-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Making A Murderer - Netflix 10-part documentary series - S1 now streaming on Netflix
- Thread starter Armadilo
- Start date
Jesus, I just watched eight episodes in a row. No breaks... eight hours in one sitting.
I can hardly believe what I just saw.. Literally the most baffling thing. Some of the most manipulative, corrupt, twisted people i've seen. I have no idea how some people can be like that.. Literally the devil.
I have to say both of Steven's Lawyers were legends though. I really liked those guys.
I can hardly believe what I just saw.. Literally the most baffling thing. Some of the most manipulative, corrupt, twisted people i've seen. I have no idea how some people can be like that.. Literally the devil.
I have to say both of Steven's Lawyers were legends though. I really liked those guys.
It was such a one sided case (in Stevens favor). It boggles my mind he got convicted again. Brendan too, although he had more against him with saying one thing then another all the time. But he was clearly manipulated into it all.
Also the whole time the show went on I had a really odd feeling towards Teresa's Brother. Something really didn't seem right about him..
Also the whole time the show went on I had a really odd feeling towards Teresa's Brother. Something really didn't seem right about him..
Sectorseven
Member
Was there ever any more investigation on Teresa's cell phone mysteries? The caller she was avoiding and who deleted voice mails.
There are some great Frontline documentaries that give more examples of how fallible the justice system can be:
The Confessions
Death by Fire
The Real CSI
ProfessorLobo
Banned
Yeah, but there were a bunch of people that lived in that area. Was there more evidence for Steven for any of them?
Kuro Madoushi
Unconfirmed Member
Kinda makes me sick watching this.
While I understand that this isn't meant to be an objective look at the whole trial, there's pretty clear evidence the investigation was botched.
My thoughts on the Brendan
My thoughts on Avery
Trying to make a case against Avery
Trying to make a case for Avery
Whew!
While I understand that this isn't meant to be an objective look at the whole trial, there's pretty clear evidence the investigation was botched.
My thoughts on the Brendan
Absolutely deplorable the way the confession was procured. An underage below intelligence suspect is grilled with no lawyer present and without his mother's consent should not have been admissible in court. Did he rape her and stab her in the trailer or garage? Why is there no blood? Where is the murder weapon? What is the motive? Some internet rumblings suggested another conversation between Brendan and his mother that claimed Avery molested him and took advantage of his intelligence, but there was nothing official. And if his was there cause, and he was coerced, how can he still be held accountable? I can't believe the interrogators went after him after they got a "confession" from his cousin. I simply can't believe if he's innocent that someone would say something like that. Assuming he is guilty, and he did say those things, it still makes no sense without the blood and doesn't explain the bones found elsewhere.
My thoughts on Avery
Terrible and sloppy investigation from the start. A police department with a reason to frame him is allowed into the crime scene and surprisingly find key evidence after the other dept did not...IN THE SAME PLACE THEY INVESTIGATED SEVERAL TIMES. They very clearly did not have any other suspects in mind, and did not do their job. One thing I don't think he doc mentioned is that two people on the jury had connection to the police too; this would explain the adamant stubborn jurors the excused one talked about. For me, no murder weapon, no blood, weak motive besides "he's a crazy sex deviant", and a suspect "confession" make this pretty absurd.
Trying to make a case against Avery
There is some claim online that Avery had been harassing Teresa; according to an online claim, he called her several times without revealing his number and also exposed himself to her, which made her uncomfortable when he called and she saw the number. This explains why she was uncomfortable according to her coworker. She decides to head over to Avery's anyways to just do the job and Avery sees that she's alone and finally has his chance to get her. This is where things get murky, but this is my best guess. He subdues her, ties her to his bed, and she wakes up and starts screaming. Brendan hears this as he's outside and gets to mail and knocks on the trailer and Avery coerces him to get inside wherein they both rape and and slit her throat. They knock her out and bring the body via her SUV to the garage where they spread something on the floor to catch all the blood and murder her. Brendan has enough and leaves and Avery takes the body to a bonfire behind his trailer, burns the body there, drives the car to the east side of his salvage yard and puts branches on it to hide it to presumably destroy later. He then tells Brendan to come out and watch the body burn and they bury the bones afterwards.
Trying to make a case for Avery
Partly Reddit's theory with a bit of my own...I'm hard pressed to believe the police killed Teresa. Instead, Teresa had some trouble with her ex and he had been calling and harassing her, which explains the conversation she had with her coworker. She told her coworker that she would deal with it and met her ex after her photos at Avery's yard. When she meets her ex afterwards he confronts her about a possible relationship with her roommate and in a jealous rage he kills her with a gun, puts her body into the back of the car, and drives it off somewhere (this doesn't explain why the roommate didn't report her missing though in a lot of cases, it's usually someone close to the victim). The ex also makes sure to "guess" her cellphone password online to remove any incriminating voice messages (I honestly think this is a huge deal). The cop finds the car and her remains and checks it (phone conversation with dispatch). He learns it's the woman who is missing and calls another officer so they can somehow plant this on Avery to make this lawsuit go away. This is where I fall apart; they get a vial of blood and plant the DNA inside the car, burn the body, and stealthily hide the car at Avery's lot. They also proceed to plant the bones behind the trailer (they had plenty of time to do this), plant the key in the bedroom (they had 3 chances to do this), and plant the bullet in the garage (they were there several times). Since there is tension within Avery's family, they are able to get a confession from Brandon's cousin and also manipulate Brandon himself to confess (honesty, I could get him to confess that he was born on Mars...). I won't say there was jury tampering, but possibly a stroke of luck to have people that are connected to the force on the jury as well to make sure it won't ever go to not guilty.
Jinfash
needs 2 extra inches
Can someone list all the evidence, left out by the filmmakers, that would have made Steven's innocence questionable?
The only I saw mentioned in an article was Teresa's negative response to him, which was allegedly relayed to her boss(?) a piece of evidence that can be argued as hearsay.
Furthermore, I'm curious about what people the people who believe he did think about Brendan's involvent.
The only I saw mentioned in an article was Teresa's negative response to him, which was allegedly relayed to her boss(?) a piece of evidence that can be argued as hearsay.
Furthermore, I'm curious about what people the people who believe he did think about Brendan's involvent.
Always-honest
Banned
Is it true that Anonymous claims to have evidence for his innocence?
Kuro Madoushi
Unconfirmed Member
Last I googled, I saw nothing of the sort and it seems a bit of a sham.
Fantastical
Death Prophet
The Twitter account is a mess. Twitter is like the worst way to convey these things. They post some confusing message and then like 4 images without real explanation.
If they have something they need to actually write out an explanation or make a video. I don't think they have much, though.
Always-honest
Banned
http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/tv/making-a-murderer-anonymous-claims-to-have-evidence-that-netflix-documentary-s-subject-steven-avery-a6790546.html
Yeah i don't know. Just something a friend told me and he sent a link
But now i see people saying it was fake. So..
Too bad
gaming_noob
Member
I blasted through this documentary in like 4 days. Loved this and I've been trying to convince my father in law to watch.
ZQQLANDER
Member
That's nice to hear.
I'm not wading into the validity of any if this, but here are the claims I have seen:
- There is her saying he answered the door nearly naked and acted creepy before requesting to never go out there again.
- Him using a different address and specifically requesting her.
- There is him calling her anonymously w *67 several times on the day of the murder and ONE MORE time NOT hiding his caller ID after her suspected time frame of murder.
- Him buying ropes and chain manacles like Brendan described a few days beforehand and claiming they were for him and his GF.
- Lastly, some non-DNA blood under the hood of the vehicle that Brandan supposedly described to them.
Source where I saw this stuff mentioned. Haven't fact checked any of this or the doc.
http://www.pajiba.com/netflix_movie...-evidence-making-a-murderer-didnt-present.php
Filthy Slug
Crowd screaming like hounds at the heat of the chase/ All the colors of the rainbow flood my face
This lady who found the missing car in a massive car lot within ~20 minutes thanks to the holy spirit.
What the fuck.
Oh no, the license plate. This may be the wrong way to start the new year.
What the fuck.
Oh no, the license plate. This may be the wrong way to start the new year.
tiredheadcrab
Member
Finished this last night. Wow that was incredible. I mean Brendan's first defense attorney was way out of line doing that. In Stevens case most people thought he was guilty from the get go. That is an unfair jury right there. The evidence was terrible at best. Doesnt sound like there is any justice here.
I have read my far share of cover ups by people in government (Franklin Scandal) and never really believe any of them but I am just not sure what to make of this trial.
BTW that blood vile was tampered with. No doubt.
I have read my far share of cover ups by people in government (Franklin Scandal) and never really believe any of them but I am just not sure what to make of this trial.
BTW that blood vile was tampered with. No doubt.
BLOODED_hands
Member
Man..... I'm so pissed. This whole thing, urgh!!
I feel soooo bad for Brendan and Kayla. Two teens/kids put on blast ;_;
I feel soooo bad for Brendan and Kayla. Two teens/kids put on blast ;_;
I honestly have no idea what you're talking about.
Androidsleeps
Member
I'm glad I'm not the only one!
I, too, get a strange vibe from her brother, he feels weird and creepy to me.
Edit: Oh yeah that holy spirit lady lol it pains me that this shit is taken seriously in courts around the world.
Might as well say my Shaman guided me.
IISANDERII
Member
Ep.4. That poor kid, holy fuck did they coerce the shit out of him. And he's white! I can't imagine the awful injustices black victims have suffered.
This system is so fucking flawed.
This system is so fucking flawed.
Filthy Slug
Crowd screaming like hounds at the heat of the chase/ All the colors of the rainbow flood my face
I have way more belief and respect for Shamans than that fucking holy spirit infused lady/goon.
And now I'm up to the dopey forensic "expert" who contaminated her own findings. It's like a fucking snowball of stupidity at this point.
BronsonLee
Member
What isn't right about Teresa's brother is that his sister just died and he's the spokesperson for the family in a highly publicized murder case.
He's not going to believe Steven or Brendan. He has literally zero reason to. To him, the system worked.
He's not going to believe Steven or Brendan. He has literally zero reason to. To him, the system worked.
Steven's lawyers are really the best. So bright-and they seem to really care about the boys. It must be so frustrating to be that capable and see through all the bullshit in the system, and be fighting it everyday.
Edit: I'm on episode 4 when the defense opens the evidence from the 1985 cases and finds
I mean-fuck you! Seriously! What more do you want?
Edit: I'm on episode 4 when the defense opens the evidence from the 1985 cases and finds
the tampered blood vial
I mean-fuck you! Seriously! What more do you want?
In all fairness, the car was in the top corner of the lot. If she started searching along the top row (as indicated in the photo in court), then it's only natural that she would go to the cars along that little roadway next. I would be much more suspicious if the car was randomly in the middle of the lot, and she just walked right over to it. The Holy Spirit stuff is still bullshit, though.
On top of that he would have been getting direction from the prosecution. Generally they want to create a unified front for the media. Having the brother just sound off on whatever would have been counter-productive. He only seems creepy to us because we are seeing this whole thing through the perspective of the defense.
BronsonLee
Member
Exactly. The Halbach family didn't exactly have the benefit of hindsight, or the wealth of information/video footage all wrapped up in a bow. I'd also have to guess it was probably the most emotionally destructive/nerve wracking time in their lives. Nobody really prepares you for a scenario like this when you're growing up.
Deleted voicemails, tampered blood vial, missing license plates being reported by the police prior to knowing what vehicle they were looking for, evidence miraculously appearing in areas previously searched and only by people that shouldn't have been there in the first place, only the searchers going to Avery's being given a camera, missing sign ins at a crime scene, conflicting arrival times, missing reports, coerced confessions, botched DNA sampling yet still being used in court, witnesses admitting they lied, defence lawyers working with prosecutors.... Holy fuck, what a circus.
And the worst part of all of this, is
And the worst part of all of this, is
we still haven't fucking clue who did it or what happened.
Lactose_Intolerant
Member
Brother in Law being a shit probably means he did it. Dude is an asshat.
That's probably the kind of reasoning that
led the jurors to condemn Avery
Lactose_Intolerant
Member
Well, he also lied about multiple things. Went hunting with a gun that was the same caliber then tried to sell it later. Was on the property at the time of the killing.
You can't be serious. Far more of a suspect? There couldn't possibly be a bigger suspect than the man that was assumed to see her last, has her car with his blood/sweat inside of it parked on his property, with her burnt bones and burnt cell phone 20ft from his door.
I'm not saying Avery did it, but he was the ultimate suspect. Whether or not that was all by design, we'll probably never know, but there is no bigger suspect.
And what motive would Avery have had to do this, again? And in the midst of this horrific act he commuted he calmly took a 20ish minute long call from his girlfriend?
I don't have the answers here, I'm just saying there is no bigger suspect than Avery. Unless there was a witness seeing somebody with her after she left Avery's property, there couldn't possibly be a bigger suspect than Avery.
Murder investigation 101
Where was the victim last seen alive?
Who was the last person to see her alive?
Where was the body found?
All point to Avery.
Avery basically lived in an isolated bubble, it's not outrageous to think he would be comfortable enough to talk on the phone while Teresa's dead body in the back of her vehicle parked in his garage. It's not like he had roommates that might come home and discover something weird.
it's the car/body stuff and where it was found and how that leads to people having reasonable doubt about him actually being the murderer.
i think cops originally suspected he was the murderer, but there wasn't anything seriously conclusive pointing to him, so there was stuff done to the scene to plant all of the evidence pointing to him. even if avery did kill her, the police fucked up by screwing with the scene of the crime.
I 100% would've voted not guilty based on what the documentary showed. All of the evidence shown in the doc was just way too convenient. Teresa's key that was found in plain sight on the 4th or 5th day of the search, which had none of Teresa's DNA on it, and just so happened to be found by someone who gave a deposition 2 weeks prior concerning Avery's lawsuit against his police department? Please.
finalflame
Banned
Holy shit it's 2:50am and I'm on episode 6. I had never heard of this case before and don't want to look up the outcome because the documentary series is so damn good. I don't think I'll go to sleep tonight/this morning until I'm done. I'm like fucking wired.
Holy shit GAF.
Holy shit GAF.
Why would Avery hide the Rav 4 under 3 planks and leave the license plate on?
After 18 years in jail, he knows how the justice system works. He knew he would be the last one to have an appointment, so he would be a person of interest. Why not crush the Rav 4, and hide the evidence?
This story doesn't make a lost of sense. Someone framed Avery, and the Police wanted to make sure they put him away for good.
After 18 years in jail, he knows how the justice system works. He knew he would be the last one to have an appointment, so he would be a person of interest. Why not crush the Rav 4, and hide the evidence?
This story doesn't make a lost of sense. Someone framed Avery, and the Police wanted to make sure they put him away for good.
Right. And there are like 13 of these "coincidences". It's so fucking shady, man.
Straight from the show:
I'm not reading any other posts yet because I'm only midway through ep3, but I actually can't believe what I'm seeing... Just the first ep is bad enough, sending an innocent man to prison for 18 years, but now
Don't answer the questions, just venting. But holy shit, I can't believe this. When he got the two top lawyers I was getting ready for another upswing, then now this. And this is only the third episode, can't imagine how much deeper the rabbit hole's gonna get.
not only did they plant evidence in the second case, but that kid is involved too? Did they force him to set his uncle up?
finalflame
Banned
I just finished the documentary and I am livid. I am fucking livid. I cannot believe this shit.
I hope this documentary gives the case the exposure it needs to be revisited or somehow appealed. Holy fucking shit.
i am going to be fuming. Such corrupt, sleazy piles of shit in this middle of nowhere fucking Wisconsin town.
I hope this documentary gives the case the exposure it needs to be revisited or somehow appealed. Holy fucking shit.
i am going to be fuming. Such corrupt, sleazy piles of shit in this middle of nowhere fucking Wisconsin town.
Most of the time it is someone the victim knew, mostly it's a significant other or ex, but if we assume that Teresa's bones and her car, complete with Avery's blood and sweat, were not planted, there's really no reason to look anywhere else.
The ex might've had a rock solid alibi for all we know. But investigators are going to start at the last place the victim was seen alive, then they're going to focus on the last known person to see them alive.
If a victim is found in their own home, or in some random place and you have no idea who might've killed them, you start looking at the people he/she knew right off the bat. Not when you know where he/she was last seen alive and who last saw her alive, which happened to be her last customer on his private property.
If I turned up missing, and the police knew the last place I was seen alive was working at your house. They wouldn't start looking at my ex-gf, especially once they find my bones in your backyard.
Similar threads
- Locked