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The Lunch Legend
GAF's Nicest Lunch Thief and Nosiest Dildo Archeologist
Werewolf Jones
Member
Why do people request permanent bans? I really don't get it.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Speaking of Hariseldon’s World...
S
SLoWMoTIoN
Unconfirmed Member
LMAO I actually like that name change. What a fucked up character.
O-N-E
Member
Trump will emerge victorious.
Just wanted to throw this out there for people to see before everything comes to pass. What we're witnessing happening is the final showdown of a long waged spiritual battle that's been going on in this country for hundreds of years, and it's reaching its climax. The sudden all-out attack from...
Banned for a prayer.
haxan7
Banned
I guarantee you he was being disingenuousTrump will emerge victorious.
Just wanted to throw this out there for people to see before everything comes to pass. What we're witnessing happening is the final showdown of a long waged spiritual battle that's been going on in this country for hundreds of years, and it's reaching its climax. The sudden all-out attack from...www.neogaf.com
Banned for a prayer.
O-N-E
Member
Stouffers
Banned
On what basis can you make/secure that guarantee?
haxan7
Banned
Nobody posts religious threads like that regularly here. Obvious attempt to get people to think of the forum as being anti-religious. They knew how evilore would have to respond. There’s a thread at the top of the politics forum saying no more discussion of Trump based conspiracy theories.
O-N-E
Member
haxan7
Banned
It’s possible. But the circumstantial evidence I’m looking at tells me otherwise. I’m smart about these things and I trust myself.
Also look at the poster’s account age, posts, and reactions.
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MetalAlien
Banned
O-N-E
Member
"I'm smart" doesn't quite cut the mustard in the realm of evidence.
haxan7
Banned
I don’t have anything beyond that to add. If you’re pissed off, look at what the poster incited in you. That’s what he wanted to do. Marxists sow division.
O-N-E
Member
Stouffers
Banned
Evangelion Unit-01
Master Chief
I’ve contemplated saying something about politics for the past two months or so but I do feel the need to broach the subject generally now. I’m writing this as I go without a set thesis and it will probably be quite lengthy. I apologize in advance but do not want to pare down as I want to capture the whole of my thoughts and be thorough. This is as much me sharing my thoughts with the staff as it is me sharing my thoughts with my fellow members.
I want to preface this but putting everything up front-I’m classically liberal. I don’t know that I can honestly call that libertarian in 2021 as those who run as libertarians are not often candidates that I agree with in terms of policy. Very few of them embody the ideals of classical liberalism. I certainly don’t see myself represented in the two party system. I’ve said in the past that I largely do not enjoy the politics side of the forum, I find the discourse there to be a bit pedestrian. I hated saying that then and I hate saying now. It makes me feel arrogant and elitist. Most people debate politics from a partisan viewpoint utilizing the talking points that they pull from the news. I try not to get caught up in that. I say all that to illustrate why I don’t enjoy the politics side. That said, I believe in the marketplace of ideas and I think that even if the politics section is not a place that I particularly want to engage in discussion it is not worthless-there is value there for others.
I also want to reiterate statements I’ve made previously regarding bans. I generally dislike the idea of permanently banning someone though I understand the need to do so. Moreover I really appreciate the transparency of the ban page as well as this thread which I see as a way of maintaining accountability and trust. I am however bothered by the idea of thread and section bans. I do not like the idea that someone could banned from discourse in one area of the forum but not another. In my mind their behavior, and by extension their character, is either acceptable or unacceptable. I think consistency is key here and someone that cannot participate in X/Y/Z discussion with decorum should probably not be participating in A/B/C discussion. I can see the need for momentary time outs in the event of silly issues like console warring but on the whole it feels wrong. It feels a bit like a “kids table” solution rather than actually working with the person to improve the situation, one way or another. I’ll also echo one of the banned user’s thoughts on the lack of transparency there. I understand this is a limitation of the forum and the ban page itself so I’m not sure what else to say about the matter. Perhaps I might add that if we cannot be transparent about a certain type of ban then perhaps it should not exist?
Prior to the election I saw that the politics board had a slant to it and there was a degree of “conspiracy” type posting. In my experience people often turn to conspiracy when they feel they are having their voice taken away and need an explanation. We saw it in spades with Russia after the 2016 election. I think the big difference here is that the left wing conspiracies are allowed to flourish online and are repeated by seemingly credible sources like cable news. Right wing people have been marginalized on both fronts and have very few outlets to discuss their ideas; facts and conspiracy theories. I believe first and foremost in the marketplace of ideas. The policing of language of any kind is quite possibly the single most dangerous thing that we can do.
As the election passed I saw a shift with ResetEra posters returning to gloat and troll as well as less active accounts suddenly start engaging in discussion on the forum. What struck me most was the fact that these people did not come to discuss but rather to antagonize and provoke. I still see users like this across the site. While it isn’t too hard to ignore these users sometimes the bait is a bit too appetizing, even for myself. I’ve tried to jump into the politics side lately, despite my reservations, to try and balance these specific kinds of posts out with something actually thoughtful. I do think more moderation is necessary to cut down on the number of people looking simply to antagonize.
The election also marked a shift in what the right leaning posters were talking about, specifically the “stolen election”. This one is a tough nut to crack in my opinion. First of all I think most everyone would be surprised at Biden’s numbers; pulling in more support than Obama is no small feat-especially for a candidate that is much weaker than Obama ever was. We absolutely know that are elections are susceptible to fraud and there were a number of questionable events around the election from late ballots to burst pipes. Moreover the opportunity for voter fraud is exacerbated by the number of mail in ballots and the more “relaxed” security measures in some states. The question isn’t whether or not there is fraud but rather was there enough fraud to overturn the result. As it stands it is impossible for us to fully audit and validate everything. All of that said, the evidence indicates that there was not enough fraud to overturn the results and it is my personal opinion that Biden’s victory wasn’t contingent on fraudulent ballots. I do empathize with those who feel differently-the very existence of some degree, even a negligible degree, of fraud as well as different state’s standards concern me. Every American should feel as though their vote counted and was secured. The fact that there is not a lot of work being done to maintain the integrity and security of our elections is frustrating.
I also think there is another element at play with the “stolen election” and that is whether or not it was “fair”. Looking at the media’s treatment of Trump over the past 4 years is tough. I haven’t ever seen a person treated so unfairly. I say that because policy wise Trump is a 1990’s democrat. Nothing he has done in terms of policy has been that extreme. I am slightly tickled by the irony that the man the world labels an extremist and that emboldened many republicans is more or less a moderate. It is also very apparent that Trump’s own ego and his unique and often questionable manner of speaking did not do him any favors. There were many times when he simply failed to adequately say things as simple as “I denounce white supremacy”. All of that to say, the reaction to Trump does not fit the reality of the 90s democrat that he truly is. When you begin to look at the media’s treatment of Trump and add in the media fanning the flames of riot this summer, the frenzied reporting on COVID, and suppression of stories like the Hunter Biden laptop scandal I can see how one could make an argument that the election was “stolen” in that the two candidates were not afforded the same level of scrutiny and fair reporting. This has always been the case with the media favoring one candidate over the other but I have never seen it at this level before. I do not think this makes a “stolen” election but it does add a lens to this whole discussion.
The last week in particular has been tough for all Americans. We all saw the crimes that were committed at the capitol building. There exists law and punitive measures. We could talk about whether or not things were exacerbated by negligence in security planning but I do not think there is much value to that in this context. I know the world has largely decided to point at Trump as the one who incited while others have pointed out that after watching the country burn for 6 months over the summer with little consequence it is not too crazy to believe that other causes might take up somewhat similar tactics but I don’t really think any of that matters; at the end of the day the people there are responsible for their own actions. As much as one might like to blame Trump’s vague and possibly irresponsible language or contrast with BLM related riots nobody else shoulders the blame like the people there. They will be tried for their crimes as it is in this country. We can argue about whether or not Trump incited it but what I do not think is proper is the response-the permanent social bans, the request by CNN to have Fox removed from the air, and the pulling of Parler from Google/Apple/AWS to highlight some of the more prominent topics. Now more than ever right leaning voices both those pushing conspiracy and those firmly rooted in reality are being silenced. I think even if we all judge this to be Trump’s doing it is not right to let every other right leaning person get caught in the crossfire. Dumping the baby with the bathwater as it were.
GAF’s post 2017 willingness to accommodate multiple views is commendable and something to be celebrated. For users on this site GAF was a place where anything reasonable went in a world that was keen to broadcast leftwing conspiracies; a product of the “old internet” prior to social media. I say all of this because I do not believe that any user that is posting a conspiracy theory, even if it is one I disagree with, is being harmful to the site. I think my earlier comments around the marketplace of ideas will hold true. Let people discuss things in a civil manner even if those things might be outlandish and untrue. Let the market sort the truth out from the fiction. I think it is disingenuous to call any such comment about a stolen election the same as a call to action like we saw at the capitol. Perhaps it is conspiracy but a violent one it is not. There is a fine line there and a cry about fraud and a call to “fight” are different. The former on its own is nothing more than a statement, only when combined with the latter does action get added. Some of these posts remind me of the silly emails I might get from a more eccentric conservative relative-dumb but harmless and usually accompanied by a bad photoshop. I do not see comments from users as too different from the stolen election cries that the media pushed for four year prior. I don’t think a person pushing either theory should get hit with a ban unless they are pushing for violence along with it. What I mean to say is some of these bans seem heavy handed even though I might disagree with the poster’s ideas.
I noted earlier today the difference between something like Twitter as the modern public square (despite the company insisting differently) and GAF being a private forum, one focused on video games no less. GAF can do what it wants and set the tone of the discussion however the staff feel is appropriate. That might be the other side to this, is there even a place for political discussion on a game forum to begin with? It’ll always exist as there will always be overlap but perhaps a different approach is needed.
I also think that the other users need to take step back and get a little perspective before they lash out at the moderation team. I appreciate the accountability in this thread and believe it goes both ways. We as members need to express our concerns in a thoughtful manner. For one, EL has been a victim of unsubstantiated and refuted accusations and subsequent cancelation just a few short years ago. I commend his commitment to the site rather than taking the easy way out and disappearing, something that I am sure was tempting at one point in time. I don’t think he intends to welcome those who called for his cancelation back with open arms. GAF is also a business, one that is at the mercy of advertisers and hosting. EL has a vested interest in making sure that the bills can continue to get paid and the lights can stay on. If either advertisers or the domain service take issue with content on the site it could spell the end of GAF. I imagine that advertisers are probably more few and far between after the events of 2017. EL has to protect his website and that includes deciding what content should be allowed there.
I’ve gone on long enough and I am sure this post is rife with spelling/grammar errors. I ultimately have three requests:
I want to preface this but putting everything up front-I’m classically liberal. I don’t know that I can honestly call that libertarian in 2021 as those who run as libertarians are not often candidates that I agree with in terms of policy. Very few of them embody the ideals of classical liberalism. I certainly don’t see myself represented in the two party system. I’ve said in the past that I largely do not enjoy the politics side of the forum, I find the discourse there to be a bit pedestrian. I hated saying that then and I hate saying now. It makes me feel arrogant and elitist. Most people debate politics from a partisan viewpoint utilizing the talking points that they pull from the news. I try not to get caught up in that. I say all that to illustrate why I don’t enjoy the politics side. That said, I believe in the marketplace of ideas and I think that even if the politics section is not a place that I particularly want to engage in discussion it is not worthless-there is value there for others.
I also want to reiterate statements I’ve made previously regarding bans. I generally dislike the idea of permanently banning someone though I understand the need to do so. Moreover I really appreciate the transparency of the ban page as well as this thread which I see as a way of maintaining accountability and trust. I am however bothered by the idea of thread and section bans. I do not like the idea that someone could banned from discourse in one area of the forum but not another. In my mind their behavior, and by extension their character, is either acceptable or unacceptable. I think consistency is key here and someone that cannot participate in X/Y/Z discussion with decorum should probably not be participating in A/B/C discussion. I can see the need for momentary time outs in the event of silly issues like console warring but on the whole it feels wrong. It feels a bit like a “kids table” solution rather than actually working with the person to improve the situation, one way or another. I’ll also echo one of the banned user’s thoughts on the lack of transparency there. I understand this is a limitation of the forum and the ban page itself so I’m not sure what else to say about the matter. Perhaps I might add that if we cannot be transparent about a certain type of ban then perhaps it should not exist?
Prior to the election I saw that the politics board had a slant to it and there was a degree of “conspiracy” type posting. In my experience people often turn to conspiracy when they feel they are having their voice taken away and need an explanation. We saw it in spades with Russia after the 2016 election. I think the big difference here is that the left wing conspiracies are allowed to flourish online and are repeated by seemingly credible sources like cable news. Right wing people have been marginalized on both fronts and have very few outlets to discuss their ideas; facts and conspiracy theories. I believe first and foremost in the marketplace of ideas. The policing of language of any kind is quite possibly the single most dangerous thing that we can do.
As the election passed I saw a shift with ResetEra posters returning to gloat and troll as well as less active accounts suddenly start engaging in discussion on the forum. What struck me most was the fact that these people did not come to discuss but rather to antagonize and provoke. I still see users like this across the site. While it isn’t too hard to ignore these users sometimes the bait is a bit too appetizing, even for myself. I’ve tried to jump into the politics side lately, despite my reservations, to try and balance these specific kinds of posts out with something actually thoughtful. I do think more moderation is necessary to cut down on the number of people looking simply to antagonize.
The election also marked a shift in what the right leaning posters were talking about, specifically the “stolen election”. This one is a tough nut to crack in my opinion. First of all I think most everyone would be surprised at Biden’s numbers; pulling in more support than Obama is no small feat-especially for a candidate that is much weaker than Obama ever was. We absolutely know that are elections are susceptible to fraud and there were a number of questionable events around the election from late ballots to burst pipes. Moreover the opportunity for voter fraud is exacerbated by the number of mail in ballots and the more “relaxed” security measures in some states. The question isn’t whether or not there is fraud but rather was there enough fraud to overturn the result. As it stands it is impossible for us to fully audit and validate everything. All of that said, the evidence indicates that there was not enough fraud to overturn the results and it is my personal opinion that Biden’s victory wasn’t contingent on fraudulent ballots. I do empathize with those who feel differently-the very existence of some degree, even a negligible degree, of fraud as well as different state’s standards concern me. Every American should feel as though their vote counted and was secured. The fact that there is not a lot of work being done to maintain the integrity and security of our elections is frustrating.
I also think there is another element at play with the “stolen election” and that is whether or not it was “fair”. Looking at the media’s treatment of Trump over the past 4 years is tough. I haven’t ever seen a person treated so unfairly. I say that because policy wise Trump is a 1990’s democrat. Nothing he has done in terms of policy has been that extreme. I am slightly tickled by the irony that the man the world labels an extremist and that emboldened many republicans is more or less a moderate. It is also very apparent that Trump’s own ego and his unique and often questionable manner of speaking did not do him any favors. There were many times when he simply failed to adequately say things as simple as “I denounce white supremacy”. All of that to say, the reaction to Trump does not fit the reality of the 90s democrat that he truly is. When you begin to look at the media’s treatment of Trump and add in the media fanning the flames of riot this summer, the frenzied reporting on COVID, and suppression of stories like the Hunter Biden laptop scandal I can see how one could make an argument that the election was “stolen” in that the two candidates were not afforded the same level of scrutiny and fair reporting. This has always been the case with the media favoring one candidate over the other but I have never seen it at this level before. I do not think this makes a “stolen” election but it does add a lens to this whole discussion.
The last week in particular has been tough for all Americans. We all saw the crimes that were committed at the capitol building. There exists law and punitive measures. We could talk about whether or not things were exacerbated by negligence in security planning but I do not think there is much value to that in this context. I know the world has largely decided to point at Trump as the one who incited while others have pointed out that after watching the country burn for 6 months over the summer with little consequence it is not too crazy to believe that other causes might take up somewhat similar tactics but I don’t really think any of that matters; at the end of the day the people there are responsible for their own actions. As much as one might like to blame Trump’s vague and possibly irresponsible language or contrast with BLM related riots nobody else shoulders the blame like the people there. They will be tried for their crimes as it is in this country. We can argue about whether or not Trump incited it but what I do not think is proper is the response-the permanent social bans, the request by CNN to have Fox removed from the air, and the pulling of Parler from Google/Apple/AWS to highlight some of the more prominent topics. Now more than ever right leaning voices both those pushing conspiracy and those firmly rooted in reality are being silenced. I think even if we all judge this to be Trump’s doing it is not right to let every other right leaning person get caught in the crossfire. Dumping the baby with the bathwater as it were.
GAF’s post 2017 willingness to accommodate multiple views is commendable and something to be celebrated. For users on this site GAF was a place where anything reasonable went in a world that was keen to broadcast leftwing conspiracies; a product of the “old internet” prior to social media. I say all of this because I do not believe that any user that is posting a conspiracy theory, even if it is one I disagree with, is being harmful to the site. I think my earlier comments around the marketplace of ideas will hold true. Let people discuss things in a civil manner even if those things might be outlandish and untrue. Let the market sort the truth out from the fiction. I think it is disingenuous to call any such comment about a stolen election the same as a call to action like we saw at the capitol. Perhaps it is conspiracy but a violent one it is not. There is a fine line there and a cry about fraud and a call to “fight” are different. The former on its own is nothing more than a statement, only when combined with the latter does action get added. Some of these posts remind me of the silly emails I might get from a more eccentric conservative relative-dumb but harmless and usually accompanied by a bad photoshop. I do not see comments from users as too different from the stolen election cries that the media pushed for four year prior. I don’t think a person pushing either theory should get hit with a ban unless they are pushing for violence along with it. What I mean to say is some of these bans seem heavy handed even though I might disagree with the poster’s ideas.
I noted earlier today the difference between something like Twitter as the modern public square (despite the company insisting differently) and GAF being a private forum, one focused on video games no less. GAF can do what it wants and set the tone of the discussion however the staff feel is appropriate. That might be the other side to this, is there even a place for political discussion on a game forum to begin with? It’ll always exist as there will always be overlap but perhaps a different approach is needed.
I also think that the other users need to take step back and get a little perspective before they lash out at the moderation team. I appreciate the accountability in this thread and believe it goes both ways. We as members need to express our concerns in a thoughtful manner. For one, EL has been a victim of unsubstantiated and refuted accusations and subsequent cancelation just a few short years ago. I commend his commitment to the site rather than taking the easy way out and disappearing, something that I am sure was tempting at one point in time. I don’t think he intends to welcome those who called for his cancelation back with open arms. GAF is also a business, one that is at the mercy of advertisers and hosting. EL has a vested interest in making sure that the bills can continue to get paid and the lights can stay on. If either advertisers or the domain service take issue with content on the site it could spell the end of GAF. I imagine that advertisers are probably more few and far between after the events of 2017. EL has to protect his website and that includes deciding what content should be allowed there.
I’ve gone on long enough and I am sure this post is rife with spelling/grammar errors. I ultimately have three requests:
- That EL and team reevaluate these bans, the approach to thread/section bans, and the role that the politics section serves more generally (while I would like to see it stay I don’t know that it has been in a good place for a while.)
- That members take into consideration the larger history of the site as well as the business complications with content when they raise a concern.
- In general that we would all be thoughtful, be kind, and extend a hand to one another in a time where it is easy to despair, sow anger, and sequester ourselves off.
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Bo_Hazem
Banned
I have no horse in the politics side here, only when heard that it has something to do with oil. But man, this is a very thoughtful post, I appreciate this wall of text.
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Bitch Pudding
Member
I want to start with a disclaimer, too: I am one of those who returned from Resetera. There are two reasons why I returned and started engaging in the politics forum just a couple of days ago which was triggered by the recent events in DC:
The elephant in the room is that I'm currently banned on Era. I was banned already for 4 months there last summer for voicing my support for the police by implying "maybe" not all cops are bastards, and now another month for calling rap "not music" in a thread about unpopular opinions, which turns out qualifies as "bigoted trolling" and racism on Era.
The second reason is that after lurking around for a couple of weeks here I realized that NeoGAF isn't a nazi-infested forum like I've been told. Instead, I realized that while the politics forum is indeed rather right-leaning at some times, a free discussion between users with different opinions and free speech in general is possible there. And in 2021, that's quite an achievement, given that so many forums have turned into full-blown echo chambers. And the latest guidelines from Tyler won't change that but allow a more serious discussion between users, knowing not every crazy shit gets a free pass here now.
My point is: I've read that dozens of Era members came here in order to troll in the politics forum last year, but not everyone returning from Era is here for "gloating and trolling". Some, like me, just like being able to freekly discuss politics again, without having to cross-check first if that opinion is shared by the administration.
Once politics become boring again I look forward to talk about what I actually like: video games. I hope that's okay with you guys.
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Kagey K
Banned
This is supposed to be a video game forum first. It was from its inception just that.
It expanded beyond video games and into off topic for those that loved the community, but didn’t game anymore.
How it became a hotbed for politics, I’ve never actually understood. It was a slow transition that nobody saw coming. Until it was too late.
Anyone going on to a gaming message board, to discuss politics is someone that doesn’t know much about it in my head.
nush
Member
Becuse those political people found they had a big audience here and subverted it.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
@hariseldon You're overreacting.
FunkMiller
Banned
It hurts to seeEviLore take the knee. I guess they got to him too then. RIP freedom.
From my exchanges with you, I’d say you’re someone who’s bought into some of the kinds of things EL is talking about. If you truly believe his attempt to shift the conversation back onto the grounds of reality is the death of freedom, there are probably other places better suited to you.
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H
hariseldon
Unconfirmed Member
And there it is. Just go somewhere else. And then it gets shut down. That’s the way of cancel culture. Slowly boil the frog, take little bits of freedom while people like you cheer it on. You’d be there cheering on the tanks in Tiananmen Square.
I want somewhere where a moderate class-based left but socially conservative person like me can talk freely without fear. The purge going on throughout the internet is insane and it’s surely no coincidence that we arrive at this point on gaf. I get it - advertisers and maybe hosting are turning the screws. It still sucks. I don’t want to go to the Donald or weird Reddit places or anything like that. I do want to be able to laugh at the insane clown shit going on because it’s therapeutic
Still, it’s no surprise to see you trying to get rid of people you disagree with. It’s in character at least.
Redneckerz
Those long posts don't cover that red neck boy
Politics does strange things to and with people.
You sure you didn't film yourself doing that?
Colorful phrasing be damned, too.
You sure you didn't film yourself doing that?
When he gets back, tell him to go to my office. I have...experience with taking it too close to home.Miyaza got banned for being rude to me I see. Only 2 weeks???!??!??!!?!!!???!!
Is that a honest question or is your Chuck Tingle sense tingling?
Freedom of speech is not freedom of consequences.It hurts to see
Colorful phrasing be damned, too.
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borborygmus
Member
You should request a perm on the basis of being a rat biding his time until the moment your side comes into power. Suddenly you act like you're running the place. Show a little grace, even if the actual owner of the site does ultimately end up saying the same thing as you, at least let it come from him rather than using the opportunity to gloat.
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AV
We ain't outta here in ten minutes, we won't need no rocket to fly through space
It hurts to see
You could never post anything you wanted here. People were already getting banned constantly for posting outlandish shit, that barrier has just been lowered slightly. Your definition of free speech is entirely subjective.
There's places online you can go and promote QAnon horseshit and deny that Covid exists if you really want - not that I think you do - and there always will be, it's just not here. Seems reasonable enough. You still aren't going to get banned for being conservative minded.
FunkMiller
Banned
I’m happy to see the back of people who believe and push conspiracy theories that put people at risk. Whether you choose to be one of those people is up to you.
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Naibel
Member
I'm all for the absolute freedom to express yourselves in an absolutely perfect world, but I have to agree, some contents and opinions displayed in here sadly put this site into jeopardy with advertisers and web-hosts. Right now things are really shaky and it's not worth nuking this wonderful oasis of sanity that is Neogaf over the ability of every single view and opinion to be heard at all costs, as loony and conspiratorial they are. It's a videogame forum after all, not an actual town-hall.
And by the by, since the split, Gaf always wanted to strike a balance between the lunacy of Resetera and the lunacy of 4Chan, so it never was supposed to be a free-for-all opinion-wise. Shame about the Honk Honk thread, but then again it truly was a soul-crushing thread to read so I'm not sad to see it go.
And I fully expect the mod team to not overstep their boundaries. They're pretty cool and not motivated by ideology like the pre-split ones. Not being politically correct and being critical of woke/SJW culture is still allowed, thank god for that ! If not, that's where I'm gonna get angry !
I'm just gonna keep a cool head about all this. I expect the political climate to calm itself a bit in a few months, once this transition period is well and truly behind us, so I hope things are gonna be slightly more relaxed after that.
And by the by, since the split, Gaf always wanted to strike a balance between the lunacy of Resetera and the lunacy of 4Chan, so it never was supposed to be a free-for-all opinion-wise. Shame about the Honk Honk thread, but then again it truly was a soul-crushing thread to read so I'm not sad to see it go.
And I fully expect the mod team to not overstep their boundaries. They're pretty cool and not motivated by ideology like the pre-split ones. Not being politically correct and being critical of woke/SJW culture is still allowed, thank god for that ! If not, that's where I'm gonna get angry !
I'm just gonna keep a cool head about all this. I expect the political climate to calm itself a bit in a few months, once this transition period is well and truly behind us, so I hope things are gonna be slightly more relaxed after that.
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borborygmus
Member
I'm all for the absolute freedom to express yourselves in an absolutely perfect world, but I have to agree, some contents and opinions displayed in here sadly put this site into jeopardy with advertisers and web-hosts. Right now things are really shaky and it's not worth nuking this wonderful oasis of sanity that is Neogaf over the ability of every single view and opinion to be heard at all costs, as loony and conspiratorial they are. It's a videogame forum after all, not an actual town-hall.
And by the by, since the split, Gaf always wanted to strike a balance between the lunacy of Resetera and the lunacy of 4Chan, so it never was supposed to be a free-for-all opinion-wise. Shame about the Honk Honk thread, but then again it truly was a soul-crushing thread to read so I'm not sad to see it go.
And I fully expect the mod team to not overstep their boundaries. They're pretty cool and not motivated by ideology like the pre-split ones. Not being politically correct and being critical of woke/SJW culture is still allowed, thank god for that ! If not, that's where I'm gonna get angry !
I'm just gonna keep a cool head about all this. I expect the political climate to calm itself a bit in a few months, once this transition period is well and truly behind us, so I hope things are gonna be slightly more relaxed after that.
FunkMiller
learn from this guy how not to be a prick.
FunkMiller
Banned
Given some of the stuff I’ve seen you post (including some incredibly grim insults towards fellow posters), I can take your hatred for me with remarkable fortitude.
However, the ‘you might want to request a perm’ was a bit much... so I’ve deleted it.
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Schrödinger's cat
Banned
There's a gaming forum here? I should check it out sometime.
AfricanKing
Banned
Something tells me people here dont know what it means to comply with external forces such as the TCF IAB Framework or SEO Augmentation
The Lunch Legend
GAF's Nicest Lunch Thief and Nosiest Dildo Archeologist
No, you really should not.
Schrödinger's cat
Banned
It is what it is, man.
We are all here at Evilore's pleasure. Ultimately this is his house and we are just visiting. We don't get to say what the decor should be and flinging shit on our hosts walls is only going to be tolerated for so long. Internet forums have always been a dictatorship, not a democracy.
Would you prefer to have no NeoGAF at all? Because, rightly or wrongly, that's always a risk.
Let's keep a little perspective on this, and also appreciate that Evilore has considerations that peons like you and me don't have to worry about.
And I love to see you soar, @hariseldon , but please don't fly too close to the sun. How else am I going to pester you for a meet up after COVID is done if I can't find you on here???
OK, now I'm gonna.
Just gotta dust-off my "Sony rools, Xbox drools" lines first.
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M1chl
Currently Gif and Meme Champion
Jethalal
Banned
So that's how he gets all the gold
It hurts to see
What ticks me off in all this is that social media and the internet at large is basically run by Americans for Americans.
I talk mad shit here on Twitter or anywhere else about any other countries elections and nobody bats an eyelid. As someone who is not American I'll be booted off the site for not toeing the line on discussion about US politics. Either agree with the approved narrative or fuck off. Even from an outsiders perspective you MUST NOT offer any kind of alternative take on the US or you are gone?
It's funny to think that for 4 years you had a lot of crazy stuff being thrown around with Trump. I think even one of the late night hosts referred to him as "Putins cock holster"? Widespread political unrest etc but just in general the internet was a bit of a mud slinging free for all.
As someone not from the USA I am totally fine with seeing posters like Nobody Important etc having their victory lap because, to be fair, they've fucking earned it. However it is absolute bullshit that I can't now take the piss out of them by saying that their candidate stole the election.
Jussie Smollett, that Covington Kid, Kavanagh, etc its all fine argue away lads. Biden stole the election!? How dare you!? Banned!
If you can look at the US elections in 2020 and not think that something absolutely stinks there then you are being willfully ignorant. However, even if you want to point it out in jest that's not allowed. If your aren't even from the USA that's STILL not allowed. How very dare you suggest that there is corruption!? Everybody knows that governments and elections are always, always, 100% legit. Just study history. You'll see that conspiracies never ever ever happen. Right?
It's like say your buddy is an AS Roma fan and they lose 2-1 to a dodgy penalty. Your friend screeches and moans non stop about cheating refs and bloody biased authorities etc. You laugh at him for being triggered and you rub it in. Down the line Roma end up winning a match 1-0 due to a dodgy penalty and you want to make fun of them so you mirror their previous comments and say "LOL you cheating bastard that was never a penalty". Then the response is "how fucking dare you even question the decisions of our brave referees you absolute arsehole never speak to me again."
Oh and before anyone says "but football fans don't riot when their team loses" let me just preemptively laugh at that.
The double standards on display here are shocking to say the least.
Imagine getting your panties in a bunch to this degree because people are saying your guy stole the election. Especially after spending several years claiming the other guy stole it (with the help of Russia).
Its an absolute shambles of a situation and from a foreign perspective pretty appalling that the message is "America has decided that you shall not question the results of the American elections and doing so will result in being kicked off the platform". Eh, OK, China.
The people who caused trouble in Washington? That's on them. Personal responsibility.
The idea that even from the other side of the world you must not question the USA elections because a few fringe lunatics in the US might belive you is total nonsense.
Conspiracy theories are exactly what it says on the tin. "Theories". The idea that you need to shut the hell up because some arseholes on the other side of the world might start a riot is absolutely ridiculous.
Here we are though.
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nush
Member
That's why the rest of us non Americans have to preface political comments with "I'm not American" or you'll be jumped on as being on the other side to whoever you are commenting on even when you don't have a horse in the race.
Redneckerz
Those long posts don't cover that red neck boy
Nah, stick to Politics. It is much nicer there.
(Honestly i just checked the Politics sub-forum out last week and i was like ''Yeah, i am not going to venture there'' as with a lot of gaming related threads equally the same).
Pick the topics and maybe even battles you like. I know i have a few and maybe even some to write about. The last thing i am interested in is the same deadbeat arguments repeated ad nauseam. That's not what i am here for. I tend to write something informative if its my own thread, and be slightly cynical when its a shitpost. Most of the time its just the (safe) middle ground though
Indeed, but its largely a cultural thing, if at that. What Europeans take for granted is an impossible discourse in US politics, and what US citizens take for granted is near impossible to comprehend in European politics.
This is why ill just take things in stride here. The US perspective on things, admittely, can be refreshening aswell no matter what side of the spectrum. It tells me at the very least that outside of my European hemisphere, very different views on the same topics can and will exist.*
*Unless its conspiracy rhetoric however. Somehow that kind of dialogue is universal all the same.
The thing is mate you'd be booted from the Donald or some of those subreddits anyway the moment you put your sensible hat on and start offering some kind of balance.
I was shocked recently to have a major falling out with a friend over Jordan Peterson of all people. Basically my buddy thinks the sun shines out of his arse but I think he's not perfect and some of his fans are too defensive when the man gets criticised. Turns out I was right.
What was good here was that politics conversation was not "serious" as such. Trump lost, Biden won, and the world keeps turning. Now though its like you'd better not dare question the election results. Haha. Like why the hell is that such a big no-no?
You had doubts about the results! Reeeee! You are causing violence!
"C'mon man."
Now of course you have all the little wormtongue bastards coming out of the woodwork to give pats on the back. "Yes my Lord, a just decision my Lord, they could cause violence if they express those views, let them go elsewhere, we no longer need to welcome their kind here my Lord.".
We all know who they are. The types who can't make two posts in a row without tripping over their own contradictions, hypocrisy and double standards. Of course they welcome this. Finally authority is stepping in an making sure they cant be challenged. Yay!
Fuck it.
Slings and Arrows
Banned
Good post overall. This bit is my main issue. Your election nonsense is American, it has been handled very Americanly, yet the 'internet west' is now being punished? C'mon man.
What ticks me off in all this is that social media and the internet at large is basically run by Americans for Americans.
I talk mad shit here on Twitter or anywhere else about any other countries elections and nobody bats an eyelid. As someone who is not American I'll be booted off the site for not toeing the line on discussion about US politics. Either agree with the approved narrative or fuck off. Even from an outsiders perspective you MUST NOT offer any kind of alternative take on the US or you are gone?
It's funny to think that for 4 years you had a lot of crazy stuff being thrown around with Trump. I think even one of the late night hosts referred to him as "Putins cock holster"? Widespread political unrest etc but just in general the internet was a bit of a mud slinging free for all.
As someone not from the USA I am totally fine with seeing posters like Nobody Important etc having their victory lap because, to be fair, they've fucking earned it. However it is absolute bullshit that I can't now take the piss out of them by saying that their candidate stole the election.
Jussie Smollett, that Covington Kid, Kavanagh, etc its all fine argue away lads. Biden stole the election!? How dare you!? Banned!
If you can look at the US elections in 2020 and not think that something absolutely stinks there then you are being willfully ignorant. However, even if you want to point it out in jest that's not allowed. If your aren't even from the USA that's STILL not allowed. How very dare you suggest that there is corruption!? Everybody knows that governments and elections are always, always, 100% legit. Just study history. You'll see that conspiracies never ever ever happen. Right?
It's like say your buddy is an AS Roma fan and they lose 2-1 to a dodgy penalty. Your friend screeches and moans non stop about cheating refs and bloody biased authorities etc. You laugh at him for being triggered and you rub it in. Down the line Roma end up winning a match 1-0 due to a dodgy penalty and you want to make fun of them so you mirror their previous comments and say "LOL you cheating bastard that was never a penalty". Then the response is "how fucking dare you even question the decisions of our brave referees you absolute arsehole never speak to me again."
Oh and before anyone says "but football fans don't riot when their team loses" let me just preemptively laugh at that.
The double standards on display here are shocking to say the least.
Imagine getting your panties in a bunch to this degree because people are saying your guy stole the election. Especially after spending several years claiming the other guy stole it (with the help of Russia).
Its an absolute shambles of a situation and from a foreign perspective pretty appalling that the message is "America has decided that you shall not question the results of the American elections and doing so will result in being kicked off the platform". Eh, OK, China.
The people who caused trouble in Washington? That's on them. Personal responsibility.
The idea that even from the other side of the world you must not question the USA elections because a few fringe lunatics in the US might belive you is total nonsense.
Conspiracy theories are exactly what it says on the tin. "Theories". The idea that you need to shut the hell up because some arseholes on the other side of the world might start a riot is absolutely ridiculous.
Here we are though.
All of this.
The day i can't laugh at whacky yanks being overly excitable, rednecks being dumb as ferk and the average American Joe being a corporate ball-washer, is a sad day indeed.
But we know they're mucking fental. It comes down to personal responsibility.
Lockdown at home to protect someone else
Don't say certain things to protect someone else
Is this the theme for the next decade? Take no personal responsibility because someone else will clean up your mess? Like we're five years old? What an insult to millions upon millions of adults.
Stiflers Mom
Banned
Stiflers Mom
Banned
I think by what happened on wednesday, it's not about "free speech" anymore.
This shit is seriously endangering our western culture and world. Not just the US, but also its strategic partners.
The US government was chased away and fleeing from a mob, security has been breached and compromised, it seems documents of national security concern have been stolen.
As a conservative myself, I wanna be able to tell it like I think it is, but if you just want to see the western world burn, by all means do it somewhere else.
nush
Member
In this day and age do you really think important stuff is printed and put in an unlocked filing cabinet? The important stuff will be on a network and protected. (Or you'd think so anyway).
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