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[Roland_Gunner]

He feuds with Seth. People say it's underwhelming and disappointing. Most seem to blame it on Seth being a bad babyface.

Those are his last three major feuds. And yes it's entirely possible that he has just had the worst run of luck ever when it comes to opponents, but it's definitely something to point out. Hell, you take out his very short feud and match with Sami and it looks even worse.

I don't watch NXT weekly but Joe was put in a really tough spot here. He was brought in as the #3 guy after HHH and Owens neither one is around anymore and then wasn't built up in a mid-level feud. Seth isn't hot enough to overcome that.

Isn't ZBJ involved in a feud with Minoru Suzuki?

ZSJ is the newest member of Suzuki's faction. He's kind of the #2 guy by default since everyone else is treated like a jobber or hurt.

 

[Sephzilla]

Zach > Zack

 

[Heroman]

I know, but it's gonna happen sometime, the dude's nearly 53. But what a way to go out eh?

Liger retirement show will be a once in a lifetime event.

 

[Hasney]

Morris > Wrasslegaf Poster > Ryder

This has concluded the ranking of Zach/Zacks

 

[Pikma]

So barring an unexpected addition next week, the Backlash card seems to be:

Spoiler

Breezango vs. Usos for the tag titles

Charlotte/Becky/Naomi vs. Carmella/Natalya/Tamina

Orton vs. Jinder for the WWE Title

Sami Zayn vs. Baron Corbin

Owens vs. Styles for the US Title

Nakamura vs. Ziggler

For reference, the card for Takeover the night before is (so far):

Spoiler

Itami vs. Roode for the NXT Title

Asuka vs. Ruby Riot vs. Nikki Cross for the Women's Title

DIY vs. AoP in a ladder match for the tag titles

Pete Dunne vs. Tyler Bate for the UK Title

Wonder what Black, Hero, Almas, Drew and Sanity will be doing

 

[serenewarfare]

I think given the law of averages the bad/good feud ratio will even out among all involved. It's certainly not like Joe is missing some crucial piece.

It might, and I agree that Joe is great. I like him a lot.

I'm mainly pointing out that so often his opponents are getting blamed for his bad feuds, when recent history suggests he's been in more weak feuds than most of them.

 

[SallyIsNow]

The one with Batista? Why willingly do this to yourself?

I have very vivid memories of it as a kid.

Wonder what Black, Hero, Almas, Drew and Sanity will be doing

4v4 lol

 

[MG310]

I like Joe a lot, but there's an interesting trend developing around him.

He feuds with Balor. People say it's underwhelming and disappointing. Most seem to blame Finn.

He feuds with Nakamura. People say it's underwhelming and disappointing. Most seem to write it off as them not having chemistry and/or Nakamura not trying.

He feuds with Seth. People say it's underwhelming and disappointing. Most seem to blame it on Seth being a bad babyface.

Those are his last three major feuds. And yes it's entirely possible that he has just had the worst run of luck ever when it comes to opponents, but it's definitely something to point out. Hell, you take out his very short feud and match with Sami and it looks even worse.

I would blame the nature of NXT on the Finn/Nakamura feuds more than anything. The first matches were enjoyable in those feuds but in the case of Shinsuke particularly they rushed through more matches that didn't really add anything.


I don't like anything about this Seth/Joe feud though. Seth is fighting Oddjob after he already killed Goldfinger. On top of that it feels like his brain hasn't caught up to his body yet so he's doing all the things he used to do but at half speed.

 

[DMczaf]

You want to say that to my avatar?

Remember when that FRAUD re appropriated disability culture?

 

[serenewarfare]

Wonder what Black, Hero, Almas, Drew and Sanity will be doing

I think they'll still add one match, but maybe not. All the matches on the card now deserve 15-25 minutes, so four of those would fill up two hours nicely.

 

[BewareTheBatsie]

the ladder match almost happened at eurovision with bojack

 

[Hycran]

On the same show, Meltzer said Alicia Fox has the best Northern Lights Suplex of all-time.

He's right. It's up there with just how impeccable Mr Perfects fishermans suplex is.

 

[BewareTheBatsie]

I have very vivid memories of it as a kid.

Batista got that X Pac heat with me when he turned on Rey.

 

[Zach]

Get over yourself.

Over myself?

You're dang right I'm over myself!

 

[serenewarfare]

I would blame the nature of NXT on the Finn/Nakamura feuds more than anything. The first matches were enjoyable in those feuds but in the case of Shinsuke particularly they rushed through more matches that didn't really add anything.

How can you make that argument when Balor's feud before Joe (with Owens) was good, and Nakamura's feud after Joe (with Roode) was also good? Both of those were in NXT too.

 

[DMczaf]

Zach is over with Zach


But weirdly, Zach is not over with Zack

But Zack is over with Zach

 

[Kaladin]

Over myself?

You're dang right I'm over myself!

I often find myself reading your posts in Bobby Heenan's voice.

 

[Fox318]

The flack Zach lacks for Zack is truly wack.

 

[serenewarfare]

Raw viewership - 2.69 million viewers

Lowest non-holiday number in over two decades.

Monday's WWE Raw television show averaged 2.696 million viewers. Viewership was down from the 2.870 million average from last week.

The first hour of Raw averaged 2.827 million viewers. Hour two drew 2.845 million viewers. The final hour of the show averaged 2.417 million viewers.

That third hour is fucking rough.

 

[Heroman]

Raw viewership - 2.69 million viewers

Lowest non-holiday number in over two decades.

It a good thing ratings don't matter.

 

[Sephzilla]

Whack Zach is gonna smack Zach in the back, jack

 

[DMczaf]

What if Kevin Dunn directed Saved By The Bell?

 

[BewareTheBatsie]

I'M SO EXCITED

 

[Zach]

I am overwhelmed.

 

[Sephzilla]

What if Kevin Dunn directed Saved By The Bell?

Not enough shaky cam and pointless cuts

 

[SallyIsNow]

Batista got that X Pac heat with me when he turned on Rey.

Lol
Rey wasn't even over with little latino OwensIsNow.

Over myself?

You're dang right I'm over myself!

Zach is over with Zach


But weirdly, Zach is not over with Zack

But Zack is over with Zach

Zach does blachface. It's wack. Attack the Zach.

Raw viewership - 2.69 million viewers

Lowest non-holiday number in over two decades.



That third hour is fucking rough.

 

[Dark Ninja]

From Stone Cold's podcast Shane Mcmahon does more fight training regularly than CM Punk has ever done in his entire life.

 

[DMczaf]

Raw viewership - 2.69 million viewers

Lowest non-holiday number in over two decades.



That third hour is fucking rough.

We are closing in on TNA on Spike numbers brother!

 

[Fox318]

Whack Zach is gonna smack Zach in the back, jack

You lack a Z-Pak

 

[Heroman]

What if Kevin Dunn directed Saved By The Bell?

Not enough camera to a Kevin Dunn production.

 

[Pikma]

Raw viewership - 2.69 million viewers

Lowest non-holiday number in over two decades.



That third hour is fucking rough.

We did it!

 

[Roland_Gunner]

It a good thing ratings don't matter.

LOL, yeah WWE can always fall back the never-ending expansion of cable in American households to keep this going.

Seriously, that number against a dull assed GSW playoff game is dreadful. They may break 2 million against a big football game.

 

[BewareTheBatsie]

Lol
Rey wasn't even over with little latino OwensIsNow.

I loved Rey so much. Didn't notice how shit his 2006 world title run was because my boy had the belt.

 

[Foggy]

How can you make that argument when Balor's feud before Joe (with Owens) was good, and Nakamura's feud after Joe (with Roode) was also good? Both of those were in NXT too.

I think you're conflating "people say" in your original post with your personal feelings on the feuds. I would be in the "people say" camp in regards to Nak's lack of effort affecting his feuds but I wouldn't agree with you that his feud with Roode was anything approximating good. I think if you wanted to build on any thesis that Joe lacks chemistry or is a weak link then you'll have to dig deeper than nebulous "people say" comparisons.

 

[serenewarfare]

I wonder how far the number can fall before it levels off to the point where it will just be watched by the same number of people every week forever no matter what.

They have like 1.4 million paid Network subs, so it's probably around that.

I think you're conflating "people say" in your original post with your personal feelings on the feuds. I would be in the "people say" camp in regards to Nak's lack of effort affecting his feuds but I wouldn't agree with you that his feud with Roode was anything approximating good. I think if you wanted to build on any thesis that Joe lacks chemistry or is a weak link then you'll have to dig deeper than nebulous "people say" comparisons.

Absolutely not. I enjoyed the Joe/Balor and Joe/Nakamura feuds for the most part. But it's absolutely the general sentiment I've seen online that they are both disappointing.

 

[Beefy]

Smackdown sounds wack

 

[Anth0ny]

Raw viewership - 2.69 million viewers

Lowest non-holiday number in over two decades.



That third hour is fucking rough.

IT KEEPS GOING DOWN, FRIENDS


#5YEARS

 

[Sweeney Tom]

Legit getting peak MNF-competition Raw ratings in fucking May. What a lovely sight to see

 

[Pikma]

The superstar shake up was a success!!!!

 

[HashtagLapsed]

I kind of disagree with Meltzer about NJPW no selling being as egregious as WWE. The matches are presented in totally different ways. Look at Omega selling his knee in the G1 match against Naito or selling his arm against Kushida at WK last year. Or Juice a couple of weeks ago.

There is a difference between Ishii no selling to prove he is a tough cunt and Rollins holding his knee for 5 seconds then doing knee based offense with his bad knee or Neville coming out with taped ribs and hitting all of his flippy shit with no consequence.

 

[Sephzilla]

Raw viewership - 2.69 million viewers

Lowest non-holiday number in over two decades.



That third hour is fucking rough.

 

[Tom Nook]

What if Kevin Dunn directed Saved By The Bell?

Heard that was actually a shoot.

 

[Fox318]

There's a reason why Steph and HHH are nowhere to be seen.

 

[SallyIsNow]

Pushing Roman as the guy for 3 years
😂😂😂😂😂

 

[Foggy]

Absolutely not. I enjoyed the Joe/Balor and Joe/Nakamura feuds for the most part. But it's absolutely the general sentiment I've seen online that they are both disappointing.

Even then, it's not like general sentiment or differences in general sentiment can illuminate any sort of qualitative worth. It's all just what you're familiar with. I'm sure anyone could spend time in a random large pocket of internet wrestling fandom and come away saying that "people say" those feuds were all trash or they were all tremendous.

 

[serenewarfare]

I kind of disagree with Meltzer about NJPW no selling being as egregious as WWE. The matches are presented in totally different ways. Look at Omega selling his knee in the G1 match against Naito or selling his arm against Kushida at WK last year. Or Juice a couple of weeks ago.

There is a difference between Ishii no selling to prove he is a tough cunt and Rollins holding his knee for 5 seconds then doing knee based offense with his bad knee or Neville coming out with taped ribs and hitting all of his flippy shit with no consequence.

That was Alvarez's counter-argument, but Meltzer didn't seem to agree. He said the Juice match was different, but most of wrestling today is doing your comeback with little to no selling.

 

[Into the Light]

Raw viewership - 2.69 million viewers

Lowest non-holiday number in over two decades.



That third hour is fucking rough.

They deserve it, I feel bad for the UK fans, its just not right.

 

[Zach]

Probably gonna watch SummerSlam 2010 tonight. Had the brilliant idea to check out 2010 WrassleGAF. Dark days, daddeh, but I'm enjoying the predictions:

Nexus defeats the Super Friends. They need to keep Nexus going, it's the best storyline they have right now. I don't know who the 7th guy will be, but I'm thinking either the Miz (who may screw it up somehow for Cena's team) or Evan Bourne (yawn).

For me Bret Hart is the leader in the clubhouse for the heel turn. No way Cena turns on the team. It's either gonna be Hart, or HHH will come out and prove to be behind Nexus.

NEXUS wins, by Bret Hart running out back to take out Ortunga, Ref down Cena and Wade Barett left JR runs in gives a stunner to Cena and Wade gets the pinfall.

Team WWE vs. The Nexus (Elimination Tag Team Match)
Winner: The Nexus. Really digging this feud. I'm hoping something big happens tonight.

JR being behind Nexus would be awesome and a great swerve on the internet folks.

Nexus should win, a heel turn would be nice. Bryan Danielson would be even better.

Team Jericho vs. Nexus: There's really no debate, one of these two things will happen:
Winner: Nexus, but if HHH returns on Team WWE, Team WWE

Team WWE vs. The Nexus (Elimination Tag Team Match)
Winner: Superfriends. Triple H is the final member. LOL at anyone thinking it's Daniel Bryan.

Danielson's 90-day no-compete clause isn't even up yet. It's not him.

No way it's HHH as the last member. No way the wwe would blow a return that could possibly result in more ppv buys by just having him show up unannounced. Especially on one of the big 4 ppv's.

Miz will end up being the last one and I wouldn't be surprised if he ended up walking out on the team.

Not sure why people expect anything else (than The Miz). Didn't they already tease that on Raw? It's not hard to tell.

>_>

 

[Pikma]

I kind of disagree with Meltzer about NJPW no selling being as egregious as WWE. The matches are presented in totally different ways. Look at Omega selling his knee in the G1 match against Naito or selling his arm against Kushida at WK last year. Or Juice a couple of weeks ago.

There is a difference between Ishii no selling to prove he is a tough cunt and Rollins holding his knee for 5 seconds then doing knee based offense with his bad knee or Neville coming out with taped ribs and hitting all of his flippy shit with no consequence.

Three words:

Susuki versus Okada

 

[ElRenoRaven]

I kind of disagree with Meltzer about NJPW no selling being as egregious as WWE. The matches are presented in totally different ways. Look at Omega selling his knee in the G1 match against Naito or selling his arm against Kushida at WK last year. Or Juice a couple of weeks ago.

There is a difference between Ishii no selling to prove he is a tough cunt and Rollins holding his knee for 5 seconds then doing knee based offense with his bad knee or Neville coming out with taped ribs and hitting all of his flippy shit with no consequence.

Yup. Huge difference. BTW did you guys hear the news. WWE decided that the Adam Rose gimmick was too good to let go to waste so when Braun comes back he's being repackaged as Adam Rose.