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[Rufus]

Guess I forgot to include the rider: "This doesn't fix the myriad of other problems with the ending."

I think we all realized. I just couldn't help but ask those questions, just to illustrate how dump the holes are.

 

[The Elite]

This. From everything we've heard and seen, Hudson and Walters basically took a path of extreme hubris SPECIFICALLY in regards to the ending. Even if he wrote literally every line of dialogue in the game it wouldn't excuse the ending just because he wrote the rest: it is his ridiculous desire to pen some grand pseudo-intellectual ending that causes it to be shit. He can easily write everything PRIOR to the ending and then tell himself "No, I'm not going to write a sensible concise ending, I'm going to wrack my brain because LOTS OF SPECULATION" and he then falls flat on his face.



I'm not sure what you're even getting at here. It's irrelevant whether it was a pool for the rest or not. He's the lead writer. He dictates the PLOT. It is highly possible for him to get the rest of it right, you're correct. Does that mean the ending wasn't bad?

Well, I wasn't troubled by the ending I got. I'm simply saying that if you're going to shit on a writer for the bad ending, at least have the courtesy to acknowledge what he did well plot wise. From any standpoint I feel the rest of the game was a fantastic experience.

It's basically been confirmed that the writers didn't have a say in the ending - Mac Walters and Casey Hudson went off together to play intellectuals and didn't bother to show the ending to the other writers until it was time to record lines, at which point, of course, it was too late to offer peer critique.

So, the rest of the game can still be great, and the lead writer can still have failed. No conflict, here.

Thanks for that bit of information. That's a good reason to single out those writers then.

 

[Jintor]

People keeps jumping on the "Everyone's whining because Shepard died" wagon. Nobody is seriously complaining about that goddamnit. You're fighting a battle with an argument you've dreamed up in your head.

 

[Replicant]

Well, I wasn't troubled by the ending I got. I'm simply saying that if you're going to shit on a writer for the bad ending, at least have the courtesy to acknowledge what he did well plot wise. From any standpoint I feel the rest of the game was a fantastic experience.

Do you even read what everyone else has been saying?! Different writer is responsible for different parts of the game. The ones who wrote for Garrus is different from the ones who wrote for Tali. The ones who wrote for Tuchanka scenario is not the one who wrote Palaven.

And guess who wrote the opening, TIM conversation, and the ending? Oh wait, no guess necessary there.

 

[TheYanger]

Well, I wasn't troubled by the ending I got. I'm simply saying that if you're going to shit on a writer for the bad ending, at least have the courtesy to acknowledge what he did well plot wise. From any standpoint I feel the rest of the game was a fantastic experience.

Most people agree that the rest was fantastic.

 

[WiiredShawn]

Well, I wasn't troubled by the ending I got. I'm simply saying that if you're going to shit on a writer for the bad ending, at least have the courtesy to acknowledge what he did well plot wise. From any standpoint I feel the rest of the game was a fantastic experience.

I'm troubled that the ending I got is basically no different from the ending you got, even though we probably made very different choices in a game supposedly about choices.

And that is the fault of the director and lead writer, by all indications. As someone much earlier in the thread said, we can be a little offended when a chef offers us a nice dinner and then expects us to eat shit for desert. If the writers thought soft determinism was a suitable underpinning philosophy, they should have been pushing it along the whole time instead of contradicting it at basically every possible moment.

 

[HK-47]

Speaking of Evolution, I guess those boring female Turian designs are canon now, huh? Maybe they were from the beginning, but I was always hoping they'd be overwritten by some kind of more interesting design when we finally saw a female Turian in Mass Effect 3. Because, y'know, the Turian Military has loads of women in it and we go to the moon of the Turian homeworld in ME3 and it'd be crazy if we didn't see one single female Turian in the entire series. Also if you finally won the Homeworld back for your girl Tali and she took her mask off right there in front of you and it was the perfect moment for the biggest reveal of the entire trilogy and then the game just faded to black. That would be pretty crazy too.

I say it was cool if we didnt already have to non sexually dimorphic races (Salarian and Krogan) and I wasnt sure it was just lazy design.

 

[GuardianE]

People keeps jumping on the "Everyone's whining because Shepard died" wagon. Nobody is seriously complaining about that goddamnit. You're fighting a battle with an argument you've dreamed up in your head.

Seriously. I'm really tired of hearing this, too. I'm sure there are people who wanted a peachy, Return of the Jedi ending, but that's not where the majority of complaints lie.

 

[Patryn]

Had no idea. That would be a little disappointing if the next game was potentially set 10,000 years later.

Aw, that's cute. You think Bioware is going to make a game set after Mass Effect 3.

Sorry to say that the Final Hours app reveals that Casey Hudson plans for all future Mass Effect games to take place either before or during Mass Effect 3. Bioware has no interest in making games set after it.

 

[nel e nel]

But based on the Arrival content, we're led to believe this blast would wipe out solar systems. This is why deactivation of the relays using space magic would be much better than space magic + big boom.

Based on The Arrival content, we are also led to believe that that particular relay was an anomaly that was supercharged with dark energy, and is more powerful than any known relay.

However, it is unusual in its potential range and versatility. Alpha usually sends and receives mass at the range of a normal secondary relay, but if certain controls are adjusted, it becomes powered by an unprecedented amount of dark energy that could send cargo to sixteen other relays and even across a great distance to the Citadel.

http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Alpha_Relay

I already got into it on this detail upthread, so it's really up to each person how much they want to buy into it.

 

[The Elite]

Aw, that's cute. You think Bioware is going to make a game set after Mass Effect 3.

Sorry to say that the Final Hours app reveals that Casey Hudson plans for all future Mass Effect games to take place either before or during Mass Effect 3. Bioware has no interest in making games set after it.

Apparently if I'm not reading the iPhone app, playing the paid DLC, or reading every inch of the codex I really can't fathom the full extent of the ending on the Mass Effect universe.

The codex I don't mind but the rest is a little silly. Include all key content in the game. I don't mind DLC but don't make it detrimental to understanding the story. That pisses me off more than any issues with the ending.

 

[The Anti-Monitor]

Seriously. I'm really tired of hearing this, too. I'm sure there are people who wanted a peachy, Return of the Jedi ending, but that's not where the majority of complaints lie.

I'm sure most people wanted the possibility of that.

Personally, I thought it'd range from "Reapers wipe the galaxy out" to "Shepard dies to save the galaxy" to "ROTJ ending, feelsgoodman.jpg".

Shepard dying is the least of the ending problems. Last time I checked, Red Dead Redemption's ending is almost universally considered one of the highest points of the game.

 

[Turfster]

Apparently if I'm not reading the iPhone app, playing the paid DLC, or reading every inch of the codex I really can't fathom the full extent of the ending on the Mass Effect universe.

Don't forget the books and comics, or otherwise you'd be scratching your head about who the fuck the anime reject space ninja emo jerk Kai Leng was. (GAF people of course all knew because we read LumpOfCole's ragecomics)

 

[The Elite]

Don't forget the books and comics, or otherwise you'd be scratching your head about who the fuck the anime reject space ninja emo jerk Kai Leng was. (GAF people of course all knew because we read LumpOfCole's ragecomics)

I get cross marketing in different mediums but the core story shouldn't be affected to the extent it has been with ME3. Honestly, I couldn't care less what Kai Leng's story was. But the fact that the destruction of the Relays can destroy half a solar system is something that should be explicitly stated in the core game. Not in DLC or buried in the codex. It's a key narrative point.

But I've honestly decided to purge the Arrival DLC from existence. I'm never going to play it. In my ending, Shepard disabled the Reapers via the Mass Relays and the galaxy was saved from annihilation. That's good enough for me.

Everyone disco dance!

 

[def sim]

Arrival also makes it clear that Harbinger was supposed to be the main antagonist, if the entirety of ME2's campaign didn't already make that obvious.

 

[The Elite]

Arrival also makes it clear that Harbinger was supposed to be the main antagonist, if the entirety of ME2's campaign didn't already make that obvious.

I just read the wiki and found out that Harbinger was that Reaper at the end when you're making the final run to the transporter beam.

I honestly can't tell it apart from the rest of the fleet. Was it mentioned in dialogue? If so, I missed it.

 

[gnarlyxcharlie]

So when are we gonna see some more from Bioware about their 'content initiatives'

 

[Moaradin]

You can tell by his glowing eyes. While it was cool to see him fuck shit up, I still would have liked dialogue scenes with him at most. Not sure how they would do a boss fight with Harbinger.

So when are we gonna see some more from Bioware about their 'content initiatives'

I'm betting this Friday.

 

[zyxwvu4321]

Harby has yellow eyes. And they mentioned he was going down to Earth.

 

[The Anti-Monitor]

I just read the wiki and found out that Harbinger was that Reaper at the end when you're making the final run to the transporter beam.

I honestly can't tell it apart from the rest of the fleet. Was it mentioned in dialogue? If so, I missed it.

You can tell because of the yellow lights.

 

[Lothars]

I just read the wiki and found out that Harbinger was that Reaper at the end when you're making the final run to the transporter beam.

I honestly can't tell it apart from the rest of the fleet. Was it mentioned in dialogue? If so, I missed it.

Yup from what I remember it does mention that is Harbinger.

 

[def sim]

I just read the wiki and found out that Harbinger was that Reaper at the end when you're making the final run to the transporter beam.

I honestly can't tell it apart from the rest of the fleet. Was it mentioned in dialogue? If so, I missed it.

Yeah, he shoots the beam at you.

Harbinger was relegated to being just one of the big bad guys for the most part in 3. Despite all of ME2, despite the sovereign like conversation you have with him in Arrival, he was bumped off like he was no special character.

 

[LiK]

So when are we gonna see some more from Bioware about their 'content initiatives'

PAX East probably

 

[The Elite]

You can tell because of the yellow lights.

lol.

I remember the music swelling when it showed up but I just assumed that was because you would have to run through Reaper fire to get to the transporter beam. Didn't pick up on the harbinger dialogue or the yellow lights.

 

[WiiredShawn]

I'm sure most people wanted the possibility of that.

Personally, I thought it'd range from "Reapers wipe the galaxy out" to "Shepard dies to save the galaxy" to "ROTJ ending, feelsgoodman.jpg".

Shepard dying is the least of the ending problems. Last time I checked, Red Dead Redemption's ending is almost universally considered one of the highest points of the game.

Instead of Brave New World, Mac Walters should have been reading Jane Austen. We watched Persuasion last night, and my god, if the ending of that movie isn't one of the best emotional pay-offs ever, regardless of how "realistic" or "intellectual" it is. And Jane Austen has endured for centuries - I doubt the same will be said of Mass Effect. Take note, Bioware.

 

[MYeager]

I get cross marketing in different mediums but the core story shouldn't be affected to the extent it has been with ME3. Honestly, I couldn't care less what Kai Leng's story was. But the fact that the destruction of the Relays can destroy half a solar system is something that should be explicitly stated in the core game. Not in DLC or buried in the codex. It's a key narrative point.

If an asteroid is flown into one, and in The Arrival DLC the Alpha Relay is also different than other ME relays. No one knows what happens when the Catalyst is activated because it has never happened. The scene with the Reapers leaving Earth (in the non-destroy endings) would be pointless if everything was blown to shit a second later. The scene of the galaxy map is just to give a visual representation that the relays are gone, not that every planet in the galaxy has been wiped out. A giant beam of energy also didn't shoot out from the Alpha Relay when it was destroyed.

 

[The Elite]

Instead of Brave New World, Mac Walters should have been reading Jane Austen. We watched Persuasion last night, and my god, if the ending of that movie isn't one of the best emotional pay-offs ever, regardless of how "realistic" or "intellectual" it is. And Jane Austen has endured for centuries - I doubt the same will be said of Mass Effect. Take note, Bioware.

I don't think there is any video game in existence that will endure for its compelling story telling. At least not on the same level as a work from Jane Austen.

I do think Mass Effect, good or bad, will be remembered for its impact on interactive story telling.

 

[zyxwvu4321]

PAX East probably

"We know you guys have lots of questions and strong feelings about the ending, so we're going to directly address that. Here is some DLC that gives all the answers about how Aria got kicked off Omega and how she gets it back 3 days before all those relays right beside it blew up."

 

[Moaradin]

Yeah, he shoots the beam at you.

Harbinger was relegated to being just one of the big bad guys for the most part in 3. Despite all of ME2, despite the sovereign like conversation you have with him in Arrival, he was bumped off like he was no special character.

Well it was clear he was much powerful than a regular Reaper in ME3. Dude was chucking out multiple beams like it was nothing and obliterating everything. I just wish there was more dialogue with him.

 

[Rapstah]

lol.

I remember the music swelling when it showed up but I just assumed that was because you would have to run through Reaper fire to get to the transporter beam. Didn't pick up on the harbinger dialogue or the yellow lights.

They couldn't get Harbinger's voice actor for ME3 for some unknown reason, so his semi-absence is because he never can speak. Funnily he has a lot of voice acting in Arrival as he voices both Harbinger and the Reaper artifact that half the plot circles around, so it's not like the actor has any problems with the franchise or company (he was also in TOR and said on Twitter that he would have loved being in ME3).

 

[MYeager]

I just read the wiki and found out that Harbinger was that Reaper at the end when you're making the final run to the transporter beam.

I honestly can't tell it apart from the rest of the fleet. Was it mentioned in dialogue? If so, I missed it.

Yeah, I believe right at the end there it is mentioned that Harbinger and several Sovereign class Reapers are heading towards the elevator.

 

[Kung Fu Jedi]

The Harbinger elements, or lack there of, bothered me in ME3 as well. He was played up, quite nicely I might add, in ME2 and he simply makes a cameo at the end of the series. For a villain that they actually gave some life and character to, he was ultimately just wasted potential.

 

[def sim]

Well it was clear he was much powerful than a regular Reaper in ME3. Dude was chucking out multiple beams like it was nothing and obliterating everything. I just wish there was more dialogue with him.

Yeah, it's weird having him taunt you nonstop in ME2 and for him to say nearly nothing in 3. He's supposed to be the largest and oldest Reaper, they could have at least used him for some exposition.

 

[Rufus]

Yeah, I believe right at the end there it is mentioned that Harbinger and several Sovereign class Reapers are heading towards the elevator.

To hand crank the button that turns off the beam.

 

[rozay]

They couldn't get Harbinger's voice actor for ME3 for some unknown reason, so his semi-absence is because he never can speak. Funnily he has a lot of voice acting in Arrival as he voices both Harbinger and the Reaper artifact that half the plot circles around, so it's not like the actor has any problems with the franchise or company (he was also in TOR and said on Twitter that he would have loved being in ME3).

Harbringer's voice actor voiced multiple characters in me3 though.

 

[MechaX]

Yeah, Harbinger's VA was definitely available. BioWare just chose not to voice (or have him play much of a role what-so-ever outside of a 20 second sequence) him for... reasons.

 

[Bowdz]

Harbringer's voice actor voiced multiple characters in me3 though.

Wow, I didn't know he was in ME3. To quote Admiral Hackett: Just what the HELL happened Bioware?

 

[DTKT]

"We know you guys have lots of questions and strong feelings about the ending, so we're going to directly address that. Here is some DLC that gives all the answers about how Aria got kicked off Omega and how she gets it back 3 days before all those relays right beside it blew up."

I will weep.

 

[Rapstah]

Yeah, Harbinger's VA was definitely available. BioWare just chose not to voice (or have him play much of a role what-so-ever outside of a 20 second sequence) him for... reasons.

Oh, right. Then maybe they couldn't get him for the ending. The fuck went on with this game's development?

 

[WiiredShawn]

"We know you guys have lots of questions and strong feelings about the ending, so we're going to directly address that. Here is some DLC that gives all the answers about how Aria got kicked off Omega and how she gets it back 3 days before all those relays right beside it blew up."

So a rehash of the recent comic series that details that exact scenario?

Yeah, you're probably right.

Oh, right. Then maybe they couldn't get him for the ending. The fuck went on with this game's development?

The easy answer: lol, Mac Walters.

The better answer: lol, Mac Walters and Casey Hudson.

The true answer: lol, Electronic "Churn your massive space opera trilogy conclusion out in two years and make it appeal to the CoD crowd for extra moneyz" Arts.

 

[The Elite]

http://www.gameinformer.com/blogs/editors/b/gitim_blog/archive/2012/04/02/my-thoughts-on-mass-effect-3-39-s-ending.aspx

Yeah, it's Game Informer but this article sums up my thoughts on the ending.

 

[sTeLioSco]

http://www.gameinformer.com/blogs/editors/b/gitim_blog/archive/2012/04/02/my-thoughts-on-mass-effect-3-39-s-ending.aspx

Yeah, it's Game Informer but this article sums up my thoughts on the ending.

everyone forgets the game is about "choices"....

mass effect wasn't supposed to have an ending like modern warfare or halflife or metalgearsolid. it wasn't supposed to have an ending,and everyone would choose to like or dislike.

anyone that doesn't address this fact,just speaks nonsense.
if its a "gaming journalist",even worse.

 

[heliosRAzi]

http://www.gameinformer.com/blogs/editors/b/gitim_blog/archive/2012/04/02/my-thoughts-on-mass-effect-3-39-s-ending.aspx

Yeah, it's Game Informer but this article sums up my thoughts on the ending.

He, just like you, need to think about the ending a little bit more.

 

[MYeager]

To hand crank the button that turns off the beam.

That's not out of line with the series. Sovereign had to manually activate the Citadel Relay since the Protheans outsmarted them with the Keepers and they put off doing anything about it for 50,000 years. Procrastinators.

 

[rozay]

So a rehash of the recent comic series that details that exact scenario?

Yeah, you're probably right.



The easy answer: lol, Mac Walters.

The better answer: lol, Mac Walters and Casey Hudson.

The true answer: lol, Electronic "Churn your massive space opera trilogy conclusion out in two years and make it appeal to the CoD crowd for extra moneyz" Arts.

The comic specified the story would continue in ME3 at the end: P

Aria loses omega in the comic, which is why she's on the citadel in ME3.

 

[heliosRAzi]

That's not out of line with the series. Sovereign had to manually activate the Citadel Relay since the Protheans outsmarted them with the Keepers and they put off doing anything about it for 50,000 years. Procrastinators.

The Catalyst could've done this himself, but he is a poopy head

EDIT: In another couple of weeks, we'll probably hit 20k again, sooner if PAX East ends up being crazy

 

[DTKT]

http://www.gameinformer.com/blogs/editors/b/gitim_blog/archive/2012/04/02/my-thoughts-on-mass-effect-3-39-s-ending.aspx

Yeah, it's Game Informer but this article sums up my thoughts on the ending.

The introduction of the “god child” character at the very end of the game was a twist I didn’t see coming. The wispy image of the dead child that haunted Shepard did wonders for explaining the Reapers purpose to me, and what exactly my options were. I boarded the Citadel with the intent to finish off the Reapers, and I committed to achieving that goal despite the cost of destroying all synthetic life. I thought about Edi, Legion, and the entire Geth population before making this decision. It sucked, but it seemed like the best option. How long would Shepard be able to control the Reapers if I had went with the blue ending, and isn’t it unfair to push synthetic hybridization onto all sentient life? I understand that destroying synthetics may seem brutal, but let’s face it – they’re not alive. That’s how I rationalized it, anyway.

I will fight this man to the death.

I guess that where we agree to disagree. I find the god-space kid to be a dumb and simplistic story telling device. I find the entire idea of the kid haunting your dreams to be dumb and without purpose.

I find the 3 possible outcomes stupid and without meaning. I won't even mention the reasons for the Reapers to "reap"...

 

[CharmingCharlie]

http://www.gameinformer.com/blogs/editors/b/gitim_blog/archive/2012/04/02/my-thoughts-on-mass-effect-3-39-s-ending.aspx

Yeah, it's Game Informer but this article sums up my thoughts on the ending.

That smacks of someone that doesn't understand the implications of the endings though. Take this bit :-

I love the prospect of the Normandy crew having to start over on a lush jungle planet. Joker, Garrus, Liara, and the

Well it doesn't take much thought to figure out what will happen to them. Firstly Garrus and Tali are going to die, no if's no but's they are dead. Both Turians and Quarians have specific food requirements that cannot be met (something to do with amino acids or something). If they have landed on a planet that can support normal human life then it will not be able to support Turian and Quarian life. So yep those two are doomed to die from starvation.

The rest of the crew are pretty much screwed too. There isn't enough people on board the Normandy to create and sustain a viable population. I remember reading somewhere you need at least 1000 people to ensure you have enough genetic variety to create a viable population. So for the rest of the crew they will probably have a happy life. However several generations down the line the genetic makeup will turn to crap and that will be the end of that.

think of all the Quarians, Turians, Humans, and the rest stuck in our solar system. What will happen to them? Will they be able to nurture Earth back to health after the Reapers razed it? I love pondering the wealth of questions raised by the end of Mass Effect 3, and the implications it has for future games in the series.

Hm again no need to put too much thought into it, the Quarians and Turians are gonna die of starvation. The Earth and solar system were depleted of resources which was shown in Mass Effect 2 so with no Mass Effect relay's a planet that relies heavily on trade with other planets is pretty much screwed. The implications for the future of the games in the series is "they are all bloody dead".

 

[spekkeh]

everyone forgets the game is about "choices"....

mass effect wasn't supposed to have an ending like modern warfare or halflife or metalgearsolid. it wasn't supposed to have an ending,and everyone would choose to like or dislike.

anyone that doesn't address this fact,just speaks nonsense.
if its a "gaming journalist",even worse.

Supposed by whom?

 

[HK-47]

All of that mattered as part of the journey for me. It's a role-playing game and whether or not I cured the genophage mattered from a character standpoint.

It's war and a shit load of people had to die. Some of those people are going to be ones who you helped along the way. They're fucked anyways. In the end, I saved the Galaxy and that's what matters. All of those people who signed up to help Shepard along the way knew that going in.

The choices I made had a great impact on the entire experience, I'm not bothered at all that they didn't factor in to the final hours of the game.

This happens a lot. People expect every story thread to tie into a neat little bow at the end of the experience. Life doesn't work like that and the best stories don't either.

If you think the only choice that really mattered was the one at the end, I'm not sure you played the game correctly. A lot of the decisions along the way mattered a hell of a lot to me and defined my character. They effected me in the role playing experience of making that finale choice. I think you're looking for a mechanical, gameplay result of all those decisions.

Saved the galaxy? Not in this ending.