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[Disheveled_Zen]

I honestly don't know. I think the ending poses more questions than answers, but Casey told IGN that any new dlc will not be connected with the end game. Maybe he changes his mind at a later date, but that is straight from his own mouth.

I think this is the thing that bugs me the most about the ending, I mean why even add it if it is never going to be flushed out? Really it just boils down to:

A. The reapers were lying and it did not kill all synthetics and they just did not want you to chose that option as it would permanently kill all the reapers, so the little boy lied in an attempt to make it seem terrible.

B. They were wrong and it only targeted reapers and not other synthetic parts. Fairly assured I read somewhere that EDI is still alive even if you chose the destroy ending.

C. The indoctrination thing, which yes I know they said did'nt happen but who knows.

I don't see many other options that explain it and sadly I think I am just going to wind up having to write my own ending.

 

[Robot Pants]

1. Jacob
2. Kaiden
3. Jack
4. Miranda
5. Vega

Team Humanity First

 

[hao chi]

Casey Hudson has pretty much debunked that indoctrination theory my friend. The guy has said the ending is what it is, and any future dlc will not change that. Sorry to say, the indoc theory is the creation of zealous BSN and GAF ME fans. Ventkid was real, and the last 3 choices were real.

You're taking a bullshitter's word for it though. This is the guy that said the ending wouldn't be A, B, or C.

It's impossible to tell when he's lying or actually telling the truth.

 

[Deraldin]

Red ending is a dumb soldier ending. Why would that be right?

Because everyone plays default male soldier shep. Bioware has the stats to prove it too.

 

[Dresden]

Because everyone plays default male soldier shep. Bioware has the stats to prove it too.

soldier, sure, but not default. Something like 83% of the players make their own Shepard.

 

[Shepard]

Right. The geth quarian fights.

Where you can end the violence and the two make peace.

Something you can't point out to the omniscient AI who apparently thinks that the opposite is inevitable.


We've been discussing this for over a week, we know what he said. It's just completely illogical and goes against the rest of the series.

Geth Quarian is just one example, and they joined forces only because of the Reapers.

 

[Rebel Leader]

1. Garrus, Wrex, Grunt
2. Everybody else

 

[Rufus]

They don't just destroy organics: they destroy synthetics and all knowledge about them. If all they wanted to do is destroy, why don't they do this to lesser civilizations?

Because what the actually do is harvest the most advanced civilization to further themselves. I'm with EatChildren on this. They eat, that's it. They don't need to have a reason, not when the reason the writers came up with requires them to be horrifically fallible without Shep being able to call them on it.

 

[Moaradin]

Think Liara and Garrus are at the top, with Tali following close behind. As characters they developed through all three games and reached a peak that none of the others did. Also, there's a sense of camaraderie between the three of them (shown the most following Thessia) that's not really present elsewhere. Especially in stark contrast to ME2 where everyone was just there because Shep solved their daddy issues.

Legion, Mordin, and Wrex round out the 'great' tiers for me.

After that, characters like Miranda, Jack, and Thane are . . . likable, I guess.

Ashley and Vega are scum.

I agree. Liara, Garrus, and Tali to a lesser extent, are the only characters that I think really connect with Shepard. As a friend or love interest. Legion, Mordin and the other great characters are all very well written but never share the same chemistry with the player as the top 3.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

Geth Quarian is just one example, and they joined forces only because of the Reapers.

EDI is another example.

Geth and quarians didn't even want to fight at first except for a bunch of higher-ups freaking out about it.


Is this really the first time in billions of years that it's gone against some imaginary "pattern"?

 

[WrenchNinja]

They don't just destroy organics: they destroy synthetics and all knowledge about them. If all they wanted to do is destroy, why don't they do this to lesser civilizations?

...why dont they just kill synthetics and tell organics to fuck off with building them Instead of going through a bunch of hoops.

 

[hateradio]

They don't just destroy organics: they destroy synthetics and all knowledge about them. If all they wanted to do is destroy, why don't they do this to lesser civilizations?

Why don't you tell me that.

There is no logical reason behind the Reapers.

 

[Shepard]

If the organics will always get killed by the synthetics... Why come in and kill the organics in the first place? According to their logic they're going to get killed anyways.

Saying they're "god-like" entities is a cop-out. Its shitty logic and writing.

killing the developed organics, they give a chance for the lesser ones to survive. Imagine if they didn't do anything, the synthetics would destroy every organic civilization, developed or not, and that would be a game over.

Why don't you tell me that.

There is no logical reason behind the Reapers.

They tell you. Or how do you think humas, salarians and Asaris survived the previous cycle?

 

[EmCeeGramr]

killing the developed organics, they give a chance for the lesser ones to survive. Imagine if they didn't do anything, the synthetics would destroy every organic civilization, developed or not, and that would be a game over.

NO THEY WON'T

 

[hateradio]

NO THEY WON'T

Just forget it. Jump into the lasers and get it over with.

They tell you. Or how do you think humas, salarians and Asaris survived the previous cycle?

I meant the deeper implications. Not the ones obviously stated.

 

[bengraven]

1. Jack
2. Tali
3. Wrex
4. Javik
5. Garrus

 

[Deraldin]

soldier, sure, but not default. Something like 83% of the players make their own Shepard.

Damn, you're right. I thought the customization feature was lower. 80% in ME2.

 

[Robot Pants]

Why don't you tell me that.

Why don't you take my shirt off

 

[inky]

killing the developed organics, they give a chance for the lesser ones to survive. Imagine if they didn't do anything, the synthetics would destroy every organic civilization, developed or not, and that would be a game over.

For who? What is the point of organic life when all you do is thwart it's very nature i.e. evolution/the cosmic imperative. How does that bring order to chaos, if organic life by it's very definition is either one or the other. How is it not shown than synthetic life moves in a pattern similar to evolution itself, maybe allowing it to become organic some sort of itself. How does having only synthetic life would prevent this synthetic life to create another unexpected organic/synthetic life that just furthers the cycle of destruction?

 

[Banana Kid]

NO THEY WON'T

YES THEY WILL BECAUSE BIOWARE TOLD US SO

CASEY HUDSON'S WORD IS LAW

 

[Achtius]

1. Kaidan
2. Liara

All I need. Singularity + Overload

 

[hateradio]

Why don't you take my shirt off

Because you're not wearing one. ;]

 

[mxgt]

Anyone that doesn't have Garrus in their top 5 is a despicable human being

 

[Hellsing321]

What really gets me is that the Reapers coerced the Geth into attacking organics in ME1 when they just wanted to be left alone.

Best Bros/Waifu Tier
Garrus
Liara
Great Character Arc Tier
Mordin
Legion
Wrex
Tali
Thane
Everyone else Tier
Meh

 

[TheSchwab_7]

1. Legion
2. Mordin
3. Garrus
4. Tali
5. Liara

Legion was just a boss. The geth/quarian conflict was the mist interesting for me and Legion just made it that much cooler.

 

[Metroidvania]

killing the developed organics, they give a chance for the lesser ones to survive. Imagine if they didn't do anything, the synthetics would destroy every organic civilization, developed or not, and that would be a game over.

And where does your proof of this come from, besides the catalyst?

Uh, list time?

1. Garrus
2. Liara
3. Wrex
4. Mordin
5. Thane/Samara

edit: Kicked Samara out of 4, forgot about mordin somehow >_>

 

[luxarific]

One of my favorite parts is having a conversation with Eve as a female Shepard. Asking why she chose to be a shaman and her struggles with it, to be experimented on and her views on what the Krogan's destiny should be if the genophage is cured. It is not pretending to be some overthought bullshit about genocide and feminism, but an honest voice of what her role is both as a female and a leader of sorts while remaining true to the fiction and the background of the krogan you know, and one that you can ultimately sympathize with.

That's not dependent on your Shepard's gender. I had the same conversation with Eve and I was a guy.

 

[Deraldin]

1. Tali/Garrus
2. Garrus/Tali
3. Liara
4. Wrex
5. Mordin

That is all.

 

[Disheveled_Zen]

What really gets me is that the Reapers coerced the Geth into attacking organics in ME1 when they just wanted to be left alone.

Not to mention the Reapers never give you any sort of proof to back up the claims they are saying despite you having several examples that prove them wrong including you making peace with the Geth, despite Reaper interference.

 

[Kurtofan]

What really gets me is that the Reapers coerced the Geth into attacking organics in ME1 when they just wanted to be left alone.

That explains their disdain of them though.Once they used them, they would have destroyed them for sure.

 

[hateradio]

What really gets me is that the Reapers coerced the Geth into attacking organics in ME1 when they just wanted to be left alone.

Exactly, the Reapers simply perpetuate their self-fulfilling prophesy. There's nothing but bad logic in that.

 

[Rufus]

Uh, list time?

Gawd, screw the lot of you.

 

[inky]

That's not dependent on your Shepard's gender. I had the same conversation with Eve and I was a guy.

But she throws an extra line in the end I think about respecting the position of women and placing their hopes on them. I thought it was cool regardless, didn't mean to say it was an exclusive thing to femshep.

 

[Shepard]

NO THEY WON'T

Yes they will, it makes much more sense. Organics need synthetics (technology) to live, synthetics don't.

For who? What is the point of organic life when all you do is thwart it's very nature i.e. evolution/the cosmic imperative. How does that bring order to chaos, if organic life by it's very definition is either one or the other.

They prevent organics death by stopping synthetics before they are too powerful to destroy the organics.

 

[Dresden]

Not to mention that the two biggest threats to the galaxy prior to the Reapers coming back were the Rachni and the Krogan--organics killing organics. I guess you could say that the Reapers are killing all the organics so they can't kill all the other organics. Lol.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

Yes they will, it makes much more sense. Organics need synthetics (technology) to live, synthetics don't.

They prevent organics death by stopping synthetics before they are too powerful to destroy the organics.

So why haven't EDI and the geth murdered everyone?

Why haven't the Catalyst and the Reapers murdered everyone?

Why is it specifically synthetics? Why not other organics? What's the line between synthetic and organic?


The entire series up until that last 10 minutes refutes this idea (that synthetics will always wipe out all organic life), and Shepard simply gives up and accepts that it's a problem.

It'd be like forcing the synthesis ending because the Catalyst says "nobody can come to a compromise in the galaxy, making everyone half-robot will solve that problem." No, that's wrong. I've been doing that for three games now.

 

[hateradio]

They prevent organics death by stopping synthetics before they are too powerful to destroy the organics.

But the reapers themselves are synthetic. They are not only part of the cycle, but the cycle itself. By culling the universe every 50,000 years they inevitably kill organics. It doesn't matter if they're primitive or not. Eventually they'll get to them.

 

[Jasoneyu]

I think the problem is that the bioware writers tried to make the reapers more that what they were, galatic feeders that strive from genetic perfection though indocrination of other species throughout thousands of cycles.

By giving the player this synthetic/organic balance bullshit AT THE END OF THE GAME with no prior heads up (other than what the VI mentioned in Thessia) it makes the ending become shitty and confusing.

And shepard would NEVER select the merge with the reapers choice based on a 5 minute conversation with a creepy holographic kid who is controlling the reapers. Goes against the whole story arc of not giving in to controlling them.

 

[Kurtofan]

Is there any romance confrontation?I never thought about teaming up Tali and Ashley, but is there banter about it?Ashley was just brooding, worst character ever.

 

[Rebel Leader]

But the reapers themselves are synthetic. Meaning they are causing the cycle. By culling the universe every 50,000 years they inevitably kill organics. It doesn't matter if they're primitive or not. Eventually they'll get to them.

They are only primitive in time not in tech

 

[OpinionatedCyborg]

Out of curiosity, I checked to see how long I played each game:

ME1: 15 hours < ME3: 24 hours < ME2: 34 hours

I think this adequately reflects how much I enjoyed each game too! Getting to know each character in ME2 was a ton of fun and the suicide mission at the end was great (only lost Legion because I picked Samara to lead one of the teams... foolish move on my part, but shit happens). The gameplay was vastly superior (to the first) and the RPG elements, some of which were really annoying in the first, were streamlined (perhaps too streamlined; they took away a bit too much IMO). I also liked it for the same reason I like thrillers: why am I resurrected? What is TIM really after? Can I trust Miranda and this black dude who works for a racist organization? Am I being spied on by the EDI? Is TIM controlling me? Will giving this reaper tech to TIM result in it indoctrinating him like Sovereign did to Saren? etc. The game never fully capitilized on my paranoia and it never allowed me to ask TIM the questions I wanted to to fully assess his plans. Nevertheless, I was engaged, much more so than with ME1, which I ran through quickly and rolled my eyes at every painful sci-fi cliche.

As for favourite characters, the only character who matters to me is Shepard. Man, she's awesome. Really too bad she had to go out like a mindless zombie. No option to say "fuck you, we'd rather die fighting the reapers than take one of your three options." No option to ask more questions about the three options presented. No way to argue or influence the outcome at the end. No hand in the order or way the allied troups attacked the Reapers. Disappointing end to an incredible character - funny, charismatic, compassionate, and hard as nails when it counted. RIP shepard. I've already created a new series of events in my mind to create a more suitable ending for you.

the import face thingy didn't work with ME3... which was actually a good thing. her complexion became a bit fucked up and her face a bit fully. she looks more like a soldier now but still a little too girly for my liking (why couldn't we customize bodies like those old WWF games for the N64? my chick would've been built like an MMA fighter rather than some dainty little thing with huge child-bearing hips):

 

[hateradio]

They are only primitive in time not in tech

To the Reapers, 50,000 years are nothing. They wake up and say, "It's killin' time already?"

 

[inky]

They prevent organics death by stopping synthetics before they are too powerful to destroy the organics.

But they only prevent organic deaths to a certain point, like I said, by stopping evolution, the very nature of the organic life they are supposedly preserving. There is no reason to believe synthetics would wipe out all organic life, as evidenced by the Geth who exiled themselves until the reapers showed up or the Quarians attacked.

 

[Shepard]

So why haven't EDI and the geth murdered everyone?

Why haven't the Catalyst and the Reapers murdered everyone?

Why is it specifically synthetics? Why not other organics? What's the line between synthetic and organic?


The entire series up until that last 10 minutes refutes this idea (that synthetics will always wipe out all organic life), and Shepard simply gives up and accepts that it's a problem.

It'd be like forcing the synthesis ending because the Catalyst says "nobody can come to a compromise in the galaxy, making everyone half-robot will solve that problem." No, that's wrong. I've been doing that for three games now.

But the reapers themselves are synthetic. Meaning they are causing the cycle. By culling the universe every 50,000 years they inevitably kill organics. It doesn't matter if they're primitive or not. Eventually they'll get to them.

Like I said, they stop the synthetics before they are too powerful to destroy organics. The Catalyst and Reapers are don't know how many cycles developed entities, they're almost the rulers of the universe: they've seen the pattern repeat itself over and over so they created a cycle of extermination to prevent the total end of the organics. Repaers and the Catalyst are not mindless Geth.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

Like I said, they stop the synthetics before they are too powerful to destroy organics. The Catalyst and Reapers are don't know how many cycles developed entities, they're almost the rulers of the universe: they've seen the pattern repeat itself over and over so they created a cycle of extermination to prevent the total end of the organics. Repaers and the Catalyst are not Geth.

This is word salad. You have no idea what you're saying.

 

[Dresden]

Like I said, they stop the synthetics before they are too powerful to destroy organics. The Catalyst and Reapers are don't know how many cycles developed entities, they're almost the rulers of the universe: they've seen the pattern repeat itself over and over so they created a cycle of extermination to prevent the total end of the organics. Repaers and the Catalyst are not mindless Geth.

that doesn't even make sense

so to stop the synthetics from killing organics

they kill all the organics

instead of just stopping the synthetics

 

[Disheveled_Zen]

The thing I don't get is what was all that crap Sovereign fed to me about not being able to understand anything about the Reapers when everything gets explained by a six year old kid in the span of a minute. Maybe he actually meant my mind could not comprehend the plot holes that undid the entire story I played through for five years.

Also I like how Shep was just like Ok, all I can picture now is the OK whiny sigh Ross does from friends with his sad face.

 

[DSix]

1. Garrus (bro forever)
2. Liara (my waifu)
3. Tali
4. Wrex
5. Legion

In ME2 I tried to do Tali as femshep but it never took

edit: oh... I'm late to the list party

 

[Deraldin]

Like I said, they stop the synthetics before they are too powerful to destroy organics. The Catalyst and Reapers are don't know how many cycles developed entities, they're almost the rulers of the universe: they've seen the pattern repeat itself over and over so they created a cycle of extermination to prevent the total end of the organics. Repaers and the Catalyst are not mindless Geth.

Yet they apparently didn't notice in the past two cycles that there are examples that contradict this. The Geth just wanted to be left alone and even in Javik's cycle where there was a big war with synthetics (The metacon war Javik mentioned) the Protheans were winning.

 

[hateradio]

Like I said, they stop the synthetics before they are too powerful to destroy organics. The Catalyst and Reapers are don't know how many cycles developed entities, they're almost the rulers of the universe: they've seen the pattern repeat itself over and over so they created a cycle of extermination to prevent the total end of the organics. Repaers and the Catalyst are not Geth.

It would have been better if they said that they stop advanced organics because they're able to create advanced AIs which could eventually threaten the Reapers. It would have made some sense in that direction.

They're not the rulers of the universe, however. They're just sentient machines that have been around for millions of years. They only see the pattern because they themselves seem to cause it every 50,000 years.