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MSNBC: Sorry, George: Critics used to love Star Wars
- Thread starter Willco
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Spectral Glider
Member
The original trilogy (as in, the original unfucked with trilogy) blows the new one out of the water. And it has nothing to do with nostalgia....it's simply because it was newer and fresher then. And while George tries to wow us with visuals, he's given up on story and directing. He lucked out when he re-edited the original Star Wars into something cohesive and was smart enough to realize he should hand off the directing to somebody else for the next one. Somewhere along the line though, he became full of himself. And Ford was right, Solo probably should have been killed off.....instead we have him standing around in the woods doing nothing but getting in the way of the Luke and Vader showdown. Jedi had problems, and it wasn't just because of the Ewoks. But because it starts off well and has a decent ending, it's still light years ahead of any of the new shit.
Don't worry, the critics are guaranteed to love Episode III!
Woo woo!
FnordChan
p.s. I (heart) Jay Pinkerton.
Woo woo!
FnordChan
p.s. I (heart) Jay Pinkerton.
FnordChan said:Don't worry, the critics are guaranteed to love Episode III!
Woo woo!
FnordChan
p.s. I (heart) Jay Pinkerton.
:lol That is hilarious!
soundwave05
Member
levious said:
What's the last kids movie you saw where the main character is burned alive on screen?
soundwave05 said:
In time bandits the kid's parents were burnt to a crisp at the end. That's just off the top of my head. Don't get your panties in a bunch, I love star wars, but don't kid yourself into thinking that it has a different target audience than Harry Potter.
Prince of Space
Banned
:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
Oh, come ON. His name is GRIEVOUS.
soundwave05
Member
Star Wars does have a slightly broader audience than Harry Potter.
It's like saying Indiana Jones is a fun popcorn movie, so lets lump it together with E.T. ... they're not exactly the same thing.
The audience is upset not because the prequels didn't "grow up" but because Ep. I & II are poorly written and poorly executed.
I mean c'mon, if you don't think Jar-Jar would stick out like a steaming turd in any of the OT, you're kidding yourself. Even the Ewoks would eventually tire of him and cook him alive.
It's like saying Indiana Jones is a fun popcorn movie, so lets lump it together with E.T. ... they're not exactly the same thing.
The audience is upset not because the prequels didn't "grow up" but because Ep. I & II are poorly written and poorly executed.
I mean c'mon, if you don't think Jar-Jar would stick out like a steaming turd in any of the OT, you're kidding yourself. Even the Ewoks would eventually tire of him and cook him alive.
Jar Jar is the one thing that was over done in my opinion. What is sad is the character would not be too bad if it wasn't so in your face and constant. Jar Jar steps in shit, jar jar smells farts, jar jar electrocuted himself, jar jar acts like an idiot in battle. It never ended.
Someone in a forum once said had jar jar acted bravely/non stupidly in the final battle his character would not seem to bad because he would have redeemed himself. I can see that, too bad it never happened.
Someone in a forum once said had jar jar acted bravely/non stupidly in the final battle his character would not seem to bad because he would have redeemed himself. I can see that, too bad it never happened.
jadehorizon1
Member
The only time I see Willco around here is in a Star Wars thread ... and 10 times out of 10 hes bashing it in some form or another ... or claiming Sam Riami to be god and Lucas to be a satan ... then when someone defends Star Wars we find incrediblely witty and clever responses such as
soundwave05
Member
shantyman said:
If Jar Jar was in the OT, I almost gauruntee you, Harrison Ford would have walked off the set.
In a way though these prequels are a lot like Anakin Skywalker -- had all the potential in the world, but in the end he's left just trying to salvage what's left of his body. With Ep. 3, I think Lucas is left trying to salvage what's left of a trilogy which really could have been better than the OT.
Spectral Glider
Member
You have to be completely film illiterate to not see the differences in writing, directing, pacing, and acting of the new movies compared to the originals.
jadehorizon1
Member
Always good to mix things up ... adds more spice
Completely agree ... the PT should be better than the OT. And its not the actors ... its the characters and their personalities ... or maybe lack of them ... the moment in the OT that comes to mind is the prison corridor in the first Star Wars ... the lines went something like this ...
(Luke and Han shooting at troopers down the hall )
Han: What the Hell are you doing!?
Leia: Somebodys got to save our skins, into the garbage fly boy.
Chewie: (growl)
Han: I dont care what ya smell, get in there you furry oaf!!
(kicks him in)
Han: Great girl! I dont want to kill I'm beginning to like her!!
(Luke looks at him like hes nuts then jumps in, Han's right behind him)
Han: AAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
Simple witty lines but ultimately in combination w/ the actors its classic stuff
... but hey whatever, if this is how Lucas wants it then thats fine with me. Ive enjoyed all of them. This is his story, I'm just watching it, not making it.
Spectral Glider
Member
It is his story, and it may be how he wants it....that doesn't mean it makes it good film though. And just because he at one time made some films I like doesn't mean I can't keep a critical eye towards his work. Going through college the, "Well, it's my paper/article/story and it's how I wanted it" argument never seemed to up my grade any.
There is nothing wrong with disliking or hating the prequel trilogy. There is also nothing wrong with voicing that opinion.
Unfortunately Willco has a pattern of posting things like this or making comment in existing threads. We get it, OK? You think the prequel trilogy sucks. Please shut up now! You don't HAVE to beat a dead horse.
Unfortunately Willco has a pattern of posting things like this or making comment in existing threads. We get it, OK? You think the prequel trilogy sucks. Please shut up now! You don't HAVE to beat a dead horse.
I do not like the argument that the OT was the same as PT and it's only nostalgia glorifying the OT. Harrison Ford in and of himself gave a much stronger performance than anything in the new movies and the original movies had nothing even remotely as embarassing as the Anakin/Padme 'romantic' scenes. Don't make me repeat the sand/skin lines. Please, for the love of god don't.
IAmtheFMan
Member
Willco said:
Willco, I like ya pal, well in the sense that I liked that kid in elementary school that would do anything for attention like staple his head or pee all over the bathroom floor, but don't feign this ignorant innocence of "hey, I saw a news article and wanted to post it! That's all." You're great at this passive aggression and if you honestly expect people to believe that you didn't want nor were expecting a certain reaction, then you're kidding yourself.
jadehorizon1 said:
You must no visit around here often then.
I never bring up Raimi (please learn to spell his name) and Lucas in the same breath unless one of the Star Wars apologists brings up my devotion to all things Spider-Man. Then, I cannot help mention that Raimi's last two films were critical and commercial successes. Sorry he's so good. And - hey! - I was talking about the soundtrack in the thread the other day and no bashing was exchanged, even though John Williams ripped off a variety of films for his latest score.
:lol Silly billy, nobody defends Star Wars!
Manics said:
No you don't, because I own an iPod. I fucking love the iPod. Now the iPod shuffle on the other hand...
shantyman said:
I posted an article, you dolt. I DID NOT WRITE THE ARTICLE. IF YOU DISAGREE WITH THE OPINION POSTED, PLEASE CONTACT MSNBC.
IAmtheFMan said:
Listen, I thought I'd post an article from a reputable news source on one of cinema's biggest franchises, and we could have civilized discourse about the crediblity of this critic's argument. No you guys have blown it all to hell!
Like Alderaan!
I pretty much agree with the article, although I really enjoyed Return of the Jedi (The Vader vs Luke duel redeems all the minor flaws in the movie).
The OT were excellent films. The PT are decent films with some shining moments. I think George is better suited to being the storyteller, not the main and ONLY scriptwriter. Despite what people think, he DID write the OT, and most of Empire was his, so at one point, he was a very strong writer.
With the prequels, not only has he grown rusty (He's been away from the game awhile), but he also made the mistake of not getting a strong writer to revise his drafts.
The storyline in the PT is excellent, but the dialogue is atrocious, and the character of Jar Jar Binks is wayyy overdone.
The OT were excellent films. The PT are decent films with some shining moments. I think George is better suited to being the storyteller, not the main and ONLY scriptwriter. Despite what people think, he DID write the OT, and most of Empire was his, so at one point, he was a very strong writer.
With the prequels, not only has he grown rusty (He's been away from the game awhile), but he also made the mistake of not getting a strong writer to revise his drafts.
The storyline in the PT is excellent, but the dialogue is atrocious, and the character of Jar Jar Binks is wayyy overdone.
IAmtheFMan
Member
Willco said:
That was actually my first post in this thread, and I'm not making any claims on the article itself. It had some valid points, and some points I didn't necessarily agree with, credibility-wise it's fine. I wasn't even really gonna post in this thread but you keep claiming that all you're doing is posting an article and wanted to have a civil discourse, and I'm calling bullshit on that, ESPECIALLY on this forum. You knew what kind of reaction you'd get from both the vocal-haters and those that defend SW, so stop exercising this passive-aggressive "well I just wanted to post an article" attitude and just own up man.
soundwave05
Member
I think the article is right on point.
TAJ
Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
>>>Which is why nostalgia is brought up so much. The audience grew up, the movies didn't, and now the audience is PISSED because it's not their desired version of star wars.
But as the article mentioned, the first two Star Wars films were critically acclaimed pieces of cinema upon their release, not after 20 years of Nostalgia inflation.<<<
Yep. My parents and their siblings loved the OT and they were between 29 and 45 when Star Wars (A New Hope or Episode IV to Gen-Y lamers) came out. Hell, even 2 of my grandparents liked the originals. (and one was dead before they came out)
But as the article mentioned, the first two Star Wars films were critically acclaimed pieces of cinema upon their release, not after 20 years of Nostalgia inflation.<<<
Yep. My parents and their siblings loved the OT and they were between 29 and 45 when Star Wars (A New Hope or Episode IV to Gen-Y lamers) came out. Hell, even 2 of my grandparents liked the originals. (and one was dead before they came out)
All I can say, is that I envy GL. All those calling him a hack, at least he's footing the bill for his work. Unlike Uwe Boll...
All the critics, both professional and on this board, should put their money where their mouth is and try and create something that has the draw/appeal that Star Wars has had for over 20 years.
Oh, and for the record, I've never been a fan of the Star Wars films. I just can give credit where it's due.
All the critics, both professional and on this board, should put their money where their mouth is and try and create something that has the draw/appeal that Star Wars has had for over 20 years.
Oh, and for the record, I've never been a fan of the Star Wars films. I just can give credit where it's due.
TAJ
Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
>>>Hell, even 2 of my grandparents liked the originals. (and one was dead before they came out)
Man either that didn't come out the way you intended or was a joke.
Either way you completed fucked up my mind.<<<
Lol. I had four grandparents. One was dead when Star Wars came out. Two of the three surviving grandparents liked Star Wars.
Man either that didn't come out the way you intended or was a joke.
Either way you completed fucked up my mind.<<<
Lol. I had four grandparents. One was dead when Star Wars came out. Two of the three surviving grandparents liked Star Wars.
Heh, a little anecdotal evidence to throw in... saw Kurosawa's The Hidden Fortress last night(Mifune rocked as usual) and figured that since it's been said to be a big influence on the original Star Wars, I might as well give that another spin. My 13 year old sister, whose only exposure to Star Wars was watching prequel Episodes 1 and 2, watched the regular laserdisc version with me. It wasn't even halfway through when she said it was "a LOT better" than the prequels. Also, she was suprised that it was 28 years old and didn't use any computer effects, but liked that stuff "looked more real".
Spike said:
I'm sorry, but stfu. If no one is allowed to criticize something they couldn't or wouldn't do themselves, the world may as well come to a stop. Can't afford be a politician? Woops, better not vote in an election!
This notion that you have to be able to do something to have the ability to dislike it and the right to say so in public is one of the things that's wrong with the world.
The original draft of Star Wars was near ripping off The Hidden Fortress, so much so that Lucas & co. considered buying the rights to the movie.
The only real similarities between the two in their final forms are the droids being similar to the goofy peasants of THF, and the 'fleeing' princess.
The only real similarities between the two in their final forms are the droids being similar to the goofy peasants of THF, and the 'fleeing' princess.
The Hidden Fortress is about two greedy peasants who end up helping a general smuggle a princess-in-disguise and a large stash of gold through enemy lines into friendly land. There certainly are a lot of elements that got carried over, but it's really not THAT similar... no force or "destroy the enemy stronghold", but you do get trademark Mifune badassness.Willco said:
jadehorizon1
Member
see there it is right there ... i happen to love all things star wars ... i love the story no matter how flawed the critics or anyone else may point out. And Im sure you would have loved Spiderman even if it tanked ... but at the same time u wouldnt like it if i ran around bashing Spiderman every chance I get. I mean even Spiderman has cheeseball lines.
MaryJane - It was good to see you tonight
Peter - Oh boy yea
MaryJane - Oh boy yea
... its cool tho man it just a movie, we watch movies to have a good time not to pick them apart piece by piece and overanalyse. Movies lose their magic that way. This is why lot of people arent happy with the PT ... they forgot to sit back and enjoy the movie, too many nitpicker Star Wars fans
First of all, it's Spider-Man. Get it right.
Second, unlike Star Wars, there's a case of the actors taking lines that aren't even that cheesy and acting, so it doesn't make me want to vomit, unlike the shit that Christensen and Portman spew from their mouths.
Plenty of people bash Spider-Man, but that's okay, because that just means more DVD copies for me.
Also because they suck.
Second, unlike Star Wars, there's a case of the actors taking lines that aren't even that cheesy and acting, so it doesn't make me want to vomit, unlike the shit that Christensen and Portman spew from their mouths.
Plenty of people bash Spider-Man, but that's okay, because that just means more DVD copies for me.
Also because they suck.
andthebeatgoeson
Junior Member
Wait wait wait, did you just say that boy who plays Spiderman can act? *snickers*
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