If you don't use the renegade option, he stabs the hologram keyboard thing as Shepard dodges his attack then stabs him.
So destroying his sword = renegade. Why? Because it's more badass that way.
Mass Effect 3 SPOILER THREAD: LOTS OF SPECULATION FROM EVERYONE
- Thread starter XANDER CAGE
- Start date
- Status
If you don't use the renegade option, he stabs the hologram keyboard thing as Shepard dodges his attack then stabs him.
So destroying his sword = renegade. Why? Because it's more badass that way.
heliosRAzi
Banned
It plays out the same way if you don't use the interrupt command. You just don't break his sword.
You have so much hope, but I can only see desperation
It funny, in the first case, if you don't do the renegade interrupt, you still kill kai leng. The result is the same, just a different cutscene. Udina gets shot by Ashley/Kaiden without the interrupt. TIM killed me when I didn't shoot him, so yeah, I don't see how self defense is renegade.
Just add this to the list of unexplainable logic.
they were working on the game and they were paid to do so....
its a product. but they didn't care or couldn't go the extra step!
bioware with a typical short ending to the trilogy ala-cod(or any similar game with light story) totally invalidates and nulls the game they made.
its a nice game.its not greatness.
me trilogy could have been halflife2/fallout2 quality.
but they are definitely not. imagine replaying me2 or me3 and facing decision that you know they wont matter. it wont be the same. when you saw a decision moment while playing the games it was awesome. this doesn't exist anymore!
who cares if you choose quarians or cure the genophage?
you just choose different teammates while playing the trilogy through some decisions. one can say they are decisions of the on-rail shooters kind,choose left-or-right path while playing the game but more complex and definitely not affecting anything at the end of it.....
EmCeeGramr
Member
Oh yeah! That's as bad as this ending. WTF with the life stream BS and not finding out what happens to the other characters apart from Red XIII. It's not until Advanced Children we know they are actually okay.
Sweet. I was already going to return my unopened PC copy but now I can also return the PS3 one, which I already opened, if I need to.
This shit was so fucking satisfying.If the first ten minutes, and the last ten minutes are removed, I totally agree with you. They really fixed a lot of shit. I don't think the ending thing is going to blow over. People generally start off with a much more positive reflection on the series which tends to fade over time.
I played OCD Paragon all the way through, and when I got here, I fucking renegaded his ass and enjoyed it.
I don't even think he was a great villain, or there was some sort of tension I consciously built up, but man it felt fucking good. Maybe it was the feeling of finally cutting out the stupid Kai Leng subplot, but whatever it was it felt good.
They probably could have done a bit better job explaining blowing up the Mass Relay, especially for those that didn't play Arrival.
I didn't mind leaving Vega's relationship with Shepard to the imagination though. From the intro I got the impression Vega was a soldier that was supposed to keep Shepard from escaping, but out of sheer respect he still treated Shepard like a superior officer that is still in active duty, and that was enough for me to go on.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
I took his lunch money from his bleeding, still warm corpse.
Can you explain why the location of the bullet wound on Shepard doesn't make sense (he was shot/grazed in the shoulder by the marauder) and perfectly reflects where Shepard shot Anderson?
I'm not saying that it's really what happens at all, that would be giving Bioware too much credit. What I am saying is that it's a better built ending than what we got, and if people would prefer to believe that ending even in the face of knowing that it likely isn't, I can sure as hell see why.
The whole 'desperation' thing is stupid, that's missing the point as much as people whom think we all just want a 'happy ending'.
I accidently pushed right trigger as a reaction to that and decided to live with it cause the prick deserved to die, only to find out that the same thing basically happened anyway. In a way it was a weird foretelling of the ending in that no matter what you pick it all ends up the same.
Rebel Leader
THE POWER OF BUTTERSCOTCH BOTTOMS
How much did he have?
heliosRAzi
Banned
Laziness from Bioware
Believing a theory just because it allows the true DLC ending just seems desperate to me.
I can see why since everyone playing this game is human (presumably), but yeah, I would rather take back Omega than Earth. Also, this is the first time we were able to visit Earth. There's no buildup.
Jake Tower
Banned
Heh
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
I fired up a default save game for PC, having played ME1 and 2 plenty on 360, but having no real desire to worry about transferring save games across. And from what I noticed, the only thing I missed out on was Wrex, who is far more likeable than Wreav. THough given I only ever had 4 or 5 party members for the entire game it didn't seem to matter much anyway.
Speaking of which I have just 2 points to make about the ME3 characters. The EDI character started well enough, with the Normandy discussion of Free Will, but then it quickly degenerated into lovey dovey feelings discussions, and I immediately switched off. Preposterous and stupid.
And second, what the fuck happens to Kaiden after you shoot Udina? He just disappeared from my game altogether. That tosser of a Spectre didn't even show up for the last stand. What a jerk.
I finally finished it last night. I shot Illusive Man and then took the literal 'right' option (to destroy The Reapers). I'll finish it again tonight and take the other option, even though I spent the entire game disagreeing with it so it will be somewhat disingenuous to suddenly take that turn at the end, but wattayagonnado?
Aside from the silly little segue where Jack and James crawled out of the busted up Normandy to walk into the sunset (I don't even know, it felt unnecessary and half-arsed), I thoroughly enjoyed the ending.
In saying that, Mass Effect 3 was guilty of twice doing something I consider an affront to interactive video gaming: taking control away from the player character in a cutscene to effect something non-canonical. Perhaps canon isn't the right word, I'll explain.
I find there is nothing more agitating then having a fight with an enemy/boss type creature, where you lay the smack down on them, only to have the battle turned against you via a cutscene. The first fight with Kai Leng on Thressia was most the egregious example. Liara, Garrus and I were whooping his arse until the cutscene kicked in to ruin my hardwork and steal away the Prothean AI.
It pisses me off no end when that happens in games.
But nonetheless, I enjoyed it a whole lot more than I expected I would. Well done Bioware.
Speaking of which I have just 2 points to make about the ME3 characters. The EDI character started well enough, with the Normandy discussion of Free Will, but then it quickly degenerated into lovey dovey feelings discussions, and I immediately switched off. Preposterous and stupid.
And second, what the fuck happens to Kaiden after you shoot Udina? He just disappeared from my game altogether. That tosser of a Spectre didn't even show up for the last stand. What a jerk.
I finally finished it last night. I shot Illusive Man and then took the literal 'right' option (to destroy The Reapers). I'll finish it again tonight and take the other option, even though I spent the entire game disagreeing with it so it will be somewhat disingenuous to suddenly take that turn at the end, but wattayagonnado?
Aside from the silly little segue where Jack and James crawled out of the busted up Normandy to walk into the sunset (I don't even know, it felt unnecessary and half-arsed), I thoroughly enjoyed the ending.
In saying that, Mass Effect 3 was guilty of twice doing something I consider an affront to interactive video gaming: taking control away from the player character in a cutscene to effect something non-canonical. Perhaps canon isn't the right word, I'll explain.
I find there is nothing more agitating then having a fight with an enemy/boss type creature, where you lay the smack down on them, only to have the battle turned against you via a cutscene. The first fight with Kai Leng on Thressia was most the egregious example. Liara, Garrus and I were whooping his arse until the cutscene kicked in to ruin my hardwork and steal away the Prothean AI.
It pisses me off no end when that happens in games.
But nonetheless, I enjoyed it a whole lot more than I expected I would. Well done Bioware.
+10 000 CERBERUS FUNDING
I don't see how people can do that. Even as a Paragon I still use most Renegade interrupts. Too satisfying.
Oddly enough on my new Renegade ME1 playthrough, I resisted punching that reporter. I want to see if she still dodges your punch in ME3 if you don't punch her in ME1 or ME2.
Uh no. FFVII's ending is pretty much like this. You know that anime Jesus girl's prayer stopped the evil meteor from hitting the planet, and thats pretty much it, no indication (from this game) that anyone survived or what they did afterwards. Every single storyline is dropped and forgotten along with two characters. Grade F
I didn't hate the ending the way most here do (didn't hate FFVII's either) but the ending climax is weak without much build up. We build god robots that only kill most of you so you don't build ordinary robots that kill everything....mmmkay. But the Geth/Quarian storyline kinda disproves that if you make the right choices.....anyway
Oh well, given the borderline hyperbole on how awful this was, I was almost expecting that after the big cut scene climax where Shepard does his thing with shit blowing up and dove flyin' all in slomo, that you get a quick jump cut of a kid playing with his space action figures in his bedroom while "You Got a Friend in Me" plays in the background. Fade to black, credits roll, faux blooper hilarity with the ME cast ensues.
and that would have been AWESOME
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Oh, something else I enjoyed. If you don't romance Tali, she and Garrus become a thing. There is no big deal about it...you just sort of stumble into them embracing. One of the small moments that give an illusion of the world moving even if you're not there.
Pretty cool.
Pretty cool.
I don't think you get that most people who 'believe' the indoctrination theory don't believe that any DLC is coming. People choose to interpret the ending that way because it's still better than what we got, they don't believe that's what is actually going on.
I also didn't mind not getting to know Vega off the bat. You got to know him later. I don't think Shepherd even blow up the mass relay if you didn't play arrival. Shepherd had enough blood on his hands and work with Cerberus to be on trial.
Empty Space
Member
I kind of want to go into the Amazon Deal thread and ask Tony about it. I've never heard of them taking back an opened game that works. I know there's some law in the UK about how if you are truly dissatisfied with a product the retailer has to take it back, but no such law exit in the US.
I don't know man, but I really want to know. It really gets on my nerves because everyone brings this up in interviews like it's common sense or something.
To me it seems this must come out straight from focus groups, there is no other reason I see. Everyone is always going about how earth and human kid are there so the audience can relate to what they know, but the quintessential moment fans of the series always bring up as being the most emotional is of some derpy-faced amphibian alien giving his life to save another alien race he had previously destined to extinction. It fucking works and they don't see it and I don't get it. I truly don't.
I remember thinking similar way back when I spoiled myself, but looking back (and having completed the game)... there's something of a point there, where you're left to wonder whether Humanity should or shouldn't be spared when it came to eliminating the threat to the Planet. That, and unlike ME3 you didn't spend multiple games making choices that effected the whole universe or could pave the way for entire groups to get into a better position, at best some sidequests help address this on a personal level and Shinra crumbling in general would help everyone in the world.
You could always cite Star Ocean 3 as a shittier ending though, don't think too many will contest that as strongly.
Jake Tower
Banned
You're the protagonist of Bioshock. You're perfectly happy to listen to the Catalyst spout his bullshit and "would you kindly" choose a color.
We're Shepard. We don't take shit from anyone. ANYONE. Even if somehow, some way the avalanche of bullshit Space Casper shovels at us has some truth to it, we're not taking his statements at face value. We're gonna question it. Big time.
But... the game won't let us.
The game turns us into you. Meekly go along with Xzibit A reasoning.
And that pisses us off.
heliosRAzi
Banned
Actually, the current ending would be better since you actually do something with the Reapers. As crappy as they are, the options given solves the main plot in an awkward way, but it is resolved. With the indoc theory, nothing is resolved. Shep is still on Earth while the Reapers continue to destroy everything.
Nope, never. Tempts me sometimes, but the Illusive Man (didn't have enough to make him off himself) and Kaiden were the only two times in the entire series I took a renegade option.
D
Deleted member 81567
Unconfirmed Member
Nah, FFVII is still better because it was an RPG not based around accumulating and reflecting player choice. It also didn't shoot itself in the foot with massive plotholes and inconsistencies within the span of it's own ending CG, or offer the player 3 completely radical and disastrous choices after defeating Sephiroth, only to show a differently colored Midgar at the end. Sure FFVII dropped everything, but had a clear and consistent big picture closure that showed the world had regained balanced; but it didn't have any of that other baggage making it so much worse.
Agree to disagree, that's cool. Following the indoctrination Theory, Shepard wakes up if you choose destroy, meaning there's still hope.
Okay this got me :lol
Jake Tower
Banned
Cool. Come back and give us your take on how different the other choices are and how satisfying.
heliosRAzi
Banned
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B004FYEZMQ/?tag=neogaf0e-20
the amazon reviews also are going the way the majority thinks.
if any bioware-sponsored-reviewer want to spent some time writing some positive ones better get to it........
I really hope that after the dragon-age 2 "reception" and the proof from the m.e. ending that Bioware aren't great at all,that they follow with Dragon age 3......
the amazon reviews also are going the way the majority thinks.
if any bioware-sponsored-reviewer want to spent some time writing some positive ones better get to it........
I really hope that after the dragon-age 2 "reception" and the proof from the m.e. ending that Bioware aren't great at all,that they follow with Dragon age 3......
We'll agree to disagree here. FFVII had a FUCKTON of baggage spanning 50+ hours that mostly is unresolved (or forgotten in the case of Vincent and Yuffie)
I measure FFVII's end to VI which to me is the best JRPG ending, in terms of character development and resolving story arcs. It doesn't wrap it in a bow but gives you enough idea as to what awaits them post Kefka. FFVII? Fuck if I know.
Hey, fair enough.
We're just going in circles now. Brilliantly executed non ending that implies Shepard will make it to the real beam is still > What we got, but that's entirely opinion.
We're just going in circles now. Brilliantly executed non ending that implies Shepard will make it to the real beam is still > What we got, but that's entirely opinion.
in ffvii you basically follow the story in a straight line. you just go,pass areas,go where the game takes you. and then it finishes and the game stood as a great game.
you play the story,you dont shape anything.(neither in me actually)
tell me did you choose to save barret instead of aerith???
or you saved the slums and expected a cutscene in the end that you didn't get?
That's why I don't understand why some people say the indoctrination theory is just for people that want the ending to be better.
I think the indoctrination theory is most likely because of the evidence for it, but I don't consider Shepard taking a nap on Earth to be a better ending than Space Magic. They both suck.
And no, I'm not getting my hopes up for an epilogue DLC.
heliosRAzi
Banned
God knows, maybe if we had actually got to visit Earth in each of the games we might have have formed an attachment to the planet as it exists in the games and saving what we had gotten used to.
But no, just like the child, they tried to make you care for something they shoved in at the beginning of the game in the first 10 minutes, I really didn't care that much about Earth or the child and was far more inclined to going back just to kick some Reaper butt due to their presence in the series than saving Earth.
They should have started you somewhere familiar and had an occasional mission that involved going back helping an underground movement of sorts, build up relationships with some characters and with each visit everything deteriorates.
Get to know and see the people and how they suffer, then finally returning with the fleets and fighting side by side with them and not just random mako 13 or generic solder bob.
At least that is what I would have liked in regards to Earth in this last chapter.
shingonation
Member
Are you taking serious user reviews that give the game a 5/5 before the ending and a 1/5 after the ending?
That seems objective to you?
And here we go.
OMG his face in the third panel, hahaha.
dont be so narrowminded.
it will permanently be more negatives than positives.
the majority hates the ending,either you like it or not.
and in the long run it will matter.
not only in amazon.everywhere. but showing it and in amazon helps.
you didn't learn anything from dragon age 2? fans can make the difference.
also
"An Utterly Brilliant Disaster, March 14, 2012" 1/5
"Amazing Until The Ending, March 9, 2012" 2/5
heliosRAzi
Banned
It matters how a story ends. If it ends on a sour note, it can affect the rest of the work. In ME3's case, while the game has awesome moments such as Tuchanka and Rannoch, the endings makes it to where my choices throughout all of the games do not matter and this discourages me from playing through the game.
LOL, lets not give into the illusion that ME offered any real choice, it told the story Bioware was going to tell regardless of what you did.
Both games have several characters and story arcs that largely left unresolved. You could argue that ME3 does a better job doing them in the interactions you have up to marching to the conduit. FF has some conversations outside the airship. Choice is irrelevant, you are still introduced to several story arcs that are left unresolved, this is both games.
littleworm
Member
I don't think user reviews need to be objective, they don't get paid to review games.
finowns
Member
If the first ten minutes, and the last ten minutes are removed, I totally agree with you. They really fixed a lot of shit. I don't think the ending thing is going to blow over. People generally start off with a much more positive reflection on the series which tends to fade over time.
Bioware did a good job on Kai-Leng. I was playing paragon but I hated KL so I had to pull the trigger. THIS IS FOR THANE!!!
- Status