Support NeoGAF

[StreetsofBeige]

PS1 success:

- Cheaper system
- Way better 3D. PS1 had smooth 3D, transparency effects, gouroud shading (however you spell it). Saturn 3D and effects were laughable
- For gamers who loved FMV clips, PS1 also better. JPEG vs MPEG I think. Saturn was all staticky. PS1 smooth shaded
- Better storage system (mem cards)
- Sega first party sports games (which many were awesome on Genesis) were all pure trash on Saturn. Something happened. Either they couldnt handle programming for Saturn or these studio crew left
- Amazingly, Sony's first party sports games were better than Sega's
- Less reliant on arcade ports like Sega would rehash like Atari back in the day. At this time gamers were expecting more with CD storage
- PS had big time third party support like MGS, FF7, Namco games etc...

The only thing Saturn did better were if you were a big Sega/Capcom arcade port gamer, enjoyed some of their JRPGs that werent FF, and if you preferred a 6 button gamepad with a 3x2 layout than PS1 which was like SNES with diamond layout and shoulder buttons. IMO, Sega black consoles always looked better than Nintendo and Sony white/grey consoles too. So if aesthetics were that important, a black console blends in better with your AV equipment.

 

[NeoIkaruGAF]

Psygnosis was very important, Sony bought the company in 1993, they are responsible for the PS1 development kit in C language. However some mistakes by Sega and Nintendo aren't actually mistakes, they are just the usual way they conducted their business, so Sony's strategy of charging a lower royalty was a very strong blow that changed the power dynamics between all the companies.

Not sure about that. Not being open to adapt and doubling down on what isn't working in the face of a new opponent who is clearly doing a lot of things right is a mistake. Yamauchi calling JRPG fans names when Squaresoft turned their back on Nintendo wasn't exactly a wise move.

 

[RetroGamingUK]

I can tell u early on it was literaly sony/namco on psx vs saturn's sega arcade games, ofc later sony kept making all the right moves, sega kept making all the wrong ones.
Here 3h long vid where ppl can see all namco psx games, fuck we dont get as many games from whole first party studios alltogether current gen both xbox/playstation combined.

Ridge Racer Type 4 was flipping gorgeous, arguably the best looking racer of the generation…

 

[hououinkyouma00]

Console I go back to the most. It has an endless well of weird and wonderful experimental games.

I'm the opposite. Unfortunately I find most 5th gen games hard to play outside of some racing titles like Type 4 and GT2. It's a console I want to go back to the most but just don't.

 

[RetroGamingUK]

IMO, Sega black consoles always looked better than Nintendo and Sony white/grey consoles too. So if aesthetics were that important, a black console blends in better with your AV equipment.

You sure?

Saturn and N64's aesthetic went well with the curved CRT sets from the early to mid 90s, but PlayStation perfectly complimented the high end WEGA sets from the second half of the decade

PlayStation just looked far more modern than its rivals.

 

[Geometric-Crusher]

You forgot to mention the benefits of compact discs over cartridges when it came to space allocation and pricing.

Mortal Kombat Trilogy
PS1 $ 49,99
N64 $ 69,99

 

[Oberstein]

A console ahead of its time.
It made Nintendo look outdated back then.
Not to mention it had an incredible niche with a whole adolescent-adult demographic that grew up with this console.

 

[SamuraiEdge]

PlayStation 1 is easily the best console of all time for how much it influenced the gaming scene all the wya up to today. Without Playstation we wouldn't have a lot of the incredible series we love and enjoy today (Resident Evil, Silent Hill, Metal Gear, and so on).

Truly was ahead of its time and a remarkable piece of kit. So many great games and easy to pick, plug, and play for so many people across the globe.

You sure?

Saturn and N64's aesthetic went well with the curved CRT sets from the early to mid 90s, but PlayStation perfectly complimented the high end WEGA sets from the second half of the decade

PlayStation just looked far more modern than its rivals.

God I love these setups.

 

[RetroGamingUK]

A console ahead of its time.
It made Nintendo look outdated back then.
Not to mention it had an incredible niche with a whole adolescent-adult demographic that grew up with this console.

The amount of tightly packed geometry in that game was insane, not to mention the gorgeous shading on everything.

Naughty Gods were always Naughty Gods.

 

[Judge Magister]

The Memory Card save system for PS1 and PS2 is in many ways superior to the storage space based save system (PC style) that PlayStation's used since PS3.
The Memory Card save extras that Team Silent baked into the PS2 SH games is something that hasn't be done post-Memory card (post-PS2).

Memory Card is a good point. It's so simple. In other old systems is so frustrating if you don't have a certain accessory to backup saves and have to deal with batteries or internal memory.

 

[p_xavier]

PlayStation nailed it with maturity and not being child friendly. That's why it was such a success, gaming was mainstream after it.

And we need a new Toshinden. Best fighting game soundtracks (1+2) there ever was.

 

[Parazels]

Ridge Racer Type 4 was flipping gorgeous, arguably the best looking racer of the generation…

RR Type 4
&
Rapid Racer (hi res + 60 fps + physics)

 

[cinnamonandgravy]

This analysis misses that many 3rd party publishers had been raked over the coals by Nintend during the SNES generation. That a big reason why Nintendo stuck with cartridges was because it planned to charge publishers an arm and a leg for them.

yep, important to remember that nintendo used to be very very strict about the games on their consoles (you played by their rules), and basically everything was more expensive with them, from licensing to production cartridges.

plus sony got burned by nintendo with the snes cd.
so now devs burned by nintendo could bail to a burned console manufacturer, sony.
friends of my enemy...

plus, a medium that's significantly cheaper plus ~100x the storage doesnt hurt

 

[Parazels]

Sony simply better prepared everything. It was like Xbox 360 vs PS3.

 

[RetroGamingUK]

RR Type 4
&
Rapid Racer (hi res + 60 fps + physics)

Great example with Rapid Racer there

For some reason in 1997 PS1 racing games started to have some gorgeous lighting/shading

 

[Oberstein]

The amount of tightly packed geometry in that game was insane, not to mention the gorgeous shading on everything.

Naughty Gods were always Naughty Gods.

Not to mention, the game was genuinely fun—and even today, it's still a joy to replay.
No wonder this trilogy left a lasting mark on an entire generation.
Ah, the '90s!

And on a different note, the abundance of high-quality JRPGs during that era certainly played a significant role.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

The amount of tightly packed geometry in that game was insane, not to mention the gorgeous shading on everything.

Naughty Gods were always Naughty Gods.

I already stopped playing platformers by then, but I remember playing a Crash demo on a sampler disc that came with my system. The graphics were awesome. 60 fps, really good shading, and I just googled it and it ran at a higher res mode than the standard mode most games used. No wonder it looked so good.

 

[Geometric-Crusher]

I don't think the Sega and Nintendo bad decisions were a bigger factor for the sony success.

For me, the true essence of the PlayStation's success lies in a point that has not been mentioned yet. Ridge Racer was not the best game but it sold a lot, at its launch in the US in a 1:1 ratio. In fact, the PS1 achieved impressive sales in games such as Tekken, RR, AC, Twisted Metal, Rayman, MK3, Arc the Lad, NFL Gameday and Resident evil.

The Sega Saturn sold a lot of units in Japan, around 1.5M, and sold 400k in the US in 1995 however, only the 1996 games had acceptable sales, while in the Western market no game surpassed 300k copies. This is terrible. Among the rejected games are Bug, Panzer Dragoon, Clockworknight, Shinobi Legions, all multiplatform from 1995, 1996, high velocity , Sonic R, Ghen War, Powerslave, Die Hard Arcade, Guardian Heroes, any famous game .

So I can only assume that unfortunately, when it became clear that the Saturn would be an unsuccessful console, people started using piracy (which is very ironic) or people bought a console to use as a shelf decoration. It's surreal that the Saturn received 1,000 games and that only about 10, I'm being generous, surpassed the 500k mark.

 

[cartman414]

Not sure about that. Not being open to adapt and doubling down on what isn't working in the face of a new opponent who is clearly doing a lot of things right is a mistake. Yamauchi calling JRPG fans names when Squaresoft turned their back on Nintendo wasn't exactly a wise move.

To be fair the pres of Squaresoft burned that bridge first by luring Enix away from the N64. Yamauchi wasn't mad at Square leaving prior to that.

 

[cartman414]

yep, important to remember that nintendo used to be very very strict about the games on their consoles (you played by their rules), and basically everything was more expensive with them, from licensing to production cartridges.

plus sony got burned by nintendo with the snes cd.
so now devs burned by nintendo could bail to a burned console manufacturer, sony.
friends of my enemy...

plus, a medium that's significantly cheaper plus ~100x the storage doesnt hurt

Sony tried pulling one on Nintendo first.

The Weird History Of The Super NES CD-ROM, Nintendo's Most Notorious Vaporware

Nintendo never released a CD-ROM gaming system. But for a while in the early 1990s, it flirted with the idea. That protracted will-they-won’t-they romance produced pages of breathless gossip columns in video game magazines, a mountain of vaporware, some terrible Zelda games, and one priceless...

kotaku.com

 

[Pimpbaa]

Games were so cheap on it compared to the previous generation. Had a ton of games on my ps1 because of that (and very few N64 games).

 

[Beechos]

It was a combination of things.

Releasing 1st helped alot. This was the generational leap of all generations from 2d to 3d and from cartridge to cd.

Namco ports of ridge race, ace combat and tekken
Battle arena toshiden

These launch games blew everything out of the water.

Saturn came out later and had worse looking games and more expensive.

N64 was just too little way too late.

 

[Plies]

Saturn came out later

Later?

 

[Geometric-Crusher]

It's no question that piracy contributed a lot to the system's sales, because a lot of people bought it that wouldn't have otherwise, and hardware sales picked up when piracy became easy and widespread. Of course, it was essential that the system was interesting in the first place, and by the end of '96, everyone was curious about PlayStation. One year prior, it was just another video game system. By 1997, even family members who I never even thought would spare a minute watching a video game reel had bought a PS and had a pirated copy of Tomb Raider.

Please review my previous post. It indicates that piracy was harmful to the Saturn I'd like to know what you think about it.

 

[Geometric-Crusher]

Later?

he seems to be referring to multiplatform games

 

[Plies]

he seems to be referring to multiplatform games

Like Wipeout and Grandia?

 

[Beechos]

Later?

My bad I thought it came out later. I remember getting playstation 1st so I thought it came out before Saturn.

 

[Beechos]

For me, the true essence of the PlayStation's success lies in a point that has not been mentioned yet. Ridge Racer was not the best game but it sold a lot, at its launch in the US in a 1:1 ratio. In fact, the PS1 achieved impressive sales in games such as Tekken, RR, AC, Twisted Metal, Rayman, MK3, Arc the Lad, NFL Gameday and Resident evil.

The Sega Saturn sold a lot of units in Japan, around 1.5M, and sold 400k in the US in 1995 however, only the 1996 games had acceptable sales, while in the Western market no game surpassed 300k copies. This is terrible. Among the rejected games are Bug, Panzer Dragoon, Clockworknight, Shinobi Legions, all multiplatform from 1995, 1996, high velocity , Sonic R, Ghen War, Powerslave, Die Hard Arcade, Guardian Heroes, any famous game .

So I can only assume that unfortunately, when it became clear that the Saturn would be an unsuccessful console, people started using piracy (which is very ironic) or people bought a console to use as a shelf decoration. It's surreal that the Saturn received 1,000 games and that only about 10, I'm being generous, surpassed the 500k mark.

I don't remember Saturn games easy to pirate but Playstation games were the easiest to pirate didn't even need to mod or anything. While original game is loading swap it out with a burnt copy I remember everyone did it back in the days on PlayStation all you needed was like a piece of straw or spring to hold the disc spinning mechanism down and swap discs and close the tray.

 

[awwr999999]

PlayStation nailed it with maturity and not being child friendly. That's why it was such a success, gaming was mainstream after it.

Going back through the PS1 and PS2 TV ads it feels like they were designed to scare protective parents.
Easy to imagine a massive demographic of American moms seeing those ads and telling their kids "You're not getting a PlayStation".
It's the polar opposite of Nintendo's blatant pandering directly to young kids and to parents of young kids.

 

[Ozzie666]

Going back through the PS1 and PS2 TV ads it feels like they were designed to scare protective parents.
Easy to imagine a massive demographic of American moms seeing those ads and telling their kids "You're not getting a PlayStation".
It's the polar opposite of Nintendo's blatant pandering directly to young kids and to parents of young kids.

Most of those kids who grew up in the 80's and early 90's, were now teenagers with jobs and income. Once the older kids buy into something, young kids want to follow suit. I don't ever remember any drama from parents. I think the older kids really were the earlier adopters. I feel like the 'kids' didn't come in until late 1996.

 

[ChoosableOne]

Winning eleven(PES) was huge in our country. Playstation cafés started popping up on every street corner because of it. I had played that game for thousands of hours. We were also mesmerized by Tekken 3 on the demo cd(playing an arcade game in home was something else). Later, we discovered Metal Gear Solid, and our perspective on video games completely changed. Being able to play such games at home after the Atari and NES era was an incredible experience back then. Nintendo and Sega weren't very well known in our country, so the Playstation being unrivaled(in our country) probably played a big role as well.

 

[awwr999999]

But then you had games taking up several slots for no reason at all. I remember dropping Alone in the Dark 2 like a stone as soon as I found out that the game needed the whole damn card to save.

The slick Memory Card holder slot in the PS2 game box makes it feel like PS2 games were always meant to have one card per game.
Back in the 2000s it was cost prohibitive for most people and the cool branded Memory Cards never left Japan.

When Sony makes an updated PS2 console the collectible Memory Cards should be a bigger deal here in the US.
Every PS2 game could have a corresponding Memory Card with game art or studio logos.

 

[RetroGamingUK]

Winning eleven(PES) was huge in our country. Playstation cafés started popping up on every street corner because of it. I had played that game for thousands of hours. We were also mesmerized by Tekken 3 on the demo cd(playing an arcade game in home was something else). Later, we discovered Metal Gear Solid, and our perspective on video games completely changed. Being able to play such games at home after the Atari and NES era was an incredible experience back then. Nintendo and Sega weren't very well known in our country, so the Playstation being unrivaled(in our country) probably played a big role as well.

Absolutely nothing comes close to Konami's footie titles

 

[PlayStaytion]

It's crazy when someone does a good job and they're reduced to "oh everyone else fucked up."

Especially when eastern studios flex their muscles.

 

[Astray]

Hoping that the new god of war metroidvania is the first true successor to this game. I don't think they've made a better metroidvania since, though maybe some people would give that to Hollow Knight.

It's not really a SOTN successor, but get POP: The Lost Crown on a deep discount and thank me later.

Easily one of the best metroidvanias I've played and my personal game of 2024.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

It's not really a SOTN successor, but get POP: The Lost Crown on a deep discount and thank me later.

Easily one of the best metroidvanias I've played and my personal game of 2024.

LOL, my PS+ subscription literally expired yesterday.

 

[SkylineRKR]

Absolutely nothing comes close to Konami's footie titles

These games were extremely good, but overlooked. ISS Pro 98 was the shit, Pro Evo arguably even better.

Goal Storm and the first ISS Pro I also borrowed, but I wasn't entirely sold on those yet.

 

[Geometric-Crusher]

I don't remember Saturn games easy to pirate

The blame for poor performance in software sales must lie with piracy, otherwise whose fault would it be?
Do you understand me? It is not reasonable that the main games for this console have sales of 200k, 300k while in the same period the PS1 has sales of 300k-1M. What explains this?

zero marketing?
Low production of CD ROMs for these games?
Low quality of the games?
People who bought a game and just played that game over and over again due to the replay factor ?

It's not about the replay factor because that would also affect the PS1, nor is it about printing fewer CDs. Buying a console just to have the console, avoiding buying games doesn't make sense. I'm led to believe that only piracy explains this phenomenon

 

[SkylineRKR]

I don't remember Saturn games easy to pirate but Playstation games were the easiest to pirate didn't even need to mod or anything. While original game is loading swap it out with a burnt copy I remember everyone did it back in the days on PlayStation all you needed was like a piece of straw or spring to hold the disc spinning mechanism down and swap discs and close the tray.

Literally the same, arguably even easier. Saturn model 1 had an access light. All you had to do is load up an original game, until it flashed one time, and then 3 times. Then swap with CDR. The reason you don't know is because no one cared about Saturn. I never knew it either, until a few years later when I got into Saturn collecting.

Modchips were the same for both systems too. But Saturn hertz output was hardware bound and you still needed to mod for 60hz. However, an Action replay defeated region lock just by inserting it into the slot. PSX didn't have this luxury.

PSX hertz was determined by country the disc was from, so a JP/US copy was always 60hz.

 

[Plies]

Geometric-Crusher , do the 3DO next, please