew, just the scum of the earth. It's also pretty clear the cops were crooked too, but there's zero doubt Steve and his nephew raped and killed this lady.
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i'm thinking maybe steven, but brendan? what's the evidence that puts you behind no reasonable doubt?
 
P

Poker Face

Member
scoobs said:
Just finished up the first trial (Steve's) and I thought for sure he was innocent, but after reading all the evidence the show didn't include, its pretty damn clear this fucker is guilty as shit. Him and his nephew, just the scum of the earth. It's also pretty clear the cops were crooked too, but there's zero doubt Steve and his nephew raped and killed this lady.
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Can you source this please, I'm not sure what you're talking about.
 
I

ilikesanta

Member
Poker Face said:
Can you source this please, I'm not sure what you're talking about.
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There is this one here: But don't read until you finish the show because there are spoilers in the article


I just finished yesterday and it was really good, frustrating, and sad.
I was thinking that they were both innocent, but after reading the article I changed my mind. Even so the cops were doing some shady shit, and Brendan never had a chance. Before hearing the verdicts I figured they were both goign to get the guilty verdicts, but the only thing I really care about was if Brendan's first lawyer got disbarred or some punishment. Fuck that guy and his stupid grinning face.
 
I

ilikesanta

Member
yyzjohn said:
The one part that I couldn't believe wasn't focused on more was the cop calling in the license plate of the Rav4. I believe it was Nov 2nd, before she was reported missing, so why would the cop be calling in the plate unless he's there looking at it.

Edit 2:
The cop had no explanation as to why he called in the plate on November 3rd. He looked very uncomfortable on the stand and only said that he wasn't looking at the plate when he called it in. If, as logic would tell us he actually was looking at the car on November 3rd, it's not "officially" found until November 5th which gave cops ample time to do whatever in the fuck they wanted with it. This whole thing makes me sick.
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I think what happened here is that the cop snuck on Avery's Property at night without a warrant and saw the car. Being there illegally, he couldn't do anything about it, but probably hinted to searchers where to start looking in the auto yard.
 
S

Sane_Man

Member
ilikesanta said:
There is this one here: But don't read until you finish the show because there are spoilers in the article


I just finished yesterday and it was really good, frustrating, and sad.
I was thinking that they were both innocent, but after reading the article I changed my mind. Even so the cops were doing some shady shit, and Brendan never had a chance. Before hearing the verdicts I figured they were both goign to get the guilty verdicts, but the only thing I really care about was if Brendan's first lawyer got disbarred or some punishment. Fuck that guy and his stupid grinning face.
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All the evidence in the article seems to come from Reddit which is not a good source. And I think Reddit got it from one of the corrupt prosecutors in the case, so I definitely wouldn't take any of that as fact. However, if it is indeed true then it doesn't look good.
 
G-Bus

G-Bus

Banned
One thing I caught that I really don't understand and I'm probably just misinterpreting the time line of events, but

when Brendan got off the bus, the bus driver and students on the bus said they saw a women taking pictures of the van. So your telling me in the time Brendan got the mail this women had made it to Stevens trailer, subdued and restrained. Clothes ripped off. what?

This whole show was one big mind fuck. I can see both sides. Why people think he's innocent and has been framed but also those that think he's guilty.
 
Y

yyzjohn

Banned
I read a book about this case. There's some stuff to suggest that Avery was violent towards women that wasn't shown in the doc. They tried to make him out to be a mild mannered guy, but he actually had a violent argument with his girlfriend when he got out. He ended up choking her unconscious and threatening to kill her. It was going to court but then she dropped the charges. So he does have a violent streak, I mean normal guys don't choke their girlfriends unconscious.
 
T

The Beard

Member
ilikesanta said:
I think what happened here is that the cop snuck on Avery's Property at night without a warrant and saw the car. Being there illegally, he couldn't do anything about it, but probably hinted to searchers where to start looking in the auto yard.
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Hmm, interesting. Yeah, I don't buy the "Jesus led me there" bullshit. What time of day did he call it in? I wish there was a timeline of all the events (including things left out of the doc), it would really help to try and understand the case.
 
E

EthanC

Banned
G-Bus said:
One thing I caught that I really don't understand and I'm probably just misinterpreting the time line of events, but

when Brendan got off the bus, the bus driver and students on the bus said they saw a women taking pictures of the van. So your telling me in the time Brendan got the mail this women had made it to Stevens trailer, subdued and restrained. Clothes ripped off. what?

This whole show was one big mind fuck. I can see both sides. Why people think he's innocent and has been framed but also those that think he's guilty.
Click to expand...

Nah man, according to some here you have to be the victims brother to think they're guilty. Hilarious, but true.
 
W

winstano

Member
I'm on episode 7 at the moment. This is such a difficult watch, but an incredible series.

The cards are totally stacked against the defence in every possible way, and it's just heartbreaking to watch the net close on someone despite every hole poked in the prosecution's arguments.

I don't know what to believe at this point with regard to their innocence, but there is absolutely no doubt that a huge amount of shady shit is going on.
 
F

FrenchMovieTheme

Member
yyzjohn said:
I read a book about this case. There's some stuff to suggest that Avery was violent towards women that wasn't shown in the doc. They tried to make him out to be a mild mannered guy, but he actually had a violent argument with his girlfriend when he got out. He ended up choking her unconscious and threatening to kill her. It was going to court but then she dropped the charges. So he does have a violent streak, I mean normal guys don't choke their girlfriends unconscious.
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The cops had to make sure they got him this time!
 
Chaplain

Chaplain

Member
A new article and video about this documentary:

Making a Murderer Filmmakers Respond to Prosecutor's Accusations That They Omitted Key Evidence from Netflix Series

"Ken Kratz is entitled to his own opinion, but he's not entitled to his own facts," filmmaker Laura Ricciardi told The Wrap. "If he'd like to put together a documentary and try to discredit us in some way, he's welcome to do that. We're not going to be pulled into re-litigating the Halbach case with him."

Added filmmaker Moira Demos: "I guess I would ask Kratz what he would trade it for. We tried to choose what we thought was Kratz's strongest evidence pointing toward Steven's guilt, the things he talked about at his press conferences, the things that were really damning toward Steven. That's what we put in. The things I've heard listed as things we've left out seem much less convincing of guilt than Teresa's DNA on a bullet or her remains in his backyard."
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Video: News 3 talks with Steve Avery's attorney, Dean Strang

It seems everyone is talking about the new Netflix series "Making a Murderer." It's the story of Steve Avery's 2007 murder trial. News 3 sat down with one of Avery's attorneys, Dean Strang, to talk about the documentary, the trial and the aftermath.
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Near the end of the video attorney Dean Strang said that Brenden has new attorneys and is in court presently trying to get another trial.
 
E

EthanC

Banned
BronsonLee said:
Why do you keep drawing such a specific line in the sand? That's some passive aggressive ish and there's really no place for that here.
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Good job only seeing what you want to see. I'm not the one who accused someone who didn't disagree with me of "Oh good to see the brother of the victim posting here". Nice selective reading on your part. I have no line in the sand. I watched the "documentary", found it frustrating, read up more on the case and it reinforced my belief that Avery is a fucking piece of shit that almost certainly killed that poor woman.

winstano said:
I'm on episode 7 at the moment. This is such a difficult watch, but an incredible series.

The cards are totally stacked against the defence in every possible way, and it's just heartbreaking to watch the net close on someone despite every hole poked in the prosecution's arguments.

I don't know what to believe at this point with regard to their innocence, but there is absolutely no doubt that a huge amount of shady shit is going on.
Click to expand...

A lot of shady filmmaking going on too. The info they chose to leave out is incredibly telling. But then again they set out to tell a biased version of events, and they did it from start to finish. Kudos to them. Unfortunately for them the internet exists and it's very easy to fill in the blanks.
 
T

Timeaisis

Member
Well, I finished it.

I have no idea if Steven is guilty or innocent but I am sure that some of police and prosecution should be in jail. Their conduct was dishonest and wrong. There's plenty of reasonable doubt in the case, and yet the presumption of innocence was non existent. The original press conference of Kratz giving the details on the Dassey confession is telling as to his motives: not to find the truth, but to convict Avery by any means necessary.

Additionally, the way Brenden was chewed up and spit out in order to help the Avery case is disgusting. His original lawyer was a patsy. The only shred of evidence against him is his own confession, in which he changed his story so many times it is completely unreliable. Seems like Mantowoc has it out for this family.
 
B

BronsonLee

Member
EthanC said:
Good job only seeing what you want to see. I'm not the one who accused someone who didn't disagree with me of "Oh good to see the brother of the victim posting here".
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..You are aware that wasn't me, right?

And complaining about getting blowback isn't a good look. Act like a smartass, get a smartass response. People usually aren't cool with being called conspiracy nuts.

Nice selective reading on your part. I have no line in the sand. I watched the "documentary", found it frustrating, read up more on the case and it reinforced my belief that Avery is a fucking piece of shit that almost certainly killed that poor woman.
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That's what I was referring to about a line in the sand, you know.
 
Y

yyzjohn

Banned
EthanC said:
Good job only seeing what you want to see. I'm not the one who accused someone who didn't disagree with me of "Oh good to see the brother of the victim posting here". Nice selective reading on your part. I have no line in the sand. I watched the "documentary", found it frustrating, read up more on the case and it reinforced my belief that Avery is a fucking piece of shit that almost certainly killed that poor woman.



A lot of shady filmmaking going on too. The info they chose to leave out is incredibly telling. But then again they set out to tell a biased version of events, and they did it from start to finish. Kudos to them. Unfortunately for them the internet exists and it's very easy to fill in the blanks.
Click to expand...


The problem is the case they presented didn't prove he killed her. We're to believe she was shot 7 times in the garage but there was no blood found anywhere even when they dug up the cement. All that shit he had in the garage something would have had blood on it.
The mattresses and carpet in his house too, no blood at all. They didn't even submit the mattress for DNA testing. How was Avery able to clean up the house and garage so effectively, he's not that smart.

I agree he's a shady guy with violent outbursts, but there's no way they proved the case against him here.
 
G-Bus

G-Bus

Banned
I'm not entirely sure how anyone can say with certainty if Avery is guilty or not. No one knows what happened that day and there's just way too many weird things going on.

It's odd that was the last place she's seen.

It's even odder to think that someone fallowed her from Stevens place, shot and burned her body and transported some of the remains into Stevens yard and fire pit.

Why would Steven do such an immaculate job of cleaning everything up in his house only to get sloppy and leave some very obvious blood stains in the vehicle.

Why would he do all that to her in the trailer, move her to the garage, shoot her 11? Times and than move her to the fire. Not to mention took a phone call some time during all this cause you know, just another day.

Why were the remains scattered? This I really don't understand.
 
Y

yyzjohn

Banned
G-Bus said:
I'm not entirely sure how anyone can say with certainty if Avery is guilty or not. No one knows what happened that day and there's just way too many weird things going on.

It's odd that was the last place she's seen.

It's even odder to think that someone fallowed her from Stevens place, shot and burned her body and transported some of the remains into Stevens yard and fire pit.

Why would Steven do such an immaculate job of cleaning everything up in his house only to get sloppy and leave some very obvious blood stains in the vehicle.

Why would he do all that to her in the trailer, move her to the garage, shoot her 11? Times and than move her to the fire. Not to mention took a phone call some time during all this cause you know, just another day.

Why were the remains scattered? This I really don't understand.
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The most damning evidence is the blood in the car, however there were no fingerprints found in that car. So we're to believe he was meticulous in either wearing gloves that would leave no prints, or he wiped down the entire car to remove prints. But he wiped the car for prints and left blood? It doesn't add up.


The bullet and key evidence are not trusted since they searched the bedroom 6 times without finding anything and then miraculously the first time a Manitowoc cop shows up he finds a key. Same for the bullet. Those were planted.


For the bones, they found them in two different spots so they were obviously moved. Also the cops didn't call in experts to collect the bones so they would know exactly what happened, instead they start shoveling and sifting bones into a box without marking where any thing was found. What a cluster fuck of an investigation
 
S

skybald

Member
G-Bus said:
I'm not entirely sure how anyone can say with certainty if Avery is guilty or not. No one knows what happened that day and there's just way too many weird things going on.

It's odd that was the last place she's seen.

It's even odder to think that someone fallowed her from Stevens place, shot and burned her body and transported some of the remains into Stevens yard and fire pit.

Why would Steven do such an immaculate job of cleaning everything up in his house only to get sloppy and leave some very obvious blood stains in the vehicle.

Why would he do all that to her in the trailer, move her to the garage, shoot her 11? Times and than move her to the fire. Not to mention took a phone call some time during all this cause you know, just another day.

Why were the remains scattered? This I really don't understand.
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The thing is, the real question is did the state prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Avery is guilty? I don't think a reasonable person would say they did. They is evidence he did it, but not a coherent story of how he did it, so the jury should have acquitted him.

I would always rather have guilty people walk because they state doesn't have the right evidence as opposed to having innocent people locked up.

I think Avery did it. I do not think the evidence is there to lock him up, though.
 
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