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Metroid Other M |OT| You're Not Supposed to Remember Him
- Thread starter Sadist
- Start date
Not a fan of Prime 3. But I'm not the norm. My ranking of the Prime trilogy is Prime 2 > Prime > Prime 3.
Prime 2's got the best level design and puzzles of the three. I enjoyed the more in-depth weapon system and I don't think dread of being in Dark Aether was a bad thing. Plus I think it's got the best graphics of the three.
Prime was the perfect balance. It had good puzzles and a good amount of action. I didn't feel like Tallon IV was as "alive" as Aether though.
Prime 3's too action heavy for my taste. The puzzles were not as good or as interesting as Prime 2 or Prime. The streamlining greatly compromised and disconnected the planets.
I wouldn't rank Prime 3 above Other M. Even though Other M does not come close to what the Prime games in terms of level design or atmosphere it did beat the pants off of Prime 3 in terms of action and thus it beats the entire Prime series in terms of action.
That's enough for me. I had to settle with backtracking in Prime 2, I had to settle with the fact that Prime while the perfect balance had two other games that did things better than it, and I had to settle with Prime 3 being more action heavy and less puzzle-y and stuff.
It's ironic because I think Prime 3 and Other M both had action as a priority but I hated Prime 3. I really think it has to do with the slow formula and "feel" of the Prime games that may not be so good for action heavy gameplay. Other M though just did the action thing so well.
That's why I enjoy the game and not so critical of it as some users here.
Prime 2's got the best level design and puzzles of the three. I enjoyed the more in-depth weapon system and I don't think dread of being in Dark Aether was a bad thing. Plus I think it's got the best graphics of the three.
Prime was the perfect balance. It had good puzzles and a good amount of action. I didn't feel like Tallon IV was as "alive" as Aether though.
Prime 3's too action heavy for my taste. The puzzles were not as good or as interesting as Prime 2 or Prime. The streamlining greatly compromised and disconnected the planets.
I wouldn't rank Prime 3 above Other M. Even though Other M does not come close to what the Prime games in terms of level design or atmosphere it did beat the pants off of Prime 3 in terms of action and thus it beats the entire Prime series in terms of action.
That's enough for me. I had to settle with backtracking in Prime 2, I had to settle with the fact that Prime while the perfect balance had two other games that did things better than it, and I had to settle with Prime 3 being more action heavy and less puzzle-y and stuff.
It's ironic because I think Prime 3 and Other M both had action as a priority but I hated Prime 3. I really think it has to do with the slow formula and "feel" of the Prime games that may not be so good for action heavy gameplay. Other M though just did the action thing so well.
That's why I enjoy the game and not so critical of it as some users here.
Well, it was good. I really enjoyed the game a lot. Still probably the worst Metroid game I've played, but fun. I'll definitely play it again. I'll echo some of the sentiments about the story and the item authorization, but I'm not going to rehash them. Hopefully Sakomoto and Nintendo as a whole will hear the complaints and fix them for next time (if there is a next time). I'm certainly not opposed to another game like this, if some changes are made. All in all a good experience. Glad I bought it. Bring on Hard Mode. =D
I can't believe they put Nightmare and Phantoon in this game! Holy crap!
XenoRaven said:
Well, it was good. I really enjoyed the game a lot. Still probably the worst Metroid game I've played, but fun. I'll definitely play it again. I'll echo some of the sentiments about the story and the item authorization, but I'm not going to rehash them. Hopefully Sakomoto and Nintendo as a whole will hear the complaints and fix them for next time (if there is a next time). I'm certainly not opposed to another game like this, if some changes are made. All in all a good experience. Glad I bought it. Bring on Hard Mode. =D
I can't believe they put Nightmare and Phantoon in this game! Holy crap!
My two favorite bosses in this game. 
So... I dunno, after sitting on it for a bit, I'm just becoming more and more disappointed in this game. Even beyond my disappointments of the game itself, I just don't like what it means for the series as a whole. I hate how they turned Samus into a whiny brat, I hate that Sakamoto completely ignored the Prime series and instead decided that they're no longer a part of his "official" Metroid universe, and I hate the fact that Sakamoto apparently wants shitty anime/JRPG/MGS style writing and cutscenes to be the future of the series.
D
Deleted member 30609
Unconfirmed Member
Just got home to find Other M waiting. So much for the Japanese version.
I played a bit of the way through the bio zone. The unskippable cutscenes are unforgivable. Luckily the iPhone exists and I can actually block it out and complain on GAF at the same time.
Otherwise the controls seem pretty cool, the first person stuff seems like a decent gimmick and th combat seems inoffensive. Hopefully the game doesn't remain super linear. The authorization stuff still kills me and for some reason I can't get back to an earlier room with a powerup because the door is locked without reason.
The less said about the VA the better.
I played a bit of the way through the bio zone. The unskippable cutscenes are unforgivable. Luckily the iPhone exists and I can actually block it out and complain on GAF at the same time.
Otherwise the controls seem pretty cool, the first person stuff seems like a decent gimmick and th combat seems inoffensive. Hopefully the game doesn't remain super linear. The authorization stuff still kills me and for some reason I can't get back to an earlier room with a powerup because the door is locked without reason.
The less said about the VA the better.
Chet Rippo
Member
XenoRaven said:
I just assumed it was because she was shot in the back when she wasn't looking, but yeah, they could have dealt with that a little better.
_Alkaline_
Member
KevinCow said:
Once again, the Metroid Prime games are canon but there's no need to recognize them since they have little bearing on the plot. There are references to the events that took place both before and after the Prime series, but that's it. It fills in some gaps but does not change or introduce anything significant related to the main Metroid storyline.
_Alkaline_ said:
But in a way, all the games of Samus gaining her own abilities, going about things her own way and being an isolated mercenary create who she is. This includes the Prime games. So the change in her character created by
Ridley, Adam being able to knock her out with a shot, obeying Adam in general, and even stuff like hanging out at the Federation HQ in the end doesn't make sense. You have to retcon all the past games to accept her portrayal or you have to convince yourself that actions mean nothing and only spelling everything out is meaningful. Which is to say, you have to revert to a little kids reading level. No offense to five year olds.
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
etiolate said:
You're projecting your idea of Samus onto the games. For the whole Adam/HQ thing, Samus has worked on orders from the Federation in nearly every single Metroid game. Metroid, Metroid II, Echoes, Corruption, Fusion, and now Other M were all missions that existed exclusively because Samus was commanded by the Federation to do a job. While she was given freedom in her actions for most, Corruption, Fusion, and Other M are pretty explicitly guided by a higher command that she willfully obeys.
The idea that Samus is a free reign do-what-she-wants-when-she-wants Bounty Hunter doesn't exist in the games. For Other M, the Federation arrived their first, and made it clear they knew more about what was going on than her. Being a bitch, ignoring command, and doing things her own way would be a first.
The idea that Samus is a free reign do-what-she-wants-when-she-wants Bounty Hunter doesn't exist in the games. For Other M, the Federation arrived their first, and made it clear they knew more about what was going on than her. Being a bitch, ignoring command, and doing things her own way would be a first.
They're self-contained and add nothing to the plot.Nessus said:
Metroid: Samus defeats Mother Brain
Prime Trilogy: OMG Phazon
Metroid II: Kills off all but one Metroid
Super Metroid: Last Metroid is stolen and eventually dies, Mother Brain returns
Other M: Last remaining moments of Adam Malkovich
Metroid Fusion: Lack of Metroids results in a surge of the X parasite, DNA from last Metroid prevents the full infection of Samus, AI guidance revealed to be that of Adam Malkovich.
It may have been an important part of GF history but there's an underlying story that is/was being focused on and the Prime Trilogy was nothing more than a brief story arc.
EatChildren said:
sigh
I don't know where to begin with this bit over and over again.
My idea of Samus is based on her actions and my actions as a player. The events that transpire in gameplay are part of the story, and in fact, the large majority of the Metroid story. Interpreting these actions and what they say about a character is called READING COMPREHENSION. Calling it a projection of my idea of Samus shows you do not use this ability, so learn it if you want to act like you have something to say. Nothing is purely objective, but the stronger ideas are judged by how well they are supported by evidence. There is a shitload of evidence in the other games about Samus as individual and isolated. The overly used counter to this is "But Sakamoto says" and "Sakamoto didn't have the technology", but authorial intent as argued here is a falsehood, and the other is simply stating Sakamoto doesn't know how to tell a story or what he was doing. You don't need cinematic level tech to tell a story, which Super Metroid shows. There are plenty of very silent stories out there where you get an idea of who the character is.
Also, there is a huge difference between being hired as a bounty hunter and being a soldier, a part of a team. She was set out on a job in Corruption, but she's almost always been out on a job(more on this below), but what she does on the job, the route she takes and the way she does it is always by her/the player's choice. Other M is the one place where her authority over herself is lost.
Also, game characters are always a dual identity of the character as it exists in static form and the character as it is enacted by the player. Samus is always Samus AND the player. The same holds for almost all main characters. A silent character is not a blank slate.
This is just pure bullshit. She does what she has to do according to her mission. She never checks off before blowing something up.
The problem being the creator knows best about what the story is supposed to be. Whatever the viewer/player gets from said story is entirely up to that person.
If someone made some horrible story but people interpreted it as something deep it's still a horrible story. You call it reading comprehension and I call it overanalysis.
If you analyze something from a game that you feel or experience that doesn't necessarily mean it was the intended purpose of the game. It's YOUR idea but not necessarily the intended idea. You just seem mad that YOUR idea of Samus is not what Sakamoto is doing with the game. Anyone would be disappointed or mad if the direction wasn't the way they'd want but they have no say in any of it so they would either deal with it and/or move on.
If someone made some horrible story but people interpreted it as something deep it's still a horrible story. You call it reading comprehension and I call it overanalysis.
If you analyze something from a game that you feel or experience that doesn't necessarily mean it was the intended purpose of the game. It's YOUR idea but not necessarily the intended idea. You just seem mad that YOUR idea of Samus is not what Sakamoto is doing with the game. Anyone would be disappointed or mad if the direction wasn't the way they'd want but they have no say in any of it so they would either deal with it and/or move on.
D
Deleted member 30609
Unconfirmed Member
Maybe the story just is that bad, but it comes off to me as just really poorly localized. Maybe Sakamoto is a real diva over creative license when translating, who knows.
PounchEnvy said:
What you're stepping into is something that is hard for people to accept, but something thats been gone over by people before. The general deal is that you can't always know what the creator intended, and to be honest, the creator doesn't always fully know what they intend. There also those cracks in transmission and communication where meaning is lost. Some argue that you are never fully present in communication, but I argue you are never fully received, but the end result is similar in that the full message is not there and it takes work to find more of the meaning intended. There is a space for understanding something without having to "seek the oracle" as some people call the act.
Also, if someone made some horrible story and people found something deep and meaningful in it, then that meaning exists somewhere in there. The intent doesn't have power over whether the product of that intent has value or not. All of Shakespeare's work exist without his hand ever penning them. Someone in the audience liked what he saw was being performed that night and wrote it down in their own hand. We can never know what Shakespeare intended, but many people have found worth and meaning in his works, even if there is no original, sublime and supreme official 100% correct work.
The question is whether my interpretation is stronger in evidence than someone else's interpretation. Most of the games create an image of Samus strong enough to fasten on to not just me, but many others, and create a barrier towards accepting this new Samus. Just admitting its a new Samus is admitting it is something not previously present. We could go back and try to find this new Samus in the old games, but I doubt you will. You will find a more mature Samus and more vengeful Samus. The fact she repeatedly heads into missions featuring the ghosts of her past present a vengeful image of Samus. If Other M acknowledged this persona and then broke it down, it would be stronger. Instead it ignores it and goes forth with a persona that has never been seen before which is why people say what they've been saying.
I can't believe I'm teaching this stuff, but my point is that there is like a whole world out there that deals with this stuff and you may not know about it, but its out there and it sort of cockblocks "Sakamoto says" from defeating people's opinions about Samus.
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
etiolate said:
I dont know why you're being a narky dick about it, but whatever.
Everything is purely objective because you're assuming that the events that transpire in Metroid, as in the gameplay, intended to serve the purpose of character building the way you read them.
Correct, and has nothing to do with my point, which is that the events of Other M and Samus' attitude to not conflict with canon.
And Other M was a completely different situation to past Metroid titles. She was dealing with a group of people who are part of a much bigger organisation, one she used to be a part of, and one she still takes contracts from (and continues to do so). And, as I said, she was not there first, and it was made very clear she was not completely informed. That, coupled with her history with the characters, gives plausible reason for working with them.
Again, you're projecting your idea of Samus and her actions and what you want her to do.
A silent character is interpretive based on the player's actions and the events of the game. This is, as you stated, reading comprehension. But it is still, ultimately, a projection. Silent characters are almost always the subject of stories designed to be perceived from multiple perspectives, with multiple interpretations of their actions and emotions. To say that there is a definitive character of Samus that can be drawn from the silent Metroid titles is utter horseshit.
And her mission requirements vary from game to game. In Metroid, Metroid II, and Echoes she was given a simple order and accomplished it how she saw fit. In Super and Prime she took the mission on her own. In Corruption she handled things her way based on how events transpired, but still followed directive on where to go. Fusion was the same as Corruption, with an even stronger directive.
anotheriori
Member
Got 100% figuring out how to get dodge to occur more often with counter charged blast made short work of
. Hey Team Ninja where's my Samus in Venus for 100% item completion, oh just imagine the rage.
Phantoom and fatal attacks to kill off the superbomb guys
Rez said:
Well it's obvious that Treehouse didn't have the freedom they sometimes do. They would never turn in a script as jumbled and over-expository as this one if they were allowed to change it themselves. I guess the people at NCL insisted that they keep it as literal as possible. It's a shame, because while the scenario and story concepts are quite strong, the dialogue is just dreadful, MGS4 level drivel. Any good cinematic storyteller knows the golden rule of 'show don't tell'. Sakamoto doesn't seem to.
Okay but they are your opinions. Keep them to yourself. What I'm trying to emphasize is that Sakamoto has the final words on what the game and what the story is. You can say all you want but you have no true say, no true part in the story. They are your interpretation and they're not the literal interpretation.etiolate said:
hamchan said:
She didnt. Remember that Prime doesnt count, she only fought him a couple times.
This also didnt seem that strange to me since at the beggining she mentions defeating Ridley for good (or at least she thought so). I think she´s more surprised to see him there than anything else.
EatChildren said:
Because I have to stop and explain a bunch of stuff everytime this debate comes up. It's headache inducing. It's like interrupting a game of baseball to let somebody join, but then you have to stop and explain all the rules.
Then it's bad game story telling. Game story telling understand what is done in action is story.
I consider who she is canon.
But she could have just gone through the mission independently while still checking up with the team. She could have used her abilities as she saw fit. She could, as she always has, done things as she needs to do them. The reasoning not to is so poorly contrived and exists as dramatic irony in its only acceptable form.
There is a strongest form of Samus which I and many others have found. It exists based on what exists in the majority of games.
anotheriori
Member
Ridley clone and PTSD.hamchan said:
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
etiolate said:
Not my problem nor excuse for you to act like a dick towards me. You could have simply told me to read through your other posts. But it's a non-issue.
Which makes Metroid's story pretty shit.
What she is to you is not necessary what she is to everybody else.
She could have, but she didn't, and her choice in Other M regarding working with the team does not conflict with canon or 'established' character. Interpretive events of all other games do not present a strong enough argument that directly conflicts with her Other M decisions, in my opinion.
It exists based on what you consider the strongest argument for her character found within the game, which is not what I agree with. Your reading of Samus is what you believe is right. I do not believe there is enough material within the games (including gameplay) to create a character that conflicts with many of Samus' action in Other M.
Some, but not all, and especially not working with the Federation.
Not everything needs to be interpreted. Again. Overanalysis. Someone said hello to you today. There doesn't have to be some deep meaning or any bullshit to it. That person may have just said hello.etiolate said:The literal story is what makes up the interpretation. I don't know what you intend to mean by "literal story"
The other thing that bothers me is how adamant you are that your interpretation is better than Sakamoto's. Get over yourself. It may be better, it may not. You're basically a spectator in all of this. If you like your idea of Samus more than Sakamoto's idea of Samus, that's fine. But don't be mad because to the Metroid series he's way more important than you are.
Putting your interpretation on the level of, or even above, Sakamoto's interpretation is just undeserved and conceited.
You've put an emphasis on what your idea of what Samus is due to your interpretations of the game. You get mad that what the developers told you of what Samus is directly deviates from what you thought she was. I don't see how this couldn't be anything other than you being mad the person you thought you knew isn't that person.etiolate said:
If someone that has a say in something says to you, a fan, that you're wrong about what they're making, then you're wrong.
Having done some editorial work, I have said to writer's faces that what they think their character is actually is not there yet in the work.
Having dealt with editorial commentary with my writing, I've had people say my idea of the story is not quite there in the story yet.
This is how things work, yo.
You think that Sakamoto is the sole author of Samus and what he says she is creates the definitive Samus.
I do not think Sakamoto is sole author of Samus, and that Samus has been made up by the works of hudreds of people through various games, and I think the definitive Samus is the one that exists within the games.
You interpret this as my ego.
Having dealt with editorial commentary with my writing, I've had people say my idea of the story is not quite there in the story yet.
This is how things work, yo.
You think that Sakamoto is the sole author of Samus and what he says she is creates the definitive Samus.
I do not think Sakamoto is sole author of Samus, and that Samus has been made up by the works of hudreds of people through various games, and I think the definitive Samus is the one that exists within the games.
You interpret this as my ego.
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
etiolate said:
Is there a concise argument from yourself, somewhere in this thread, as to why Samus working with the Federation is a completely out-of-character decision? If so, please tell me, and I'll go read it. No need to find it yourself, I'll happily search.
I'm after something that references the supposed strongest argument readable from the events of past Metroid games, by the way, because so far you've yabbered on about said argument for Samus' character, superior reading comprehension from the events of these games, and how they conflict with Samus' Other M decision of working with the Federation, but you haven't actually referred to anything substantial.