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[Roman Empire]

And there are too many games coming out later this year and early next year to keep playing this in modes many don't want to play

Plus I don't know it can survive long enough to wait on these modes.

Yeah, gamers just have their hands full with backlog or more interesting games. An average live-service game is nothing worthy of notice.

 

[gothmog]

Pull the other one, D1 has a 6.1 user score on metacritic an was only saved by VOG. The less said about D2's launch state the better. That game nearly killed to studio.

D1 sold well and was generally well reviewed at launch (metacritic 76 which is probably closer to 8/10 at launch which is good). VOG did save it as people were bored with the lack of content. Taken King took a while but revitalized it. I can only imagine how much money they burned before TTK came out.

As far as nearly killing the studio? I think part of it was just poor planning and not understanding how they should have monetized it.

 

[clarky]

D1 sold well and was generally well reviewed at launch (metacritic 76 which is probably closer to 8/10 at launch which is good). VOG did save it as people were bored with the lack of content. Taken King took a while but revitalized it. I can only imagine how much money they burned before TTK came out.

As far as nearly killing the studio? I think part of it was just poor planning and not understanding how they should have monetized it.

You said they where perceived as great at launch, I beg to differ the reception for both amongst players was awful.

TTK came a year after, not anywhere near launch

D2 was nothing to do with poor planning it was poor game design and ignoring your core fans needs. They removed any grind, random rolls, simplified skill trees & gave exotics out like candy. You could obtain literally everything the game had to offer in under 25 hours. By the time Osiris came out the game was on life support.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Some interesting takes, but mostly sounds like complaints due to skill-issues and just having an issue with the gameplay loop.

It does seem that due to the low player count due to the alpha and mostly hardcore left playing, it seems like someone like him who isn't that big on PvP is getting the short end of the stick.

Since matchmaking is designed around experience level and the player count is low right now, I wonder how representative the experience is as matchmaking has a very limited pool causing issues for the system to work properly.

 

[cormack12]

Building and balancing a game around 3 player premade teams severely limits your audience.

I'll be playing either way but a hell of a lot of people won't because of it.

That's why matchmaking exists. It's existed since the dawn of time on ultra competitive modes, from Defuse/Plant in CS to Siege to Apex. I've won on Battle Royales infrequently as part of a matchmade team. And quite a lot as part of squads in BF and CS 1.6+

Other times we've entered the dark zone and been ganked by a 6v3 or we just got done by a team of 3 very good matchmade players

I really think it's an excuse and needs to be taken out the equation. Supporting/Introducing solo play properly will kill the pool of players and mess with the balancing. To me, on the sideline it's a very selfish demand and it's largely been asked for by people who seem to like the gameplay already. And I can understand Bungie getting fed up with the question. Maybe in 18-24 months when the game is established with a known userbase they can experiment but in the here and now, those players moaning about solo queues need to be asking how can they draw more fence sitters in. In my opinion at least, because like it nor not, adding solo queues is not going to affect whether this game is a roaring success or not.

The whole launch since alpha has been a bit of a fiasco, down to being secretive about the beta (don't even know if it's open or closed yet). And I don't buy these claims of being hard to scale up to an open alpha. It's just spinning up more virtual servers because they are dedicated.

I am intrigued to try it, but I kind of think with timings and all the controversy the chance when they have a captive audience is going to pass by and this will end up fizzling.

 

[clarky]

That's why matchmaking exists. It's existed since the dawn of time on ultra competitive modes, from Defuse/Plant in CS to Siege to Apex. I've won on Battle Royales infrequently as part of a matchmade team. And quite a lot as part of squads in BF and CS 1.6+

Other times we've entered the dark zone and been ganked by a 6v3 or we just got done by a team of 3 very good matchmade players

I really think it's an excuse and needs to be taken out the equation. Supporting/Introducing solo play properly will kill the pool of players and mess with the balancing. To me, on the sideline it's a very selfish demand and it's largely been asked for by people who seem to like the gameplay already. And I can understand Bungie getting fed up with the question. Maybe in 18-24 months when the game is established with a known userbase they can experiment but in the here and now, those players moaning about solo queues need to be asking how can they draw more fence sitters in. In my opinion at least, because like it nor not, adding solo queues is not going to affect whether this game is a roaring success or not.

The whole launch since alpha has been a bit of a fiasco, down to being secretive about the beta (don't even know if it's open or closed yet). And I don't buy these claims of being hard to scale up to an open alpha. It's just spinning up more virtual servers because they are dedicated.

I am intrigued to try it, but I kind of think with timings and all the controversy the chance when they have a captive audience is going to pass by and this will end up fizzling.

I'm onboard and will be playing at launch, mostly solo queuing as well by the looks of things. My experience is similar to yours and by enlarge my experiences with randoms is a positive one in the games I do play.

However I would like to know how matchmaking works in this game a little more. Does it match you into a lobby with 2 randoms then you pick contracts and gear up? or is it a case of gearing up then getting tossed into a game with 2 random players ? If its the former then that would be cool but I can't see me risking all my best gear and mods on the latter only to be matched with a couple of plonkers who turn up with just a knife.

Also they need to sort the contracts out, from what I've seen it looks counter productive everyone in the random squad having completely different and conflicting objectives in a match. They must be a way of match people up who have similar objectives to accomplish.

Like I was saying earlier it seems to be made specifically with premade teams in mind in the current build. At least it needs to be a bit more solo matchmaking friendly.

 

[cormack12]

I'm onboard and will be playing at launch, mostly solo queuing as well by the looks of things. My experience is similar to yours and by enlarge my experiences with randoms is a positive one in the games I do play.

However I would like to know how matchmaking works in this game a little more. Does it match you into a lobby with 2 randoms then you pick contracts and gear up? or is it a case of gearing up then getting tossed into a game with 2 random players ? If its the former then that would be cool but I can't see me risking all my best gear and mods on the latter only to be matched with a couple of plonkers who turn up with just a knife.

Also they need to sort the contracts out, from what I've seen it looks counter productive everyone in the random squad having completely different and conflicting objectives in a match. They must be a way of match people up who have similar objectives to accomplish.

From what I've seen it just requires people to not be morons. You load in, see your exfil point, then everyone should ping their objective and you traverse the optimal path to each objective on the way there. That's why I don't get the issues. Having said that DMZ didn't work like that and it was ultra confusing trying to get to the events. But even the map keys just sound like strongholds.

I really don't get the issues, part of me thinks this is streamer culture which is the most damaging to the game to be honest. Ive also noticed a shift in the last week from a few big streamers which all seem suspiciously on the same message like 'the bones of a good game are there', 'the foundation is solid' and pushback against their own communities. Part of me wonders if a script has been dropped by Bungie to their 'partnered' streamers.

For me the biggest issue is still the loot. And my complaints are more against the genre. I don't think the formula is there yet to create the casual PvPvE extraction game. If I look at Marathon now, I see people extracting for credits, people dropping back in with same equipment to increase how much it's worth (credits). Contracts which we know will scale terribly like Halo, like Diablo but because we are seeing base faction requests they look reasonable. I just don't get the point. All this secrecy around the Marathon map as well is just conjecture.

The reason The Dark Zone worked well in The Division was because it let you take your hard earned loot back into the safety of PvE and enjoy it, like the unique exotics (I know this changed - but the drop rate is still higher and you can earn raid exclusive drops too).


For me:

Drop the shields and knocks. If you're killed, you're dead;
Allow some bonuses like fultons from MSG V to be purchased so you can extract something with little risk (1 per game);
Don't have static exfil points, instead have an exfil running every five minutes that just appears on the map;
Have the PvP be zones between PvE contracts;

That would make the extraction shooter more casual focused which is what Bungie is aiming for imo.

Edit: Alternatively, how good would it be to link to Destiny as the equivalent of a Dark Zone with a new pool of exotics or uniques?

 

[Jibran#one]

This looks such a f2p game it's mindboggling what they are charging for it.
how can this game compete with all the f2p offerings it's just not possible

 

[clarky]

From what I've seen it just requires people to not be morons. You load in, see your exfil point, then everyone should ping their objective and you traverse the optimal path to each objective on the way there. That's why I don't get the issues. Having said that DMZ didn't work like that and it was ultra confusing trying to get to the events. But even the map keys just sound like strongholds.

I really don't get the issues, part of me thinks this is streamer culture which is the most damaging to the game to be honest. Ive also noticed a shift in the last week from a few big streamers which all seem suspiciously on the same message like 'the bones of a good game are there', 'the foundation is solid' and pushback against their own communities. Part of me wonders if a script has been dropped by Bungie to their 'partnered' streamers.

For me the biggest issue is still the loot. And my complaints are more against the genre. I don't think the formula is there yet to create the casual PvPvE extraction game. If I look at Marathon now, I see people extracting for credits, people dropping back in with same equipment to increase how much it's worth (credits). Contracts which we know will scale terribly like Halo, like Diablo but because we are seeing base faction requests they look reasonable. I just don't get the point. All this secrecy around the Marathon map as well is just conjecture.

The reason The Dark Zone worked well in The Division was because it let you take your hard earned loot back into the safety of PvE and enjoy it, like the unique exotics (I know this changed - but the drop rate is still higher and you can earn raid exclusive drops too).


For me:

Drop the shields and knocks. If you're killed, you're dead;
Allow some bonuses like fultons from MSG V to be purchased so you can extract something with little risk (1 per game);
Don't have static exfil points, instead have an exfil running every five minutes that just appears on the map;
Have the PvP be zones between PvE contracts;

That would make the extraction shooter more casual focused which is what Bungie is aiming for imo.

Fultons now there's a good idea. You could like you say attach some loot you desperately need to get out, even have other players shoot it down as you extract it then PVP hijinks ensue as you fight over it.

There was talk early in development around rare artifacts that need to be extracted and then combined for use later in the game (possibibly on this 4th map?) Could be interesting if its still in the game.

 

[clarky]

This looks such a f2p game it's mindboggling what they are charging for it.
how can this game compete with all the f2p offerings it's just not possible

What free to play extraction shooter are there? Havoc mode in Delta Force? Thats not even out on console yet. Arc Raiders will also be charging.

Personally I'm happy its not free to play, first line of defence against cheaters.

 

[MMaRsu]

What free to play extraction shooter are there? Havoc mode in Delta Force? Thats not even out on console yet. Arc Raiders will also be charging.

Personally I'm happy its not free to play, first line of defence against cheaters.

Well.. that worked out so well for Tarkov



(I know RMT is the problem but still)

 

[clarky]

Well.. that worked out so well for Tarkov



(I know RMT is the problem but still)

I've not played Tarkov in ages but that game was/is just too hardcore for the console/mainstream folks. It just does not respect your time, for better or worse.

Great game though. Will probably attempt to get back into it when 1.0 launches finally, if i can find a set up that works for me personally.

 

[Darchaos]

This fucking game Dosent even knows what it wants to be, plays like a fucking BR but wants to be an extraction shooter, the loot is pink squares with a random value like wtf is this The avatars are fucking colorful Unicorns jumping across the map like horny rabbits that is down to clown, holy shit, imagine defending this corporate shit

 

[MMaRsu]

It just does not respect your time, for better or worse.

Which is all the worst to know that there is almost a cheater in every single match, on average.



If you read the comments people are saying 2 years later and nothing has changed.

Don't even bother with Tarkov anymore, if you value your time and sanity.

I loved it to death, but fuck all that.

 

[MMaRsu]

I didnt create this Tarkov edit for nothing (even tho looking back its not really my best edit lmao but still dope)

 

[clarky]

Which is all the worst to know that there is almost a cheater in every single match, on average.



If you read the comments people are saying 2 years later and nothing has changed.

Don't even bother with Tarkov anymore, if you value your time and sanity.

I loved it to death, but fuck all that.

Good to know. I was never massively into it think i have around 100 hours game time, which is nothing compare to the Tarkov nuts. A lad who works for me eats sleeps and breathes the fucking thing. Drives me nuts lol.

I didnt create this Tarkov edit for nothing (even tho looking back its not really my best edit lmao but still dope)

Neat, well done.

 

[clarky]

This fucking game Dosent even knows what it wants to be, plays like a fucking BR but wants to be an extraction shooter, the loot is pink squares with a random value like wtf is this The avatars are fucking colorful Unicorns jumping across the map like horny rabbits that is down to clown, holy shit, imagine defending this corporate shit

Ironically your post gives me that very same reaction.

 

[Darchaos]

Ironically your post gives me that very same reaction.

My dude, you need to get up from youre shitstained officechair and get some air, you have lived in this thread for a week now

 

[clarky]

My dude, you need to get up from youre shitstained officechair and get some air, you have lived in this thread for a week now

Im in the middle of the Sahara desert mate nothing much else to do. There is literally nothing for 300 miles in any direction. The last thing I need is more air.

 

[Darchaos]

Im in the middle of the Sahara desert mate nothing much else to do. There is literally nothing for 300 miles in any direction. The last thing I need is more air.

Fair enough

 

[coachmcguirk91]

From what I've seen it just requires people to not be morons. You load in, see your exfil point, then everyone should ping their objective and you traverse the optimal path to each objective on the way there. That's why I don't get the issues. Having said that DMZ didn't work like that and it was ultra confusing trying to get to the events. But even the map keys just sound like strongholds.

I really don't get the issues, part of me thinks this is streamer culture which is the most damaging to the game to be honest. Ive also noticed a shift in the last week from a few big streamers which all seem suspiciously on the same message like 'the bones of a good game are there', 'the foundation is solid' and pushback against their own communities. Part of me wonders if a script has been dropped by Bungie to their 'partnered' streamers.

For me the biggest issue is still the loot. And my complaints are more against the genre. I don't think the formula is there yet to create the casual PvPvE extraction game. If I look at Marathon now, I see people extracting for credits, people dropping back in with same equipment to increase how much it's worth (credits). Contracts which we know will scale terribly like Halo, like Diablo but because we are seeing base faction requests they look reasonable. I just don't get the point. All this secrecy around the Marathon map as well is just conjecture.

The reason The Dark Zone worked well in The Division was because it let you take your hard earned loot back into the safety of PvE and enjoy it, like the unique exotics (I know this changed - but the drop rate is still higher and you can earn raid exclusive drops too).


For me:

Drop the shields and knocks. If you're killed, you're dead;
Allow some bonuses like fultons from MSG V to be purchased so you can extract something with little risk (1 per game);
Don't have static exfil points, instead have an exfil running every five minutes that just appears on the map;
Have the PvP be zones between PvE contracts;

That would make the extraction shooter more casual focused which is what Bungie is aiming for imo.

Edit: Alternatively, how good would it be to link to Destiny as the equivalent of a Dark Zone with a new pool of exotics or uniques?

Interesting points

From my experience with randoms, the contracts are secondary. Looting and completing objectives are a much bigger priority. Which I think is a good thing. In an average match, you will usually hit 3/5 POI on the map anyways, completing contracts passively. Most people extract within first 15min. So if I really need to do a contract and my run didn't cross paths with the contract, I'll usually just solo it after my teammates exfil, with no issues

I don't think random exfil would work with randoms. It would just add another level of chaos of where to go and what to do. The single exfil location really helps team coordinate a planned run without even needing to talk

PvP vs PvE zones is an interesting idea. It would be enjoyable to complete more difficult AI encounters without being concerned about being 3rd partied. I do worry whether that would take away from the moment to moment intensity tho. It would be great if future maps had variety of the two

I think Marathon will evolve a lot over time. You hear a lot of criticism because of that, imo. People trying to push the direction of the game in one way or another. I really enjoy the game for what is now, personally

I don't mind the TTK, but it really seems to be a sore spot with a lot of people. I wouldn't mind lowering it a bit. Respawning teammates directly from their bag is really dumb. Should 100% be an item. What's your problem with the loot? It's really satisfying as a newbie to Extraxtion shooters?

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

Which is all the worst to know that there is almost a cheater in every single match, on average.



If you read the comments people are saying 2 years later and nothing has changed.

Don't even bother with Tarkov anymore, if you value your time and sanity.

I loved it to death, but fuck all that.

This video killed that game for me

 

[MMaRsu]

This video killed that game for me

Same, and understandably so! Why bother putting that much time in a game with such rampant cheating. Not for me!

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Same, and understandably so! Why bother putting that much time in a game with such rampant cheating. Not for me!

Eh biggest competitor to Marathon out of the way then?

 

[clarky]

Eh biggest competitor to Marathon out of the way then?

Don't think they'd ever be competition.

If Marathon does find success it will largely be a console audience, with some PC players. Bit like the Destiny split but smaller.

Arc Raiders is the biggest threat. Maybe Delta force when it comes to console as well. New DMZ possibly but that's a while away yet.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

They are giving you an out sony/Bungie.... are you going to take it?

 

[clarky]

They are giving you an out sony/Bungie.... are you going to take it?

A video about an article about Marathon? Didn't you post the article also earlier?

Do you need a hug?

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

A video about an article about Marathon? Didn't you post the article also earlier?

Do you need a hug?

did i. can you show me?

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

. This shows what are the real priorities.

 

[simpatico]

Sure people have work and all, but that excuse doesn't always ring true. There have been plenty of tests where people got in as much as they can and the day it's taken away they talk about how they can't wait to play it again. This just.... doesn't look like that by looking at the graphs at all.

Remember Elden Ring Network Test hype levels? Miyazaki would never drop a graph like that on us.

 

[Hari Seldon]

Don't think they'd ever be competition.

If Marathon does find success it will largely be a console audience, with some PC players. Bit like the Destiny split but smaller.

Arc Raiders is the biggest threat. Maybe Delta force when it comes to console as well. New DMZ possibly but that's a while away yet.

If Marathon finds any success Fortnite will copy it and then burry it.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Some interesting takes, but mostly sounds like complaints due to skill-issues and just having an issue with the gameplay loop.

It does seem that due to the low player count due to the alpha and mostly hardcore left playing, it seems like someone like him who isn't that big on PvP is getting the short end of the stick.

Since matchmaking is designed around experience level and the player count is low right now, I wonder how representative the experience is as matchmaking has a very limited pool causing issues for the system to work properly.

Marathon's big success factor is if there is a hidden market that wants a simplified extraction shooter with bright sci fi colours.

Many streamers who dont like or arent experienced with extraction shooters dont seem to care for it as they dont like the game mechanic of losing progress and it being a slow burn kind of game loop. And the hardcore Tarkov gamers who are expert extraction gamers dont sound like they'll care either.

All the other stuff like hit and miss graphics, 3 person teams, no other game modes or solo queue just add to the problems.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

. This shows what are the real priorities.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Doesnt even make sense.

If they think prox chat is so poisonous, just give gamers an option On/Off.

But IMO they want it off for everyone not for cussing and trolling, but they want to make the game as simplified as possible. Work in a team, loot and extract and shoot anything that moves. Adding in prox chat to work, trade or get backstabbed by chatting with other teams will be gameplay overload for the audience they are going after.

Bungie cant be that naive thinking the extraction genre is giant. It's not. But simplifying it vs. some of the hardcore games like Tarkov makes them think they can get a big pie slice. But they arent even going after Tarkov gamers. They are going for the COD and Destiny crowd.

 

[Pop]

. This shows what are the real priorities.

YOu know Bungie could just have it off by default. Give players the option

 

[Ozzy Onya A2Z]

Reading that just feels like craft your exact loadout then essentially third party other teams with all your advantages, superior gear and tactically wise too. Reads like the game could be very weighted and exploited by stacked squads. Given the maps and limited player pools/playlists you're likely to run into this often. It's exactly why there were no friends codes/stacking for the closed alpha, Bungie didn't want stacked squads wreaking havoc all day every game. If your game isn't designed with systems and mechanics that enable randos to compete with stacked squads then I don't know what to say.

 

[Ozzy Onya A2Z]

YOu know Bungie could just have it off by default. Give players the option

Nah, bring back prox chat full on. Ban party chat, #NoOffToggle and give the toxicity back to the gamers. It was fun as fuck.

 

[Luipadre]

Meanwhile arc raiders beta and full game will have proxy chat and friend invites

 

[MaKTaiL]

You must be from half of the group that never came back.

I played the PS5 Pro version. I bet the stats are the same though.

 

[amscanner]

literally everyone who played this game is saying it's not for solo. I can't imagine charging $40 for a game that needs 2 friends to play with would have success.

It would be f2p game pretty soon i guess.

 

[Dr. Samuel Hayden]

. This shows what are the real priorities.

"We're still figuring out how to do it"

Hey bungie... I hear they've created this new revolutionary feature... it's called... a mute button.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

"We're still figuring out how to do it"

Hey bungie... I hear they've created this new revolutionary feature... it's called... a mute button.

What they'll probably do is add in canned voice commands. Press the D-pad and call out pre-recorded lines like "Let's trade!" or "Dont shoot!".

 

[Hideous Snake]

Bungie can't be real having aim magnetism on PC??? I don't care if it's an option. This shit doesn't belong here

Also proximity chat in those kinda games are necessary. They can be hilarious and create great memories. Put that as an option instead you soft cunts

 

[MaKTaiL]

Thats a shame. What other online shooters did/do you play?

All Battlefields, various CODs, The Finals, Destiny 1/2, Fortnite, Apex, Counter Strike, Warframe, etc. I don't mind playing different games as long as they are good.

Marathon definitely did not click with me at all. As for what I said about Concord being fun I stand by it. The gameplay in itself was pretty good during the time I tested the open beta.

But just as Concord, Marathon will fail because of its price tag. The only way I see it surviving is if it goes free to play. If Bungie insists on selling this game it's definitely DOA (in my opinion).

 

[MaKTaiL]

Because 300 dev's will be sitting on their plums for the next 5 months?

Seems like you never played a Bungie game before.

 

[MayauMiao]

 

[MayauMiao]

I played the PS5 Pro version. I bet the stats are the same though.

How so? You encountered more bots than players?

 

[MaKTaiL]

How so? You encountered more bots than players?

I mean the ratio of people who played a few matches and then left. I played right when the Alpha started. The matches I played had real players though. I'm not sure how it is now.

 

[Fake]

. This shows what are the real priorities.

Imagine falling to a fucking idiot like him...