Hey, if they did it for my Xbox 360 games I don't see why I would doubt them for my PC games. Sorry, any company who bends over backwards (when they don't really have to) to get my last gen games working at no cost to me is alright in my book. Phil has come though with this as he promised. I see no reason to doubt him.
Microsoft unifying PC/XB1 platforms, Phil implies Xbox moving to incremental upgrades
- Thread starter dancrane212
- Start date
Hey, if they did it for my Xbox 360 games I don't see why I would doubt them for my PC games. Sorry, any company who bends over backwards (when they don't really have to) to get my last gen games working at no cost to me is alright in my book. Phil has come though with this as he promised. I see no reason to doubt him.
Bitch Pudding
Member
Yeah, he forgot PS4 and NX.
It does hedge risk because they don't have to create the hype; they get to exploit it. It is still risky, they will have to make a number of units and sink capital into it and they have only vague ideas of how it'll sell. But Oculus certainly lowered the risk by popularizing the idea we're ready for VR now.
ChosenPredator
Banned
yeah they essentially cut the backwards compatibility threads forever, so moving forward hopefully every single game i ever buy from MS (digitally) will always be there
MilkyJoe
Member
How about ease of use? None of the arse ache that comes with PC gaming. You grossly underestimate convenience.
Re Xbox gold. I have it, I paid £20 for 13 months of it. I don't play online very much, if at all. I paid £20 for the 54 free games.
And the exclusives? Do I care if a PC player can play a game I'm playing? No, I couldn't give a shit. PC is not and never will be, in the same camp as consoles. And even if it were it's not something I'm interested in.
You do stuff like that when you're behind. Just as Sony was giving away major recent games with PS+ in the PS3 era MS is doing consumer friendly BC set ups.
Look at Sony/Ms/Nintendo when they were ahead. They tended to be more miserly.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
So now we are expecting Devs to optimize their game for different versions about the Xbox future console?
ChosenPredator
Banned
the one thing im curious about if fallout turns to be successful with its console mods, I wonder if it'll make MS more open with mods, maybe they can put the mod thing into their ecosystem.
It's an interesting point to raise - I think it's unlikely these boxes would be as custom as a single five year console. I doubt they'd carry the same r&d cost, they'll probably me more 'off the shelf pc' than ever. More like the alienware model of assembling off the shelf components onto a custom board, probably, than custom pieces of silicon everywhere (which the current consoles still use, even if architecturally they are 'off the shelf').
LordRaptor
Member
Here's the thing; there is no 'last gen' on PC.
The reason people can't access their GFWL purchases is because MS shut the store down.
That's literally it.
Disaster Nebraska
Banned
I honestly don't like using maybes and possibilities to prop up the decisions of a company. I enjoy hype trains and speculation as much as the next guy, but I feel you're leaning too heavily on "could be" and "might be".
I don't think anyone is "suffering" because of Xbox One's weaker hardware to any significant degree. Multiplatform games aren't really my concern here, to be perfectly honest. I'm sure that multiplatform publishers will always pour a significant amount of love and care and attention into the weakest version like they always have in the past, and I'm sure that having a more powerful console on the market will translate to better versions of games for everyone...
*ahem*
Setting that aside, my main concern is how this affects the traditional console exclusive model. Sorry, "console exclusive" means something else now. I mean the traditional, true exclusive model of making a game for one fixed piece of hardware. I don't necessarily think this would affect multiplatform publishers like EA or Activision very much, but others in this thread have already stated some very strong and well-reasoned opinions on that matter, so if that's the crux of your point I'd turn to them instead.
Again, just look at what Apple do every 12 months, faster CPU, Faster GPU, More Ram.
All inside the same casing (more or less)
This is the easiest way to explain what they are going for. I am all for it tbh and it is going to be exciting to see what they come up with.
foamdino
Member
You're missing my point. I mentioned convenience, which with a much shorter upgrade cycle is thrown out. Upgrading a console by plugging in a new GPU (something that is being speculated about) is the equivalent of how it works with pc gaming - there's no 'arse ache'. Plug in, download driver and go - and the drivers auto update these days. Long gone are the days of editing himem.sys
Microsoft's strategy seems to be moving xbox as a console *closer* to the pc gaming scene you are *not interested in* - does this make you happy? Do you want to have to fiddle with a much shorter upgrade cycles? Do you want to have to fiddle with settings or play a game in "low" until you buy an XBox GFX upgrade?
I'm arguing that this move is *bad* for traditional console gamers whilst simultaneously being not particularly interesting to pc gamers - it is quintessentially the worst of all worlds.
Bitch Pudding
Member
Yeah, they can, because the Apple badge is worth its weight in gold. MS however...
Hehe, sometimes I miss figuring out a way to make a game even start. EMM386.exe anyone?
Right. I get that. As a console owner I feel the pain just about every generation.
But I trust Spencer going forward and he's proved it with Xbox and I trust he'll do the same with PC.
What's Sony plan for next generation? I seriously don't know? Do you get to keep your digital games?
Except Xbox has not even a tiny fraction of the mindshare and brand power compared to Apple. Stop it with this nonsense comparison.
And besides, even with Apple's monstrous brand awareness, people really aren't replacing their iPad on a yearly basis. This has been repeated in this thread over and over.
tiredheadcrab
Member
Yeah I hate starting a new gen over again. The smart phone market spoiled me. The idea that when I buy an upgraded faster Xbox where all I have to do is put in my account credentials and all my settings and apps are ready to go sounds amazing.
I would be stunned if they didn't allow forward/backwards compatibility for the PS5.
You can't let your major competitors offer those features and not have anything to offer in response.
foamdino
Member
QEMU, config.sys etc. All good fun deleting the windows software (hey it was backed up on floppy anyway I can re-install if I actually want to use it) and just running dos 6.2. Playing with OS/2 warp as a windows 3.1 alternative etc. Getting stuff to run was sometimes more interesting than playing the games when they actually worked (although Arena was awesome)
We are two years into generation 8. I think it's about five years too early to be thinking about whether or not the PlayStation 5 will be backwards-compatible.
Dee Dah Dave
Member
I really doubt they will move to a structure anywhere near what the mobile and tablet market do.
I think they are largely using that phrasing because what they are going to do is release a mid gen, improved Xbox One.
What happens after that is anyone's guess.
I think they are largely using that phrasing because what they are going to do is release a mid gen, improved Xbox One.
What happens after that is anyone's guess.
Truespeed
Member
No, they actually can't. They've tried repeatedly and have always failed. PC gaming is Steam. Microsoft should stop trying to compete with it and embrace it because they're never going to ever be a threat to Stream.
Disaster Nebraska
Banned
I think the purpose of a console is to provide a complete package. Controller, hardware capabilities, the gaming philosophy of the company behind it, the talent of the first-party devs, the UI, etc all play a role.
If you're only concerned with the guts of the hardware itself, I agree that console exclusives are silly and don't make sense. Despite the power differences, Xbox One and PS4 are more alike than they are different when it comes to the "guts". Same manufacturer. Similar processors and architecture.
But it's the support of the console that matters, too. PS4 isn't just a 7-core, 8 GB RAM box that plugs into my TV. It's a system where Sony curated indie developers from around to world to make content on. It's the place where Sony's top games are delivered. It's a system with a camera and a controller (with a lightbar and touch-pad), and it's gonna have VR soon, too. It's a system where the UI was designed to sleep and quickly return you to your game, and to play certain apps without having to completely exit your game.
This thread is chock-full of people making comparisons to phones/tablets as if that justifies annual console upgrades. Well, I'd like to make another comparison. People don't buy an Apple phone because it has the most powerful CPU and the snappiest UI (it doesn't). People buy an Apple phone because they like the package. They like how Apple emphasizes high-fidelity screens and innovative touch controls and makes their stuff easy to use. They like the suite of apps exclusive to the platform.
How is it so hard to see that people may buy a console package for the very same reasons?
Exactly. That's why I love digital. Everything is more convenient.
I think I"m probably as much of an iPad zealot as there is. Wife and I both have one, and between the 2 of us we get 1 upgrade every other year. We do phones a bit more often, but it's usually driven by camera improvements since we have kids. Otherwise there would be little point.
I am all for shorter console generations, but that's not where I really see this going. That being said, I don't want to replace them every year or two. That defeats the point imo.
It's never too early if you are buying digitally. You want to carry over your games like you do for everything else.
therealbigrich
Member
I really want to see this happen just because for consoles it hasn't happened before. It's basically the way phones, PCs and tablets are made with yearly updates. I don't think it would be good for a yearly update for consoles but every 2 or 3 maybe.
The ppl saying the new items don't sell cause ppl don't always upgrade are absolutely correct but some do and they all still use that play store or app store to buy things and use the same services.
The ppl saying the new items don't sell cause ppl don't always upgrade are absolutely correct but some do and they all still use that play store or app store to buy things and use the same services.
Even if it happened every 3-4 years would be great.
It's less of an issue compared to what it once was, the configurations are far less exotic than they once were.
Take a look at this video here, people modded the OG Xbox by replacing the CPU with one twice as fast and replacing the RAM with Chips that had double!
Guess what? many games ran better.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycIaoKUiiYg
...
No, seriously. It's too early. You're talking about a console that probably won't be released until fall 2020. Let me enjoy the games I'm playing right now, I have no idea what I'll be doing five years from now.
BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
I really hope ps4 doesn't stick around for another 5 years.
What I'm saying the leader is less likely to be generous because they have less incentive to be. This does not mean MS is trust worthy as they've basically been talking out of both sides of their mouths since the mid 360 era. They are currently more generous though.
Thanks for making sense. I keep wondering if I'm on the same planet with some Gaffers in this thread. Yeah sure, everyone is upgrading their phone, PC, console, tablet, TV every year. Lord, people shouldn't forget that they might be the exception and that we are posting on a geek-board. And about those Apple comparissons...I'm giving up.
I hear about the US economy's imminent collapse on a daily basis (same with Europe) and yet people with normal wages, normal lifes, including stuff like feeding children, paying for car repairs, going through divorces and so on are trying to make me believe that EVERYONE owns three consoles, a tablet, smartphone , PC...and can afford to upgrade this shit on a regular basis. C'mon
Disaster Nebraska
Banned
3-4 is more likely, depending on how VR takes off. They may angle PS4 as the budget VR option while coming out with a much more robust VR console that is designed with VR in mind.
When did Spencer say it's going to be a yearly upgrade? Why are you saying that?
Can't stop too!
But Playstation vs Playstation isn't out of question:
http://www.*****************/2015/1...e-release-of-a-ps4-with-improved-performance/
http://www.4gamer.net/games/990/G999024/20151021121/
Complicated
Banned
I buy a new phone every year. If I can get a new Xbox that plays the Halos prettier along with each new Halo game (every three years) I would absolutely do so. If Sony and Nintendo stuck with the same old business model I would just buy their console for cheap and play a few exclusives at the end of their generation. PC would probably be the same rather than sinking money into more expensive individual parts to keep it up to date.
Anybody might think that I had replied to you, if you actually read the post I was quoting you'd have seen that the useage of 'Apple' is 100% interchangeable with any phone or tablet manufacturer.
You'd have also have seen that I was agreeing with the post that suggests that what our games consoles are right now are modular from an engineering point or view and it would be super simple for either MS or Sony to make a faster version of the machine we already have.
It wasn't a reflection on MS' marketing ability, mindshare or social media presence.
Sorry, I wasn't talking about Xbox only. What I was trying to say: replacing one of your electronic devices each year for 400$-500$. For example 2017 new phone, 2018 new console, ....
I don't think that gaming tech moves fast enough to be worth a yearly upgrade. Probably every 3 years?
They do have to convince people to jump in. To buy the games on w10 store, to buy a new system sooner rather than later.
Additionally the number of folks who can shell out for a new console often aren't that numerous and mostly also PC folks. So there are a lot of problems with this business plan.
it is amazing how quickly you came around this idea now that ms is hinting at doing it. here are some quotes for reference when you questioned my idea of a ps4 premium and even calling it bad ....
"Again, you are talking about a different industry within the tech world. Game systems don't follow the same model that cell phones do and the majority of consumers are used to having their console be relevant for 5+ years.
Easier ports/connectivity in a new model is fine. The newer model running games notably better though would cause backlash especially with how easy it is for tech comparison articles and videos to spread (social media). People with the older model will feel screwed since they thought the system would follow the same model as previous consoles (with many people putting good money into the console via game purchases due to that).
This would be bad. There's a ton of current gen only games coming out, therefore causing people to buy current gen only consoles now. We are getting into the peak of the PS4 and Xbox One's life in terms of their game library. People who just bought a PS4 would be very upset if there's an announcement for a newer model that has more power just a year or so later.
Bad examples. Nintendo has been doing remodels for their handhelds for a long time (more than 10 years) and the Elite is just a controller (there has always been multiple options and prices for controllers). It's also a controller that will work for all Xbox One users and not just people who (say) bought the system this year.
Bad idea in my opinion. I get why people (especially the more hardcore) would have no problem with laying down the extra money in ditching their old PS4 and getting a "PS4 Plus" but a new model like that would create too many questions. "What model is best for me?", "Should I even put the time/effort into making features for me game specifically for PS4 Plus if the majority of people are on the regular model?", "What's the difference? What games make better use of the Plus? Are they games I'm even interested in?", "Is my old system useless now?", etc.
Again, all questions similar to what people were saying in terms of SEGA products during the middle of the '90s. The home console space will never be ready for this. There's too much of a foundation/expectation for a successful console getting top of the line support for at least 5 years before it gets outdated by its successor."
link for conversation where there are many that ridiculed the idea of an upgraded console
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=188973578&highlight=#post188973578
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
What does "forward" compatibility mean?