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[BenjaminBirdie]

Ok stop with the wall of spoilers. At least mention the episode number above it

Sorry I just literally couldn't imagine someone stopping at any point in watching this except maybe to sleep. So I assumed every post was by someone who's watched the entire thing.

How could you possibly stop at the end of any of these episodes.

 

[The One and Done™]

Sorry I just literally couldn't imagine someone stopping at any point in watching this except maybe to sleep. So I assumed every post was by someone who's watched the entire thing.

How could you possibly stop at the end of any of these episodes.

Sleep. Life. I'm fine with the wall of spoilers as long as there is an indication of the episode so i know if i can read it or not.

 

[SuperPac]

Lmao

Spoiler

im as infuriated as anyone else having finished the series but does anyone actually fucking believe as grossly incompetent and awful and hardcore framing the cops were, that they actually murdered someone? Holy shit lol

Episode 8

Spoiler

I will admit that the thought crossed my mind briefly, because they were about to be on the hook for a big payout - personally. But really, they just didn't follow any other leads and there was clear misconduct if not planting of some evidence.

The whole thing is really sad. Great documentary series though. I'm wondering how the filmmakers landed on this case - seems they got involved really early.

 

[trilobyte]

Just started ep 5

Spoiler

wtf at the blood vial tampering.

 

[NeonBlack]

Just finished episode 4.

My brain is has a shortage and I'm pretty sure I'm going to pass high blood pressure down to my unborn children.

These cliffhangers are the devil.

 

[KarmaCow]

Sorry I just literally couldn't imagine someone stopping at any point in watching this except maybe to sleep. So I assumed every post was by someone who's watched the entire thing.

How could you possibly stop at the end of any of these episodes.

I just finished episode 3 and this is just hard to watch. It's so intensely personal, seeing the anguish from everyone involved which you know are real people is too much. What's worse is that it's so invasive. I can understand the rationale since it's a documentary but it's hard to look past what feel like exploitive moments for the sake of a shot.

The subject matter is enough on it's own but everything surrounding it is kinda sickening. Not just the typical "reporter" scum looking for a quick sound bite from a bereaved family member barely coping on their own but the deposition tapes just make you want to scream. Voyeuristically listening to Steven Avery

Spoiler

tell his parents he's going to kill himself

, his mother clearly desperate for any help, or

Spoiler

the kid being coached into not only confessing but co-authoring a narrative for a heinous crime

hurts, I had to take breaks.

 

[dork]

On episode 3. The cop on the stand said that key wasn't there, then it was. That's interesting...

Episode 3

Spoiler

no way her throat was slit. Blood would be everywhere

 

[The One and Done™]

The media portrayal here is disgusting

 

[FlyinJ]

How is this thread not moving like crazy. So much to talk about.

 

[José Mourinho]

I don't think this kid Brendon could be less involved if he tried. I don't want to be too disrespectful but you'd swear he hardly knows what day it is. His story changes every time he opens his mouth and even his lawyer's investigator is pushing him to say things he, in my opinion, clearly didn't witness or do.

Edit: How these arsehole investigators, who constantly lead this kid to make statements, sleep at night is beyond me.

 

[Psychological Intellect]

halfway through episode 8

Spoiler

im done

 

[Hazaku]

Probably the only thing in recent years I couldn't binge watch ...

Shit is so infuriating

 

[Mass_Pincup]

I'm on episode 7 and one thing I have to say about this is that the media are completely disgusting, everything to get a headline. Avery was guilty way before the trial for the public.

Spoiler

The state really didn't help either by removing his name before a verdict was found, not to mention the brother of the victim who didn't even watch the confession tape and the shitty lawyer who completely fucked over Brendan

It's just so surreal to me, the length as to which people would disregard common sense is just baffling, he doesn't even have a motive.

Spoiler

And the sheriff who flat out says that it would've been easier to kill then to frame him? That he still thinks that Stevan Avery is guilty of the crime as to which he was found innocent thanks to DNA samples? Incredible.

 

[José Mourinho]

I'm on episode 7 and one thing I have to say about this is that the media are completely disgusting, everything to get a headline. Avery was guilty way before the trial for the public.

Spoiler

The state really didn't help either by removing his name before a verdict was found, not to mention the brother of the victim who didn't even watch the confession tape and the shitty lawyer who completely fucked over Brendan

It's just so surreal to me, the length as to which people would disregard common sense is just baffling, he doesn't even have a motive.

Spoiler

And the sheriff who flat out says that it would've been easier to kill then to frame him? That he still thinks that Stevan Avery is guilty of the crime as to which he was found innocent thanks to DNA samples? Incredible.

The whole thing is staggering.

 

[FrenchMovieTheme]

what the FUCK!

i finished it tonight and

Spoiler

i just can't believe it. how the fuck can they find either of them guilty beyond a reasonable doubt? some of this stuff has already been brought up but

1. why wouldn't he just impound the car? why would he leave it in plain sight?
2. how did the lady who found the car find it in like 10 mins? it's a fucking gigantic lot!
3. how did it take them like 5 visits before they found the key?
4. why did the jury just ignore major inconsistencies with regards to time and so on?
5. the dude with the license plate shit fucking says "oh a 97 rav4" and then says "oh i only said it cause she told me that" then the defense atty plays it back and she never said it. the guy is like idk brah!
6. what is stevens motive? he fucking just got out of jail after 18 years, why would he want to risk going back to jail?
7. no blood found anywhere in the house?
8. pulling some simpsons style bullshit on the DNA testing of the car (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3X3GBrWcoac). first its supposed to take 6 months (beyond the trial end date), then magically its done like the next week?

there are a bunch of other things, those are just off the top of my head and some brought up in the documentary. i shouldn't have finished this before i went to bed because now im just pissed. and all these cops/investigators were assholes

 

[PAULINK]

Episode 6 was kind of a drag, the beginning episodes are pretty stacked, then it just leads to the court. Though so far episode 7 has picked up the tension.

 

[Nyx]

Watched the first two episodes, man.....

What a tragedy so far.

 

[petethepanda]

Why did I start this so late at night on a Sunday? I have to sleep. I work in the morning. Just finished ep3, it's 2:15, next episode is highlighted...

Glad I went in knowing nothing at all about this, haven't even read the show's description (or this thread for that matter).

 

[DEAD RABBIT]

Just finished binge-watching this.

Calling this a miscarriage of justice doesn't do the expression justice. This started as a miscarriage, turned into a forced abortion and ended up with the lady bleeding to death.

What really got to me were Teresa's brother and her ex-boyfriend. I know edited footage can make you feel biased, but there was something really off about those two. Especially the ex, his reactions, half-grinning/gloating during the guessing the voicemail password segment.

 

[JumpJeff84]

Well it's 2:30 and I can't stop watching

 

[Ashodin]

This is really good and I want the case to be reopened or something because of this. This is absolutely heinous on the part of the cops/law in the area, and needs to be righted.

I desperately wish I could do something to find evidence of his innocence, because you could clearly tell the hate was on for Steven.

 

[Dirtyshubb]

I know it might seem unlikely but i really hope that the added exposure to this case brings some further investigations or something because its clear as day that the police have had setting 2 innocent people up.

I mean the ultimate scenario would be that this helps show how corrupt the police force can be, and also how easily they can get away with it. Of course you get people shot every week that shouldn't have been and nothing has really happened about that so the chances of any change is pretty much non existent.

 

[Double H]

Episode 9:

Spoiler

Just wow at Sgt. Andrew Colburn (Mr. Number Plate) being the one to escort both Brendan and Steven out of court after they were found guilty. The guy can't help but parade his self-satisfaction with the verdicts.

 

[Lyonaz]

Oh wow the music is done by the Last of Us guy, Gustavo Santaolalla, watching first episode now.

 

[POWERSPHERE]

Man, this is a heartwrenching watch. Just got up to Episode 3, so not reading anything about it but man, hope it gets more positive...

 

[Always-honest]

Great. Just watched part 1

 

[Koozek]

So, after half of the first episode I wasn't really feeling it because I thought that the biggest twists were already revealed so early. Boy, was I wrong. Gave it a chance again after seeing this thread getting bumped a few times and now I'm hooked at episode 3. Will binge the rest.

 

[Alienous]

Episode 6, 20 minutes in, and I want Steve Jobs to represent me if I'm ever put on trial.

 

[internetwolf]

I finished this last night

...I hate cops


One of the best docuseries I've ever seen. The AV club reviews keep mentioning 'the staircase 'so I'll watch that next.

 

[Anondreas]

Wow, I'm on episode 5 right now. This is unreal.

 

[Justin]

I finished this last night

...I hate cops


One of the best docuseries I've ever seen. The AV club reviews keep mentioning 'the staircase 'so I'll watch that next.

Yes the Staircase is amazing as well as Paradise Lost. Murder on a Sunday Morning is another on I feel not enough people have see. I believe the full thing can be found on YouTube.

 

[internetwolf]

Yes the Staircase is amazing as well as Paradise Lost. Murder on a Sunday Morning is another on I feel not enough people have see. I believe the full thing can be found on YouTube.

phew I'm going to be busy!

Thanks!

 

[Palette Swap]

Bless Netflix. We're watching this with my wife and my mom, and find it absolutely riveting. These people have done an amazing job.
We're halfway through, and regardless of what really happened, this looks like such a huge miscarriage of justice.
For the sake of the argument, is there some sort of rational debunking of some of the defense's points? I'm asking because I have this intuitive disbelief in the face of something so huge.

Oh wow the music is done by the Last of Us guy, Gustavo Santaolalla, watching first episode now.

Damn, when I started watching this yesterday, I thought it sounded like him but completely forgot to check afterwards.

 

[dork]

How the fuck was it allowed for these detectives to interview the minor. This is just like the west Memphis 3 again

 

[Anondreas]

I really need to go to bed. It is so hard to stop watching this though.

 

[dork]

Episode 3. These officers questioning is fucking awful. This kid is just guessing!


This poor kid!! He is so slow...I'm so pissed off right now. And I usually side with the cops. But this is fucked up

 

[LizardKing]

I watch a LOT of crime docs and this is definitely right at the top of the list. It's amazing that there is so much here that it really does fill up the 10 episodes with twists and turns and keeps it drama filled.

Chapter 8

Spoiler

I don't think they should have said they are not suggesting the cops killed her. When you look at the evidence, if you are accepting that Avery was being framed, the most logical conclusion was that the cops killed her or had someone kill her. Two big points that help the prosecution were that Avery's place was her last known location and the fact that Steven did have a large fire that night. For this to be more than a pretty far fetched coincidence, the cops would have had to have this planned from day one. They would have had to have been watching him, took their opportunity when Theresa left the property and watching that he had a fire that night and then came up with the best way to plant the body.

I don't know why this is so large of a leap for people to make, and they are trusting these cops saying they don't think they killed her. Logic should tell you it's the most likely scenario. People aren't trusting the cops here and finding out they are dirty, but still just won't believe a cop could do that. Even despite the fact we see cops murder people on camera on a fairly regular basis. His lawsuit had the potential to destroy them. I wouldn't put it past them to protect themselves no matter the cost. Look at the cop who said "It would be easier just to kill Steve Avery." Seriously, that is the mindset of these people. But obviously he thinks we're stupid, and that we don't realize how it would look when the man suing the corrupt police department for 36 million winds up dead. Better to drag his name through the mud. Not to mention any claims the family could make if Steven did wind up dead.

Edit: And obviously when I say the "cops" I don't mean the whole department. There could have just been a few cops in on it and the rest were unaware.

 

[José Mourinho]

Something about the victims brother really doesn't sit well with me.

 

[FlyinJ]

Ch 8 response to above:

Spoiler

I don't think even the defense thought the cops killed her, and to frame it that way when it was so unlikely would have been a huge mistake.

We know that Coulburn found the car 3 days before it was discovered in Avery's lot from his call to dispatch.

The cops found the car, she was probably dead inside it, and they moved on from there to frame Avery is what they were going for.

As I said before, the call from Coulburn to dispatch saying he found the car is the most damning piece of evidence in this entire case.

 

[DietRob]

Two days later this is still fucking with my mind.

I don't understand why a bigger point wasn't made of

Spoiler

there being absolutely no blood in Steven's room, or garage. Also wondering why the defense didn't explore the blood of the girl being found in the back of the RAV 4 more.

Personally I think that the

Spoiler

Ex-Boyfriend

did it.

Spoiler

Those missing VM's that he admitted to deleting were likely damning evidence showing motive for the Ex. I think he killed her dumped the car with her body in the back. Police officer found the car put it in Steven's junkyard. They likely burned the body then moved the remains to his fire pit. I still don't understand how or why they found bones fragments in several different places.

So many fucking questions.. and it's still got my head spinning.

 

[Nokterian]

Spoiler

Fuck i feel so bad for brendan the fucking jury

 

[LizardKing]

Ch 8 response to above:

Spoiler

I don't think even the defense thought the cops killed her, and to frame it that way when it was so unlikely would have been a huge mistake.

We know that Coulburn found the car 3 days before it was discovered in Avery's lot from his call to dispatch.

The cops found the car, she was probably dead inside it, and they moved on from there to frame Avery is what they were going for.

As I said before, the call from Coulburn to dispatch saying he found the car is the most damning piece of evidence in this entire case.

Spoiler

I'm not saying that they should have said the cops killed her. Obviously they shouldn't say that (and couldn't). But they just should have not said either way. We don't absolutely know that's when he discovered the car. He called in a did a plate check. That's the part that doesn't make sense with the theory the cops killed her sure. It could be as you said, they found the car later. Or maybe Coburn wasn't in on it and maybe Lenk already knew where the car was and told Coburn if you find this car report directly to me. So Coburn identified it and didn't do anything about it. A lot of things could have happened to result in that plate check, but one thing that is most likely is that Coburn was either looking at the car or the plate or both. What happened before that, or was this the first time any police discovered the car, who knows.

But that is assuming 2 big coincidences happened in that 1. She was last seen at Avery's (even the fact that a person that the cops would love to have go away had this person at his house a few hours before she disappeared is a HUGE coincidence if he was not set up from that moment.) 2. HE had a large fire in his backyard the night she disappeared. This was not disputed and was obviously something he did of his own volition and also wound up where the body was found and the method of disposal. If the police didn't know he had that fire on the day of the murder, that again would be a very large coincidence.

You can't explain away these things with the theory the police just happened to find her 2 days later. If you think he's not guilty, you have to either accept they are massive coincidences, or someone set him up from day one.

 

[Trouble]

Finished watching this yesterday. I feel like there are a ton of similarities to the first season of Serial, especially how I feel about the whole thing at the end.

Spoiler

Not completely convinced that he is innocent, but the state's theory of the case is basically impossible. Would never have voted to convict if I was on the jury.

Spoiler

Also, I think the defense made a huge tactical mistake by going so hard on the frame-up angle. They should have stuck to the fact that the evidence presented didn't actually prove that Steven killed her.

Personally I think that the

Spoiler

Ex-Boyfriend

did it.

That seems quite possible. Could have been the one that

Spoiler

planted the key as well

.

Steven's

Spoiler

blood in her RAV4

still fucks me up, though. I don't really buy the theory that

Spoiler

the preservative test was wrong

.

 

[FlyinJ]

Spoiler

I'm not saying that they should have said the cops killed her. Obviously they shouldn't say that (and couldn't). But they just should have not said either way. We don't absolutely know that's when he discovered the car. He called in a did a plate check. That's the part that doesn't make sense with the theory the cops killed her sure. It could be as you said, they found the car later.

But that is assuming 2 big coincidences happened in that 1. She was last seen at Avery's (even the fact that a person that the cops would love to have go away had this person at his house a few hours before she disappeared is a HUGE coincidence if he was not set up from that moment.) 2. HE had a large fire in his backyard the night she disappeared. This was not disputed and was obviously something he did of his own volition and also wound up where the body was found and the method of disposal. If the police didn't know he had that fire on the day of the murder, that again would be a very large coincidence.

You can't explain away these things with the theory the police just happened to find her 2 days later. If you think he's not guilty, you have to either accept they are massive coincidences, or someone set him up from day one.

Chapter 8 response:

Spoiler

I think that the cops were surveying his every move. He was about to bankrupt the city and make several officers lose their jobs and were looking at everything he did to find any dirt on him. They knew everything he was up to. They knew the auto trader woman was going to his house, and they knew he made a bonfire. A few days later when they came across the woman dead in her car, they already knew she had been at Avery's from survellience and went from there. Actually everyone knew she had been at Avery's at the point he called in seeing the car, didn't they?

Another theory is he did kill her, but off the property, and the cops planted tons of evidence on his property to seal the case.

 

[LizardKing]

Chapter 8 response:

Spoiler

I think that the cops were surveying his every move. He was about to bankrupt the city and make several officers lose their jobs and were looking at everything he did to find any dirt on him. They knew everything he was up to. They knew the auto trader woman was going to his house, and they knew he made a bonfire. A few days later when they came across the woman dead in her car, they already knew she had been at Avery's from survellience and went from there. Actually everyone knew she had been at Avery's at the point he called in seeing the car, didn't they?

Another theory is he did kill her, but off the property, and the cops planted tons of evidence on his property to seal the case.

Spoiler

Yes you can say they were watching him the whole time, and that can explain getting rid of the remains in the fire, but the fact that she turned up dead in the first place is still a massive coincidence if neither he or the cops did it. Especially in an area like this. When we are looking at things that are likely to have happened, this is a very unlikely thing. It's like this case being handed to these cops on a silver platter by pure happenstance. At exactly the right time during the depositions, within weeks no less.

 

[FlyinJ]

Spoiler

Yes you can say they were watching him the whole time, and that can explain getting rid of the remains in the fire, but the fact that she turned up dead in the first place is still a massive coincidence if neither he or the cops did it. Especially in an area like this. When we are looking at things that are likely to have happened, this is a very unlikely thing. It's like this case being handed to these cops on a silver platter.

I definitely agree with that.

 

[dork]

Something about the victims brother really doesn't sit well with me.

He just wants anyone to pay for it. He probably has no information of these confessions or anything.

Jesus episode 4 this poor kid


I'm gonna go back and fourth for every episode aren't I?
Episode 4 is insane.

Spoiler

the blood of his in the car with no fingerprints. The key with nobody but his dna on it

 

[LizardKing]

I definitely agree with that.

Spoiler

So, if you think that the rest of this case was fabricated against him and that he is innocent, wouldn't it stand to follow that the most likely thing is that her very death was part of that fabrication against him? If we are saying it's very unlikely to just be a coincidence. The only thing that would stand in the way of that theory would be blind trust in the belief that the police just wouldn't do something like that. For me, it's more likely that they would than just having it be a coincidence. Of course I can't rule out anything.

 

[Cap'n Cook]

My brother just called me to tell me about this docuseries. He said he watched 3 episodes last night, couldn't sleep just thinking about it so he got up at 3 in the morning and watched the entire series.

 

[FlyinJ]

My brother just called me to tell me about this docuseries. He said he watched 3 episodes last night, couldn't sleep just thinking about it so he got up at 3 in the morning and watched the entire series.

I started watching on Saturday afternoon and had two Xmas parties I was supposed to go to, and ended up not going. I couldn't stop.

My friends can blame my absence on the police's mishandling of the Avery case.