Support NeoGAF

[EmCeeGramr]

I read the interview and had to look up Catharsis meant on wikipedia not really into literature.
Lets say the description of the word and my feeling were almost the same.

this is the quote "me" is the interviewer.


Wikipedia description of Carthatic.


So they wanted us to hate the franchise???
Job well done he should write for hollywood.

Cathartic is a positive term. It means emotional release or payoff. So if you're in a suspenseful scene, seeing the scene end in a good way is catharsis. If you hate a character, and then they end up getting their comeuppance, that's cathartic.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvypGrIG4B4

I guess thats why joker was running off with the normandy. This ending had the blast destroying everything.

They just applied this to all the endings even when the normandy wasn't in danger >.>.

So has anyone come up with a reason yet for why the amount of "war assets" would change whether or not red space magic blows up the Earth or spares it?

I say "spares it" even though a giant space station filled with pollutants is about to collapse onto the only habitable planet in the Sol system causing an extinction-level event anyway and rendering the billions of civilians and soldiers trapped in the system without resources.

 

[ezekial45]

So it is safe to assume that any squad mates that are with Shepard prior to the ending sequence dies? Cause I brought Garrus and Kaiden with me, and they were never seen again after that.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

So it is safe to assume that any squad mates that are with Shepard prior to the ending sequence taking place dies? Cause I brought Garrus and Kaiden with me, and they were never seen again after that.

No, they have a chance to show up leaving the Normandy at the end as though nothing happened.

 

[Apophenia Overload]

How bad was Halo 3's ending in comparison? Or was it bad? What was the fan response? All I know about it is that Johnson and Anderson share almost comically similar fates, and that

Spoiler

343 Guilty Spark

is the last boss? What? I ask because Halo is probably the most major space opera video game series in recent years besides Mass Effect in terms of depth of lore. Maybe Starcraft and Half-Life as well, but those series are not close to over yet.

 

[HarryHengst]

So it is safe to assume that any squad mates that are with Shepard prior to the ending sequence dies? Cause I brought Garrus and Kaiden with me, and they were never seen again after that.

Nah, they are on the Normandy. I had Liara with me and she stepped out the ship at the end. No idea how thats possible and why they left Shepard on Earth, but oh well.

 

[Derrick01]

So it is safe to assume that any squad mates that are with Shepard prior to the ending sequence dies? Cause I brought Garrus and Kaiden with me, and they were never seen again after that.

Not necessarily. I had Garrus and Ashley with me up to that point where Harbinger comes down and at the end when everyone's getting off the shuttle it was Joker, Ashley and Javik for me.

Ashley was my love interest though so maybe that's why.

 

[Enduin]

Not necessarily. I had Garrus and Ashley with me up to that point where Harbinger comes down and at the end when everyone's getting off the shuttle it was Joker, Ashley and Javik for me.

Ashley was my love interest though so maybe that's why.

Apparently if your war assets are low they will die and you will see their bodies there behind you if Ive heard correct, if not they totally bailed on you and high tailed it back to the Normandy.

 

[dragonelite]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvypGrIG4B4

I guess thats why joker was running off with the normandy. This ending had the blast destroying everything.

They just applied this to all the endings even when the normandy wasn't in danger >.>.

lol that makes even less sense if you ask me. Because you didn't gather enough troops the Space Magic is Deadly??? Dam you bioware.

If you wanted people to hate synthetic life why not let EDI betray you at illusive man base because of the reaper code fragment. The geth after legion uploaded reaper data still attacked the Quarian just because they thought they surpassed organic life. Then i would have had no problem with Destroy cutscene.

And if you wanted to do something different then Mass Effect be open to it with your fanbase.
And give it a proper good thought out endings.

 

[HarryHengst]

Apparently if your war assets are low they will die and you will see their bodies there behind you if Ive heard correct, if not they totally bailed on you and high tailed it back to the Normandy.

Ahaha, if thats true thats even more ridiculous. The whole series long you get told that Shepard is great partly because of her ability to bind people to her who follow almost blindly wherever she goes, and at the final moment they abandon her?

 

[firehawk12]

Ahaha, if thats true thats even more ridiculous. The whole series long you get told that Shepard is great partly because of her ability to bind people to her who follow almost blindly wherever she goes, and at the final moment they abandon her?

Yeah, either they die, or abandon you or get teleported to the Normandy somehow. It's all very weird... like, how did Anderson make it? Was he behind you the whole time?

 

[Petrichor]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvypGrIG4B4

I guess thats why joker was running off with the normandy. This ending had the blast destroying everything.

They just applied this to all the endings even when the normandy wasn't in danger >.>.

The music is so good. Especially when joker is trying to outrun the blast.

 

[Xander51]

I just finished this. I agree with most of the sentiments in this thread. The ending is TERRIBLE. I actually enjoyed ME 2's ending, but this I can't really defend at all.

It's more arbitrary and out of the blue than the endings of Fallout 3 and Deus EX HR combined.

 

[MotionBlue]

Ahaha, if thats true thats even more ridiculous. The whole series long you get told that Shepard is great partly because of her ability to bind people to her who follow almost blindly wherever she goes, and at the final moment they abandon her?

Shepard lead the charge towards the beam, and was wiped out along with some troops, there was a fallback order shortly before/after Shepard was hit. I assume they were following you, but obeyed the order to fall back thinking you were dead.

 

[Tookay]

edit: Oh, you mean did I view it morally bad? I think the part where they said the cycle would repeat is what makes it a morally wrong choice, for me.

Except Shepard proved that it didn't necessarily have to repeat. The Ghost Kid was wrong.

 

[Black-Box]

WHYYYY TALIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII

THEY RUINED HER.

and just like that I jump on the bioware hate camp

 

[Rokam]

The greyed out option with the IM I believe requires you to use every blue/red choice when you encounter him throughout the game. There's one on Mars that you can miss out on if you don't pick the option on the left middle side that just explains things further. Missed it on my first run through.

 

[firehawk12]

The greyed out option with the IM I believe requires you to use every blue/red choice when you encounter him throughout the game. There's one on Mars that you can miss out on if you don't pick the option on the left middle side that just explains things further. Missed it on my first run through.

I assumed that had to do with the 4000/5000 EMS score thing, actually?

 

[branny]

I finally got through the game yesterday. I felt physically ill watching the credits. I left the game feeling exhausted (admittedly this may have been more related to Insanity), confused, and disappointed, lacking any drive to start it up for another playthrough ever again.

I can excuse a lot of the over-the-top crap, occasional hit-or-miss fanservice, the cloying and nonsensical vent kid pity party stuff, questionable and sometimes absurd retconning, and even ridiculous moments of plot serendipity that require a huge suspension of disbelief. But to see such franchise inconsistency on this scale? Inexcusable. ME3 can only properly function on the assumption that ME1 doesn't exist. And there is absolutely no way can I defend ME3 from the last mission to its conclusion. The final 15 or so minutes in particular are so bad that they have probably soured my opinion of the entire series.

This is coming from someone who loves the original Mass Effect far more than he probably should and who doesn't care either way about the "controversial" plot twists in games like Star Ocean 2/3 and Digital Devil Saga.

I'm frustrated because there were some really touching vignettes throughout the game, the combat was improved over ME2 (adepts are fixed), there was less bullshit minigame tedium, we finally got proper homosexual romances, and some of ME1's atmosphere was actually back. I was perfectly happy to ignore the fact that Reapers were supposed to seize the Citadel immediately upon their return to mess with all the relays and prevent everything Shepard was trying to accomplish in ME3. It was fine if I was getting something in return, whether it was closure with plot threads, characters, or even simply some cheap thrills. ME3 came along and helped me finally begin accepting ME2's existence as important to the Mass Effect universe--another feat I thought would've been completely impossible.

Now we're rewarded with brief, vague, and wholly unsatisfying endings that come out of nowhere, with magical solutions to problems we never encountered along the way, with objectively flawed explanation in all the wrong areas (most of it actually going against what has been laid out by earlier games), and left without any meaningful representation of our actions across a series defined completely by player agency.

 

[Bowdz]

Except Shepard proved that it didn't necessarily have to repeat. The Ghost Kid was wrong.

That was definitely the most jarring aspect of the ending. ME1/2 built the Reapers up to be beyond our comprehension, but when you talk to their puppetmaster (so much for each Reaper being a nation), you find out that their entire purpose is based on a theory you just disproved (in most playthroughs I'm assuming).

 

[neojubei]

Finished the game.....kinda of sad now. I knew Shepard wasn't going to make it and seeing Anderson just slouch beside her dying....so sad.

 

[Digoman]

And whoever thought it was so fucking smart to use that kid as a narrative device should be fired. Why does shepard give a shit about this kid? It's just so maddening to even think about it.

Up until the endings this was probably my biggest complain with the game storywise. After all the shit Sheppard have seen (visions of an entire empire/species destroyed in the previous cycle, countless humans being turned into reaper-making goo and so on) this kid is what stick to him? Maybe if you reach hard enough my Paragon Shepard but my cliche Renegade Femshep? No way. That is the problem if you try to make a custom hero in a RPG and then decide what affects him/her or not.

Going back to ending and the interview where Mac Walters says "But this is the last story that will be in this time period.", more and more it appears that Bioware is going to use the destruction of the relays and some timeskip to basically reset any of the actions of the players and start the next project without any branching. Still don't know how they are going to deal with endings "choices".. maybe everything ends up on synthesis ending one way or the other (catalyst did say the AIs would eventually rise up again).

I get that you can't deal with all possible branches at this point, so just pick a cannon path and go from there. Anything other that then these endings... (assuming that was what they were for).

 

[dragonelite]

Ahaha, if thats true thats even more ridiculous. The whole series long you get told that Shepard is great partly because of her ability to bind people to her who follow almost blindly wherever she goes, and at the final moment they abandon her?

Still that is why i think your squad should have made it with you onto the citadel.
Anderson and illusive man dialogue. You shoot/kill him or force him to suicide.

Then you have to make a choice get assimilated by the Ai god(indoctrinated without the player really knowing forcing him to believe the dark matter/energy plot) ends see the races of the new cycle rise up.

Or stand aside and that claim that im not the one who can decide over all the races and will fight against the indoctrination attempt and then the Ai god revives the Illusive man in his reaper form. Have to fight it out with that reaper Illusive man or some other boss battle.
The Citadel will probably Explode so the normandy picks you and your squad up just in time.

queue in potential fucked up Epilogue Bioware style......
/Suck it i like cheesy heroic happy endings.

For the epilogue.
There are multiple variables.
Assuming that your ME 2 crew is either fighting on earth or Commanding ship in space.
Low War assets normandy can't make it in time to get shepard of the citadel because low war assets means less support in space means Joker has a harder time to reach the citadel.

Other Squad mates are probably in space or on earth for the final battle. Low War assets means that your Squad mates meet their end because they got overpowered simple like that where as if you do get enough war assets Some random ship or npc character will take the hit. You know the "that could have been me take the bullet" scenario. You know Wrex and Grunt will survive everything because they have big quads

Then after the who survives lottery you can start the rebuilding cutscene.
But then again Bioware had to render a lot more cutscenes.
So really it makes me wondering maybe the shitty ending has to do with a technical issue instead of creative issue.
Limited by disk space to fully tell the story

/Still in denial phase come on. How long does something like this go on. Tell me DA 2 people.

 

[LumpOfCole]

What the hell gives Shepard the right to change every organic and synthetic in the galaxy to suit the needs of less conflict and peace?

Just typing that made me feel stupider. I hate these endings.

 

[Minion101]

Why don't the Reapers kill the synthetics who are trying to kill us

 

[Last Hearth]

I agree, what if I'm a human and I don't want to be part machine. Opps, sorry, you have to be assimilated for the sake of the "greater good". So Shepard is space tyrant/big brother/Borg.

And they want us to believe that synthesis is the best ending?

 

[Confidence Man]

/Still in denial phase come on. How long does something like this go on. Tell me DA 2 people.

Forever.

 

[Dion Blaster]

This ending reminds me of the Animorphs book series. Interesting universe, though provoking, moral choices, but the ending was pretty unsatisfying.

I will say that I enjoyed Animorphs more overall, and despite the sucky ending it made more logical sense than the Mass Effect ending.

 

[Rei no Otaku]

I actually liked the ending. There were things about it I'd definitely have done differently (make the choices much more unique for one), but overall I enjoyed it.

 

[Apophenia Overload]

So, um, how do the endings compare to what Halo 3's ending did for that series, guys?

 

[Keasar]

What the hell gives Shepard the right to change every organic and synthetic in the galaxy to suit the needs of less conflict and peace?

Just typing that made me feel stupider. I hate these endings.

THE STAR CHILD COMMANDS IT!

All hail spooky kid!

 

[pa22word]

The greyed out option with the IM I believe requires you to use every blue/red choice when you encounter him throughout the game.

Please tell me this isn't true. It would have meant BioWare has learned nothing at since they made KotOR when it comes to story telling, and that they've once again undermined the entire point of dialog options. Who gives a shit that I have dialog choices when I'm forced to be either Mother Theresa or Hitler in order to get the best outcomes? Might as well play this game on the damn shooter setting that picks the dialog for you and quit fooling myself that this game actually has meaningful choices in it.

What a disgrace.

 

[The Librarian]

I agree, what if I'm a human and I don't want to be part machine. Opps, sorry, you have to be assimilated for the sake of the "greater good". So Shepard is space tyrant/big brother/Borg.

And they want us to believe that synthesis is the best ending?

I still don't understand what "synthesis" is. So all living things will forever have machine parts?

 

[McNum]

I assumed that had to do with the 4000/5000 EMS score thing, actually?

Got all of the blues on TIM with a mere 3100 EMS score, so no, I don't think it matters much more than a full bar, at least.

So... this is how Mass Effect ends? I'm not sure if I like it or not, but it was... interesting. Oh, sure, it's not what I would have done, but I don't hate it either. (My mad idea would have been Shepard taking control of a Reaper and duke it out with Harbinger in a burning city Godzilla style. Final blow of the game? Heavy Melee attack that cuts Harbinger in two.)

I picked the Synthesis ending for my Shepard. I figured that's what he'd do, having gone from hating all AIs, to respecting EDI and Legion to finally accepting synthetics as a lifeform of their own. Could also have gone for Control, I suppose, but Synthesis just seemed better for this one. Now organic and synthetic are the same. In theory, at least. I think I'll play through the game again, I do have two full trilogy Shepards. Wonder what ending will fit my Paragade who is ruthless to her foes, but kind to her friends... She won't do Synthesis.

But you know what? I'm still sad that it had to cost the Mass Relays. I like the Mass Effect world, but without the relays, the story is over. No more casual galaxy travel, no more galactic community. Over. And I wanted a Mass Effect 4 set a few hundred years later, or a Garrus game or something... But nope! Galaxy over. Please insert new franchise to continue.

 

[Rokam]

Please tell me this isn't true. It would have meant BioWare has learned nothing at since they made KotOR when it comes to story telling, and that they've once again undermined the entire point of dialog options. Who gives a shit that I have dialog choices when I'm forced to be either Mother Theresa or Hitler in order to get the best outcomes? Might as well play this game on the damn shooter setting that picks the dialog for you and quit fooling myself that this game actually has meaningful choices in it.

What a disgrace.

Well it's either that you have to pay NG+ or have to play multiplayer. Take your pick, none of the options for why it's grey are good.

 

[Rokam]

I still don't understand what "synthesis" is. So all living things will forever have machine parts?

I think you get a taste of what it means at least for synthetics early on when Legion shows you what the Reaper upgrades did to the Geth. Made them individuals.

 

[Lingitiz]

So, um, how do the endings compare to what Halo 3's ending did for that series, guys?

Halo 3's ending was fine, it was a nice culmination of everything the chief had done up to that point, and offered a solution that neatly wrapped up the conflict with the flood and covenant. At the same time, it gave you a feeling that the rest of the galaxy was at peace while Master Chief's story was left open ended for more adventures.

In comparison, ME3's ending has so many loose ends, and a foreboding feeling that whatever choice you made just wasn't enough, and perhaps the galaxy might even be worse off because of your actions. The loss of the relays and so many people dying off makes it seem like there is very little to salvage from the universe.

 

[firehawk12]

Got all of the blues on TIM with a mere 3100 EMS score, so no, I don't think it matters much more than a full bar, at least.

Hrm, so what does the whole "save Anderson" thing mean then? I just assumed that below 4000 EMS, you can't convince TIM to shoot himself and Anderson has to die.

 

[MotionBlue]

I still don't understand what "synthesis" is. So all living things will forever have machine parts?

The way I understand it, Synthesis changes the fundamental way of the universe. The line between Organic and Synthetic is forever gone.

Think Beast Machines, with the technorganic bullshit.

 

[Rokam]

Hrm, so what does the whole "save Anderson" thing mean then? I just assumed that below 4000 EMS, you can't convince TIM to shoot himself and Anderson has to die.

Below 4000 EMS you can still shoot TIM and "save" Anderson. No matter what though Anderson dies.

 

[Bowdz]

Up until the endings this was probably my biggest complain with game storywise. After all the shit Sheppard have seen (visions of an entire empire/species destroyed in the previous cycle, countless humans being turned into reaper-making goo and so on) this kid is what stick to him? Maybe if you reach hard enough my Paragon Shepard but my cliche Renegade Femshep? No way.

Although I was not a fan of the child sequences and forcing them on the player, it is worth noting that witnessing the death of a child can have a profound impact on a lot of people. When I was taking my EMT class, all of the instructors were adamant that pediatrics in EMS was the worst aspect of the job. The entire tone of the class was changed and the instructors (all of whom had been paramedics for 20+ years and most of whom had only dealt with a handful of pediatrics) emphatically stated that their experiences with children were hands down the most emotionally taxing and painful of their careers. So while I wasn't a particularly big fan of the child being used in the game, I don't think it is that outrageous to think that an event like that, even with only a brief exposure to the child, could effect somewhat who has already witnessed large quantities of pain and suffering.

I do have to admit that I loved the hauntingly beautiful remix of "Leaving Earth" in the dream sequences. I'm just starting a second playthrough and I just paused the game at the first dream and let the music play in the background for a while.

 

[firehawk12]

Below 4000 EMS you can still shoot TIM and "save" Anderson. No matter what though Anderson dies.

So the only thing that 4000 EMS gets you is the Shepard lives ending?

 

[neojubei]

What the hell gives Shepard the right to change every organic and synthetic in the galaxy to suit the needs of less conflict and peace?

Just typing that made me feel stupider. I hate these endings.

It makes sense. Not to ruin the ending of Battlestar Galatica but............

Spoiler

They pretty much did the same thing.

The middle choice was the only choice or else there will always be war with organics and cybernetics. Synthesis is the only solution. The created will always rebel with their creators. The Quarians and Geth are proof.

 

[Rokam]

So the only thing that 4000 EMS gets you is the Shepard lives ending?

Appears so, and that's only if you choose to destroy synthetics. So yeah fuck that. Shit Legion and his Geth were the true good guys.

 

[McNum]

Hrm, so what does the whole "save Anderson" thing mean then? I just assumed that below 4000 EMS, you can't convince TIM to shoot himself and Anderson has to die.

Nope, my Shepard just Saren'd The Illusive Man. I swear, the most dangerous weapon my Shepard had wasn't his glorious Widow sniper rifle. It was his "Blue to awesome!" speech.

Finding that Widow was like finding an old friend in the game. Sure, meeting the ME2 crew was nice, but finding the Widow? Yay! Get AP Ammo from Garrus, the +a lot of damage from Cloak and take down Harvesters in one shot. Good old painless.

 

[Digoman]

What the hell gives Shepard the right to change every organic and synthetic in the galaxy to suit the needs of less conflict and peace?

Just typing that made me feel stupider. I hate these endings.

Are you question the green space magic? Shame on you.

/Still in denial phase come on. How long does something like this go on. Tell me DA 2 people.

DA2 (storytelling wise) was a masterpiece compared to this. Bioware sure showed me. I though that my choices were meaningless on the third act of that game, but now I know how it really feels to have everything you did wiped out.

 

[Rokam]

It makes sense. Not to ruin the ending of Battlestar Galatica but............

Spoiler

They pretty much did the same thing.

The middle choice was the only choice or else there will always be war with organics and cybernetics. Synthesis is the only solution. The created will always rebel with their creators. The Quarians and Geth are proof.

The Geth didn't rebel though. The Quarians fired on them first and murdered other Quarians. They had no choice, hell the Geth even tried to surrender.

 

[Tookay]

How bad was Halo 3's ending in comparison? Or was it bad? What was the fan response? All I know about it is that Johnson and Anderson share almost comically similar fates, and that

Spoiler

343 Guilty Spark

is the last boss? What? I ask because Halo is probably the most major space opera video game series in recent years besides Mass Effect in terms of depth of lore. Maybe Starcraft and Half-Life as well, but those series are not close to over yet.

Halo 3's ending sucked as well. Actually, the whole Halo storyline is an exercise in missed potential. A lot of interesting setup with the Covenant got wasted on space zombies. Sort of like ME.

Two series that couldn't just leave well enough alone. They had intriguing concepts, but then ancient races and universe-threatening villains hijack the plot, when the base stuff (humans vs. Covenant, humans/turians/geth/etc dealing with each other) was more compelling. It's like these writers don't trust themselves and have to throw cliched villains on top of things to solidify their stories.

What the hell gives Shepard the right to change every organic and synthetic in the galaxy to suit the needs of less conflict and peace?

Just typing that made me feel stupider. I hate these endings.

Exactly. The synthetic ending bothers me especially because of this. It's just a creepy playing God like that.

That was definitely the most jarring aspect of the ending. ME1/2 built the Reapers up to be beyond our comprehension, but when you talk to their puppetmaster (so much for each Reaper being a nation), you find out that their entire purpose is based on a theory you just disproved (in most playthroughs I'm assuming).

And the worst part is, Shepard just sort of nods along with the kid saying that, when you should get an option to retort the basic premise of his argument as STUPID.

 

[Petrichor]

It makes sense. Not to ruin the ending of Battlestar Galatica but............

Spoiler

They pretty much did the same thing.

The middle choice was the only choice or else there will always be war with organics and cybernetics. Synthesis is the only solution. The created will always rebel with their creators. The Quarians and Geth are proof.

What prevents the new bio-synthetics from... creating their own synthetics though? (That could rebel..)

Yeah. I actually would have liked the endings if it was a straight choice between control / destroy (and if it was made clear that choosing control would only delay the reaper cycle, not stop it)

 

[Red Blaster]

So I think we can all agree that ME3's ending was worse than MGS4's. Unbelievable to think how someone could top it yet here were are.

 

[dragonelite]

So, um, how do the endings compare to what Halo 3's ending did for that series, guys?

Halo had a legendary ending which held the franchise open for a sequel.
A sequel that is getting its core fans prepared with novels that dig into pre halo:Ce history.
Hell those novel's lore could be a nice prequel Trilogy for 343 studios to explore if they wanted to too after the Reclaimer trilogy.

And halo 3 was far from IP suicide.
Only thing was Chief was in Cryo sleep floating what looked like the marathon planet but is now know as a forerunner ShieldWorld.

So either the Master Chief would land on the Shieldworld or he would be found by unsc/oni.
Because of the beacon Miranda dropped.

It is only because Halo started on the Xbox or else i would be my IP of this gen.