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NBA Offseason 2017 |OT| Only Big Ballers™ Allowed *please pay $495 to be a Big Baller

C

Cybit

FGC Waterboy
Lionel Richie said:
No they wouldn't have had another title or two, Bosh and Wade went FUBAR after year 4. The Spurs smacked the living shit out of them in the second Finals, a solid bench player wouldn't have done much. There was a ceiling to what they could achieve and they reached (close to) that ceiling. This revisionist story doesn't work like that because it ignores everything else that could have gone wrong for them. What if Ray Allen forgets he's soft as fuck and decides to not go to Miami? Then they would have won just one title!

Again, is it possible that the CBA fucked the Heat? Yes. Is it possible it was deliberate to fuck the Heat? Yes. Would they have won more without it? I don't think so, I honestly don't see how it would have mattered much when you look at the context as a whole. Besides, isn't 2 titles awesome enough? That team was awesome but when I look at them now and remember how they played, I think 2 titles is pretty much what they deserved. They were fantastic and at times utterly brilliant, but they were a notch below other legendary teams.

Also, not saying luck didn't have anything to do with it, but to say "the Warriors got lucky more than anything" is really underselling how great that team was built. The Heat were the ones who got lucky their big three had a great time playing for team USA and took their talents there. They were tanking for Michael fucking Beasley not long before that happened. The Warriors were a methodically built team that had a lot things going besides being in the right place and the right time for Durant.
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I guess I am thinking with 3 more MLE folks, that bench goes from awful to passable, and that would (I think) have been enough to deal with SAS. Miami was really close to having only one title (OKC), and also really close to having 3 titles (DAL). Though had they beaten Dallas, I don't think LeBron goes the PF route the following year.

The Warriors also tanked to get Harrison Barnes, had a player become not injury prone after being injury prone throughout their early career (which, at least for now, has shown to be completely random), and if they knew what Draymond was, would not have passed on him in the 1st round (twice, mind you, going for Barnes and Festus Ezeli instead). Thompson was a fantastic pick. I don't mean to demean what GSW did do right - but there's a lot more luck involved then folks are willing to admit generally.

Mind you, Miami just happened to be the right place right time team when 3 of the best 5 players decided they wanted to play together (or were tipped off by Wade about the whole situation in advance, which has nothing to do with Miami being smart).

Boogs31 said:
Warriors were not lucky. They drafted Curry, Thompson and Green and got one star, Durant, as a free agent.

The Cavs drafted Irving and got one star, LeBron, via free agency. They also won the lottery 3 out of 4 years which got them Wiggins and Bennett which they traded for Love. If anything, the Cavs have been the far luckier team.

And stop with this Cavs would have destroyed the Warriors without Durant. The Cavs barely beat a Warriors team without Durant purely because Green got suspended, Curry was dealing with a legitimate knee injury, and Bogut was hurt for games 5-7.

Warriors would still have been the favorites over the Cavs this year without Durant. And that's despite the fact that I agree with you that Cleveland was a better team in 2017 than they were in 2016. But the team the Cavs beat in the 2016 finals was a shell of the Warriors team that they've actually been for the last three years.
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Let me be clear, Cleveland deserves pretty much none of what they have. Cleveland got lucky that LeBron James was born in Akron and not in Maryland or anywhere else. See the Zach Lowe tweet. They won the lottery 3x (even though 2013 was a boobie prize).

The way LeBron was playing this Finals, I don't think 2016 GSW would have had a chance. It isn't a knock on GSW, it's that LeBron and Kyrie went out of their minds. Durant basically saved GSW in games 3 and 5. Also..I'm not sure GSW even gets to the finals - OKC might have been an insane rematch, and having to deal with 2 of SAS / OKC with Durant / HOU could have been brutal.

LionPride said:
You wanna know how GS got lucky? The Bucks choose Monta because Steph ain't have ankles. Steph got the same contract as Ty Lawson and people thought the Warriors were dumb. They took a flyer and he ain't been hurt since.

Scouting players isn't luck, it's not luck that Steph and Klay ended up as they did, nor Dray. That's scouting and player development

It's not luck the cap jumped up at the same time to get KD, every team knew that cap was going up and the Warriors capitalized on good business moves.
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See earlier comments about Dray; Klay was a good pick, and Steph was a good pick + KAAAAAHHHHNNN striking again + injury prone going away. They took a gamble and it paid off. Good on them. But it was a gamble.

As for the cap - teams had been told the cap would be smoothed for years prior - this is why OKC traded Harden away. That said - I'm not sure any GM or team has shown an ability to draft anything beyond a standard deviation of talent - this is why Hinkie / Ainge / Morey do the "grab as many picks as possible" plan. There's never been any statistical proof that anyone consistently drafts above random luck after accounting for average production of the spot.

All this aside, the terrifying part is that GSW is probably going to be better next year, after a full year of Durant integrated into the team. 74-8 and 16-0 are legitimately in reach for this team.
 
M

msdstc

Incredibly Naive
Tom Penny said:
Maz and Felger don't know shit about NBA but I have heard Isaac is the biggest boom or bust in the draft. I don't know if they worked him out though and why wouldn't they move back?
Click to expand...

His defense is pretty much a sure thing. I like him a lot actually. Lots of options it seems.
 
RedAssedApe

RedAssedApe

Banned
sf2fanatic said:
I have this gut feeling Lakers are going to draft 2 UCLA guys in the first round
Click to expand...

Ball and who? I wouldn't mind getting leaf but it sounds like he's going earlier than 27/28. Anigbogu is super raw but could also be taken early too.

There's also:

- Bolden. tbh don't know much about him. He got limited minutes off the bench
- Alford. couldn't guard anyone in college. gonna get destroyed in the pros
- Isaac Hamiilton. maybe a late 2nd rounder.

Am I missing anyone?
 
M

msdstc

Incredibly Naive
This Isaac rumor has me giddy. I like him over Tatum. His length and insane athleticism is incredibly useful on defense. If he becomes more assertive that's great, but if not? He's still a top tier defensive weapon.
 
R

Rvaan

Banned
Vault Dweller 111 said:
Let's assume Kawhi isn't going anywhere.


Spurs have nothing that could even approach a package that is enough for Porzingis.
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On paper the Spurs don't have enough to get Porzingis from the Knicks. But if there was a franchise that could be dumb enough to trade 1 of the 5 best young players in the NBA for something dumb it would be the Knicks.
 
Cornbread78

Cornbread78

Member
msdstc said:
This Isaac rumor has me giddy. I like him over Tatum. His length and insane athleticism is incredibly useful on defense. If he becomes more assertive that's great, but if not? He's still a top tier defensive weapon.
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Can he score off the dribble or shoot though?
 
F

Frozenprince

Banned
Rvaan said:
On paper the Spurs don't have enough to get Porzingis from the Knicks. But if there was a franchise that could be dumb enough to trade 1 of the 5 best young players in the NBA for something dumb it would be the Knicks.
Click to expand...
Dump Noah's salary and get future picks and I could absolutely see Phil do it.
 
J

jbug617

Banned
Nobody knows who Ainge is going to pick. He might be willing to move down again.
One NBA exec told the Herald that Ainge would love to find a way to get North Carolina State point guard Dennis Smith Jr., who isn’t rated as high as the third overall pick. Another said the Celts were looking at perhaps moving down in the draft again and picking up another asset for their trouble.

Meanwhile, to give you an idea of how surreal this has all become, a coach from yet another team said that if you asked 10 different clubs what Ainge wanted, you’d get 10 different answers. “We call him the minister of disinformation,” he said. “He’s putting a lot of stuff out there.”
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http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/...keeping_everyone_guessing_on_eve_of_nba_draft
 
S

sf2fanatic

Member
henhowc said:
Ball and who? I wouldn't mind getting leaf but it sounds like he's going earlier than 27/28. Anigbogu is super raw but could also be taken early too.

There's also:

- Bolden. tbh don't know much about him. He got limited minutes off the bench
- Alford. couldn't guard anyone in college. gonna get destroyed in the pros
- Isaac Hamiilton. maybe a late 2nd rounder.

Am I missing anyone?
Click to expand...

I was thinking the first two you mentioned. That'll be great if they both get drafted early in the first round.
 
R

RBelong2Us

Member
LionPride said:
You wanna know how GS got lucky? The Bucks choose Monta because Steph ain't have ankles. Steph got the same contract as Ty Lawson and people thought the Warriors were dumb. They took a flyer and he ain't been hurt since.
Click to expand...
Haha, Bucks did not have a pick between Monta and Curry. Warriors were done with Monta, he wasn't going to get them anywhere .
 
R

Rvaan

Banned
DC4YKEXXYAECmBw.jpg
He deleted it but ... WTF is going on in the Land?
 
G

Gorillaz

Member
NBA is the only sport to have it's offseason filled with more fuckery then the normal season

Big Balla Zone in less then 24 hours people
 
RedAssedApe

RedAssedApe

Banned
Gorillaz said:
NBA is the only sport to have it's offseason filled with more fuckery then the normal season

Big Balla Zone in less then 24 hours people
Click to expand...

i hope they interview lavar and he goes nuts with the lavar-isms with his two other sons flanking him. all decked out in BBB. he needs to speak more things into existence like paul george and Labron coming to the Lakers to play with Lonzo.
 
F

FZZ

Banned
Yeah tbh CP3, Griffin, and Harden on the same team seems like a fucked up disaster

in a D'Antoni system too?

yikes
 
R

Rvaan

Banned
FZZ said:
Yeah tbh CP3, Griffin, and Harden on the same team seems like a fucked up disaster

in a D'Antoni system too?

yikes
Click to expand...

That's a fight waiting to happen. We're talking like during the player meeting CP3 calls after they start 3-8.
 
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