Captain Smoker
Member
No problem, I'm here. 8) xDdonny2112 said:
Media Create Sales: 01/19 - 01/25
- Thread starter PantherLotus
- Start date
Liabe Brave
Member
Even without Monster Hunter the PSP level is amazingly close to NDS. (It depends on how many SKUs Captain Smoker's counting, but I conservatively subtracted 3.)
I wonder how much of the difference is attributable to larger amounts of shovelware.Captain Smoker said:
I don't see the point of counting third party sales without Monster Hunter games. Capcom releases MH games on other consoles.
That would be like removing the sales of DQ games on Ds (biggest third party games on the handled). The average shrinks to ~67k and should shrink more (in comparison) with the release of DQIX
That would be like removing the sales of DQ games on Ds (biggest third party games on the handled). The average shrinks to ~67k and should shrink more (in comparison) with the release of DQIX
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
Spiegel said:
or it'd be like treating first party and third party games separately
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
Spiegel said:
Nintendo can release games on other consoles, but they don't. It's not about what Capcom does with Monster Hunter or what Nintendo does with their games. If you thought that was the point, you got it exactly 100% wrong.
Anyone releasing a game on the PSP is in competition with Monster Hunter directly. Anyone releasing a game on the DS is in competition with Nintendo's games directly. That's the point. If, hypothetically, there was a system where just football games sold well, it might be useful to break out football games when discussing software sales.
Breaking out games is a way of showing whether or not the software ecosystem is robust or narrow. You can also break them out by genre, or by median sales rather than mean, or by showing a distribution of software sales.
If you genuinely believe that it's unfair to break out Monster Hunter games even though the mean-median tilt on the PSP is almost entirely due to them and Crisis Core, then it ought to be doubly unfair and only half as useful to break out Nintendo consoles software sales by first-party/third-party. The fact that you do makes me wonder why mathematically (or even holistically) you feel one is valid and the other is not.
It's a useless comparison, as it's not really representative of any meaningful trend itself. What would be best is comparing like with like (ie: Capcom to Capcom, SEGA to SEGA, Square Enix to Square Enix, etc), and even that doesn't usually take key issues into account (budget, promotion, franchise strength, genre competition, etc).Spiegel said:
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
Spiegel said:
So would you exclude Monster Hunter in the context of "How are non-Monster Hunter games doing on X console" and "the future non-Monster Hunter support on X console based on the sales of their games" not in the context of "how much software has X console sold"?
I never said it was perfect. But it's better than comparing total software sales between, for example, psp and ds because psp has a lackluster first party support compared with the ds.
So yes, if we are talking about the future third party support on X console I think counting total sales is more misleading than counting third party sales.
So yes, if we are talking about the future third party support on X console I think counting total sales is more misleading than counting third party sales.
Liabe Brave
Member
Actually, there's a perfectly valid reason to exclude Nintendo games on a Nintendo system: they're basically bimodal. Regardless of quality, third-party games have less chance of hitting maximum sales potential on Nintendo systems. If I'm a third-party publisher, excluding first-party sales when trying to develop sales targets makes total sense. (It actually makes a lot less sense on PSP, where the second mode isn't platform owner or even publisher but Monster Hunter; a PSP list that was all-games-but-MH compared to a DS list all-third-party would be more similar for this function.)Laguna said:
When talking about total sales, all publishers and games need to be included. Other questions require other manipulations of the data.
Jaded Alyx
Member
Hey guys, what's going on in..
........
oh God.
........
oh God.
Cosmonaut X
Member
Liabe Brave said:
Why? Do you believe that the success of Nintendo games on Nintendo platforms hinders the sales of third-party titles to that degree, even in genres where Nintendo doesn't have much (if any) presence? If so, do you believe that competition from Nintendo games on Nintendo platforms is more damaging to the "maximum sales potential" of a game than Mega Third Party Game X is to the sales potential of other third-party games on, say, the PSP or 360?
jarrod said:
Because usually the important part in the topic of the third party support is how well or bad are third parties generally doing on X console
If third parties have usually good sales on X console it doesn't matter how well or bad are first party games doing. They'll continue supporting the console.
EXAMPLE (by garaph):
Gamecube total first party sales: 15 million Nintendo/Pokemon games (~60 games)
Ps2 total first party sales : 16 million SCEJ games (111 games)
Boulayman said:
There's also anime games (and of course sports that schuelma mentioned)
and how about comparing the Fate Unlimted fighting game versus TVC. Or the guilty gear comparisons.
heck lets just compare this week Fragile and Zill'0. They both pretty much sold the same if your average out Famitsu and Media Create. Fragile should have destroyed some unknown port in sales.
Then you have the fact that have any Wii third party game over performed like P*P. A game that tripled the sales of its PS2 version.
How much you want bet Tenchu PSP is going to kill the Wii one?
I mean I just went through like quite a few genres here.
ccbfan said:
You can't just compare random games that might share a genre. Ridiculous.
I fully admit that for certain types of games/genres PSP is a safer bet. But let's not get carried away. There are certainly 3rd party Wii efforts that would sell less on PSP.
Kurosaki Ichigo
Member
I like how its compared to count out all 1st party titles on all consoles with counting out just MH just on PSP. Pretty fair I'd say.
Also, wow at WE Wii, they may as well update the rosters or something (like those Final Evolution / Liveware Evolution did on PS2) given the delayed release.
Also, wow at WE Wii, they may as well update the rosters or something (like those Final Evolution / Liveware Evolution did on PS2) given the delayed release.
"How 3rd parties are doing" isn't really revealed by looking at lump 3rd party sales though. And disregarding 1st party performance entirely gives a skewed view of overall software potential. These are inherently meaningless figures without context.Spiegel said:
Should Enix look strictly at the top 3rd party performers on each machine to determine how well Dragon Quest could do where? Would Hudson be better off looking purely at bulk 3rd party sales on each machine and spreading support accordingly? What you're suggesting (ie; using just overall 3rd party sales to determine 3rd party potential and support) is hugely shortsighted.
jarrod said:
We're going in circles. You have asked me that here and I responded you here
Of course third parties have to do a more "in depth" analysis. but for us comenting the state of third parties on x console and the future support I prefer my take.
Sengoku Basara vs Musou Orochi. Both ports, both comparable games. Oh wait, the psp game was a late port, the wii game was a day one release
Okay
Yes, those games have sold from acceptable to great. Big name games do fine on psp
jarrod said:
I have something better, I know you love ratios.
Same day release:
PS2 Sengoku Basara 2 Heroes 176,562
WII Sengoku Basara 2 Heroes 21,296
Ps2 = 8.4xWii
8 months delay:
PS2 Musou Orochi: Maou Sairin 411k
PSP Musou Orochi: Maou Sairin 150k (and counting, it's surely going to do close to 180k)
Ps2 = 2.8xPsp (it's going to end at ~2.3)
Thanks Smoker. I found these bombs* interesting:
Disgaea > Touching
NDS - Disgaea: Prince of the Demon World and the Red Moon 19.637
NDS - Dokidoki Majo Shinpan! 2 19.574
Don't try this again, Capcom:
NDS - Viewtiful Joe Scratch! 5.661
Not casual enough?
NDS - The Sims 2 3.700
Oh dear:
NDS - Metal Slug 7 3.200
SEGAAAA
NDS - English of the Dead 1.500
* In before someone says 'b-b-but it's fulfilled its shipment, or made profit etc'. <20k can't be a hit, right?
Disgaea > Touching
NDS - Disgaea: Prince of the Demon World and the Red Moon 19.637
NDS - Dokidoki Majo Shinpan! 2 19.574
Don't try this again, Capcom:
NDS - Viewtiful Joe Scratch! 5.661
Not casual enough?
NDS - The Sims 2 3.700
Oh dear:
NDS - Metal Slug 7 3.200
SEGAAAA
NDS - English of the Dead 1.500
* In before someone says 'b-b-but it's fulfilled its shipment, or made profit etc'. <20k can't be a hit, right?
Jaded Alyx
Member
The thing is though, it is because of this that these threads have become boring and predictable.jman2050 said:
Spiegel said:
I wasn't asking you about big names in general, I was asking you about RE and Dragon Quest. Do you think those games would sell as well as Wii games? Do you, for instance, think a RE4 port would sell as well on PSP as it did on Wii?
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
Pachael said:
Hard to tell how bomba this is. The original sold 125k, the PSP rerelease sold 40k, the PSP budget version sold around 40k. I'm not sure what Disgaea DS shipped but it's not the sort of catastrophic bomba you might think based solely on the number.
This is a major bomba.
Sells for 2000 yen as of last October and rapidly dropping.
Bomba + early DS title = Megabomba.
Did around 12 times that much in the US, still bomba.
