Support NeoGAF

[splattered]

When there was a supposed conflict of interest in the CMA loosely tied to Sony 10+ years ago, then we had news articles popping up out of nowhere.

CMA Senior Director Used to Work for Law Firm Representing Sony

It emerges that a senior director at the UK Competition and Markets Authority has a history with a law firm that has represented Sony in the past.

gamerant.com

A CMA director, who blocked Microsoft's Xbox-Activision merger, previously worked for a Sony law firm (Update)

Conflict of interest identified?

www.windowscentral.com

CMA Senior Director has ties to Sony-affiliated law firm

The CMA (Competition and Markets Authority) has stood in the way of the merger of Microsoft and Activision-Blizzard. Now it has come to light one of the organization's senior directors has formerly…

nichegamer.com

CMA Senior Director Who Reportedly Blocked ABK Deal Previously Had Ties To Firm Representing Sony - Gameranx

A major discovery into the CMA reveals a conflict of interest which resulted in Microsoft's bid to acquire Activision Blizzard being blocked.

gameranx.com

Judge's son works for Microsoft, a direct connection, and I see one reference behind a paywall on law360...

Judge Discloses Son's Microsoft Job Ahead Of FTC Hearing - Law360

The California federal judge overseeing the Federal Trade Commission's bid to block Microsoft's $68.7 billion merger with Activision disclosed at a hearing Wednesday that her son works for Microsoft, then moved on to setting out the ground rules for a high-stakes five-day evidentiary hearing...

www.law360.com

If I'm going to point out scripts....one is a hell of a lot easier to see than the other.

I'm not saying this is a conflict of interest. As has been pointed out, the lawyers involved seem fine with it.

Well I mean it's not like Microsoft demanded to know how many PS platinum trophies/Sony salaries all the CMA family members had throughout the trial? If people really want to go witch hunting in hopes of steering the outcome in their favor they can but it doesn't appear to be overly important to everyone involved with the FTC case at this point. Maybe we will see the concern raised in the coming days if it isn't looking good for the FTC, who knows?

 

[ToadMan]

Good question but I can only speculate: it's a good card to play if they need to appeal and ask an other judge to extend the current temporary injunction.

This article provides a summary
https://www.carneybadleyspellman.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/dri-feb-2019-article.pdf

The TLDR is

1) Judges should recuse themselves if there is a possibility any "reasonable" person would see any potential conflict of interest

2) Parties to the case can bring a motion to disqualify a judge due to conflict of interest but it is risky because the judge decides on that motion themselves. If they reject it, the side bringing the motion is now in a case with a judge they have tried to disqualify.

3) There is no written prescribed timing for a disqualification motion to be brought, but judicial precedent in the Ninth Circuit has sought it as soon as possible after a conflict of interest had been identified.

So I'd take it that the FTC legal counsel don't think it's worth the risk to bring the disqualification motion and now that they haven't, they won't going forward.

The judge probably should have recused herself from the "gamer's lawsuit" based on the "reasonable person may see a conflict" test, but she didn't and here we are.

 

[splattered]

Just like they shop around marketing deals, right?

Correct?

 

[OmegaSupreme]

How much longer is this freak show going to last?

 

[TrueGrime]

Whether or not it truly is a "gotcha" remains to be seen. This could be grounds for appeal for the FTC and so they are keeping it in their back pocket. I'm just guessing, but so is everyone else so....

Yeah. Honestly, I'm not sure what the FTC was thinking. If you remotely think it is going to impact the trial then you file a grievance with the court and put pressure on the judge to recuse themselves. If the judge says no, then that is ammo you can use later. However, with them not even blinking an eye at it prior to the trial starting, if the FTC uses this angle as an appeal tool then it could just as easily be used to shut that down because they were fine with it prior to an outcome not happening in their favor.

 

[splattered]

How much longer is this freak show going to last?

I've been saying for a while I'm ready to get off this ride but to honest we've only just recently gotten to the good parts so I suppose I'm buckled in here for the long haul... Will be interesting to see where things go after this FTC trial

 

[Elios83]

This article provides a summary
https://www.carneybadleyspellman.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/dri-feb-2019-article.pdf

The TLDR is

1) Judges should recuse themselves if there is a possibility any "reasonable" person would see any potential conflict of interest

2) Parties to the case can bring a motion to disqualify a judge due to conflict of interest but it is risky because the judge decides on that motion themselves. If they reject it, the side bringing the motion is now in a case with a judge they have tried to disqualify.

3) There is no written prescribed timing for a disqualification motion to be brought, but judicial precedent in the Ninth Circuit has soight it as soon as possible after a conflict of interest had been identified.

So I'd take it that the FTC legal counsel don't think it's worth the risk to bring the disqualification motion and now that they haven't, they won't going forward. The judge probably should have recused herself from the "gamer's lawsuit" based on the "reasonable person may see a conflict" test, but she didn't and here we are.

Thanks this seems clear in the absurdity that the judge judges herself
So if they lose FTC will just appeal on the merits of the ruling.

 

[Dolomite]

Why don't you bring this valuable data by yourself here?
Can we look at all the cases they had in the last 5 years and calculate their success rate?

Lol sure? The FTC abandoned their cases against Lockheed Martine, Nvidia's planned purchase of Arm Ltd and had their case against Facebook's META dismissed...and those are just the headline Fed cases from the last two years.

I'll do you one better, here's a Very short list of some of their misfortunes in court from a 2022 article

U.S. keeps losing antitrust court battles but few expect pullback

The U.S. government has been hit with four painful losses at antitrust trials recently but legal experts do not expect the Biden administration's regulators to slow efforts to make American business more competitive.

www.reuters.com

And another

Judge rules in favor of U.S. Sugar purchase of Imperial, rejects antitrust concerns

A U.S. judge on Friday ruled in favor of U.S. Sugar Corp's plans to buy rival Imperial Sugar Co, rejecting a Justice Department argument that the proposed deal would drive up the price of sugar for households as well as for food and soda makers.

www.reuters.com

Fuck it one more

FTC to Come Back Stronger After Dropping Qualcomm Litigation

The Federal Trade Commission’s decision to drop its antitrust case against Qualcomm Inc. is part of a broader strategy to regroup and build more favorable case law rather than a retreat from this type of litigation, attorneys say.

news.bloomberglaw.com

My Favorite quote "Over the past two years, the Federal Trade Commission has suffered a series of stinging defeats in headline matters"

The case against the FTC

If this were a business, the firm’s shareholders might be asking for new management.

thehill.com

 

[Bojanglez]

"despite being an Xbox informer"

WTF is an Xbox informer?

 

[Elios83]

Lol sure? The FTC abandoned their cases against Lockheed Martine, Nvidia's planned purchase of Arm Ltd and had their case against Facebook's META dismissed...and those are just the headline Fed cases from the last two years.

I'll do you one better, here's a Very short list of some of their misfortunes in court from a 2022 article

U.S. keeps losing antitrust court battles but few expect pullback

The U.S. government has been hit with four painful losses at antitrust trials recently but legal experts do not expect the Biden administration's regulators to slow efforts to make American business more competitive.

www.reuters.com

And another

Judge rules in favor of U.S. Sugar purchase of Imperial, rejects antitrust concerns

A U.S. judge on Friday ruled in favor of U.S. Sugar Corp's plans to buy rival Imperial Sugar Co, rejecting a Justice Department argument that the proposed deal would drive up the price of sugar for households as well as for food and soda makers.

www.reuters.com

Fuck it one more

FTC to Come Back Stronger After Dropping Qualcomm Litigation

The Federal Trade Commission’s decision to drop its antitrust case against Qualcomm Inc. is part of a broader strategy to regroup and build more favorable case law rather than a retreat from this type of litigation, attorneys say.

news.bloomberglaw.com

My Favorite quote "Over the past two years, the Federal Trade Commission has suffered a series of stinging defeats in headline matters"

The case against the FTC

If this were a business, the firm’s shareholders might be asking for new management.

thehill.com

They had their recent defeats this was known to me as well but it would have been interesting to have actual statistics with all the cases they handled (within a reasonable time frame to make a statistic like 5 years) and calculate the overall success rate.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Lol sure? The FTC abandoned their cases against Lockheed Martine, Nvidia's planned purchase of Arm Ltd and had their case against Facebook's META dismissed...and those are just the headline Fed cases from the last two years.

I'll do you one better, here's a Very short list of some of their misfortunes in court from a 2022 article

U.S. keeps losing antitrust court battles but few expect pullback

The U.S. government has been hit with four painful losses at antitrust trials recently but legal experts do not expect the Biden administration's regulators to slow efforts to make American business more competitive.

www.reuters.com

And another

Judge rules in favor of U.S. Sugar purchase of Imperial, rejects antitrust concerns

A U.S. judge on Friday ruled in favor of U.S. Sugar Corp's plans to buy rival Imperial Sugar Co, rejecting a Justice Department argument that the proposed deal would drive up the price of sugar for households as well as for food and soda makers.

www.reuters.com

Fuck it one more

FTC to Come Back Stronger After Dropping Qualcomm Litigation

The Federal Trade Commission’s decision to drop its antitrust case against Qualcomm Inc. is part of a broader strategy to regroup and build more favorable case law rather than a retreat from this type of litigation, attorneys say.

news.bloomberglaw.com

My Favorite quote "Over the past two years, the Federal Trade Commission has suffered a series of stinging defeats in headline matters"

The case against the FTC

If this were a business, the firm’s shareholders might be asking for new management.

thehill.com

What's the link at the bottom? It's a 404 error page. (Never mind. You fixed it.)

As for skimming some of the stuff you posted where the FTC lost, what a farce. It's like they have no idea what they are doing. Youd think as a commission they'd know the laws on competition and mergers/acquisitions like the back of their hand. So if they fight companies combining it's be a slam dunk win. Guess not.

 

[Bridges]

Fuck I was just about to post this

Glad I refreshed haha

 

[Topher]

Well I mean it's not like Microsoft demanded to know how many PS platinum trophies/Sony salaries all the CMA family members had throughout the trial? If people really want to go witch hunting in hopes of steering the outcome in their favor they can but it doesn't appear to be overly important to everyone involved with the FTC case at this point. Maybe we will see the concern raised in the coming days if it isn't looking good for the FTC, who knows?

My gut tells me there really is nothing here and if there is, we will hear about it. And if Sony is correct and the FTC had an opportunity to object then there truly is nothing to talk about.

Yeah. Honestly, I'm not sure what the FTC was thinking. If you remotely think it is going to impact the trial then you file a grievance with the court and put pressure on the judge to recuse themselves. If the judge says no, then that is ammo you can use later. However, with them not even blinking an eye at it prior to the trial starting, if the FTC uses this angle as an appeal tool then it could just as easily be used to shut that down because they were fine with it prior to an outcome not happening in their favor.

I think on appeal the FTC will have to have compiled a number of inconsistencies on the judge's part to accompany the allegation of "conflict of interest". Hard to see an appellate court judge looking at such allegations coolly without some hard evidence.

 

[GHG]

What's the link at the bottom? It's a 404 error page. (Never mind. You fixed it.)

As for skimming some of the stuff you posted where the FTC lost, what a farce. It's like they have no idea what they are doing. Youd think as a commission they'd know the laws on competition and mergers/acquisitions like the back of their hand. So if they fight companies combining it's be a slam dunk win. Guess not.

They don't have the power and conflicts of interest are too strong in the US system.

If you look at cases where they've had to back out or have even lost, those are cases that were successful (in terms of regulatory bodies being successful) in other countries.

They've always had to fight with one hand tied behind their back while attempting to run uphill.

In all honestly with the way things are currently set up they may as well not exist in the US. The same goes for the SEC, it's a free for all.

 

[TrueGrime]

I think on appeal the FTC will have to have compiled a number of inconsistencies on the judge's part to accompany the allegation of "conflict of interest". Hard to see an appellate court judge looking at such allegations coolly without some hard evidence.

Agree! I'm trying to find cases where the FTC has lost the initial case, but has had a successful appeal. And if that appeal was successful, how long did it take to get that appeal stamped. MS and AB are on a strict timeline here.

 

[splattered]

At what point is the public going to find out if MS and Acti were able to come to an un/successful renegotiation or extension etc? That piece of info feels badly missing at this point...

 

[GHG]

At what point is the public going to find out if MS and Acti were able to come to an un/successful renegotiation or extension etc? That piece of info feels badly missing at this point...

We will know beforehand because there will need to be a shareholder vote.

 

[Godot25]

I will laugh so hard at the meltdowns that will be around here if judge does not give PI to FTC and Microsoft will close over CMA despite "legal experts" here assuring me that it is practically impossible

 

[dotnotbot]

I will laugh so hard at the meltdowns that will be around here if judge does not give PI to FTC and Microsoft will close over CMA despite "legal experts" here assuring me that it is practically impossible

First part I think everyone here is aware already it's not gonna be granted, second part - good luck, it's not only "experts" here but lawyers saying the same as well.

 

[Calverz]

My god, follow the posts I quoted. It's all there and it's not complicated.

I'm looking for a tl:dr version haha

 

[Topher]

I will laugh so hard at the meltdowns that will be around here if judge does not give PI to FTC and Microsoft will close over CMA despite "legal experts" here assuring me that it is practically impossible

Who here told you that not winning the injunction is "practically impossible"?

 

[HTK]

So who's winning so far...?

 

[harry mason 1989]

So who's winning so far...?

We will know the answer in July 18 2023

 

[Topher]

So who's winning so far...?

CADE

 

[MasterCornholio]

I will laugh so hard at the meltdowns that will be around here if judge does not give PI to FTC and Microsoft will close over CMA despite "legal experts" here assuring me that it is practically impossible

If they want to win the appeal closing the deal isn't going to help them.

 

[Godot25]

Who here told you that not winning the injunction is "practically impossible"?

"practically impossible" was not for PI, but for closing over CMA...

PI is not going to happen. Everybody without goggles made out of 4 shaped symbols can already see that from miles away. FTC did not have a good case to begin with, but they managed to fumble even this.

But at least there is conspiracy about judge's son, right?

 

[Godot25]

First part I think everyone here is aware already it's not gonna be granted, second part - good luck, it's not only "experts" here but lawyers saying the same as well.

And that will be probably reason for "laughing hard"

 

[MasterCornholio]

"practically impossible" was not for PI, but for closing over CMA...

More like practically impossible without any consequences.

 

[Topher]

"practically impossible" was not for PI, but for closing over CMA...

You'll be disappointed if you expect meltdowns over that ( or the FTC ruling for that matter). Just means more legal trouble for Microsoft. Besides, the CMA dropped the console aspect and folks reacted quite coolly to that. The emotional ones are the Florian Muellers of the world.

 

[OmegaSupreme]

So who's winning so far...?

We are

 

[xHunter]

PI is not going to happen. Everybody without goggles made out of 4 shaped symbols can already see that from miles away. FTC did not have a good case to begin with, but they managed to fumble even this.

Are you suggesting that you are a "legal expert"?

 

[mrmustard]

So who's winning so far...?

Forums and news sites. Getting tons of clicks.

 

[TrueGrime]

At what point is the public going to find out if MS and Acti were able to come to an un/successful renegotiation or extension etc? That piece of info feels badly missing at this point...

I believe that CAT appeal will conclude before the time to complete the merger happens. If the CAT throws things back down to the CMA to consider, I think MS and AB 100% re-negotiate. If the CAT agrees with the CMA then the deal is deader than dead. However, I wouldn't put it past a trillion dollar company to find a loophole to try and keep this going somehow, but AB would need to be all in as well.

In either case, CAT is the big one here. It'll be interesting because the only remedy the CMA proposed to MS earlier is to divest. Which I think is bullshit for an initial remedy for any company wanting to acquire. CMA made Meta divest last year (Mostly because Meta and Giphy had already begun integration BEFORE the outcome of their CAT appeal) and now they're pushing to block this acquisition.

If people think this shit with the FTC is juicy, just wait until the CAT stuff starts.

 

[Godot25]

You'll be disappointed if you expect meltdowns over that ( or the FTC ruling for that matter). Just means more legal trouble for Microsoft. Besides, the CMA dropped the console aspect and folks reacted quite coolly to that. The emotional ones are the Florian Muellers of the world.

I guess we will see about that

 

[FoxMcChief]

How much longer is this freak show going to last?

When the CMA and FTC bend over and let big dick Phil Spencer have his way with them.

 

[HoldTheAir]

So @DeepEnigma said "script" 10 times in a month on gaf and you think that's some type of gotcha?

Similar to how the FTC attorney constantly tried to get Phil into some kind of "gotcha" moment, but failed miserably.

 

[Topher]

PI is not going to happen. Everybody without goggles made out of 4 shaped symbols can already see that from miles away. FTC did not have a good case to begin with, but they managed to fumble even this.

But at least there is conspiracy about judge's son, right?

Re: your edit. You should read more before posting. I've said multiple times the FTC is going to lose. Also on record stating the judge's son isn't an issue since the FTC didn't have a problem with it.

I guess we will see about that

"We"? Depends on the results. I'll be here discussing it no matter what.

 

[Godot25]

Are you suggesting that you are a "legal expert"?

Nah. I'm just implying that people here sometimes does not have a clue what they are talking about.

All I know is that Microsoft hired peeps more knowledgeable that GAF members to find a way around CMA and if they will find one they will take it.

But I mean.. What can I expect from people who thinks that it is good question from FTC lawyer to claim that if you have 70 billion for merger you can instead use them to buy third party exclusives and that it is same type of transaction. And that by wanting to go hard to mobile business Microsoft if writing off their console business

 

[HoldTheAir]

Could the deposition of the Google Stadia lead where he stated that cloud competes with consoles have an effect on the CAT hearings?

 

[Topher]

Nah. I'm just implying that people here sometimes does not have a clue what they are talking about.

All I know is that Microsoft hired peeps more knowledgeable that GAF members to find a way around CMA and if they will find one they will take it.

Wow.....Microsoft hired lawyers to find a way around the CMA? So glad you are here to tell us these things.

We got another "expert" here folks!

 

[xHunter]

Nah. I'm just implying that people here sometimes does not have a clue what they are talking about.

All I know is that Microsoft hired peeps more knowledgeable that GAF members to find a way around CMA and if they will find one they will take it.

But I mean.. What can I expect from people who thinks that it is good question from FTC lawyer to claim that if you have 70 billion for merger you can instead use them to buy third party exclusives and that it is same type of transaction. And that by wanting to go hard to mobile business Microsoft if writing off their console business

Ok, so people voicing their opinion is something that triggers you so much go around and accuse people of acting like "legal experts". Maybe you should take a little time off this thread. Its not that serious.

 

[Banjo64]

I will laugh so hard at the meltdowns that will be around here if judge does not give PI to FTC and Microsoft will close over CMA despite "legal experts" here assuring me that it is practically impossible

Good for you champ

 

[Topher]

Good for you champ

But if he's wrong...

 

[TrueGrime]

Personally, I think the FTC convinced no one that their arguments have any merit to secure an injunction. Instead of producing facts it just seems like they are trying to corner MS into saying something that they can further use as ammo, but I think MS has done a decent job of not putting themselves in a trap they can't talk their way out of.

Funnily enough, if the FTC got their way initially, yesterday would've been the end of the trial and I still think they would've lost still in incredible fashion. Still, who knows what the fuck will happen. Most people thought the CMA wouldn't have blocked and the EU to follow the CMA's lead. The whole fucking merger has been chalked full of surprises.

 

[splattered]

I dunno i do feel like some people on this forum are gonna need safe spaces if the FTC shenanigans don't play out how they want and the CMA is the only potential block left standing in the way... i imagine it's going to get fairly heated in here as we get down to the wire. Lots of temp/perm bans and stuff.

 

[Godot25]

Ok, so people voicing their opinion is something that triggers you so much go around and accuse people of acting like "legal experts". Maybe you should take a little time off this thread. Its not that serious.

I mean. I don't think it's that serious. I was having fun yesterday reading all messages without interfering.

From "judge's son is Microsoft employee" as a safeguard against non-Pi decision, trying to catch Spencer's oath as "for PS5 only" and thinking that if Microsoft communicates about Minecraft Dungeons exclusivity that it holds more weight then actually releasing full game mulitplatform....

...just to name a few.

 

[Banjo64]

But if he's wrong...

We saw what happened when the CMA blocked - absolute chimp outs and bans for the Xbox crew. When the CMA dropped the console SLC, despite the crowing from the Xbox crew, every normal poster tried to have a level headed discussion. It'll be the same here.

If this deal goes through I get the feeling it'll be the finest accomplishment in some posters' lives.

 

[Topher]

I dunno i do feel like some people on this forum are gonna need safe spaces if the FTC shenanigans don't play out how they want and the CMA is the only potential block left standing in the way... i imagine it's going to get fairly heated in here as we get donw to the wire. Lots of temp/perm bans and stuff.

The regulars who post are going to be fine. It is the flybys who shitpost that bring all the emotion and nonsense.

Basically this....

We saw what happened when the CMA blocked - absolute chimp outs and bans for the Xbox crew. When the CMA dropped the console SLC, despite the crowing from the Xbox crew, every normal poster tried to have a level headed discussion. It'll be the same here.

If this deal goes through I get the feeling it'll be the finest accomplishment in some posters' lives.

 

[MasterCornholio]

I dunno i do feel like some people on this forum are gonna need safe spaces if the FTC shenanigans don't play out how they want and the CMA is the only potential block left standing in the way... i imagine it's going to get fairly heated in here as we get down to the wire. Lots of temp/perm bans and stuff.

All it takes is one per the sec filing to cause issues.

 

[splattered]

All it takes is one per the sec filing to cause issues.

True but those issues aren't permanent yet.. we aren't quite at the season finale just yet. yet. yet. yet. Sorry i'm sick and tired haha