UnemployedVillain
Member
I don't think they understand how insurance works for people who aren't rich or have government provided insurance like they do
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McConnell and GOP Senators desperately working on a new "Skinny Repeal" for the ACA
- Thread starter balladofwindfishes
- Start date
I don't think they understand how insurance works for people who aren't rich or have government provided insurance like they do
Phrozenflame500
Member
So they're going to kill one of the few cost control measures the ACA has and alter nothing else? Yeah, uh, good luck with that.
balladofwindfishes
Member
McConnell is a master strategist!
Gnome Scat
Member
Oh my god just give up already.
Huh, I just read their analysis. I have a hard time thinking that it comes out to those numbers but they seem to think that enough people will opt out of insurance to actually save money. Isn't the penalty only a couple of hundred bucks?
BoogieWoogie
Banned
A couple hundred bucks is a LOT for a good chunk of the population.
the max is like 2 grand or the cost of a bronze plan for a year
They only really had a couple options. Trump was actually right when he said if they didn't anything him and the Republicans wouldn't own Obamacare. They would have got away with it because regular voters have the memory of goldfish and think ACA and Obamacare are two different things. Trump can't live with that though, he has an out of control ego and a hard on for hating Obama and undoing everything he does regardless of who it hurts including himself and the GOP. And apparently the GOP are in the end spineless and think they are impervious to losing seats in midterms and the next election over screwing over healthcare. I don't know, maybe they are right about that, i'm just not surprised by anything anymore. Either way people were going to be screwed on healthcare so I would concentrate on the positive that once the GOP does this they own this shit. They do this and the dems need to make it priority one to drive home the message in everyones brain that this is the GOP's shit sandwich that they own full stop.
TangoAlphaLima
Member
Bob Dole, Orrin Hatch, Chuck Grassley, John Chafee, and others. It was like a "Who's Who" of the GOP that supported the individual mandate in 1993. It's also a list that includes still-sitting Senators like Hatch and Grassley that changed their mind and now want to repeal the ACA's individual mandate.
For a party that's seemingly all about people taking personal responsibility, it's absurd that the GOP has focused on the individual mandate as one of the biggest "problems" with the ACA.
Seth Enosh
Member
Yep, the base hates the mandate. They're politicians and they respond to the will of their voters. Even democrats have been swayed by arguments against the mandate in the past; Obama successfully used it against Hillary during the 2008 primaries.
As far as personal responsibility goes, it seems more in line with that ethic to say people should have the choice to buy or not buy insurance and be personally responsible for the results.
(I'm totally fine with the mandate btw, just wanted to point out the popularity issues and that it was never an "all republicans" thing)
It'd be hilariously stupid to repeal the mandate. Everything says repealing that really would put the insurance market into a sort of death spiral. Except if they repeal it and make headlines they can't say Obamacare is dying. They own it at that point. They want their cake and to eat it to. They want to claim a victory but claim no fault when that victory goes nuts and fucks everyone? Good luck with that messaging.
Bam Bam Baklava
Member
@byrdinator
Corker, asked about the Senate health care bill (with just over an hour to go), says, "I don't know what the deal is." Same, senator. Same.
Corker, asked about the Senate health care bill (with just over an hour to go), says, "I don't know what the deal is." Same, senator. Same.
It's just historical precedence. Party in power takes the blame when shit hits the fan.
538 has a nice run-down of what is actually happening and they are live-blogging it. This is very helpful, because I have no idea about Senate procedures and there's a LOT of crap that is going on before the motion-to-proceed is voted upon. Note, that's simply a motion to VOTE on whatever the "final" bill is... which no-one knows. So even if some of the holdouts vote "yes" on a motion-to-proceed, that doesn't necessarily mean they would vote "yes" on the final bill.
http://fivethirtyeight.com/live-blog/senate-vote-health-care/
http://fivethirtyeight.com/live-blog/senate-vote-health-care/
They aren't planning to just repeal the mandate -- they are planning to only vote on repealing the mandate so that they can say they passed something and then go back to working in secret to come up with a new bill in conference. That new bill won't be subject to any amendments etc. when the conference concludes
Their opponents are a group of losers who had to change their brand new slogan in the 48 hours between tweeting it and properly unveiling it 😂
TangoAlphaLima
Member
The base only hates the mandate because they were told to hate the mandate by the GOP, not the other way around. Had the GOP been in favor of it, their base would have been too.
The problem with your personal responsibility interpretation is that it ignores the fact that society bears a burden when individuals are not covered by health insurance. Hospitals don't deny emergency patients because they have no health insurance, they just can't collect, and those costs are passed on to everyone else.
DrROBschiz
Member
Its time to Admit
Obama wasnt the devil
He made a good step forward with the ACA and it should be fixed and expanded
Take responsibility for your shitty regressive ideas no one likes
Obama wasnt the devil
He made a good step forward with the ACA and it should be fixed and expanded
Take responsibility for your shitty regressive ideas no one likes
Ace Harding
Member
If Obama was against the mandate maybe he could just put out a tweet or something that says he supports this legislation. Then they'd have to abort.
Bam Bam Baklava
Member
@LACaldwellDC
Heading into lunch a lot of undecideds, including Portman, Murkowski, Capito, Flake, Lee. The vote is in just over an hour
Heading into lunch a lot of undecideds, including Portman, Murkowski, Capito, Flake, Lee. The vote is in just over an hour
TetraGenesis
Member
I'm very sorry to say this but I hope your brother-in-law develops a debilitating illness and learns a thing or two.
It will decrease the deficit because fewer people will choose to get Medicaid and subsidized individual plans, according to the CBO.
Widdle Puppy
Banned
I'm worried af
Beer Monkey
Member
I called Portman's DC office before lunch opposing MTP with reasons.
I don't think I can recall ever seeing this sort of bizarre desperation in a senate leader.
Just Collins.
Lazy vs Crazy
Member
Collins and the Democrats.
darkstar0155
Member
I think Collins is the only hard NO no matter what. Everyone else it just depends on what is voted on.
Saint Gregory
Member
The Democrats need to sell this as a plan to get Donald's friends extra money for sex boats.
This is just an epic cluster.
"What Is The Senate Voting On Today?
This isnt entirely clear"
(From Anna's post on 538: http://fivethirtyeight.com/live-blog/senate-vote-health-care/ )
"What Is The Senate Voting On Today?
This isnt entirely clear"
(From Anna's post on 538: http://fivethirtyeight.com/live-blog/senate-vote-health-care/ )
Chezzymann
Member
Man if thats the case this is probably gonna pass, fuck
Collins.
You can expect a handful of others (Paul, etc) to maybe not think this is a hard enough repeal to potentially be No's, and then the swing staters who are worried about being attacked for knocking 500K Ohioans off health insurance.
Ultimately, I think this bill probably still has a tough road to ho. It depends if the arm-twisting about needing to pass something works.
darkstar0155
Member
It really just depends on what is voted on. A repeal only bill is a solid fail all around imo. And the original replacement is also almost guaranteed to be a fail since Collins, and Paul are extreme hard no's, with the W.V. senator and others that said they would already vote no.
Zaraki_Kenpachi
Member
So they're finally dropping the charade that this is about people's health care not being good enough? People better wake the fuck up if this happens.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Looks like they probably have the votes to move forward with this plan. Portman and Heller are both "yes" on mtp.
Actually getting the votes to pass something will be challenging, however.
Actually getting the votes to pass something will be challenging, however.
If they have Heller this is gonna proceed. Though, as you say, an actual plan will probably go down like usual.
If they vote on MTP, they can vote on passing something.
Make no bones about it.
people have already woken the fuck up, everything the republicans have been doing for the last few months has been massively unpopular with the general public.
the reason they're doing it anyway is because they do not give a single fuck about the general public's opinion, all they care about is pleasing a few small groups (the ultra rich and the craziest tea partiers mainly). these are the people who got them elected, these are the ones who could get them successfully primaried, and nobody else matters. there never was a real charade, only the thinnest of pretenses so everyone can pretend they're following a sane ideology.
it's people like you who need to wake up to the fact that we don't really live in a democracy. the republicans were elected by a minority of the populace and only listen to an even smaller minority in that bloc. oligarchs are running things and they're getting exactly what they want out of this.