Multiple people shot at Wisconsin Sikh temple

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cartoon_soldier said:
I view the anti-Sikh riots differently than Gujarat. They are similar to the Bombay riots. The active government/ruling party individuals were much more involved in gathering mobs and feeding the frenzy in those two.
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I think the right wing BJP party is always when any riots take place in India. They mostly cater to uneducated masses, they go around the country giving hateful speeches and provoking their followers. Things have improved over the last decade...there weren't any riots after the Mumbai train bombings or after those November 2008 Mumbai attacks....

What happened in Assam recently is due to the surge in illegal migrants from Bangladesh.
 
The Mana Legend said:
Dude, this shit happens all the time, and always has. This is tragic as all fuck, but it's not a "sign of things to come."
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Mass shootings rarely happen back to back. At least in the USA. Where are you from to where this isn't a burgeoning trend?

This is horrible. Just saw it on the news.
 
commedieu said:
Mass shootings rarely happen back to back. At least in the USA. Where are you from to where this isn't a burgeoning trend?

This is horrible. Just saw it on the news.
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What? Yes they do. There were copycat shootings right after Columbine. Insane people see all the attention being lavished on the shooter by the media and get some stupid ideas on their head.
 
delirium said:
What? Yes they do. There were copycat shootings right after Columbine. Insane people see all the attention being lavished on the shooter by the media and get some stupid ideas on their head.
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Then that's essentially confirming his point about this being a "trend of shootings"
 
BocoDragon said:
Then that's essentially confirming his point about this being a "trend of shootings"
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No, delirium is describing how the copycat phenomenon after shootings is common, and not making a comment on whether we have a long-term trend of increasing numbers of mass shootings over the years.

Unless, of course, I am misreading. Always possible.
 
Two points if data is not enough to imply a trend.

Especially when one targeted random people (movie goers), and the other seems to have targeted a religious group...
 
It's over, right? The hostage situation/multiple gunmen stuff was mistaken?




http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/08/05/possible-injuries-after-shooting-at-sikh-temple-in-wisconsin/

A White House official said President Obama was notified of the shooting and is continuing to receive updates. The NYPD also announced, out of caution, a heightened police presence at Sikh temples in New York City.
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Does the NYPD have a policy on increasing police presence after mass shootings in America? They did the same thing with theaters after Aurora.

Watch politicians begin to spin this shit or something soon.
 
Kurdel said:
Two points if data is not enough to imply a trend.

Especially when one targeted random people (movie goers), and the other seems to have targeted a religious group...
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Or one incident might have incite other psychopaths to pursue their sick fantasies with audaciousness ( that in itself is a trend)
 
ezekial45 said:
Do we know anything about the gunman? CNN is saying he's dead.
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The NYT's and HuffPo both report that he's dead. Apparently an officer arrived on the scene and exchanged fire with him, killing him in the process. The officer was wounded, according to NYT.
 
phosphor112 said:
Labeled a terrorist before 9/11. Care to point to such a heinous crime in America that was labeled a terrorist since 9/11?

For fucks sake. Breivik's attacks in Norway were just called that! "2011 Norway Attacks."

Not referred to as a terrorist. Just look up any article from Jun 22, 2011.
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why are you suprised? The mainstream media seldom calls people of non muslim origin as terrorists if they perpretrate acts of terror and violence.

Imagine just imagine if the current killers of the sikh civilians were of muslim origin. The narrative of the press would be completely different. As muslims we better get used to it. It's not fair but when was life meant to be fair.

My condolences to the innocent people here. To be gunned down in a place of worship or anywhere else for that matter is absolutely criminal and heinous
 
Fraull said:
What the fuck is wrong with people. Goddamn America change your fuckin gun laws.
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Think about how many guns are in America right now and how many shootings don't occur like this on a consistent basis. I'm all for some more roadblocks like psych evals for legal purchases but we have to change the culture first and get mental help for the rampagers before they go on sprees. Gun control puts a lot of carrying members on the defensive unfortunately.
 
Awesome said:
Gun laws don't change anything, a person is going to get weapons eventually when they want one.
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That's the theory. But take a look at real world data, and that claim doesn't hold up.

Even over here in Germany, where it's about 20 times less likely to die from homicides with firearms than in the US, most of the recent shooting sprees are done by people with access to legal firearms.
 
I read people advocating more guns because of this. The logic being if everyone in the temple was armed, this wouldn't have happened. Whilst I disagree with the idea of more weapons, I do, however, that these people would think twice knowing they'd walk into a room of armed people. I say that because, whilst they may not ultimately care for their own safety, the damage they inflict could be more limited and so the entire plan (to kill a mass number of people) may not be worth it in their eyes.
 
jersoc said:
are bombs legal in the middle east with suicide bombers?

laws won't stop criminals from getting a gun lol.
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A lot of countries have strict gun laws and don't have a fraction of the gun related deaths the US does. As such, I don't think your argument is valid as is. Especially when you realize it's not "criminals" doing these shootings. These are civilians doing the shooting, not mobsters. Civilians who are only classified as criminals after the massacre.
 
Jason Raize '75 - '04 said:
I read people advocating more guns because of this. The logic being if everyone in the temple was armed, this wouldn't have happened. Whilst I disagree with the idea of more weapons, I do, however, that these people would think twice knowing they'd walk into a room of armed people. I say that because, whilst they may not ultimately care for their own safety, the damage they inflict could be more limited and so the entire plan (to kill a mass number of people) may not be worth it in their eyes.
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More guns would just create a "who is the actual shooter?" scenario. We don't need any more wild west crap.
 
Jason Raize '75 - '04 said:
I read people advocating more guns because of this. The logic being if everyone in the temple was armed, this wouldn't have happened. Whilst I disagree with the idea of more weapons, I do, however, that these people would think twice knowing they'd walk into a room of armed people. I say that because, whilst they may not ultimately care for their own safety, the damage they inflict could be more limited and so the entire plan (to kill a mass number of people) may not be worth it in their eyes.
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I don't think these people generally care about the consequences. They often take steps beforehand with the thought that they probably won't make it, and they gear up for confrontation. More armed people might make the otherwise rational mugger/robber/burglar think twice, but it's not going to make some nutjob think twice about going on a spree.
 
I wish all guns would just vanish in America. Not gonna happen though, and if the government tries to take them away by force, there will be blood.
 
Gun law in America makes my brain hurt, seems so unnecessary. Throw it out and surely American lives would be saved.

Or maybe I just don't understand it.
 
DragonGirl said:
A lot of countries have strict gun laws and don't have a fraction of the gun related deaths the US does. As such, I don't think your argument is valid as is. Especially when you realize it's not "criminals" doing these shootings. These are civilians doing the shooting, not mobsters. Civilians who are only classified as criminals after the massacre.
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Other countries aren't indoctrinated into the gun culture that the USA has. You have people here that claim they would rather die, than give up their guns. We are just different in that regard, its not just a gun, its an identity, and its seen as a civil right, equal to the rest of the civil rights. We don't any anyone telling us what to do, when it comes to gun rights. Its so much more than just a ballot check mark..

I agree with everyone having a gun, mainly because I know that gun regulation isn't going to work here. I don't like the notion that criminals have weapons that law-abiding registered citizens can't get their hands on. If we could actually get rid of the guns & the gun culture, yes. That would be safer! But is that going to be the military going house to house removing weapons from the entire country..?

Dev,

I think It would be better to have to investigate who the shooter was, rather than a room full of victims again. I understand the Wild-West point, but I also feel like most criminals with guns do take advantage of the idea that the house they are invading wont have any resistance.
 
Devolution said:
Think about how many guns are in America right now and how many shootings don't occur like this on a consistent basis. I'm all for some more roadblocks like psych evals for legal purchases but we have to change the culture first and get mental help for the rampagers before they go on sprees. Gun control puts a lot of carrying members on the defensive unfortunately.
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I understand there are a ton of guns in circulation. Look at countries where guns are hard to get like Canada. You rarely hear of gun violence. Sure if someone wants one they could get it, but by changing the rules it's less available to all the nut jobs out there.
 
I bowl at the bowling Alley right across the street sometimes, crazy. This is terrible. Any information on the shooter yet? My thoughts are with the families and loved ones and I hope for the best for those recovering.
 
Fraull said:
I understand there are a ton of guns in circulation. Look at countries where guns are hard to get like Canada. You rarely hear of fun violence. Sure if someone wants one they could get it, but by changing the rules it's less available to all the nut jobs out there.
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.
 
Willkiller said:
Gun law in America makes my brain hurt, seems so unnecessary. Throw it out and surely American lives would be saved.

Or maybe I just don't understand it.
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The US is a third world country when it comes to firearms, no way around it. (I include the following as a picture, since some people don't seem to care about wiki-links otherwise.)

tsbU1.png


The thing is, it's cultural. So people have to either change their overall views on whether guns are really necessary in a modern society, or accept that it will absolutely lead to more deaths. To put it bluntly, Stop Guns or Stop Whining.
 
Awesome said:
Gun laws don't change anything, a person is going to get weapons eventually when they want one.
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Except guns become much harder to obtain. Do you know an illegal weapons dealer? In the UK those that managed to find them often have to make do with tiny .22 purse guns or old WW2 revolvers.

The whole "if someone wants to kill a person, they'll do it with or without guns" is such an embarrassing argument. It only holds true for premeditated murder. Crimes of passion and mass-rampages are much less lethal if you have knives instead of guns.
 
How long till the conspiracy theories pop up? (you could just copy and paste this question into every major news event btw)
 
Fraull said:
I understand there are a ton of guns in circulation. Look at countries where guns are hard to get like Canada. You rarely hear of gun violence. Sure if someone wants one they could get it, but by changing the rules it's less available to all the nut jobs out there.
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Actually, in Toronto there has been an unusual and scary amount of gun crimes the past few weeks (about 4 deaths in 3 separate cases I believe). I personally think it's an abnormality rather than of a sign of things to come.

Anyway, I don't think restricting gun laws is the right way to go about this. Fighting guns in the US is as pointless as the war on drugs or internet piracy because of the gun culture. This was clearly (hopefully I'm not speaking too son) a racially motivated hate crime so a more logical solution is promoting tolerance in places like school or media.
 
One of my customers who is a cop in Oak Creek got a text while sitting in our lounge area and ran out of the building. I found out why an hour later.

That is so close by here. So saddening.
 
Jackpot said:
Except guns become much harder to obtain. Do you know an illegal weapons dealer? In the UK those that managed to find them often have to make do with tiny .22 purse guns or old WW2 revolvers.

The whole "if someone wants to kill a person, they'll do it with or without guns" is such an embarrassing argument. It only holds true for premeditated murder. Crimes of passion and mass-rampages are much less lethal if you have knives instead of guns.
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The other thing is that there are more chance to find someone planning something big. Guys like the Aurora shooter stockpile weapons and ammo over time. If he had to do all that illegally, there'd be many more chances for him to get caught along the way.
 
You Are Viewtiful said:
Actually, in Toronto there has been an unusual and scary amount of gun crimes the past few weeks (about 4 deaths in 3 separate cases I believe). I personally think it's an abnormality rather than of a sign of things to come.

Anyway, I don't think restricting gun laws is the right way to go about this. Fighting guns in the US is as pointless as the war on drugs or internet piracy because of the gun culture. This was clearly (hopefully I'm not speaking too son) a racially motivated hate crime so a more logical solution is promoting tolerance in places like school or media.
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promoting tolerance in the media is just as unlikely as gun control
 
TacticalFox88 said:
Worst thing about these tragedies, is that the gunmen can take the cowardly way out by suicide to avoid justice.
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The suspect here is reported to have been killed by a police officer.

Cubsfan23 said:
why do people get overdramatic with the "world is ending" stuff? 2 guys in 2 months, out of 300 million people. decided to shoot up random people. It's amazing that it doesn't happen more often.
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If we did everything we could as a country to prevent this kind of thing, and it still happened, then I'd be able to chalk it up to something that is just going to happen no matter what. Since we do almost nothing to prevent it from happening, its incredible frustrating every time. Doubly so because we know how this plays out: A week of media coverage, and then no one speaks of it again (especially since the shooter is dead/there will be no trial) with absolutely no new legislation (not even an assault weapons ban).
 
why do people get overdramatic with the "world is ending" stuff? 2 guys in 2 months, out of 300 million people. decided to shoot up random people. It's amazing that it doesn't happen more often.
 
Cubsfan23 said:
why do people get overdramatic with the "world is ending" stuff? 2 guys in 2 months, out of 300 million people. decided to shoot up random people. It's amazing that it doesn't happen more often.
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It really isn't, living in a country where you can live a generally comfortable life for less and yet some still decide to do insane shit to harm others, it should be a stat of 0, and it's a shame there is no solid way to prevent them outside of gun control (which i'm not sure I believe in though i do not own a gun)
 
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