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Man of Steel |OT| It's about action.

I

inm8num2

Member
Liquidsnake said:
Too much negativity here. Between this and TDKR you guys really break my heart. I mean really break my heart.
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I agree with your sentiment, but I still had to post this:

tumblr_ljxzhwkIuR1qao8c2o1_500.gif
 
B

Bobby Roberts

Banned
Salvor.Hardin said:
Oh I certainly agree that they weren't targeted for revenue generation. But were they used as a vehicle to market the movie? Undoubtedly. Nothing creates hype like enthusiast hype. It's why comic films are even made these days - they're easy to market because fans do half of the job.

A similar situation is taking place in the gaming industry right now. Sony realizes that the number of people who actually give a damn about drm is completely insignificant compared to their regular business of shifting consoles. But appeasing the enthusiasts leads to its own rewards which then trickles down to the general gaming audience.

Never underestimate the marketing power of the enthusiast.
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I still think you're laying way too much weight and power on the influence of an audience that is shrinking and getting older and spends large amounts of its time self-marginalizing. "Enthusiast Hype" isn't much of a factor, and "Hype" itself is only a positive to a point.

Comparing comics fans to what happened with Microsoft's anti-consumerism seems a bit of a stretch.

Superhero movies aren't made because comics fans are easy marketing. They're made because they provide easy opportunities to build blockbusters. It has almost nothing to do with the audiences currently purchasing the stories at comics stores, and everything to do with realizing imagery that can be used to pull in exponentially more people. Superhero movies provide an easy template to provide spectacle and basic mythological storytelling. Recognizability helps, which is why characters like Superman, Batman, Spider-Man, etc. are pursued by these companies. But they're not going after those properties because of the fanbase. They're going after them as a means to create an entirely new, much larger, much more LUCRATIVE fanbase.

Now you can argue that such a thing is mercenary on behalf of the executives - and it is, definitely. But that doesn't mean that the movies themselves are pandering, so long as the creatives in charge of telling those stories are doing it honestly, with concern for the story and the characters within.
 
L

LosDaddie

Banned
Avengers was/is the best comic book movie to date because it was exactly what an Avengers movie should be; Getting the superheroes together to wreck shit. Sure the movie had fan-service, but so what? That should be expected.

The reason why Marvel created Avengers back in the 1960s was because fans would always write in to Marvel about how they loved the guest-appearances characters would have in each other's comics (ie Hulk fighting the Thing, etc.). So Marvel just decided why not create a comic where their superheroes team up on a regular basis. All the romance & character development is left to the individual character's comic(s).
 
Z

Zabka

Member
I am more hyped to see the changes to the character than anything else now.

FortMajor said:
holy shit tell Newman to take the stick out of his ass. Trying way too hard.
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That was quite a read.
Standing back from the totality of Man of Steel allows the observance of a curious disaster: an expensive actioner with nary a thrilling beat; a “character piece” (this is very likely too generous) whose character is barely tangible in mere presence; a refreshingly wordy screenplay that, once actually spoken, is revealed to use its vast, vast majority of chances for interaction among great, better-than-this actors to instead spout off sci-fi exposition that holds too little proper context (“release the planet generator”) or, much less, provides any signal of so much as an attempt at coherence.
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M

Matrix

LeBron loves his girlfriend. There is no other woman in the world he’d rather have. The problem is, Dwyane’s not a woman.
FortMajor said:
holy shit tell Newman to take the stick out of his ass. Trying way too hard.
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It's awful and people should apologize to Singer and Routh? lol
 
B

Bobby Roberts

Banned
Here's Vince Mancini's Filmdrunk review, which is one of the more readable reviews (as per usual - he's great at writing stuff that sounds like you're bullshitting w/ a friend at the bar)

http://filmdrunk.uproxx.com/2013/06/review-man-of-steel

This review I think encapsulates the feeling most of my friends have settled upon a couple days after watching the movie.

relevant quote:

A lot of people are going to hate Superman because of the maddeningly wasted potential, but in the end I give it credit for creating that potential with a first half that was entertaining, inspiring, earnest, heartfelt, and beautiful. And the cast is incredible, aside from this guy. Man of Steel strikes me as both a shining example of what a comic book movie can be, and a perfect reason of why a lot of people wish the talent pool comic book movies attract could be applied to something less comic booky.
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M

Matrix

LeBron loves his girlfriend. There is no other woman in the world he’d rather have. The problem is, Dwyane’s not a woman.
Expendable. said:
Is there any outlet not to trust more than AICN? I can't think of one. Even Drew gave it an A+ over at HitFix.
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Why should I trust anyone? cause I don't. I simply posted a positive AICN review only cause you felt the need to post the latest RT score showing even more critics hating on it. Why can't we have both? I can't stand either site if you want to know the truth.

I'm gonna have no problems deciding for myself when I see it if I love, like or hate it myself.
 
E

Expendable.

Member
FatboyRoberts said:
Here's Vince Mancini's Filmdrunk review, which is one of the more readable reviews (as per usual - he's great at writing stuff that sounds like you're bullshitting w/ a friend at the bar)

http://filmdrunk.uproxx.com/2013/06/review-man-of-steel

This review I think encapsulates the feeling most of my friends have settled upon a couple days after watching the movie.

relevant quote:
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Nice review, definitely agree with a lot his points.
 
R

Raguel

Member
I actually like reading AICN because they have a passion for film, be it good or bad. That's not to say I agree with them or that the writing is good (its mostly bad). But I rather read AICN's reviews than that festering tripe that was posted earlier.
 
T

Timbuktu

Member
FatboyRoberts said:
Here's Vince Mancini's Filmdrunk review, which is one of the more readable reviews (as per usual - he's great at writing stuff that sounds like you're bullshitting w/ a friend at the bar)

http://filmdrunk.uproxx.com/2013/06/review-man-of-steel

This review I think encapsulates the feeling most of my friends have settled upon a couple days after watching the movie.

relevant quote:
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The last line especially rings true. This cast would be really great for a non comic book movie. As much as people here hate on films being 'Oscar-baits' we really don't get many proper adult dramas outside of those months nowadays. There are great more arthouse films here and there, but we don't get casts as big as this outside of comic books now.
 
I

inm8num2

Member
Expendable. said:
Why? It's from the director of one of the greatest movies of the new millenium. Can't wait to see it this weekend.
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I think you took that comment a bit too seriously. The tongue was in the cheek. I was commenting on how people are freaking out over the RT score dropping.
 
E

effzee

Member
Timbuktu said:
The last line especially rings true. This cast would be really great for a non comic book movie. As much as people here hate on films being 'Oscar-baits' we really don't get many proper adult dramas outside of those months nowadays. There are great more arthouse films here and there, but we don't get casts as big as this outside of comic books now.
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While that might be true I resent the notion that because its a comic book genre film, it should forever be contained within that genre as a lower tier film in quality.

If a movie is well made, regardless of the genre, its a worthwhile artistic expression and quality film. On the one hand people complain that summer blockbusters are so stupid and bad and wish they would be of better quality. But then when talented directors, writers, and or actors are attached to the projects we get some people complaining that its a waste of their time or talent.

Well which is it people? Why can't super hero movies be more than just popcorn movies?

As for the reviews coming in...I am not going to sit back and discount reviews especially when I haven't seen the movie. It could be average or just bad. I find it hard to believe considering the talent involved and from what I have seen so far BUT you never know.

I will say this, and I said it earlier too, Batman Begins is considered almost universally as a great movie and one of the best, if not best, comic book movies. It also received largely OK reviews. It also met some resistance from people who thought it changed Batman too much. Not fans of the character, but reviewers in general. Those critics whose mind about Batman, his villains, and his world was made up not based on the comics but on the Burton films. And it took up until TDK and TDKR for them to accept that another Batman, Joker, Catwomen, Alfred, and all the characters in the Batman world existed before and after the Burton films.

I get some of that same tone in the reviews that reference Reeves and Donner. Its god damn time for change. We have been watching on film the same interpretation of Superman since the 70s and a lot of the reviewers seem to have made up their mind on Superman based on those movies alone, so when they see something completely different which re introduces the character they don't seem to like it. No not saying all reviewers are doing so and that every negative review should be dismissed, but there is this sentiment that they are comparing it to Donner films and not just judging the film for what it is.

I fear for whatever next iteration of Batman on film comes around. I loved the Nolan Batman films and hold them in very high regard, but I know already most reviewers won't accept or give a chance to the very first "next" Batman.
 
R

Raptor

Member
Liquidsnake said:
I dreamed of a Superman where he was moping around, not sure what to do with himself. Having trouble deciding if he should do good or bad.

Just a constant struggle. A very dark dark Superman movie.
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Dude I fucking want this so bad, I dont' want humour, I don't want stupid jokes, I don't want IronMan 3 nor Avengers, I want Superman to be treated seriously, he is not some sugar apple pie that smiles at everything, he has issues,

Fucking goddamn it!
 
M

Matrix

LeBron loves his girlfriend. There is no other woman in the world he’d rather have. The problem is, Dwyane’s not a woman.
Hell it took Clark 10 years on Smallville to work out his issues and accept becoming Superman lol jk kinda
 
E

effzee

Member
Raptor said:
Dude I fucking want this so bad, I dont' want humour, I don't want stupid jokes, I don't want IronMan 3 nor Avengers, I want Superman to be treated seriously, he is not some sugar apple pie that smiles at everything, he has issues,

Fucking goddamn it!
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No! Everything has to be like Avengers and or Iron Man! Funny! Bright! Quips!

Anything else is taking the source material and character too seriously!
 
E

Error

Jealous of the Glory that is Johnny Depp
Dahbomb said:
I accidentally read that big spoiler. :/

If that is really what is causing some of the bad reviews then I am just... I don't know what to say. It's not even comparable to the Superman Returns super child story line which in fact ruined that movie far more.
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The scene with the piano was one of the most cringe worthy scenes in a comic book film ever.
 
T

Timbuktu

Member
effzee said:
While that might be true I resent the notion that because its a comic book genre film, it should forever be contained within that genre as a lower tier film in quality.
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I am definitely now saying that they are of lower quality. It's just compared with Lets say TV, cinema should be able to tell a wider range of stories when each is distilled into two hours or so. I am thinking of what soderbergh said recently, there is less variety in films the get wide release, these big tentpoles cast such a large shadow over everything else. Comic book films, even more than other franchise movies, can be more limited in the stories they can tell with such a big baggage of history, characters and fans. You get the same origins stories that get told again and again, spiderman and superman have both been rebooted now within a decade. Just let Batman lie for a while.

That in itself is interesting, but it is happening at the expense of other movies. I also miss sometimes the kind of big blockbusters we got in the 90s or before. Then again, Pacific Rim is 'new', so i am grateful for that.
 
M

Matrix

LeBron loves his girlfriend. There is no other woman in the world he’d rather have. The problem is, Dwyane’s not a woman.
G-Fex said:
Smallville the movie

you wait ten sequels before something happens
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First movie would be completed devoted to staring at Lana with his telescope.

Wait... now I know why Singer made Supes creepy.
 
G

GamerXXX

Banned
I think a very good review is a review by Grace, from beyondthetrailer in youtube. She provides a detailed review of MOS and it's better when you are watching the reviewer as you can see what they are feeling.

I checked her review expecting an abysmal one and a real bashing cause she had negative things to say about MOS even before it came out; she wasn't sold on Cavill or the trailers. Well, i was surprised to see that even though she felt movie had many flaws, there's is potential for a sequel and that the groundwork has been laid. What she goes on to explain is that the movie had many great ideas but things weren't executed well and she blames Goyer and Snyder for script and execution. In her opinion, they tried to jam in too many things in the 2.5 hours and so it felt like getting a guided tour of a big facility whilst driver is driving fast and not letting you explore what's interesting. This seems to be a recurring theme with this movie - Underdeveloped characters, rushed scenes which had potential and not letting aspects of the film fully take a life of their own. In a nutshell, she claims it fails screen writing 101 - Getting into scenes at the latest possible time and exiting them at the earliest possible time.

On the characters, she goes on to explain Crowe, Cavill and Antje Traue were the standouts and it was interesting to hear her praise Cavill since she wasn't sold on him beforehand. It is KEY that Cavill sold the role, very KEY. She wasn't too sold on Zod and the rest, except Costner...

It's a detailed review and i think it kinda puts all of the criticsm together but what i most take away from it is that even though she always had concerns on MOS from day 1, she felt critics were too harsh and that overall, MOS is good enough to warrant a sequel and possibly justice league.. It seems cast was solid and ideas good but execution faulty and she thinks Goyer and Snyder need to go, if sequels are to be made.'


anyway, thought she did a great job with this review, check it out for yourselves. I'm still as hyped as ever to watch it as i think superman fans will like it..
 
M

Matrix

LeBron loves his girlfriend. There is no other woman in the world he’d rather have. The problem is, Dwyane’s not a woman.
Solo said:
Spider-Man 3
Skyfall
The Dark Knight Rises
Green Lantern
Super 8
ASM
Prometheus

The list goes on and on....

:_(
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I think you were on some hallucinogenic drugs with that one. That movie should have changed you forever. Yet you let others get to you.
 
D

DMczaf

Member
Solo said:
Spider-Man 3
Skyfall
The Dark Knight Rises
Green Lantern
Super 8
ASM
Prometheus

The list goes on and on....

:_(
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Skyfall and TDKR don't belong on that list AND YOU KNOW IT! There's disappointment, and then there's those other movies.

I also like how Spider-Man made it twice. Best franchise.
 
S

Solo

Member
dmshaposv said:
Along with myself, on GAF I only trust the following person for his completely rational, uncomprimising review:

Jett.

Mr negativity will tell it like it is.

Solo became an instant joke character when he said he prefered TDKR over TDK, lol.
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I have since come around to the true, canon ranking of the Nolan Batman films: BB >>> TDK > TKDR
 
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