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NEOGAF's Official Music Production Thread: calling all producers

MUnited83

For you.
So I bought Sonar Platinum this steam sale (was ridiculously ultra cheap for me). Any tips/tutorials for a complete utter noob in Music production? I'd like to dabble around in electronic music a bit.

Also, are the Cakewalk Instrument Packs tools worth it?
 

Falk

that puzzling face
I'm a die-hard SONAR Platinum user, although I've moved on from a lot of the bundled instruments.

If you're talking about the Digital Sound Factory expansion packs, they're generally really great value, albeit a little on the budget end of the scale.

Other than that, Z3ta is a really solid synth, although it can be a little overwhelming to twiddle around with. Lots of good patches and soundsets on the net.

You might find yourself wanting in terms of drum samples coming out-of-the-box with SONAR depending on the genres you're looking to get into. They may be cliche at this point, but check out Vengeance sample packs and soundsets especially if you're into EDM.
 
I guess this thread is getting more attention than the other one. I just finished working on this track and would really appreciate you guys' and gals' critique on it.

https://soundcloud.com/adnan-a-al-sannaa/i-dreamed-of-a-blue-planet

Not really a fan of this. If I were you, I'd work on sound design. The synths and percussion noises you're using all sound tinny and dry, and the mix is very static. The whole thing sounds like it's coming out of a Casio keyboard, it's not doing the song any favors. Also, the metronome click noises in the beginning kind of sounds randomly placed to me.

Anyways, I'm far from an expert, but that's my two cents.
 

shagia

Member
So I bought Sonar Platinum this steam sale (was ridiculously ultra cheap for me). Any tips/tutorials for a complete utter noob in Music production? I'd like to dabble around in electronic music a bit.

Also, are the Cakewalk Instrument Packs tools worth it?

Personally, I think the most important thing to do in production is just always make stuff. Not saying that you have to spend every hour of your life on it or anything, but definitely keep it up by continuously making things. Play around with the tools and synths in your DAW and try to make things out of them, try out other third-party synths, sample packs (try Splice Sounds if you're interested in various samplepacks, especially EDM types, do understand that it's a paid service though), DAWs, utilities, etc. Don't be afraid to experiment with other genres either.

When it comes to learning, there's a lot of sources, but one that I used myself (and still read from) is Sound On Sound's Synth Secrets. Start from the bottom if you're interested!

Also I've never used anything from Cakewalk besides Z3ta+2, and it's definitely a real strong synthesizer. Z3ta 1 also!
 
I totally didn't know this existed before posting in Off-Topic asking this, so I'm going to copy/paste here.

I'm looking for a recommendation for a MIDI controller that is under/around $150, and preferably one that I can order on Amazon (hooray giftcards!)

Some info about what I plan to do with would probably be helpful. I'm looking to compose some music for a game I'm making with my son and daughter. I play piano and hammered dulcimer, have a good musical background and knowledge of music theory and composition. However, I have little experience with digital music creation. I'm looking for something entry level that has keys that don't feel terrible. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated, as well as suggestions for DAW software. I was given a suggestion of Reaper, and that looks pretty good, but suggestions here would be great, too.
 

Falk

that puzzling face
Nowadays, if someone is starting fresh with a DAW (i.e. not sacrificing familiarity to swap) I'd recommend Reaper too. It's extremely affordable ($60!), well-maintained and has a very comprehensive feature set.
 
It's hard to not recommend Reaper over pretty much everything else, especially if your budget is limited. Feature rich, customizable, incredibly well-maintained. Also made by the creator of Winamp.

If you want to try something outside of the traditional DAW paradigm, you can check out Renoise. Not quite as powerful (especially for recording live instruments/vocals) as traditional DAWs and the look makes it seem daunting, but the workflow is extremely quick once you learn it and it has some very powerful midi and sample sequencing features.
 

Kozak

Banned
Finally had a chance to sit down with a friend after the holiday madness and work on production.

My friend has a decent level knowledge of music theory so working with him has been a huge benefit to me, finally getting my mixes in key and hitting the right notes in a scale.. Who woulda thought it would make such a huge difference haha

We were churning out ideas yesterday and I followed up a bit on one of them:

https://soundcloud.com/sabit-kozak/sabo-chen-id

Would love to hear what you guys think :)
 
Not really a fan of this. If I were you, I'd work on sound design. The synths and percussion noises you're using all sound tinny and dry, and the mix is very static. The whole thing sounds like it's coming out of a Casio keyboard, it's not doing the song any favors. Also, the metronome click noises in the beginning kind of sounds randomly placed to me.

Anyways, I'm far from an expert, but that's my two cents.

I'm not sure how I would fix this though. Do you mean I should try to use compression? Because that's something I'm still trying to learn.
 

Kozak

Banned
I'm not sure how I would fix this though. Do you mean I should try to use compression? Because that's something I'm still trying to learn.

I feel by removing that clap stick/metronome sound from the beginning of your track it would already improve a lot. It sounds a bit better placed in the latter parts of the track.

I guess you could find a new lead synth but I don't really have an issue with it.

Maybe lower the overall volume of your risers as I feel it comes well above the rest of your mix.

I like your track a fair bit :)
 
I feel by removing that clap stick/metronome sound from the beginning of your track it would already improve a lot. It sounds a bit better placed in the latter parts of the track.

I guess you could find a new lead synth but I don't really have an issue with it.

Maybe lower the overall volume of your risers as I feel it comes well above the rest of your mix.

I like your track a fair bit :)

Thanks a lot for your input. It's funny that I did lower the volume of the riser but then pushed up again ...

And I'm using operator which I'm not expert on. I'm considering getting Sylenth1 or a Roland Botique. This one in particular: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tut_HuSvSSg
 
got a question about sound design or whatever this falls under

https://soundcloud.com/enschwayofficial/3d-friend

how can i make a synth that sounds like whatever is happening at 0:55? i absolutely love this kind of synth but i don't really know how this is supposed to work.

Are you talking the bass sweep down or the supersaw chords? For the bass sweep if I was trying to replicate this I'd probably load up a standard ass reece bass, automate the pitchdown, and use a frequency shifter to accentuate the pitchdown and make it sound tapestoppy like it does there. For the supersaws I'd load up serum(these sound like the massive wavetables though, so maybe use that), throw 2x16x osc on there with a slight detune and compress and limit to all hell and back.

Also is it just me or does that track sound overcompressed/limited during the drops, and the highend is killing me. I've had a few songs I pushed that hard but I keep backing off because I'm afraid it comes across as tasteless but looking at the likes/views maybe I'm doing the wrong thing.
 

Falk

that puzzling face
Also is it just me or does that track sound overcompressed/limited during the drops, and the highend is killing me. I've had a few songs I pushed that hard but I keep backing off because I'm afraid it comes across as tasteless but looking at the likes/views maybe I'm doing the wrong thing.

The overcompressed, super-treble sound has become almost descriptive of modern EDM.

Thanks dubstep and complextro through 2011 to 2013 tbqh.

edit: Also soundcloud encoding has always been and is still complete ass, even for 128kbps mp3 or whatever they use now. I push my stuff harder for soundcloud uploads if I'm not enabling downloads (e.g. it's only going to be heard via the stream) because if it's already going to sound like shit anyway, might as we ll make a lower common denominator happier. I have my better-sounding renders for everything else.
 

Kyzer

Banned
I think I'm finally getting into a phase I never thought I'd encounter, wanting to upgrade to pro tools. Reaper has been so good to me, but the more outboard I try to integrate the bigger a headache it becomes. Reainsert is too wonky and when your track count gets high it becomes a real migraine
 
The overcompressed, super-treble sound has become almost descriptive of modern EDM.

Thanks dubstep and complextro through 2011 to 2013 tbqh.

edit: Also soundcloud encoding has always been and is still complete ass, even for 128kbps mp3 or whatever they use now. I push my stuff harder for soundcloud uploads if I'm not enabling downloads (e.g. it's only going to be heard via the stream) because if it's already going to sound like shit anyway, might as we ll make a lower common denominator happier. I have my better-sounding renders for everything else.

Yeah it definitely seems to be a sound people are actively shooting for now. That being said I don't know about the soundcloud encoding thing because I've got terrible ears for that sort of stuff (although I have noticed tracks that have been pushed harder sound better on soundcloud even when compensating for the volume loss by increasing the gain on my speakers/headphones). I should probably get into the habit of mixing for different formats too but I'm still struggling with just mixing so I'm going to keep working on that first.


Back in producing as well!

It's been 2 years since I last uploaded something to my soundcloud page and it's just early snippets but it feels pretty good! :)

https://soundcloud.com/nyx_1978

Hope I can finish both of these tracks in the coming weeks/months....
Sup, welcome back to the good times. Excellent track naming convention, maybe I should switch from my date+genre+possibletitle combo I listened to both of your snippets, I personally like Snip2 more than Snip1. I can't put my finger on why, I like the groove more I guess, it's probably the vocal sample too. I think the mixing on Snip2 sounds tinnier (sort of hollow?) than the mixing on Snip1 though. I think they both sound kind of hollow? And the drums feel sort of overbearing to me, especially the hats. That being said I like the groove overall even if it feels a bit repetitive and boring to my ears, but that's probably because I generally don't listen to extended minimal techno mixes. You should definitely finish this stuff though.

I guess this thread is getting more attention than the other one. I just finished working on this track and would really appreciate you guys' and gals' critique on it.

https://soundcloud.com/adnan-a-al-sannaa/i-dreamed-of-a-blue-planet
I hate to do this but there's a lot of stuff you could improve on. The first one is that the drums straight up feel like they're not in time. Specifically the woodblock hits. The sounds you're using also aren't inspiring, they're really dry generally, there's not a lot of ambience and everything feels very disconnected as a result. The casio keyboard description someone gave is kind of apt. You should experiment with reverb. That aside the instrumentation is also very sparse, it sounds like you rarely have more than 2 to 4 tracks going at a time and those tracks are all very sparse in nature so the song sounds empty. The riser is also kind of poopy, both in sound design and use. Your music needs feel like it's going somewhere before the riser happens or that whole thing doesn't work. Experiment with things like filtering, adding extra elements, and generally making the orchestration want to move before adding a riser. The best section is probably near the end with everything going but there's definitely room for improvement imo. All that being said please don't let this critique get you down, I'm just trying to provide constructive feedback and if you're enjoying yourself you should continue doing so.


We were churning out ideas yesterday and I followed up a bit on one of them:
https://soundcloud.com/sabit-kozak/sabo-chen-id
Would love to hear what you guys think :)

The kick sounds punchy, I don't know if it's too punchy, it sounds fine on my headphones. DJ intro's are so boring to me though :(. Is that KSHMR Sweep down 01 from the splice sounds of KSHMR sample pack? It's pitched down with the end chopped right? I'm like 91% procent sure it is. I like this more than the previous track I heard from you switch. That being said I'll try to give some constructive criticism. I don't think your 1st riser/buildup section is working because the drop didn't hit me as hard as I know it could. The snare seems to start doubletiming it too early & it's also super loud and drowns out everything, so you should maybe filter it & wash it out with highpass & reverb automation. The hi-hat is also super loud in this section and feels confused, I don't think you need it honestly. You could do with some sort of highpitched riser synthy thingy there too maybe? I'd also mute virtually everything on beat 4 of the final bar before the first bass drop because the bleedover is removing a lot of impact from the bass drop too. I'd tell you to put some snare there too but that's so 2014, so maybe a vocal/synth hit, or some sort of reverse bass sweep, whatever you feel like honestly. You put the purra there for the second drop so I guess you could do that there too. I guess it might be a breakdown instead of a drop? I don't know, it feels like it goes up in intensity to me but then it sits there for nearly a minute without a kick before it goes into the snare build again. I like the final drop when everything comes in but it kind of sucks to have to wait that long to get to the point in a short track because you really didn't drive it home for very long so it's nowhere near as catchy as it could be. I also think your kick is getting masked in that section so it loses a lot of punch but I don't know how to fix it because it's something I've noticed about my own stuff too. Maybe more sidechain or making more room via EQing? Overall I can definitely hear an improvement from your previous track to this one though.


I hope my comments are useful to you guys, and I'm not coming off like a mean asshole. If I should stop making these posts and should just give a one line awesome track bro reply in the future let me know too.
 

lazygecko

Member
I uploaded a .wav to Soundcloud a few days ago and immediately noticed a clear difference in how it sounded after their compression algorithm was done with it. I have no idea what they're using to fuck it up so badly.
 
I uploaded a .wav to Soundcloud a few days ago and immediately noticed a clear difference in how it sounded after their compression algorithm was done with it. I have no idea what they're using to fuck it up so badly.

I didn't know you could upload wavs. Do you have to be a premium member or something?

Yeah I've noticed that uploading things to Soundcloud always noticeable fs up some of the high frequency stuff. I got into the habit of just EQing out the highest stuff on my percussion and it solves that problem at least.
 
I could have sworn I tried it before and it wouldn't let me. Maybe i'm getting it mixed up with a different site. Though yes I noticed now that it says WAVs are supported.
 
I hope my comments are useful to you guys, and I'm not coming off like a mean asshole. If I should stop making these posts and should just give a one line awesome track bro reply in the future let me know too.

Do me, do me! Your comments are useful, and I would love to get some feedback

My track was on the bottom of the last page, so here's a repost.

Took a break during the holidays, now I'm working on a synthwave piece. At least I think I am, I'm starting to doubt if it's even worth chasing that very specific 80s style.

https://soundcloud.com/florsh-558501827/biz

Anyways, thoughts would be appreciated.
 
Do me, do me! Your comments are useful, and I would love to get some feedback

My track was on the bottom of the last page, so here's a repost.

I know, I saw your track too late earlier and had already hit post and felt bad about leaving you out so I was already planning on coming back to check yours out. But now I'll definitely come back to "do you" tomorrow since you'd like me too.
 

Accoun

Member
It's hard to not recommend Reaper over pretty much everything else, especially if your budget is limited. Feature rich, customizable, incredibly well-maintained. Also made by the creator of Winamp.

If you want to try something outside of the traditional DAW paradigm, you can check out Renoise. Not quite as powerful (especially for recording live instruments/vocals) as traditional DAWs and the look makes it seem daunting, but the workflow is extremely quick once you learn it and it has some very powerful midi and sample sequencing features.

It's easy not to, if someone's looking for a complete package. Not everyone new wants to be browsing through the sea of free plugins (although getting an issue of Computer Music magazine helps at least a bit, because of their CM plugins bundle). It's not like it's necessarily a bad thing, but unless I missed that, it just wasn't mentioned in the conversation and it should be. Same with Renoise.
 

Kozak

Banned
The kick sounds punchy, I don't know if it's too punchy, it sounds fine on my headphones. DJ intro's are so boring to me though :(. Is that KSHMR Sweep down 01 from the splice sounds of KSHMR sample pack? It's pitched down with the end chopped right? I'm like 91% procent sure it is. I like this more than the previous track I heard from you switch. That being said I'll try to give some constructive criticism. I don't think your 1st riser/buildup section is working because the drop didn't hit me as hard as I know it could. The snare seems to start doubletiming it too early & it's also super loud and drowns out everything, so you should maybe filter it & wash it out with highpass & reverb automation. The hi-hat is also super loud in this section and feels confused, I don't think you need it honestly. You could do with some sort of highpitched riser synthy thingy there too maybe? I'd also mute virtually everything on beat 4 of the final bar before the first bass drop because the bleedover is removing a lot of impact from the bass drop too. I'd tell you to put some snare there too but that's so 2014, so maybe a vocal/synth hit, or some sort of reverse bass sweep, whatever you feel like honestly. You put the purra there for the second drop so I guess you could do that there too. I guess it might be a breakdown instead of a drop? I don't know, it feels like it goes up in intensity to me but then it sits there for nearly a minute without a kick before it goes into the snare build again. I like the final drop when everything comes in but it kind of sucks to have to wait that long to get to the point in a short track because you really didn't drive it home for very long so it's nowhere near as catchy as it could be. I also think your kick is getting masked in that section so it loses a lot of punch but I don't know how to fix it because it's something I've noticed about my own stuff too. Maybe more sidechain or making more room via EQing? Overall I can definitely hear an improvement from your previous track to this one though.

Thanks for this dude, this is helpful :)

Ya that is the KSHMR sweep down from his sounds of KSHMR vol. 1 pack. Love the pack :) Trying to restrict myself to 1 sample pack per song atm so I can focus on learning how to make a good track if that makes sense?

With the 1st riser/buildup, I hadn't known of this till yesterday, I could chuck an autofilter on it and apparently that would make the transitions smoother and help the drop? I haven't tried it yet, going to give it a go today. Hope that helps it. I'll give your high pass and reverb automation a go too. That sounds like it could add a lot of energy.

I hear what you mean with the hi hats in that section. Its too noticeable and distracting. Will probably cut them out in that section but I'll have a listen to what it sounds like if it rose as well, maybe on the off beat. Thanks for that catch!

Definitely think I should shorten the drop by 1 bar and have that last 8 bars come in earlier. I've received feedback that it still needs a lot of sounds to give it life. Was thinking some owl hoots and haunting sounds tbh. I hear what you mean about the kick.. I'll try sidechain more but I don't want to bring the threshold down too much. Hopefully I can EQ it.

Nice to hear there is improvement, thanks man :)
 
I tried to be Madeon http://picosong.com/EPeJ/

I sorta got his type of kick, but I cannot touch his snares.

got a question about sound design or whatever this falls under

https://soundcloud.com/enschwayofficial/3d-friend

how can i make a synth that sounds like whatever is happening at 0:55? i absolutely love this kind of synth but i don't really know how this is supposed to work.

I'd say just play around with layering some detuned saw waves together. Try maybe having one the covers more higher frequencies, and one that covers more of the mid area. You could get more specific and split it up however you like, again, just play around with things as I don't really have a definitive answer. A lot of people use a lot more saw wave layers than just 2, but this particular sound doesn't seem like it's too stacked. Then adjust the panning and stereo separation in a way that makes it fit together better. If you use Sylenth, just checking on the compression box and leaving the settings as is can give it a teeny bit of a harder/tighter sound.

For the bass, i'm guessing he has two layered in. Maybe just a normal sub bass using a sine wave, and then some kind of crispier one that stretches more out to the mid area, which sounds like it's using saw waves. Maybe a bit of distortion. I'm by no means expert, that's just my amateur analysis that may or may not be helpful. Hopefully it helps a little though.

There are many other places on the net I've seen that break that sort of supersaw sound down into sections so you can hear exactly what is being layered together. So you can always look for those if you're really having trouble. (Which would make my post utterly redundant and insignificant. Maybe I should have just said that first instead of trying to explain it lol)
 

The Kree

Banned
got a question about sound design or whatever this falls under

https://soundcloud.com/enschwayofficial/3d-friend

how can i make a synth that sounds like whatever is happening at 0:55? i absolutely love this kind of synth but i don't really know how this is supposed to work.

If you're talking about the lead synth sound doing the stuttering: It just a supersaw with some LFO automation. It's not particularly tricky to do once you know how.

In your synth of choice, stack a few saw waves at different octaves and slightly detune them for a thick wide sound, then assign a tempo synced LFO to either a low pass filter or the amp and modulate the note rate (switching between 8th/16th/32nd notes).
 

Nyx

Member
Sup, welcome back to the good times. Excellent track naming convention, maybe I should switch from my date+genre+possibletitle combo I listened to both of your snippets, I personally like Snip2 more than Snip1. I can't put my finger on why, I like the groove more I guess, it's probably the vocal sample too. I think the mixing on Snip2 sounds tinnier (sort of hollow?) than the mixing on Snip1 though. I think they both sound kind of hollow? And the drums feel sort of overbearing to me, especially the hats. That being said I like the groove overall even if it feels a bit repetitive and boring to my ears, but that's probably because I generally don't listen to extended minimal techno mixes. You should definitely finish this stuff though.

Thanks for your comment!

I bet the ''hollow'' sound is Reason's fault, I remember people complaining about the sound coming out of Reason before. I'm probably too used to it to even notice anymore.
I do use a lot of reverb on my drums so maybe that causes it too.

Personally I like Snip1 more but that is definitely more my fav genre, I like Snip2 too ofcourse and feel that in general people will like that more cause it's not as ''complicated'' as the other.

Oh and regarding tracknames, I think I'll name these ''You'' and ''Me'', ha! :D

Will definitely try finishing both but that is always the hard part of producing imo. Making a 6-7 minute track interesting enough to not get bored at all while listening, using FX, fills, etc.
It's also the least fun part of producing if you ask me cause it feels more like work than just fiddling around and trying to come up with something that sounds good for a minute or so haha.
 

Falk

that puzzling face
I uploaded a .wav to Soundcloud a few days ago and immediately noticed a clear difference in how it sounded after their compression algorithm was done with it. I have no idea what they're using to fuck it up so badly.

If I had to hazard a guess, it's probably the same problem and solution as YouTube's video encodes. An extremely fast, cheap encode setting to deal with the volume of media being uploaded.

128kbps mp3 sounds bad, but not as bad as Soundcloud ends up being. Ditto for the IQ at average bitrate YouTube goes for.

It's made me wish time and time again we can upload already-pre-encoded stuff that adheres to SC/YT's specifications, but since it's done on our end, we can squeeze the highest quality out of the bitrate.

Ah well, consumer ease trumps quality every time.
 
I hate to do this but there's a lot of stuff you could improve on. The first one is that the drums straight up feel like they're not in time. Specifically the woodblock hits. The sounds you're using also aren't inspiring, they're really dry generally, there's not a lot of ambience and everything feels very disconnected as a result. The casio keyboard description someone gave is kind of apt. You should experiment with reverb. That aside the instrumentation is also very sparse, it sounds like you rarely have more than 2 to 4 tracks going at a time and those tracks are all very sparse in nature so the song sounds empty. The riser is also kind of poopy, both in sound design and use. Your music needs feel like it's going somewhere before the riser happens or that whole thing doesn't work. Experiment with things like filtering, adding extra elements, and generally making the orchestration want to move before adding a riser. The best section is probably near the end with everything going but there's definitely room for improvement imo. All that being said please don't let this critique get you down, I'm just trying to provide constructive feedback and if you're enjoying yourself you should continue doing so.

Thank you for taking listening to my track and giving feedback. It is definitely clear to me now that I should spend more time with sound design and have more 'sounds'. Now that I think about it, the track does feel like a room with very little in it.

And yeah, I mostly have 4 tracks going except the end part and the middle. I'll pay more attention to this in the future and try to achieve a 'fuller' sound.

Any synths you recommend using? I'm using Operator currently but thinking of switching to Massive or Sylenth1.
 

Foshy

Member
Are you talking the bass sweep down or the supersaw chords? For the bass sweep if I was trying to replicate this I'd probably load up a standard ass reece bass, automate the pitchdown, and use a frequency shifter to accentuate the pitchdown and make it sound tapestoppy like it does there. For the supersaws I'd load up serum(these sound like the massive wavetables though, so maybe use that), throw 2x16x osc on there with a slight detune and compress and limit to all hell and back.

I'd say just play around with layering some detuned saw waves together. Try maybe having one the covers more higher frequencies, and one that covers more of the mid area. You could get more specific and split it up however you like, again, just play around with things as I don't really have a definitive answer. A lot of people use a lot more saw wave layers than just 2, but this particular sound doesn't seem like it's too stacked. Then adjust the panning and stereo separation in a way that makes it fit together better. If you use Sylenth, just checking on the compression box and leaving the settings as is can give it a teeny bit of a harder/tighter sound.

For the bass, i'm guessing he has two layered in. Maybe just a normal sub bass using a sine wave, and then some kind of crispier one that stretches more out to the mid area, which sounds like it's using saw waves. Maybe a bit of distortion. I'm by no means expert, that's just my amateur analysis that may or may not be helpful. Hopefully it helps a little though.

There are many other places on the net I've seen that break that sort of supersaw sound down into sections so you can hear exactly what is being layered together. So you can always look for those if you're really having trouble. (Which would make my post utterly redundant and insignificant. Maybe I should have just said that first instead of trying to explain it lol)

If you're talking about the lead synth sound doing the stuttering: It just a supersaw with some LFO automation. It's not particularly tricky to do once you know how.

In your synth of choice, stack a few saw waves at different octaves and slightly detune them for a thick wide sound, then assign a tempo synced LFO to either a low pass filter or the amp and modulate the note rate (switching between 8th/16th/32nd notes).

Yup I was talking about the lead synth. Thanks for the suggestions! :D
 

Kozak

Banned
Yo homies,

My friend and I sat down with that track I posted earlier and fleshed it out.

https://soundcloud.com/sabit-kozak/purra-id-sabo-chen-original-mix

We chucked an overdrive on our drop to give it a bit of oomph but is that a correct thing to do?

I keep forgetting to add an amp to my leads so I'll definitely have to do that.

Pretty happy with my verses :) They would always do my head in. I'll listen to a tracks verse and just think "how the fuck did they think of that" :p
 

Mik2121

Member
So... I bought Fruity Loops (Producer Edition) about 4 days ago and I'm already having lots of fun even though I don't have much time for it and I'm a music illiterate (I like listening to music, I just don't know anything about the theory). I started watching a bunch of beginner videos from BusyWorksBeats where he talks about chords and stuff (first time I heard about that), and it's very interesting and, I think, well explained.

This is the WIP (43 secs of slow music) of what I have been doing while learning the very basics: https://soundcloud.com/xmik2121x/testsong001

Edit: Probably too hard to give any sort of comment on this, so don't worry. Just wanted to leave it here! I will probably be coming around asking questions sometimes, if that's ok!
 

Kozak

Banned
Pretty cool for a few days in :) I like the progression.

Getting mad DnB vibes from the short bit hehe. A nice drum pattern could complement it well but dunno if you're going for that. Don't mind me, just talking to myself :)
 

Mik2121

Member
Pretty cool for a few days in :) I like the progression.

Getting mad DnB vibes from the short bit hehe. A nice drum pattern could complement it well but dunno if you're going for that. Don't mind me, just talking to myself :)

Thanks for the comment Kozak! The idea is to make it more chill, sorta like Interstellar.
I would like to change the main electric sound with something closer to an organ or even a tubular bell (but I don't know where to find that stuff, nor whether it would sound good or not so I need to try!).

But again, thanks a lot for the comment.
 

Kozak

Banned
Thanks for the comment Kozak! The idea is to make it more chill, sorta like Interstellar.
I would like to change the main electric sound with something closer to an organ or even a tubular bell (but I don't know where to find that stuff, nor whether it would sound good or not so I need to try!).

But again, thanks a lot for the comment.

No worries!

Heres a resource of free samples with an Orchestral section.

http://earmonk.com/free-sample-libraries/

https://www.reddit.com/r/edmproduct...uys_here_is_a_free_sample_pack_of_orchestral/

That Reddit pack was quite popular too.
 

Kozak

Banned
Not a specific one that I know of sorry :( I kinda just mass downloaded sample packs and divied them up into folders :)
 

Mik2121

Member
Alright, I think this is some good timing for this question.

I know nothing about samples, VSTs, etc... I have seen some videos of people opening stuff like "EastWest" stuff, Harmor? And then I see just samples of, say, a piano just by itself, and I'm confused.

What exactly is a sample, and what's the difference between using a sample by itself and a VST? I assume samples are just the raw sounds and VSTs let you add things like reverb and whatnot to those raw sounds?

Then there's also stuff like "Kontakt 5 Player" which has lots of sounds and you can then download samples for it... but I thought samples were a-ok for use for anything? Or are they presets done in Kontakt or something like that?
This kind of stuff is, right now, the most confusing part for me.

What would be a must VST or whatever to just get some extra instruments? That's all I want (for now?). Sorry if I'm making some very n00b-sounding questions. This stuff is so much more complex than things like doing concept art, haha!
 

Kozak

Banned
Hey guys, I uploaded my first mashup: Royal Dynamic Feat. Mr. X-Hip Hop vs D-Jastic-Up To No Good

https://soundcloud.com/sabit-kozak/...ip-hop-vs-d-jastic-up-to-no-good-sabo-mash-up

Just kinda came to me when making a mix for a comp and I scrapped the comp to make it instead haha. Would love to know what you guys think. I like it heaps but then again I love the two songs haha.


Mik2121 said:
Alright, I think this is some good timing for this question.

I know nothing about samples, VSTs, etc... I have seen some videos of people opening stuff like "EastWest" stuff, Harmor? And then I see just samples of, say, a piano just by itself, and I'm confused.

What exactly is a sample, and what's the difference between using a sample by itself and a VST? I assume samples are just the raw sounds and VSTs let you add things like reverb and whatnot to those raw sounds?

Then there's also stuff like "Kontakt 5 Player" which has lots of sounds and you can then download samples for it... but I thought samples were a-ok for use for anything? Or are they presets done in Kontakt or something like that?
This kind of stuff is, right now, the most confusing part for me.

What would be a must VST or whatever to just get some extra instruments? That's all I want (for now?). Sorry if I'm making some very n00b-sounding questions. This stuff is so much more complex than things like doing concept art, haha!

I think samples are fine to use. The listener would never know unless you want it to be obvious anyway. The sampler is such a powerful tool to use with samples. You can find some good samples for leads and basses, load em into a sampler in FL and do your thing. You could be out and about, hear a grand piano you like, record a note and load it into your sampler in FL at home. No shame in using samples as audio either imo. You can EQ and transpose the hits to your liking anyway. You can still ad reverb to a sample without a VST. My tracks are mostly samples aside from my leads, bass etc. but even then I might use a sample for those if I like the sample.

VSTs for me seem like another learning experience completely.... Seems a valuable thing to learn if you want to create your own sound. But theres so many options within the VST its scary... haha.

I also downloads presets for them to achieve something specific. Like I downloaded a bunch of Big Room, House and Melbourne Bounce soundbanks which have a variety of leads and basses that suit the genres. From there you can tweak it to your like using the various options on the VST. I actually like to get rid of all the reverb and other effects put on by the VST cause I've heard its better to put them through a send in Ableton. Dunno if thats the same for FL.

How do i get all my samples and presets? I follow my favourite youtube producers and they usually release stuff, join facebook groups related to the music you want to produce, youtube searchs, google searches :)

I still consider myself a beginner so my understanding is just a bit better than yours but ya hope that helps :)
 

Accoun

Member
Alright, I think this is some good timing for this question.

I know nothing about samples, VSTs, etc... I have seen some videos of people opening stuff like "EastWest" stuff, Harmor? And then I see just samples of, say, a piano just by itself, and I'm confused.

EastWest stuff are IIRC just so-called ROMplers - they are samplers, but without the ability to put your own sounds in it.
Harmor is a synth, but I think you can load samples into it and mangle them through whatever it has to offer to create synth sounds based on them. I never used it and am not sure what it can, really.

What exactly is a sample, and what's the difference between using a sample by itself and a VST? I assume samples are just the raw sounds and VSTs let you add things like reverb and whatnot to those raw sounds?

And speaking of samples themselves: it's a recorded sound. Any kind - drum hits, physical instrument recordings, voice or whatever. you can just drop them into your DAW (which might be quicker if you have something that you want to use unaltered, like drum hits. Also easier to use if you want to reverse them, add stutter and other things that are easier to use with raw audio), or use a sampler if you want stuff like filters, envelopes, using MIDI notes to trigger them or easy pitching. Of course you can add effects to both methods, since you add them not to the synth/sampler plugin, but the channel they are on. Some samplers have built-in effects, of course.

Then there's also stuff like "Kontakt 5 Player" which has lots of sounds and you can then download samples for it... but I thought samples were a-ok for use for anything? Or are they presets done in Kontakt or something like that?
This kind of stuff is, right now, the most confusing part for me.

Kontakt is a sampler, and a very advanced one. It features scripting, so the library creators have lots of control over what happens with the samples (and is why it's often considered a separate category from other samplers). The libraries also can have controls themselves thanks to it: for example an electric guitar sample library might have controls to switch between pickup position, or a synth sample library may have at least some of the controls that a synth usually has (filters, envelopes, etc.) or even different microphones/microphone positions on a drum kit.

What would be a must VST or whatever to just get some extra instruments? That's all I want (for now?). Sorry if I'm making some very n00b-sounding questions. This stuff is so much more complex than things like doing concept art, haha!

Depends what you're looking for. Kontakt is a sampler with a HUGE (43 GB according to their website) default library of various sounds and ability to buy hundreds of third-party libraries. If you want various samples of real instruments, then it would be probably the most bang for your buck you can get. When it comes to synths, most people would probably prefer actual synths, but it might be usable for that as well.

Disclaimer: I'm writing it on my phone in my bed early in the morning and I might not be fully awaken. :p
 

Mik2121

Member
Thank you two a lot. This stuff is the main thing right now that was making music production sound like the most complex thing ever, but now it feels slightly less complex (still nuts!).

For what I wanna do right now I don't think I need to know all the ins and outs of music production so I won't stress myself and I'll keep learning slowly. Again, thanks for the clarifications. I will install Kontakt Player on my FL Studio at home to enjoy those free samples and then just concentrate on making actual music.
 

Falk

that puzzling face
If I could make an analogy, Kontakt = Steam, Native Instruments = Valve, other sample libraries = games by other devs, one-shot samples = art assets

So, Native Instrument made a platform (more accurately, a sampler) called Kontakt, and has a lot of in-house games (... sample libraries), and the platform is so robust and flexible that other vendors also use it for their own sample libraries, often relying on Native Instruments framework for authentication and delivery.

The difference between a single sample and a sample library is the latter consists of a huge amount of different recordings, and typically is wired to be capable of closely mimicking the instrument it advertises, by way of elaborate scripting.
 

Mik2121

Member
That makes sense, Falk. I was playing around with the stuff pre installed in FL Studio last night, and found that I can get most of the sounds I was looking for with the Kontakt library I had plus this other thing called Groove Machine Synthetizer (I think?) that could make lots of cool space-ish windy sounds.

I will jump back into composing and stop playing around with those VSTs or else I'll never get any song done, haha!

Thanks for the analogy too, probably the best you could make on a gaming forum, haha!
 
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