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Naruto Manga |OT2| Not A Romance Manga

Frog-fu

Banned
Most of those things were brought on by Sakura herself and failure to communicate such things. Her and Ino's entire thing was silly when you think about it from both sides. Her being unable to help is something, but most of the time it doesn't go anywhere in part 1. Even when she says she wants to change she rarely puts incentive. (She didn't ask any of the Jonin after her match with Ino for training. Even if she was out, she still could have made the effort)

Sarada obviously asked people about her parents, yet no one talked to her about it. Now if she never asked that would be a thing, but she asked her mother herself and she was like "Duh...don't worry about it!" Asked Shizune, "Duh...don't worry about it!" Asked Sasuke. "Who the hell are you...?"

Naruto was the only one that actually took steps to help her.

I don't necessarily disagree with you on most of that, but by her own doing or not, Sakura did have some shit to deal with over the course of 240≠ chapters. I'd say her best moment in Part I was her fight with Ino. She clearly didn't want to be in Ino's shadow and wanted to be her equal, and she got it.

From there, she was just left to stagnate until it was time for Tsunade to take her as a student.

You can't really compare that with an fast paced dramatic arc that is introduced, explored and solved in 10 chapters though.
 

360pages

Member
I don't necessarily disagree with you on most of that, but by her own doing or not, Sakura did have some shit to deal with over the course of 240≠ chapters. I'd say her best moment in Part I was her fight with Ino. She clearly didn't want to be in Ino's shadow and wanted to be her equal, and she got it.

From there, she was just left to stagnate until it was time for Tsunade to take her as a student.

You can't really compare that with an fast paced dramatic arc that is introduced, explored and solved in 10 chapters though.

True, I don't hate Sakura, despite me thinking she is the worst character in part 1, most of her faults is on how she is written, not the character herself.
 
Sakura understood the current Naruto and the part 1 team 7 Sasuke


she grew close to him as a team-mate (she could've loved him as well)


She didn't know the other side of Naruto the one that we saw in the waterfall

hence she tried to do things without fulling understanding.... She went and did that confession in order to help Naruto and to take away the burden she assumed she placed on him


but the thing is that Naruto put the burden on himself and he was after Sasuke mostly for his connection with the Sauce

when I say she did things without thinking it through I mean that she went and did things... some of which she had a good intention for but executed it in a poor manner


Like I previously stated she is also ignorant.... not mostly about people around her but about her actions

when she assumed Naruto would just accept the confession and ditch the Sauce she probably thought that she was doing such a great thing but in reality she was not only lying to herself but actually thinking Naruto in a bad light.

Hence why I said countless times that she sees the world in some distorted way were everything isn't as twisted as it really is and that there is a easy quick fix to it all
 

ghstwrld

Member
are we even reading the same story?

Kishi flat out has Sai say Sakura is trying to prepare herself to bear the burden of Nardo's hate and Sauce's death; the idea she has some twisted view on how everything was going to work out if she continued on her path doesn't hold with anything from the actual manga
 

Arabesque

Member
Cause she looks it when there is no good reason for it?

I mean, ignoring all of this shipping talk, Konoha had been reduced to a giant crater in the ground, Tsunade(her master) had one foot in the grave, Naruto went 6 tails and went after Pain, half the village was dead at the time and Hinata was in critical condition.

But you think she was sad cause Hinata liked Naruto?

You said Kishimoto's post ending stuff had been good. One of the things he gets praise for is Sarada. I don't see why he should.

Sarada seems less susceptible to similar criticism because she resembles her father, has a Sharingan and is thus likely to be relatively stronger and more relevant.

And again, Sarada's looks have little to do with how she had been received. Sure, you could argue characters with more attractive designs draw more people to them, but that only works to a point. If all Sarada had the looks of Sasuke, no one would have felt attachment to her story. Certainly not if she had her father's psychotic personality.

Sarada isn't getting the same scrutiny Sakura got is because she is not Sakura. For that matter, she is not Sasuke, no matter how much she looks like him. Her story and the experience she underwent is uniquely different from what either Sakura or Sasuke experienced when they were at her age. Sakura never had doubts about who her parents were because they were there, and her father never tried to attack her with a sword while her mother dodged questions about where her father left for such long periods of time and never calling to check on them. Sasuke didn't one day discover a photoshopped family photo of his father and mother. Trying to equate how Sarada acted in the mini-series with how Sasuke and Sakura acted earlier in the manga is erroneous, because the reactions, events and attitudes are different.

"My mom is not real mom! Who cares what happens to her?"

"Sorry, Seven, but I'm not going back to the village cause I don't know who I am anymore."

This type of self-absorbed shit wouldn't have flown if it were Sakura. It just wouldn't. The only reason she got away with being so disrespectful to Sakura in the first place was A) because it's Sakura, and B) SasuSaku is a joke.

Otherwise, her bratty behaviour isn't far off from that of Sakura in her early introduction phase.

Who's ignoring context now?

Sarada reached that emotional point after going to her mother one day asking a simple question: what did my dad look like? All the girl wanted to know was what her dad was like, because she was curious and lonely and needed to know who her father was. In response, all she got was Sakura snapping at her, everyone who wasn't Naruto dodging her questions, and then once she meets her dad, she gets nearly skewered for her troubles.

So when she goes and does her own research and discovers what she thought to be conclusive proof that Sakura and everyone had been hiding the truth from her, she felt betrayed. And thus she lashed out, like any normal person would in a similar emotional state would. You might think that people who feel angry at a moment because they were lied to by the closest people they trust as bratty or self absorbed, but I think otherwise.

Of course it wouldn't fly if Sakura did that, because it was impossible for Sakura to ever experience the same situation. What, did Naruto cheat on her mom and she found out, and that why she'd be badmouthing him and treating him poorly at the start?

Naruto being a dunce when it comes to shinobi related stuff is par for the course. This is the guy that needed an icecream analogy to understand the basics of senjutsu.

When it comes to people, however, I'm simply not buying it because time and again Naruto demonstrated a great understand of people and emotions. He did with Konohamaru, with Zabuza, Neji, Gaara, Sasuke- - the list goes on and on.

The look of shock on his face when Hinata said it clearly shows he understood exactly what she meant. He isn't retarded.

Naruto being a dunce is something that is part of his character, shinobi stuff or otherwise. He had always a side of him that was pretty dumb that every figure of his life pointed out, and we had seen play out throughout the manga. It might have gotten better as he aged, but he still had those moments.

Naruto, even as a kid, had a great deal of emotional intelligence, to make up for him not being traditionally as smart as some of his peers. But the basis for that emotional intelligence came from him being able to relate his experiences with those you listed. He understood what it was like to feel lonely, shunned, hated, bullied, looked down upon. That why he spoke out against Zabuza trying not to show his pain over Haku's death, and why he was able to relate with Neji, Garaa and especially Sasuke (because all of them had comparable situations growing up).

Now we can argue that he couldn't understand what Hinata said at the time properly because he didn't have a way to relate to her in that manner at the time, but I already know what you will say:

I find your justification intellectually dishonest. Especially since you're so keen on disregarding all context.

In what I wrote in that post, I tried to put everything into context and I had not attempted to be dishonest at any point.

Yet when Naruto meets with Hinata on the battlefield he thanks her and leaves it at that. Zero indication that he even remotely likes her back. Just like the rest of the manga. He just didn't like her back.

I didn't say Naruto liked Hinata back at that time? I said Naruto didn't process the thought that Hinata liked him romantically because he was busy thinking of how to stop everyone from killing Sasuke and getting beaten up.
 

Frog-fu

Banned
Last post; going to bed.

I mean, ignoring all of this shipping talk, Konoha had been reduced to a giant crater in the ground, Tsunade(her master) had one foot in the grave, Naruto went 6 tails and went after Pain, half the village was dead at the time and Hinata was in critical condition.

But you think she was sad cause Hinata liked Naruto?

Bruh, it's literally what she was thinking at the time.

And again, Sarada's looks have little to do with how she had been received. Sure, you could argue characters with more attractive designs draw more people to them, but that only works to a point. If all Sarada had the looks of Sasuke, no one would have felt attachment to her story. Certainly not if she had her father's psychotic personality.

I'm going to keep contesting that because I know this fanbase with its irrational hate wouldn't for one second think of giving Sarada a pass if she were a Sakura clone. I find it inconceivable.

Sarada isn't getting the same scrutiny Sakura got is because she is not Sakura. For that matter, she is not Sasuke, no matter how much she looks like him. Her story and the experience she underwent is uniquely different from what either Sakura or Sasuke experienced when they were at her age. Sakura never had doubts about who her parents were because they were there, and her father never tried to attack her with a sword while her mother dodged questions about where her father left for such long periods of time and never calling to check on them. Sasuke didn't one day discover a photoshopped family photo of his father and mother. Trying to equate how Sarada acted in the mini-series with how Sasuke and Sakura acted earlier in the manga is erroneous, because the reactions, events and attitudes are different.

I haven't asserted Sarada is just like Sakura or has similar circumstances. Only that she engaged in the same type of behaviour and got hardly any backlash for it.

Who's ignoring context now?

Sarada reached that emotional point after going to her mother one day asking a simple question: what did my dad look like? All the girl wanted to know was what her dad was like, because she was curious and lonely and needed to know who her father was. In response, all she got was Sakura snapping at her, everyone who wasn't Naruto dodging her questions, and then once she meets her dad, she gets nearly skewered for her troubles.

So when she goes and does her own research and discovers what she thought to be conclusive proof that Sakura and everyone had been hiding the truth from her, she felt betrayed. And thus she lashed out, like any normal person would in a similar emotional state would. You might think that people who feel angry at a moment because they were lied to by the closest people they trust as bratty or self absorbed, but I think otherwise.

Of course it wouldn't fly if Sakura did that, because it was impossible for Sakura to ever experience the same situation. What, did Naruto cheat on her mom and she found out, and that why she'd be badmouthing him and treating him poorly at the start?

I'm not ignoring context, I trusted that you would take to mean that similar statements and actions by Sakura - regardless of context - were enough to burry her under fandom hate for over a decade.

Taking Sakura's oprhan statement into context for example: it was a fairly accurate assessment of an obnoxious boy she didn't know very well, who she thought was actively undermining and annoying her on purpose and who wouldn't stop trying to win her affections despite her clear disinterest.

None of that is ever taken into account.

The same goes for the context of Sakura doing other stupid stuff she shouldn't have, like her false confession and attempt to kill Sasuke. Both came from good places, but that hardly ever comes up.

Relating this back to Sarada: again, not as bad, under different circumstances, but not all that different and still pretty shitty. For all intents and purposes Sakura was a single mom who had a complicated relationship with her her husband and daughter. Yet not one really seemed to feel any empathy for Sakura when Sarada shit-talked her. Most either found it hilarious or were pretty much immediately as understanding as possible of her position.

What can I say, it bothers me a little.

Naruto being a dunce is something that is part of his character, shinobi stuff or otherwise. He had always a side of him that was pretty dumb that every figure of his life pointed out, and we had seen play out throughout the manga. It might have gotten better as he aged, but he still had those moments.

Naruto, even as a kid, had a great deal of emotional intelligence, to make up for him not being traditionally as smart as some of his peers. But the basis for that emotional intelligence came from him being able to relate his experiences with those you listed. He understood what it was like to feel lonely, shunned, hated, bullied, looked down upon. That why he spoke out against Zabuza trying not to show his pain over Haku's death, and why he was able to relate with Neji, Garaa and especially Sasuke (because all of them had comparable situations growing up).

This is confusing.

You admit Naruto had a great deal of emotional intelligence, even as a child, but you have no issue with that being utterly disregarded in The Last for the sake of trying to legitimise an up until entirely one-sided attraction.

The basis for Naruto's emotional intelligence had little to do with him being able to relate to the circumstances. Zabuza wasn't lonely, shunned, hated, bullied or looked down upon. He was a ruthless killer who had just lost the one person he cared about. Naruto had never experienced loss up until then and yet he managed to reach out.

Neji wasn't really plagued by any of those either, and yet Naruto understood him because even though he didn't believe in fate, he understood what it meant to Neji all the same.

But, even still, even without his exceptional emotional intelligence, there is no good justification for dumbing Naruto down to that extent and retconning that moment to fit the script when the manga already showed clear as day Naruto knew what that meant.

The validity of your argument hinges on the belief that this was always how that moment was going to be revisted (again, after it already was in the war), years and years before The Last was written. I don't believe you genuinely believe that is was.

Now we can argue that he couldn't understand what Hinata said at the time properly because he didn't have a way to relate to her in that manner at the time, but I already know what you will say:

We can't argue because there is nothing to argue about. There is only you trying wiggle out of accepting the fact Naruto knew what she meant. It was written on his face. That's not the reaction of a man who was just told a girl loves him like he loves ramen. Come on already.

In what I wrote in that post, I tried to put everything into context and I had not attempted to be dishonest at any point.

The very start of this post is you trying to find every which other explanation to something that is obvious. Nah, I do think you've been a little bit disingenuous.

I didn't say Naruto liked Hinata back at that time? I said Naruto didn't process the thought that Hinata liked him romantically because he was busy thinking of how to stop everyone from killing Sasuke and getting beaten up.

No, you didn't, but by the time Naruto and Hinata met enough time had processed. Naruto wasn't fighting or training every single second since hearing those words, so I'm going to assume that he thought about it off panel, and if not, that him remembering the time she saved him from Pain and only thanking her was him having processed how he felt about her.
 
^^^

Naruto never loved Hinata throughout the manga. Thats what the Last is there for, and though they could of handled much better, it is that story.

Long ass post incoming.



Dude, she looks sad. What is there to be sad about? If Naruto is her BFF, someone she had no romantic interest as some of you are claiming despite an abundance to the contrary, why would Sakura's "empathic face" look like that? You're not making sense.



What makes MS better? I agree the raws are the best thing to wait for, but MS are hardly that much better than MP.



Except for the fact that Hinata is blantantly being pushed to the forefront outside of the manga and is completely overshadowing Sakura. The VA even made jokes about it, since they're not blind to it either.



Naruto was a story about perservance, and like most, it typically involved the underdog plot.

The prophesied child of prophecy demigod transmigrant son of the Yondaime and Kushina blessed with a great lineage is hardly material for an underdog.



My thoughts exactly. No one should think that.

In this case MS is better. They are usually better from what I've seen. I remember in Gaiden MP straight up left out the word Sakura when Naruto was talking about Sarada.

Thats just SP promotion and she's hardly overshadowing Sakura lol. One does not simply erase 15 years of the manga for one movie. If you are talking about the current movie then I can tell you thats also not the case.

1. I am not sure you realized that you proved my point from assuming that I said something else.

She was grateful for Naruto and didn't assume that doing such a action would be kinda sad to someone who should deserve it more like Hinata (who actually scarified herself for Naruto's safety)


2. Could mostly be answered via my above posts.... I just hope you understand what I wrote this time :/

3. Again proving my point of not knowing the consequences of her actions

she had put them to sleep in order to ensure that they'd not harm themselves in a battle that wasn't really their burden to address but by telling them to tag along only to be used by her?

What feeling would that create to some people

4. I could go all day proving some statements and arguments from that battle in part 1

I can also go and show screens.... You are partly right that Sakura wanted to surpass Ino but don't assume that was the only reason for the split up

If she just wanted to do it only for the other reason then for the crush then she wouldn't have splintered it up in the first place

one can still be a rival and be close I can compare that too multiple rivals in this series

5. Exactly what I just claimed.... She wanted to showcase to them that she was also in their league without considering the consequences of such a action


I mean even though she knew she had a healing factor... one does not just run into Madara after he powered up especially since one wouldn't know what new powers would he posses

it was a blind action on her part even more so when you realize that after her failure she is shown to be depressed that Sasuke didn't care

6. ://///////////////////////////////


Ummm what part.....

what part?

I mean....?


you mean when she went to heal their arms?

There is nothing wrong with Sakura hugging Naruto to show thanks lol. You know how stupid that sounds.....can't hug a best friend because this other girl loves him. Furthermore, Hinata and everyone in the village is shown smiling at the moment......its an expression of gratitude something they can all relate to.

3. Iirc she needed Kiba for his senses. K11 wanted to kill Sasuke as well. She was doing them a favour in retrospect.

4. Go on. All your panels would be before the conclusion of the fight. Like I said, your point is disapproved as Sakura and Ino continue being friends despite being rivals in love. If their love rivalry was the reason for their break up then why would they continue being friends despite it still existing? You missed a point that was clearly explained by Kishi.

5. No you also wrote, impress Sasuke-kun, a poor effort in trying to demean her intentions of reminding Naruto and Sasuke that she is still with them as a team mate. Once again you misread the situation. She had the element of surprise. She was planning on getting impaled and then blasting Madara with one punch and the plan worked......if it was not for her lack of intel on the ability of limbo.

Naruto has shown to get sad numerous times when Sasuke is seemingly shown not to care. Something something Team 7. The whole point of that was to show that Sasuke is not what he seems. He did care, he was the first one to react....Sakura however did not see this. Naruto outright calls him out on this saying sometimes the body moves on its own.....a reference to when Sasuke seemingly did not care for Naruto in part 1 and yet almost sacrificed his life to save him.

6. First meeting with Sasuke in shippuuden. Naruto is on the floor crying, feeling powerless due to failing. Sakura is crying as well but says "crying is not going to bring him back'........"I'm still with you.....we'll get stronger...together!" Sai also joins in and Naruto appreciates it saying thanks. She reminded him that he's not alone.
 

Fox318

Member
So...

we're back to this agian
TLVZbqc.jpg
 

Sai

Member
[EDIT] - Also, Psycho_Mantis: MS and MP are equally inconsistent in terms of translation quality. It's been this way for years, and I know it's not the first time mentioned in this thread.

Dude, she looks sad. What is there to be sad about? If Naruto is her BFF, someone she had no romantic interest as some of you are claiming despite an abundance to the contrary, why would Sakura's "empathic face" look like that? You're not making sense.
What kind of expression is Sakura supposed to make, when she fully understands why Hinata just practically threw herself out there to die for Naruto, Frog-fu?

Facial expressions that depict empathy in these kinds of situations are usually varying degrees of complicated, which doesn't usually translate to something soft, or warm. There were reasons-a-plenty to suspect that Kishimoto intended for Sakura to develop romantic feelings for Naruto. This ain't one of them.
 

Sai

Member
So, it seems they just got the point Naruto 'n Sasuke wake up with buffs.

Any upcoming episodes handled by SP's A Team? They better throw everything they've got at Naruto vs Sasuke.

I'm going to be disappointed. ._.

Where? Theories about who?
Probably talking about tumblr, and the shipping weirdos.
 
So, it seems they just got the point Naruto 'n Sasuke wake up with buffs.

Any upcoming episodes handled by SP's A Team? They better throw everything they've got at Naruto vs Sasuke.

I'm going to be disappointed. ._.


Probably talking about tumblr, and the shipping weirdos.

Based Norio will join. After this movie is released, it will get better.
 

Arabesque

Member
So, it seems they just got the point Naruto 'n Sasuke wake up with buffs.

Any upcoming episodes handled by SP's A Team? They better throw everything they've got at Naruto vs Sasuke.

At this pace, they won't get there until 3 months from now, if not slightly more. We should get the final opening and ending by that time, so I'm sure it'll look good.
 

FZZ

Banned
Godwin should have a second law that says every Naruto debate will always lead back to shipping

Fuck it I'm declaring it

FZZpure's Law.
 

jdkluv

Member
I just want more NaruHina dammit. *Begs to our lord and savior Studio Pierrot, masters of fillers and flashbacks, to blow all dat budget on a honeymoon arc and other stuff focusing on the life and times of Naruto and Hinata doing fluffy things together after the events of The Last*

I'm aware I'm basically praying to the devil here...

Tfw knowing that Naruto ended up with the best girl is what gave me the incentive to pick up the manga again.
 

captainpat

Member
So just to be clear this movie announcement still doesn't mean it's getting made, right? I'm almost certain we've heard this kind of news about a lot of videogame and anime adaptions that have gone nowhere.
 

brinstar

Member
I just want more NaruHina dammit. *Begs to our lord and savior Studio Pierrot, masters of fillers and flashbacks, to blow all dat budget on a honeymoon arc and other stuff focusing on the life and times of Naruto and Hinata doing fluffy things together after the events of The Last*

I'm aware I'm basically praying to the devil here...

Tfw knowing that Naruto ended up the best girl is was what gave me the incentive to pick up the manga again.

Yeah I wish we got to see more of Naruto's home life :(
 
I don't know but would it surprise us?

Gooch is usually on top of this stuff xD

So just to be clear this movie announcement still doesn't mean it's getting made, right? I'm almost certain we've heard this kind of news about a lot of videogame and anime adaptions that have gone nowhere.

See, I heard it was still in negotiations but the way some people are reporting it makes it seem likes its a done deal.
 

captainpat

Member
See, I heard it was still in negotiations but the way some people are reporting it makes it seem likes its a done deal.

Yea, there only a couple sites that note that this whole thing could fall though at negotiations.

I hope that's the case and we don't have to hear about this shit anymore. I can't believe one of the guys is supposed to be a fan of the series. How can you be a fan of this series and think that a live action movie is a good idea?
 
Her site's down. lol

Well shit.

Yea, there only a couple sites that note that this whole thing could fall though at negotiations.

I hope that's the case and we don't have to hear about this shit anymore. I can't believe one of the guys is supposed to be a fan of the series. How can you be a fan of this series and think that a live action movie is a good idea?

Lets forget about the story problems.....I can't imagine the fighting/action sequences ever looking good.
 

Fj0823

Member
Yeah I wish we got to see more of Naruto's home life :(

There is just no way Pierrot will let pass that oportunity. The stories write themselves

-The time Naruto and Hinata had their first date and end up having a funny adventure

-Hinata gets lots of attention due to her being the girlfriend of Konoha's #1 hero, jealous girls start trying to make them break up. Hilarity ensues

-Naruto is invited to the Hyuuga manor, to learn how to be a "proper" husband candidate.

-Hinata and Naruto have a small fight, just when they're sent together in a mission alone, their teamwork is broken and they eff up the mission. Must work things out and complete the mission.

Took me 5 minutes,and I just got pierrot 6-10 episodes worth of filler. You can contact me for the paycheck details Pierrot.
 
There is just no way Pierrot will let pass that oportunity. The stories write themselves

-The time Naruto and Hinata had their first date and end up having a funny adventure

-Hinata gets lots of attention due to her being the boyfriend of Konoha's #1 hero, jealous girls start trying to make them break up. Hilarity ensues

-Naruto is invited to the Hyuuga manor, to learn how to be a "proper" husband candidate.

-Hinata and Naruto have a small fight, just when they're sent together in a mission alone, their teamwork is broken and they eff up the mission. Must work things out and complete the mission.

Took me 5 minutes,and I just got pierrot 6-10 episodes worth of filler. You can contact me for the paycheck details Pierrot.

you have www.fanfiction.net for that

If SP are going to go ahead with a Part 3 without Kishi then......welp.
 

jdkluv

Member
There is just no way Pierrot will let pass that oportunity. The stories write themselves

-The time Naruto and Hinata had their first date and end up having a funny adventure

-Hinata gets lots of attention due to her being the boyfriend of Konoha's #1 hero, jealous girls start trying to make them break up. Hilarity ensues

-Naruto is invited to the Hyuuga manor, to learn how to be a "proper" husband candidate.

-Hinata and Naruto have a small fight, just when they're sent together in a mission alone, their teamwork is broken and they eff up the mission. Must work things out and complete the mission.

Took me 5 minutes,and I just got pierrot 6-10 episodes worth of filler. You can contact me for the paycheck details Pierrot.

Lpvsnlk.gif


you have www.fanfiction.net for that

If SP are going to go ahead with a Part 3 without Kishi then......welp.

Inb4 SP makes Naruto GT.
 

brinstar

Member
There is just no way Pierrot will let pass that oportunity. The stories write themselves

-The time Naruto and Hinata had their first date and end up having a funny adventure

-Hinata gets lots of attention due to her being the girlfriend of Konoha's #1 hero, jealous girls start trying to make them break up. Hilarity ensues

-Naruto is invited to the Hyuuga manor, to learn how to be a "proper" husband candidate.

-Hinata and Naruto have a small fight, just when they're sent together in a mission alone, their teamwork is broken and they eff up the mission. Must work things out and complete the mission.

Took me 5 minutes,and I just got pierrot 6-10 episodes worth of filler. You can contact me for the paycheck details Pierrot.

I would watch every single one of these
 
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