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[PaintTinJr]

OK so it won't be the same merger that the CMA blocked. That makes more sense to me.

To summarise there will be changes made to it but we don't have the details on what Microsoft is offering. Hopefully the CMA lets us know what those changes are for transparency reasons.

There is a document - sadly with redactions - on the CMA website of what Microsoft's new merger proposal entailed , but unless there is something substantial in the redacted parts, it reads like the exact same merger. but with a different slant because the EU have since been a pushover, and the US courts for the last 50 years have been so tone deaf to anti-trust that based on the white flag of US courts the UK should look the other way too.

My own guess at this point is that because the CMA didn't state they were still blocking by today, every day extra is likely being used to justify a capitulation of the block - with a small chance that they will use the full time and still block, coincidentally giving the CMA more time to get ducks in a row for an inevitable new appeal challenge.

 

[bitbydeath]

I'm confused. Didn't the CMA change their stance because Microsoft was going to change the deal?

No. CMA is still blocked. MS simply proposed a new deal to try get it unblocked. We don't know what MS has proposed or if CMA will see it as enough to unblock. We do know CMA wants divestment.

 

[PaintTinJr]

Everything except that last sentence makes no sense. Gives the impression that Australia is simply going to wait and follow what UK decides instead of standing up and delivering their own decision.

This goes back to the reported "collusion concerns" between CMA and FTC.

Each agency should just report their findings - period.

The trade agreement between two nations might stipulate that alignment is required. If the Aussies have no strong opinion or very strong, then maybe best to just back their trade deal, which is their right to deem as more important, when the UK are more important to their capitalist market than this deal.

edit:
Although, I fundamentally agree with you, the Eu giving one iffy analysis for 27 nations is just unacceptable. they should have needed each member state make their own decision, then do it by majority, and then await countries with a veto to override if that was their decision.

 

[harry mason 1989]

Hope both cma & ms will end this drama soon

 

[Vox Machina]

Is this legal? They should only decide if the deal is harmful for Australia? UK market has nothing to do with Australia market?

I agree with you in theory but in practice, for some of these global mergers these smaller market regulators may not have the resources to study the market well enough or may just have too much on their plate which is more related to their territory in general (and thus more applicable to their constituents) to get to the global merger. I always expected Australia and New Zealand to defer to the UK. I'm actually surprised NZ had the guts to make an independent call, although I think thats more due to not having any excuses left for delaying and not wanting to appear to fully capitulate to the CMA.

 

[CRAIG667]

The trade agreement between two nations might stipulate that alignment is required. If the Aussies have no strong opinion or very strong, then maybe best to just back their trade deal, which is their right to deem as more important, when the UK are more important to their capitalist market than this deal.

edit:
Although, I fundamentally agree with you, the Eu giving one iffy analysis for 27 nations is just unacceptable. they should have needed each member state make their own decision, then do it by majority, and then await countries with a veto to override if that was their decision.

That's ridiculous, money down the drain. The whole point of the EU is to streamline what goes on in Europe. Having each member draw their own conclusions defeats the whole objective.

While we're at it, brexit was/is a complete con. The Tories have lined their pockets for short terms gains while the average man pays for it. We in the UK have gained nothing but we have lost a foot at the table.

 

[FUBARx89]

That's ridiculous, money down the drain. The whole point of the EU is to streamline what goes on in Europe. Having each member draw their own conclusions defeats the whole objective.

While we're at it, brexit was/is a complete con. The Tories have lined their pockets for short terms gains while the average man pays for it. We in the UK have gained nothing but we have lost a foot at the table.

What you on about? We took back our borders. Clearly we're winners /s

Anyways, we expecting this week for CMA to make any moves? Ain't kept up since the CAT judge demanded satisfaction and got his satisfaction.

 

[Pipoqueiro]

Is this legal? They should only decide if the deal is harmful for Australia? UK market has nothing to do with Australia market?

 

[Timberwolf25]

What you on about? We took back our borders. Clearly we're winners /s

Anyways, we expecting this week for CMA to make any moves? Ain't kept up since the CAT judge demanded satisfaction and got his satisfaction.

Not a Brit, but I thought there was more to it. Such as having rules made in Belgium that really wasn't beneficial to the UK.
From when I lived in Germany, it seemed to be to me that smaller EU countries benefited way more from the union than countries like Germany, France and the UK that seemed to bear the most burden. My German neighbors weren't too happy with the EU as a whole, but that's anecdotal as I only got the view from 2-3 of them.

Edit: Ironically if the UK was still part of the EU, this deal would be done right?

 

[PaintTinJr]

That's ridiculous, money down the drain. The whole point of the EU is to streamline what goes on in Europe. Having each member draw their own conclusions defeats the whole objective.

While we're at it, brexit was/is a complete con. The Tories have lined their pockets for short terms gains while the average man pays for it. We in the UK have gained nothing but we have lost a foot at the table.

Careful, that sounds awfully political.

If you actually read what I wrote, I was drawing a parallel between two countries with a trade agreement doing their own analysis and giving a joint compromised opinion, versus the workings of the EU having that same processes, instead of their current one.

 

[freefornow]

Hurry up CMA. Just sign off on it.
I need Blur 2 to be a pursuable reality asap!

 

[hlm666]

I agree with you in theory but in practice, for some of these global mergers these smaller market regulators may not have the resources to study the market well enough or may just have too much on their plate which is more related to their territory in general (and thus more applicable to their constituents) to get to the global merger. I always expected Australia and New Zealand to defer to the UK. I'm actually surprised NZ had the guts to make an independent call, although I think thats more due to not having any excuses left for delaying and not wanting to appear to fully capitulate to the CMA.

Any aussie can tell you the accc is useless, they are waiting on the uk because they couldn't be bothered doing their own analysis and don't want to end up in a stupid situation where they are the only ones opposing it then being closed over because big tech doesn't give a toss about the Australian market. Valve doesn't even sell/ship it's hardware here for instance. On a side note the UK/cma has no control over our regulator, this is just them seeing cma/ftc and wanting to sit with the cool kids. Also none of our trade agreements have clauses pertaining to regulators/accc outside the fact that anything imported/sold has to abide by our laws/regulations. Here's the link, I can't be arsed reading it to prove myself wrong but if someone else is that bored feel free to go for it.

https://www.dfat.gov.au/trade/agreements/in-force/aukfta

 

[Eotheod]

This might be part of recent post-Brexit trade-deal between the UK and Australia, rather than a historical commonwealth issue.

It is not, we just follow suit with UK. It has been done before with ACCC and global mergers, we quite literally just wait for our English Lord's to tell us what to do.

 

[bitbydeath]

Any aussie can tell you the accc is useless, they are waiting on the uk because they couldn't be bothered doing their own analysis and don't want to end up in a stupid situation where they are the only ones opposing it then being closed over because big tech doesn't give a toss about the Australian market. Valve doesn't even sell/ship it's hardware here for instance. On a side note the UK/cma has no control over our regulator, this is just them seeing cma/ftc and wanting to sit with the cool kids. Also none of our trade agreements have clauses pertaining to regulators/accc outside the fact that anything imported/sold has to abide by our laws/regulations. Here's the link, I can't be arsed reading it to prove myself wrong but if someone else is that bored feel free to go for it.

https://www.dfat.gov.au/trade/agreements/in-force/aukfta

More countries should have done this TBH.
It's Australia's way of saying they're against it, but aren't large enough to actually oppose it. Most countries (aside from US and UK) would have fallen into the same predicament.

 

[ZehDon]

Any aussie can tell you the accc is useless, they are waiting on the uk because they couldn't be bothered doing their own analysis and don't want to end up in a stupid situation where they are the only ones opposing it then being closed over because big tech doesn't give a toss about the Australian market. Valve doesn't even sell/ship it's hardware here for instance. On a side note the UK/cma has no control over our regulator, this is just them seeing cma/ftc and wanting to sit with the cool kids. Also none of our trade agreements have clauses pertaining to regulators/accc outside the fact that anything imported/sold has to abide by our laws/regulations. Here's the link, I can't be arsed reading it to prove myself wrong but if someone else is that bored feel free to go for it.

https://www.dfat.gov.au/trade/agreements/in-force/aukfta

The ACCC is far from useless. If you like Steam's current refund policy, for example, you can thank the ACCC.

 

[The Pleasure]

Every time someone thinks that this topic needs a break, this is what happens.

 

[hlm666]

The ACCC is far from useless. If you like Steam's current refund policy, for example, you can thank the ACCC.

Yeh it's probably the reason valve took so long to charge us in aud when new zealand had their own currency implmented years before us and why they don't sell hardware here. If they weren't useless they would have got this pushed onto consoles and phones aswell, they took on valve, then job done walked away. They took on banks about credit card surcharges, apparently won but I'm still paying credit card surcharges? which the icing on the cake is the damn government is one of the biggest offenders. When I pay my vehicle rego or drivers license fees online those pricks charge a surcharge......... I'm gonna keep my useless rating for the time being, valve was just their bradbury moment.

 

[dante_f]

I agree with you in theory but in practice, for some of these global mergers these smaller market regulators may not have the resources to study the market well enough or may just have too much on their plate which is more related to their territory in general (and thus more applicable to their constituents) to get to the global merger. I always expected Australia and New Zealand to defer to the UK. I'm actually surprised NZ had the guts to make an independent call, although I think thats more due to not having any excuses left for delaying and not wanting to appear to fully capitulate to the CMA.

Wow i want their job , for a good paying gig I just have to do copy paste and change u.k. to Australia

 

[Unknown Soldier]

 

[Bernoulli]

wasn't the final decision supposed to come the 8th?

just end this now or Block it until next year

 

[Goalus]

If I were the CMA, I would force MS to bring the entire Heretic/Hexen series to consoles. Also Mageslayer, Take No Prisoners and Soldier of Fortune. If they comply, they can have Activision.

 

[Eotheod]

Yeh it's probably the reason valve took so long to charge us in aud when new zealand had their own currency implmented years before us and why they don't sell hardware here. If they weren't useless they would have got this pushed onto consoles and phones aswell, they took on valve, then job done walked away. They took on banks about credit card surcharges, apparently won but I'm still paying credit card surcharges? which the icing on the cake is the damn government is one of the biggest offenders. When I pay my vehicle rego or drivers license fees online those pricks charge a surcharge......... I'm gonna keep my useless rating for the time being, valve was just their bradbury moment.

ACCC for consumer protection rights is actually significantly important, and has had some serious historical impacts on the consumer market. The ability to actually get reparations for faulty items, fining over tiny font customer rights waivers, dodgy Harvey Norman shit and not to mention actually providing a solid year to two year default return policy/warranty.

 

[NickFire]

These recent hardware sales trends make it unfathomable, to me, that regulators would allow MS to use non-gaming revenue to take control over so much of the gaming industry. All this focus on Sony's ability to compete misses the point IMO. The focus should be on whether the massive volume of consumers, who have all already voted with their wallets, should be subject to the risk of losing access to a large segment of traditionally 3rd party content because a trillion dollar wants to be #1 despite not earning their place the traditional way.

 

[CuNi]

These recent hardware sales trends make it unfathomable, to me, that regulators would allow MS to use non-gaming revenue to take control over so much of the gaming industry. All this focus on Sony's ability to compete misses the point IMO. The focus should be on whether the massive volume of consumers, who have all already voted with their wallets, should be subject to the risk of losing access to a large segment of traditionally 3rd party content because a trillion dollar wants to be #1 despite not earning their place the traditional way.

In a crude sense of humor, one might say they are exactly doing it in the traditional way. Usually companies that become the top dogs got their position through money, politics and corruption. So Microsoft is kinda playing by the books.

 

[mckmas8808]

These recent hardware sales trends make it unfathomable, to me, that regulators would allow MS to use non-gaming revenue to take control over so much of the gaming industry. All this focus on Sony's ability to compete misses the point IMO. The focus should be on whether the massive volume of consumers, who have all already voted with their wallets, should be subject to the risk of losing access to a large segment of traditionally 3rd party content because a trillion dollar wants to be #1 despite not earning their place the traditional way.

 

[user friendly]

I'm sure it's been said before but I feel like this isn't going to go the way I think MS thinks it's going to go. I have nothing to back up that feeling other than how things have gone for MS lately. I just don't see this changing anything as far as marketshare goes. I'm eagerly waiting to see how or if this changes anything at all. I guess it's a long-term move though.

 

[havoc00]

Idfk anymore, I've given up, I'm just expecting this to close in October now, Lol. Every date is wrong, might as well go with the latest possible.

 

[Timberwolf25]

Idfk anymore, I've given up, I'm just expecting this to close in October now, Lol. Every date is wrong, might as well go with the latest possible.

watch. Now we'll get news tomorrow

 

[Ozriel]

These recent hardware sales trends make it unfathomable, to me, that regulators would allow MS to use non-gaming revenue to take control over so much of the gaming industry. All this focus on Sony's ability to compete misses the point IMO. The focus should be on whether the massive volume of consumers, who have all already voted with their wallets, should be subject to the risk of losing access to a large segment of traditionally 3rd party content because a trillion dollar wants to be #1 despite not earning their place the traditional way.

Arguing that paying for exclusivity isn't 'the traditional way' is quite the strange thing in 2023.

Are we talking about the same recent hardware trends where Sony's wiping the floor with Xbox?

I think the 'monopoly' argument went out the door as soon as Sony signed that contract.

 

[mayham2199]

Idfk anymore, I've given up, I'm just expecting this to close in October now, Lol. Every date is wrong, might as well go with the latest possible.

This is where I'm at. I fully expect this to pass at this point.

 

[Negotiator101]

This is where I'm at. I fully expect this to pass at this point.

August 29th is the date but the CMA said they're trying to get it done quicker, not sure why anyone was expecting anything different. Given the extension to October they'll probably take to the 29th now anyway.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

August 29th is the date but the CMA said they're trying to get it done quicker, not sure why anyone was expecting anything different. Given the extension to October they'll probably take to the 29th now anyway.

CMA probably realized that MS literally submitted the exact same thing to them again and expected them to kowtow. So now CMA is trying to figure out what to do, knowing there's an American aircraft carrier mysteriously parked just offshore from London for an unknown reason.

 

[Heisenberg007]

I was thinking yesterday, how quite has it been in terms of acquisitions of late.

Tencent purchased a couple of studios, but Embracer, Microsoft, Sony, have all been quiet. Not gonna lie, it feels good.

 

[M1987]

I want the CMA to block again just for the drama

 

[Heisenberg007]

I want the CMA to block again just for the drama

 

[Bernoulli]

I want the CMA to block again just for the drama

if they block i want them to drag it as much as they can, ACTVI needs to get the extra cash

if politics are involved it's over they will drop it

 

[M1987]

if they block i want them to drag it as much as they can, ACTVI needs to get the extra cash

if politics are involved it's over they will drop it

If it was politics that were involved then that's bullshit,they are supposed to be a independent regulator

 

[Unknown Soldier]

I want the CMA to block again just for the drama

If they actually blocked again, I doubt there will be much drama. MS will just let the merger agreement terminate and walk away. I don't see them actually trying to fight with the CAT for 1-2 years and holding ABK hostage the entire time.

 

[MasterCornholio]

If they actually blocked again, I doubt there will be much drama. MS will just let the merger agreement terminate and walk away. I don't see them actually trying to fight with the CAT for 1-2 years and holding ABK hostage the entire time.

I thought they already accepted it. Maybe I'm just don't understand the current situation.

 

[jm89]

So any more information on the divestiture MS offered?

Last i read was from the bloomberg article about cloud marketing rights. Has there been any more information that's come out since then?

 

[jm89]

I thought they already accepted it. Maybe I'm just don't understand the current situation.

You mean the CMA?

From what i understood the only thing the CMA accepted was the material changes to the proposed order which was related to the old deal.

They used these material changes to get the the trial that was supposed to take place end of july adjourned.

If they didn't get it adjourned, then they would have to prepare to go to trial over the appeal whilst looking into the new merger proposal.

Right now MS probably submitted a the new merger proposal and CMA are looking into it.

 

[MasterCornholio]

You mean the CMA?

From what i understood the only thing the CMA accepted was the material changes to the proposed order which was related to the old deal.

They used these material changes to get the the trial that was supposed to take place end of july adjourned.

If they didn't get it adjourned, then they would have to prepare to go to trial over the appeal whilst looking into the new merger proposal.

Right now MS probably submitted a the new merger proposal and CMA are looking into it.

For some reason I thought the CMA accepted everything already. The situation itself is pretty strange which is why I'm probably not understanding it correctly.

 

[Bernoulli]

it could be that microsoft wants to time this with starfield release to bring more hype and grow their gamepass and console sales

marketing of starfield and COD on gamepass

 

[Deleted member 848825]

it could be that microsoft wants to time this with starfield release to bring more hype and grow their gamepass and console sales

marketing of starfield and COD on gamepass

I highly doubt MS are trying to delay anything at all with the CMA. I know they've been arrogant and audacious throughout. But they just want the deal done. For me its far more likely, any posturing or reluctance to offer anything else more substantial to the CMA at this time. Would be solely to try and get the deal over the line without additional concessions/remedies/divesture. That's if my understanding is still correct. i.e any alleged new proposal or offer is still an unknown at this time and MS are simply saying the landscape has changed and thats enough for the CMA to reconsider.

I'm sure if/once successful, MS will will of course do a marketing push lasting for years off of the back of the acquisition and its IP's.

 

[adamsapple]

Don't worry guys, they were just waiting for me. We're probably gonna get something soon.

 

[PaintTinJr]

Don't worry guys, they were just waiting for me. We're probably gonna get something soon.

Well I'm stating upfront, that a likely absence of me commenting on the merger outcome between this Sunday and next Wednesday is not a sign of anything, but lack of time.

So if the deal passes next Monday - against my hopes -I'll probably be commenting about it(the CMA embarrassment) on the Thursday.

 

[sainraja]

FH5 was handed out along with SteamDeck review units as a verified game. Crashes that early in the life of the device were not uncommon. Pinning that on the game is illogical.

Again, the majority of Microsoft's game releases since 2021 have run on the Deck without any hotfixes or patches, and most have shipped with 'Deck Verified' tags.

Valve encourages Proton. It's part and parcel of the Deck experience, and you pitching it as 'a hacky workaround to mimick windows' is doing their efforts a disservice.

Valve encourages Proton. Not Microsoft. He's not questioning the fact games are compatible. He is just pointing out the why they are — due to Proton, which is supported/encouraged by Valve, as you have pointed out.

Perhaps your point is that Microsoft is OK with their games being compatible due to Proton, but there is a slight difference in saying who is putting the work behind that. Whatever the case may be, MS has opted for Proton for compatibility, which is something Valve encourages (the reason should be obvious). MS isn't putting any further effort in doing so. I guess take that as you may.
--
That's my assessment of the situation simply based on what the two of you were saying.

 

[HoofHearted]

 

[ReBurn]

All days in the future are coming days, Tom.

 

[Bernoulli]

when it comes from him it means 100% approved CMA dropped the case