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Mass Effect 3 Multiplayer |OT| Rich, deep online role playing

DY_nasty

NeoGAF's official "was this shooting justified" consultant
lol

What is survivability like on the Adept Vanguard? If you charge into a pack you're pretty much dead right?

Its some razors edge shit. It only works if you can actually kill things quickly - not just stagger lock. The melee synergy stuff ties into the biotic explosions too so you can potentially throw out some ridiculous damage rather quickly. Melee kill > Power melee kill > power damage boost from Charge (and all of these boosts last for a decent amount of time) spam bubbles then spirit bomb with lift grenades.

Survivability is still good just because of Charge and Stasis Bubble alone - but its nothing close to human spamhard

edit: also, weapons make a difference. Disciple w/ melee mod and clip extension for staggering anything short of a brute or Carnifex w/ melee mod and whatever you feel like. The class is the anti-Phantom - but god help you if you're playing against Reapers.
 
Neither, unless you're just looking to play bronze. Gold and later waves of silver are about pairing up with another biotic player to combo Reave with Warp, Throw, Biotic Charge, or Nova, or comboing Reave with Cluster Grenades. Many popular Drell Adept builds skip Pull entirely, but I think that's overkill.

I wouldn't recommend evolving Pull past rank 3 or 4. The weaker biotic explosions is almost irrelevant; the only time you care about having big explosions is when dealing with protected targets. Against unprotected targets, a rank 6 + rank 6 explosion is overkill; Pull 4 + Reave 6 deals plenty of damage.

*blinks*

What?!? No Pull whatsoever? So you rely on other players to get maximum effectiveness out of your build? That makes zero sense. So what happens if there are no other biotics on your team? Just Reave? It makes no sense.

The reasons why you *do* want Pull at levels 5 and 6 are:

5: Expose means your weapon damage (and more importantly, biotic detonations) do 25% more damage. This is key. Do you only play on Bronze? Because on Silver/Gold a Pull/Reave detonation usually won't kill a full health basic enemy (hence not "overkill" as you say), but the Reave will finish it off almost immediately (before it can get up and attack). If you don't level up Pull here, then it will take longer for the Reave to finish it off, allowing it to recover and shoot back at you.

6: Duration & Combo is simple... duration gives you time to get that second Reave in if you miss with the first and the detonation damage (following along with the reasoning above) is crucial to put down enemies as fast as possible.

Besides what I mentioned above, Pull itself is absolutely *critical* to the build. It's got one of the quickest (if not *the* quickest) biotic cooldowns in the game, and if you roll with a single light weapon like a Carnifex or Phalanx you can Pull about every 1.5 seconds (or less). Why is this important? Because even though it only pulls unarmored targets, it also staggers protected enemies like Marauders and Centurions. This means it'll stagger them out of cover (exposing them to Reave) or give you breathing room to whittle their shields down so you can Pull them properly.

Also, investing in Pull is far more important than investing in Fitness (the assumed substitute). We all know Drells are squish and Fitness boosts are always a percentage of the base, not a flat increase. A 20% boost to shields/health are more significant on a 500/500 base, but give lower returns on one that's 250/500 (or whatever the Drell's base is). This is balanced through the Drell's mobility... use it! Don't stand your ground when getting swarmed, give ground and run before they close to medium-close range. The Drell is incredibly quick and having Pull (with its amazing cooldown) actually helps to give you breathing room when you need to run.

Honestly, I've never seen *one* Drell Adept not depend on judicious use of Pull. I would argue the *popular* build always maxes that and Reave pretty much ASAP, in fact.

Edit: The combination of Pull/Reave/Cluster Grenades in fact makes the Drell Adept the slightly better class for me over the Asari Adept with Stasis/Throw/Warp (with both in the top tier of classes). The higher versatility of Stasis/Warp is counterbalanced by the mindnumbing speed of Pull/Reave but nothing the Asari has compares to the massive damage output of Reave/Cluster Grenades. The Asari is more useful overall but when you want to put many different things down *fast* the Drell trumps all other classes (thanks in large part to Pull).
 
How do you recommend spec-ing the Krogan Sentinel? That's the class I'm playing next.

I'm basically following the template off that multiplayer build site that's been posted a few times (don't have the URL offhand since I'm on my iPad). But it's basically as follows:

Max out Tech Armor for health/shield bonuses
Max out Rage/Fitness with melee and health/shield bonuses
Max out the grenade
Ignore Incinerate

The idea of this build is to create a melee tank, because if you spec out all the health/shield bonuses, the Krogan Sentinel has the highest health/shield of any class/race.

This means you won't be using any powers. At first I was hesitant to do this since I use powers A LOT, but since the Sentinel only has Incinerate, he's not really a power-heavy player anyways. And since you'll be able to take so much damage, you can maximize your melee strength and constantly get your rage going by smacking shit around.

I'm looking forward to trying this build out. I'm kinda doing it already with my Krogan solider (just got first place in a Silver match ths morning), but it will be nice to eat a ton of damage and shake it off!
 

Kyoufu

Member
Its some razors edge shit. It only works if you can actually kill things quickly - not just stagger lock. The melee synergy stuff ties into the biotic explosions too so you can potentially throw out some ridiculous damage rather quickly. Melee kill > Power melee kill > power damage boost from Charge (and all of these boosts last for a decent amount of time) spam bubbles then spirit bomb with lift grenades.

Survivability is still good just because of Charge and Stasis Bubble alone - but its nothing close to human spamhard

edit: also, weapons make a difference. Disciple w/ melee mod and clip extension for staggering anything short of a brute or Carnifex w/ melee mod and whatever you feel like. The class is the anti-Phantom - but god help you if you're playing against Reapers.

Once I get a Geth Shotgun I'll try it out. I have the Disciple but uuuugh I don't like it at all.

I doubt I'd move away from Human Spamhard though. They made that class too good.
 
So... new N7 Challenge for the weekend. But don't get excited just yet...

http://blog.bioware.com/2012/03/23/operation-fortress/

Welcome to the next N7 multiplayer weekend!

Last weekend the community joined together to push back the reapers in Operation Goliath. With over 3 million brutes killed, their numbers have been decimated. Expect to encounter far fewer this weekend.

As a reward for that outstanding performance, join your friends online between 5 PM PST Friday, March 23 and 5 AM PST Monday, March 26, to reap the rewards of last weekend’s successful offensive with a 25% XP bonus.

- All enemies.
- All maps.
- All challenge levels.
- All platforms (PS3 included).
- All weekend.

To participate, you will need to play Mass Effect 3 multiplayer during the listed time period. That’s it. The bonus applies to all XP earned. Gather your squad and take advantage! You’ll want to be leveled up for next weekend’s event…

+25% experience. Now’s the time to shoot for level 20 with your favorite character, or build up your N7 rating!
 
Not like getting to 20 is that hard right now. It takes what, 10 matches perhaps? I also do not really see the point in promoting the chars (i dont give a shit about my N7 rating), so eh.
 

EatChildren

Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
Can't say I like the Quarian Infiltrator much. Sabotage is way too contextual. Great against Geth, Atlas and Turrets, but kind eh against everything else, unless I'm missing something (I know it overheats weapons). I mean, for that kind of support role I'd rather play as an engineer. As infiltrator, cryo blast and grenades are much more useful.
 

firehawk12

Subete no aware
Can't say I like the Quarian Infiltrator much. Sabotage is way too contextual. Great against Geth, Atlas and Turrets, but kind eh against everything else, unless I'm missing something (I know it overheats weapons). I mean, for that kind of support role I'd rather play as an engineer. As infiltrator, cryo blast and grenades are much more useful.
It's useful mostly for Geth farming... and even then, because of the nerf, it's still not that great.
 
*blinks*

What?!? No Pull whatsoever? So you rely on other players to get maximum effectiveness out of your build? That makes zero sense. So what happens if there are no other biotics on your team? Just Reave? It makes no sense.

The reasons why you *do* want Pull at levels 5 and 6 are:

5: Expose means your weapon damage (and more importantly, biotic detonations) do 25% more damage. This is key. Do you only play on Bronze? Because on Silver/Gold a Pull/Reave detonation usually won't kill a full health basic enemy (hence not "overkill" as you say), but the Reave will finish it off almost immediately (before it can get up and attack). If you don't level up Pull here, then it will take longer for the Reave to finish it off, allowing it to recover and shoot back at you.

6: Duration & Combo is simple... duration gives you time to get that second Reave in if you miss with the first and the detonation damage (following along with the reasoning above) is crucial to put down enemies as fast as possible.

Besides what I mentioned above, Pull itself is absolutely *critical* to the build. It's got one of the quickest (if not *the* quickest) biotic cooldowns in the game, and if you roll with a single light weapon like a Carnifex or Phalanx you can Pull about every 1.5 seconds (or less). Why is this important? Because even though it only pulls unarmored targets, it also staggers protected enemies like Marauders and Centurions. This means it'll stagger them out of cover (exposing them to Reave) or give you breathing room to whittle their shields down so you can Pull them properly.

Also, investing in Pull is far more important than investing in Fitness (the assumed substitute). We all know Drells are squish and Fitness boosts are always a percentage of the base, not a flat increase. A 20% boost to shields/health are more significant on a 500/500 base, but give lower returns on one that's 250/500 (or whatever the Drell's base is). This is balanced through the Drell's mobility... use it! Don't stand your ground when getting swarmed, give ground and run before they close to medium-close range. The Drell is incredibly quick and having Pull (with its amazing cooldown) actually helps to give you breathing room when you need to run.

Honestly, I've never seen *one* Drell Adept not depend on judicious use of Pull. I would argue the *popular* build always maxes that and Reave pretty much ASAP, in fact.

Edit: The combination of Pull/Reave/Cluster Grenades in fact makes the Drell Adept the slightly better class for me over the Asari Adept with Stasis/Throw/Warp (with both in the top tier of classes). The higher versatility of Stasis/Warp is counterbalanced by the mindnumbing speed of Pull/Reave but nothing the Asari has compares to the massive damage output of Reave/Cluster Grenades. The Asari is more useful overall but when you want to put many different things down *fast* the Drell trumps all other classes (thanks in large part to Pull).

Listen to the man! Pull is absolutely critical to the class! Fitness is the area you wan't no points in, as you're dying almost as quick with it maxed; take advantage of the Drell's mobility and hit cover as soon as you get damaged.
 

Cat Party

Member
I used my Crusader shotgun with the max accuracy mod and the thing was hilarious. I need to practice more with it to get the feel for how to use it, but it was beheading everyone if I aimed it right on a silver Cerberus match. It can one-shot a Guardian through the shield slot from across a room, lol. It reloads very fast, too. It's so heavy, though.
 

RS4-

Member
Lol this game

"I don't like drell adepts, they die." So they kick me but the guy that was complaining is an N7-1. On gold.
 

enzo_gt

tagged by Blackace
New N7 weekend sucks in a game where max level is so easily attainable already.

I don't care about XP, gimme da monies.
 
New N7 weekend sucks in a game where max level is so easily attainable already.

I don't care about XP, gimme da monies.

I wish it was +25% credits along with or instead of XP.

You gain XP so fast already.

My thoughts as well. When I saw the N7 Challenge notification pop up on Twitter, I was like, "Awww, hellz yeah." Then I opened the link. Am disappoint.

Guess now's as good of time as any to take my Level 1 Soldier out for a spin.
 
New N7 weekend sucks in a game where max level is so easily attainable already.

I don't care about XP, gimme da monies.

Definitely agreed, but the encouraging thing is that at this rate, they probably will have a credits weekend sooner or later.

Since it's still a fairly new game, this is probably around the time when the players who started off strictly with the single player are now delving into the multiplayer. If I were just starting out, I'd appreciate the (easy to understand) bonus to XP over the credits early on.

It's always fun to play a round then gain like 4 levels all at once.
 
Was just playing then. Some awesome asari vanguards were with me. im IAMBLEST, level 18 Engineer i believe.

This game is excellent, tho i wish there were more maps. First time ive ever played multi on a "shooter" really liking it so far. Shame i have crap weapons and only one mod so far..
 
Been playing a Human Engineer lately... and I am now convinced it's top tier along with Drell/Asari Adepts, Human Vanguard and Salarian Infiltrator.

Agreed. The level 6 combat drone with rockets is like having another person with you. That with Chain overload stuns everyone enough for the vanguards to rush in and pulvarise people.
 

enzo_gt

tagged by Blackace
Definitely agreed, but the encouraging thing is that at this rate, they probably will have a credits weekend sooner or later.

Since it's still a fairly new game, this is probably around the time when the players who started off strictly with the single player are now delving into the multiplayer. If I were just starting out, I'd appreciate the (easy to understand) bonus to XP over the credits early on.

It's always fun to play a round then gain like 4 levels all at once.

+25% XP doesn't bode great for the longevity of the game much I think either.. levelling all of the characters to 20 still seems like it wouldn't take very long either and the endgame would come quick. And "prestiging" in this game is even more useless than in CoD so I don't know about this.

At the rate this game is evolving, I'm open ears to DLC character/level talk already. Though I'm not sure if I'd pay for it exactly. DLC stages should have some different objectives too (carry a power generator to another part of the map, etc.).
 

rozay

Banned
+25% XP doesn't bode great for the longevity of the game much I think either.. levelling all of the characters to 20 still seems like it wouldn't take very long either and the endgame would come quick. And "prestiging" in this game is even more useless than in CoD so I don't know about this.

At the rate this game is evolving, I'm open ears to DLC character/level talk already. Though I'm not sure if I'd pay for it exactly. DLC stages should have some different objectives too (carry a power generator to another part of the map, etc.).
Yep, variation in objectives will be needed to keep things fresh in DLC.

I like this mode but not enough to spend $5-10 per character pack or map pack. Hopefully that doesn't prevent me from playing in the future, but we'll see.
 

Walshicus

Member
I can't believe they're giving XP when we're all maxed anyway.

I can't believe I have to grind credits for a CHANCE at something. I keep getting characters I already have over weapons I don't. What kind of bullshit moron designed this?

Well, ostensibly they seem to be offering it in prep for whatever *next* weekend's objective is.


That said, I like the idea of reactively changing enemy distribution in accordance with meeting or failing community objectives.
 
+25% XP doesn't bode great for the longevity of the game much I think either.. levelling all of the characters to 20 still seems like it wouldn't take very long either and the endgame would come quick. And "prestiging" in this game is even more useless than in CoD so I don't know about this.

At the rate this game is evolving, I'm open ears to DLC character/level talk already. Though I'm not sure if I'd pay for it exactly. DLC stages should have some different objectives too (carry a power generator to another part of the map, etc.).

I don't think the 25% XP weekend is an effort to extend the gameplay; moreso to entice new players to get into the multiplayer (the game's only been out barely two weeks after all).

And I definitely agree with you and rozay... there has to be more to the modes/objectives than just this in order to achieve true longevity. Ideally the DLC will include these new maps/modes/objectives AND include the data for the new classes (so even if you don't buy the DLC, you can still play in games with people who DO buy it). Fragmenting the userbase would be suicide for the multiplayer since there's no competitive element.


I can't believe they're giving XP when we're all maxed anyway.

I can't believe I have to grind credits for a CHANCE at something. I keep getting characters I already have over weapons I don't. What kind of bullshit moron designed this?

The game's been out for two weeks; relax. Last weekend with the Reapers was them throwing a bone to the early multiplayer adopters; this weekend is throwing a bone to the ones who are just getting into it.

As for the system... again, there are plenty of games with random loot systems... all those systems also had some sort of grinding to get that same loot. The only thing different (and I would argue, better) from those systems is the way you *access* your loot. Instead of drops per enemy killed, it's at the end of the round.
 
Maybe it's just me but...Combat Drone fucking sucks.

Don't think of it as a killer of enemies... use it primarily as a distraction and you're golden (the Drone is a big, big reason why I think Human Engineer is top tier).

The insanely fast cooldown, ability to be placed anywhere and reasonable durability means it's the best distraction in the game. It can singlehandedly slow the advance of big enemies like Brutes and an Atlas, can be placed behind enemies in cover like Phantoms, Guardians and Engineers and has abilities useful enough to be worthwhile in combat.

Don't knock Lil Sparky... just change your perspective on him.
 

Kyoufu

Member
Don't think of it as a killer of enemies... use it primarily as a distraction and you're golden (the Drone is a big, big reason why I think Human Engineer is top tier).

The insanely fast cooldown, ability to be placed anywhere and reasonable durability means it's the best distraction in the game. It can singlehandedly slow the advance of big enemies like Brutes and an Atlas, can be placed behind enemies in cover like Phantoms, Guardians and Engineers and has abilities useful enough to be worthwhile in combat.

Don't knock Lil Sparky... just change your perspective on him.

It doesn't even distract enemies... :lol

I'm disappointed :( In ME2 it was your tank, now it's a piece of shit. Guess I'll stick to Decoy.
 
I tried silver with random. First time jumping from Bronze. Two salarians infiltrators, two humans adepts. Geth, firebase glacier. We got our ass kicked at wave 7 after severals near wipes at waves 5 & 6...

Sometimes I feel they played so dumb, sometimes they played really well. I guess the difficulty and the combo of Pyro/Hunter is really trick to handle if you're not tag teaming the shit out of the enemy.
 

enzo_gt

tagged by Blackace
Combat drone distracts enemy not enemies. Works without failure against Guardians, haven't tried it on much else.
 
It doesn't even distract enemies... :lol

This is entirely untrue.

Combat drone distracts enemy not enemies. Works without failure against Guardians, haven't tried it on much else.

Try it on all the big enemies (and enemies in general). Some respond better if it's behind them, some respond better if it's in front of them (notably Brutes). But now I've gotten into the habit of always leading out with Sparky (instead of Overload) whenever encountering a mob... one big plus of the drone is that despite its "transparency", it occupies space that enemies can't just walk past. Great for holding a choke and giving yourself breathing room.
 

Kenaras

Member
Where to even start...

*blinks*

What?!? No Pull whatsoever? So you rely on other players to get maximum effectiveness out of your build? That makes zero sense. So what happens if there are no other biotics on your team? Just Reave? It makes no sense.

Yes, no Pull whatsover. Yes, you rely on other players to get maximum effectiveness; it's a team game after all. A Drell Adept who doesn't combo with another biotic is a mid-tier class; a Drell Adept who does combo with another biotic is god-tier. Go lookup 17-minute Gold speed farming. Zero Pull is the standard Drell Adept build for these runs.

However, you'll notice I recommended 3-4 Pull; this way you don't rely on another biotic. Honestly though, a Reave AoE stun followed by a few Carnifex headshots deals with basic enemies just fine.

The reasons why you *do* want Pull at levels 5 and 6 are:

5: Expose means your weapon damage (and more importantly, biotic detonations) do 25% more damage. This is key. Do you only play on Bronze? Because on Silver/Gold a Pull/Reave detonation usually won't kill a full health basic enemy (hence not "overkill" as you say), but the Reave will finish it off almost immediately (before it can get up and attack). If you don't level up Pull here, then it will take longer for the Reave to finish it off, allowing it to recover and shoot back at you.

You don't even know how biotic detonations work. Detonations scale with difficulty and enemy health, so it doesn't matter whether you're playing on Bronze, Silver, or Gold; if it's strong enough for Bronze it's strong enough for Gold. I have 4 Pull on my Drell Adept; my detonations deal plenty of damage to deal with unprotected enemies, regardless of difficulty. On top of that, it's questionable whether the 25% more damage even applies to detonations. There's debate on that topic, and I haven't seen a definitive answer.

6: Duration & Combo is simple... duration gives you time to get that second Reave in if you miss with the first and the detonation damage (following along with the reasoning above) is crucial to put down enemies as fast as possible.

Besides what I mentioned above, Pull itself is absolutely *critical* to the build. It's got one of the quickest (if not *the* quickest) biotic cooldowns in the game, and if you roll with a single light weapon like a Carnifex or Phalanx you can Pull about every 1.5 seconds (or less). Why is this important? Because even though it only pulls unarmored targets, it also staggers protected enemies like Marauders and Centurions. This means it'll stagger them out of cover (exposing them to Reave) or give you breathing room to whittle their shields down so you can Pull them properly.

1) How do you miss with Reave against a helpless floating target, unless you're intentionally trying?
2) Rank 3/4 Pull works just as well as Rank 6 for hitting targets behind cover.

Also, investing in Pull is far more important than investing in Fitness (the assumed substitute). We all know Drells are squish and Fitness boosts are always a percentage of the base, not a flat increase. A 20% boost to shields/health are more significant on a 500/500 base, but give lower returns on one that's 250/500 (or whatever the Drell's base is). This is balanced through the Drell's mobility... use it! Don't stand your ground when getting swarmed, give ground and run before they close to medium-close range. The Drell is incredibly quick and having Pull (with its amazing cooldown) actually helps to give you breathing room when you need to run.

It's true that "we all know Drells are squish." However, what "we all know" and what's actually true are often very, very different things. Fitness gives Drell a higher % increase than it does other races; this happened in the launch day balance changes. Because of this, Drell gain almost as much health/shields as humans and Asari do. (650 health/shields for humans/Asari, 600 health/shields for Drell.) However, these numbers only matter if you get caught with Reave down. With Reave up, Fitness actually provides more effective health/shields to the Drell Adept than most other classes. I'm specced for 40% damage reduction on my Reave; as such, that 600 bonus health/shields effectively becomes 1000 bonus health/shields as long as I maintain my Reaves.

On top of all that, max Fitness provides an additional 10% movement speed. I like how you conveniently ignore that perk, while simultaneously trumpeting the value of Drell mobility.

The combination of Pull/Reave/Cluster Grenades in fact makes the Drell Adept the slightly better class for me over the Asari Adept with Stasis/Throw/Warp (with both in the top tier of classes). The higher versatility of Stasis/Warp is counterbalanced by the mindnumbing speed of Pull/Reave but nothing the Asari has compares to the massive damage output of Reave/Cluster Grenades. The Asari is more useful overall but when you want to put many different things down *fast* the Drell trumps all other classes (thanks in large part to Pull).

Singularity/Warp is also blisteringly fast, but no one cares. Mowing down unprotected targets simply isn't all that important; it's the elite units which matter. And no, the Drell's ability to drop things fast has almost nothing to do with Pull; it's Reave+Cluster Grenades which do that. If a large group including basic enemies actually looks like a threat, you should be using Reave+Cluster Grenades, not Pull+Reave.
 
It should be worth noting biotic detonations take in to account the level of each power, so having 6 pull might be worth it just for that
 

firehawk12

Subete no aware
I can't believe they're giving XP when we're all maxed anyway.

I can't believe I have to grind credits for a CHANCE at something. I keep getting characters I already have over weapons I don't. What kind of bullshit moron designed this?
I've spoken to randoms who have spent 100 dollars on Spectre packs. They're not going to mess with that economy until much later in the game's life.
 

DY_nasty

NeoGAF's official "was this shooting justified" consultant
Maybe it's just me but...Combat Drone fucking sucks.
It's not just you.

They do suck. Turrets put in more work. Decoy is a better distraction.
Once I get a Geth Shotgun I'll try it out. I have the Disciple but uuuugh I don't like it at all.

I doubt I'd move away from Human Spamhard though. They made that class too good.
Disciple is a pathetic shotgun for doing any kind of damage by itself. It's only great because of its the closest thing to a auto-stagger weapon and with mods you can pretty much lockdown and combo anything that doesn't deserve its own parade.

Also, I hate how the aim is in this game. Unless you look down sights, the reticule is a fucking lie when enemies get up close. Its waaaaaaay off to the right - so you have to adjust and over correct by a pretty significant amount. It's not that big of a deal with the majority of the shotguns because the spray is a lot wider than you'd expect, but when enemies get right under you its a problem because you either have to adjust by leaning left or taking the time to look down sights.
 

Stantron

Member
I can't wait to be paired up with low level randoms when the N7 challenge is eventually Gold with full extraction requirement.

So regarding the Vanguard Charge/Nova spamming build... I understand that being host is better because it will decrease delays. But sometimes my biotic charge is ready, I'm aiming at an enemy at point blank range while spamming Y in the heat of battle... and I die because the move didn't come out. Does it make sense that this happens also while I'm host, or am I missing something. I assume that if you set up the game it will choose you as host automatically. And this can be confirmed by spawning first in wave 1.
 

Kenaras

Member
I can't wait to be paired up with low level randoms when the N7 challenge is eventually Gold with full extraction requirement.

So regarding the Vanguard Charge/Nova spamming build... I understand that being host is better because it will decrease delays. But sometimes my biotic charge is ready, I'm aiming at an enemy at point blank range while spamming Y in the heat of battle... and I die because the move didn't come out. Does it make sense that this happens also while I'm host, or am I missing something. I assume that if you set up the game it will choose you as host automatically. And this can be confirmed by spawning first in wave 1.

When that happens it's usually caused by a Vanguard-specific bug, not lag. In my experience it can happen regardless of whether you're hosting or not. You can usually work around it by firing your weapon, but that doesn't always work.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=36094174&postcount=3198
 

eek5

Member
Maybe it's just me but...Combat Drone fucking sucks.

The problem is that it is inconsistent. The nice thing is you can cast it across the map by ADS at an enemy but the majority of the time they'll just keep walking and the drone will die. Sometimes they'll distract enemies but if you just want a road block decoy is better.
 
Where to even start...

Yes, no Pull whatsover. Yes, you rely on other players to get maximum effectiveness; it's a team game after all. A Drell Adept who doesn't combo with another biotic is a mid-tier class; a Drell Adept who does combo with another biotic is god-tier. Go lookup 17-minute Gold speed farming. Zero Pull is the standard Drell Adept build for these runs.

However, you'll notice I recommended 3-4 Pull; this way you don't rely on another biotic. Honestly though, a Reave AoE stun followed by a few Carnifex headshots deals with basic enemies just fine.

Yes, it's a team game but most people don't have the luxury of playing with dedicated groups that run 2 Asari Adepts and 2 Drell Adepts. And hey, I do agree with your points that speccing a no-Pull Drell Adept is ideal in this very, very limited situation. But using a no-pull Drell Adept in your typical pick up game is very, very gimped.

My discussion on the Drell Adept is predicated on the notion of the class standing up by itself, independent of teammates and weapons. Yours obviously doesn't. It doesn't mean that either of us are wrong, it just means that these are two very different prisms we're evaluating the class with.


You don't even know how biotic detonations work. Detonations scale with difficulty and enemy health, so it doesn't matter whether you're playing on Bronze, Silver, or Gold; if it's strong enough for Bronze it's strong enough for Gold. I have 4 Pull on my Drell Adept; my detonations deal plenty of damage to deal with unprotected enemies, regardless of difficulty. On top of that, it's questionable whether the 25% more damage even applies to detonations. There's debate on that topic, and I haven't seen a definitive answer.

If this is truly the case then hey, I take back what I said before. With that said though, level 6 pull still gives you increased detonation damage and duration. These are worth maxing out the skill, regardless of the controversial benefits of level 5.

1) How do you miss with Reave against a helpless floating target, unless you're intentionally trying?
2) Rank 3/4 Pull works just as well as Rank 6 for hitting targets behind cover.

Not sure what platform you're on but I'm on the 360. Reave is the Y button, which means I have to move my thumb from the right stick to hit Reave (sacrificing aim). Besides the controller mechanics, there are plenty of ways to miss with Reave:

- Pull brings the enemy behind cover
- Pulling in a crowd and the crosshairs land on a non-pulled enemy
- Pulling at an extreme distance and the crosshairs for Reave are tiny

All of these happen with regularity that Reave on the target isn't always a given (still probably a 90-95% success rate though). In those rare instances when it's a miss, Pull duration gives you the time to get it right the second time.


It's true that "we all know Drells are squish." However, what "we all know" and what's actually true are often very, very different things. Fitness gives Drell a higher % increase than it does other races; this happened in the launch day balance changes. Because of this, Drell gain almost as much health/shields as humans and Asari do. (650 health/shields for humans/Asari, 600 health/shields for Drell.) However, these numbers only matter if you get caught with Reave down. With Reave up, Fitness actually provides more effective health/shields to the Drell Adept than most other classes. I'm specced for 40% damage reduction on my Reave; as such, that 600 bonus health/shields effectively becomes 1000 bonus health/shields as long as I maintain my Reaves.

These are very good points and this moves into "arguable" territory for me, but is still heavily dependent on if you're playing a pickup game or with a dedicated group running with all Asaris and Drells.

In the pickup game, being able to get maxed Fitness means no Pull... this absolutely gimps the class and should never even be considered. In a dedicated group, then absolutely maxed Fitness becomes far more viable, and at that point I would guess it's a matter of playstyle preference on the player of whether or not they want to go with or without Pull.

On top of all that, max Fitness provides an additional 10% movement speed. I like how you conveniently ignore that perk, while simultaneously trumpeting the value of Drell mobility.

I didn't ignore the perk at all, I just felt it wasn't relevant. If someone wanted to put a few points in Fitness, I would recommend not maxing Drell Assassin, not Pull (which is the exact build I suggested several pages back on the Drell Adept. 6/6/6/5/3, and this is the same build I have on my own Adept). You get the 10% movement bonus at both level 1 and level 6, but sacrificing Pull entirely is *not* worth the additional shields/health/movement bonus you get from maximizing Fitness.

Singularity/Warp is also blisteringly fast, but no one cares. Mowing down unprotected targets simply isn't all that important; it's the elite units which matter. And no, the Drell's ability to drop things fast has almost nothing to do with Pull; it's Reave+Cluster Grenades which do that. If a large group including basic enemies actually looks like a threat, you should be using Reave+Cluster Grenades, not Pull+Reave.

Singularity/Warp is also a combo only on the Human Adept... considering that class also has Shockwave (and isn't a part of this discussion at all) then it's entirely irrelevant. And I do agree with you that the elite units matter... again, that's the high-level consideration that comes with playing with dedicated groups, not the pickup games that comprise the vast, vast majority of games played (and the vast majority of this thread's posters fall into that category, not the ones looking for 17 minute Gold speed runs).

And I do agree with you that the ability to drop big things fast is based on Reave/Cluster Grenades. But Pull is absolutely key in dealing with the swarms of basic enemies that Reave/CG cannot deal with.

Again, my build tips are based on the notion of evaluating the class as it stands on its own... not in a very narrow situation.
 

Bisnic

Really Really Exciting Member!
Speaking of Drell Adepts, i really feel like i should respec him to lvl 1, mine just got to 20, but i feel like i wasted too much points into getting max Pull, where i should have put them in more defense or cluster grenades power. Especially for silver.

Also, can't wait for the patch that will fix the irritating constant Reave sound.
 

LosDaddie

Banned
I'm basically following the template off that multiplayer build site that's been posted a few times (don't have the URL offhand since I'm on my iPad). But it's basically as follows:

Max out Tech Armor for health/shield bonuses
Max out Rage/Fitness with melee and health/shield bonuses
Max out the grenade
Ignore Incinerate

The idea of this build is to create a melee tank, because if you spec out all the health/shield bonuses, the Krogan Sentinel has the highest health/shield of any class/race.

This means you won't be using any powers. At first I was hesitant to do this since I use powers A LOT, but since the Sentinel only has Incinerate, he's not really a power-heavy player anyways. And since you'll be able to take so much damage, you can maximize your melee strength and constantly get your rage going by smacking shit around.

I'm looking forward to trying this build out. I'm kinda doing it already with my Krogan solider (just got first place in a Silver match ths morning), but it will be nice to eat a ton of damage and shake it off!

Thanks!


Maybe it's just me but...Combat Drone fucking sucks.


It definitely..... was not as useful as I'd hoped it would be.
 
Speaking of Drell Adepts, i really feel like i should respec him to lvl 1, mine just got to 20, but i feel like i wasted too much points into getting max Pull, where i should have put them in more defense or cluster grenades power. Especially for silver.

Also, can't wait for the patch that will fix the irritating constant Reave sound.

Are you playing in dedicated Gold speed run groups with 2 Asari Adepts and another Drell Adept? If not, then I wouldn't.

Curious though, what's your build look like? If you don't have max fitness or max grenades, then where did your points go?
 

Kenaras

Member
In the pickup game, being able to get maxed Fitness means no Pull... this absolutely gimps the class and should never even be considered. In a dedicated group, then absolutely maxed Fitness becomes far more viable, and at that point I would guess it's a matter of playstyle preference on the player of whether or not they want to go with or without Pull.

I think we're in agreement on most points, so I'll just highlight this one. If by "no Pull" you mean "no rank 6 Pull", then yes. If you mean "zero Pull", then no. 6/3/6/5/6 is a popular build which sacrifices very little while keeping Pull. 6/4/6/4/6 and 6/4/5/5/6 are other less-popular options, which I'm personally fond of because AoE Pull is really quite good. It should be noted that the +15% power damage from rank 5 Drell Assassin doesn't apply to biotic detonations, so losing it doesn't hurt as badly as some might think.

Two other notes: 1) I'm on PC, and usually play with 1-3 friends, filling any other spots with publics. That definitely has an impact on how you play. 2) I don't want to waste anymore time defending zero Pull builds, since it's not a build I personally like. I mentioned it because it's a frequently suggested build when this question is asked on other sites, but in my opinion it only shines when partnered with an Asari Adept.
 

Mindlog

Member
Are you playing in dedicated Gold speed run groups with 2 Asari Adepts and another Drell Adept? If not, then I wouldn't.
It doesn't have to be a 2a/2d group, but something similar. Limited/No pull Drells are optimal, but it's liability if you don't play with the right group. 6/3/6/5/6 looks like a great compromise between the two. I'll probably be putting a respec card to use.

My DA has max pull and I use it all the time. However, when a good random group is playing I almost never use it. The same thing applies to stasis bubble. On gold vs Cerberus I stasis the majority of phantoms and guardians. When I'm with a good group I mostly warp and throw.

Speaking of warp and throw: Human Sentinel - Full TA (PDR) with a Power Efficiency III mod is not too effin shabby. Came out on top of a Gold match.

We won a gold match so I bought a premium veteran package. It gave me sniper rifle pierce 2. I stuck it on my Quarian Infiltrator that I never play. During the middle of the game I sniped at two cannibals. I got them both and apparently another group behind them. I got a killstreak with 1 sniper shot. Sniping Defeated.
 

Bisnic

Really Really Exciting Member!
Are you playing in dedicated Gold speed run groups with 2 Asari Adepts and another Drell Adept? If not, then I wouldn't.

Curious though, what's your build look like? If you don't have max fitness or max grenades, then where did your points go?

I have max reave, max pull max or 5 points into "drell something". 4 points into grenades, 5 points into fitness. Something like that i think, im at work, cant check.
 

Mrbob

Member
New N7 weekend sucks in a game where max level is so easily attainable already.

I don't care about XP, gimme da monies.

Yup. Second weekend N7 bonus fail. Getting XP in multi is the easiest thing to obtain.

Bioware also needs to get some more bonuses for "prestiging" and importing your class into the main game. Getting a 10 N7 level overall bonus is worthless, and the single player bonus is pitiful as well for importing your multi character into the war.
 
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